Dates for CBAs extended

Icsics

New circular out today extends the dates for the CBAs....does anyone know what they're doing..??

mtoutlemonde

Icsics wrote: »

New circular out today extends the dates for the CBAs....does anyone know what they're doing..??

If they could extend the dates to some date twenty years from now I'd be very happy

Icsics

mtoutlemonde wrote: »

If they could extend the dates to some date twenty years from now I'd be very happy

Isn't the whole thing a complete joke, extending dates to March?!

mtoutlemonde

Icsics wrote: »

Isn't the whole thing a complete joke, extending dates to March?!

No one knows anything - it's sad when they are meant to be reforming education but instead they are dumbing down our education system and piling on lots of pressure on our poor second years/Junior Certs. Can't wait for reformed Leaving Cert

km79

It’s an absolute farce now
Schools have their dates long planned anyway
Assessment tasks in same subject could now be months apart ????????

They also release CBA2 student exemplars for science today to aid teachers
Obviously they again didn’t have one for each descriptor
Oh no why would they
5 of one descriptor
2 of another
And none for the other two

Just ridiculous
The worst thing is that some aspects of it are working well but it was just rushed through without taking on board views of the professionals involved

I await Ruairi Quinn/PureClareGolds positive spin on this latest evidence that it really is just make it up as they go along
A view confirmed at our latest JCT science day. The coordinator was asked about the Level 2 courses and support for the students ( I can’t remember the exact question)
Her answer was they were working on it and hope to roll it out soon
So what about the children who are 3 years in ???????
RIDICULOUS

maynooth_rules

Sums up the whole Junior Cycle. Give it 2 years and it will bloody anarchy in schools woth all their CBAs. Ridiculous idea that rightly has **** all support amongst teachers. But the powers that be will persevere with the noncense to the detriment of our children.

PureClareGold

km79 wrote: »

It’s an absolute farce now
Schools have their dates long planned anyway
Assessment tasks in same subject could now be months apart ????????

They also release CBA2 student exemplars for science today to aid teachers
Obviously they again didn’t have one for each descriptor
Oh no why would they
5 of one descriptor
2 of another
And none for the other two

Just ridiculous
The worst thing is that some aspects of it are working well but it was just rushed through without taking on board views of the professionals involved

I await Ruairi Quinn/PureClareGolds positive spin on this latest evidence that it really is just make it up as they go along
A view confirmed at our latest JCT science day. The coordinator was asked about the Level 2 courses and support for the students ( I can’t remember the exact question)
Her answer was they were working on it and hope to roll it out soon
So what about the children who are 3 years in ???????
RIDICULOUS

I am quite annoyed at the fact that this is being released now. Makes no sense to do this to teachers and kids now. Would like to know why

Icsics

PureClareGold wrote: »

I am quite annoyed at the fact that this is being released now. Makes no sense to do this to teachers and kids now. Would like to know why

Yes PureClareGold, none of it makes any sense. This episode just highlights the farce that is now the JC. We decided to work on original timelines & not tell kids of March deadlines.

km79

PureClareGold wrote: »

I am quite annoyed at the fact that this is being released now. Makes no sense to do this to teachers and kids now. Would like to know why

Because they are making it up as they go along
The facililtator more or less said that last Monday
I have put a LOT of time into preparing class resources for new science course and I am going to be very very annoyed when it changes . And it will. Soon

PureClareGold

Icsics wrote: »

Yes PureClareGold, none of it makes any sense. This episode just highlights the farce that is now the JC. We decided to work on original timelines & not tell kids of March deadlines.

Didn't say none of it makes any sense. This part doesn't which in reality is just admin. We can all stick with original dates and nothing changes. I don't think the specs and subjects are a farce. Have quite enjoyed seeing my students engage with their CBAs. They have learned loads. That's been my experience

amacca

PureClareGold wrote: »

Didn't say none of it makes any sense. This part doesn't which in reality is just admin. We can all stick with original dates and nothing changes. I don't think the specs and subjects are a farce. Have quite enjoyed seeing my students engage with their CBAs. They have learned loads. That's been my experience

Fair enough ....would you accept that you might be in the minority.


in one way they are less ridiculous than the old green booklet I suppose..those just dragged on and on forever to the detriment of exam prep etc and were of questionable benefit in terms of the kids actually learning...the hard deadline and short amount of time to do the CBA in would be one benefit I could see as long as the teacher is allowed to let a student fail if they don't engage and there are no repercussions for the teacher.....thats a big if though as the teacher seems to always end up being johnny in the middle with this stuff.

The extension of the deadline doesn't bode well for that potential benefit (slim as it is)

km79

Can someone clear something up for me
The assessment task is set by the SEC and corrected by them
I assumed it was the same “ exam” for all students all over the country
Now we have a situation where there are months between some students doing it ????!

amacca

km79 wrote: »

Can someone clear something up for me
The assessment task is set by the SEC and corrected by them
I assumed it was the same “ exam” for all students all over the country
Now we have a situation where there are months between some students doing it ????!

ah sure don't worry...if that is the case its a low stakes exam, it doesn't really matter................................thats the general vibe here despite all the circular action verb definitions and wonderful specifications and engaging and unpacking thats going on.

Blaizes

Wild guess but maybe the deadline is too tight to be easily met by all schools.Doing a paternity leave subbing recently and English dept. was under pressure to get all the stuff in for the deadlines.Getting the kids to rewrite the work after drafts etc. then typing everything up all very very time consuming and a lot of pressure on everyone. If these roll out across every subject I just don't know... Panic stations maybe!!!

happywithlife

we've only english science & business CBA-s to factor this yr (as far as i know) and already its causing timetabling issues. plus there was a ruction today when DP put up xmas exam timetable with slots timetabled for xmas exams when CBA's are meant to be used instead - excuse was parents will want a traditional xmas grade

km79

happywithlife wrote: »

we've only english science & business CBA-s to factor this yr (as far as i know) and already its causing timetabling issues. plus there was a ruction today when DP put up xmas exam timetable with slots timetabled for xmas exams when CBA's are meant to be used instead - excuse was parents will want a traditional xmas grade

Parents dont have a say !
The circular this week categorically states CBA's will replace the relevant house exams and must do so to prevent over assessment for both students and teachers
This is one of the main selling points of the new JC after all
However some people only seem to notice this when it suits them and what the best of every world
It's all new JC/wellbeing/ group work being pushed on one hand but then "we need to give them a proper test" on the other . And I am not only talking about management !
It's in . Go with it. But all of it. Not just the bits that suit!
Parents slowly beginning to realise the implications but it's too late now! They had their chance to have their say. Most didn't take it and those that did were all for it as it took the focus/pressure off terminal exams.......well we are where we are now as the saying goes!
Stand your ground. Ye will only get one chance at this .....

amacca

its not fair to expect individual teachers stand up for whats right and then have a target painted on their back and they are more and more a group made up of factions

if those are the recommendations/rules then management shouldn't get away with being selective but it can't be up to teachers to have to fight them on everything imo

either the cbas replace christmas tests or they don't ... end of.

Mardy Bum

km79 wrote: »

Parents dont have a say !
The circular this week categorically states CBA's will replace the relevant house exams and must do so to prevent over assessment for both students and teachers
This is one of the main selling points of the new JC after all
However some people only seem to notice this when it suits them and what the best of every world
It's all new JC/wellbeing/ group work being pushed on one hand but then "we need to give them a proper test" on the other . And I am not only talking about management !
It's in . Go with it. But all of it. Not just the bits that suit!
Parents slowly beginning to realise the implications but it's too late now! They had their chance to have their say. Most didn't take it and those that did were all for it as it took the focus/pressure off terminal exams.......well we are where we are now as the saying goes!
Stand your ground. Ye will only get one chance at this .....

Ironically, the Inspectorate will arrive and inform you that you must be assessing your students often.

A lot of teachers want house exams still which makes it a very complex situation.

LaLa2004

km79 wrote: »

A view confirmed at our latest JCT science day. The coordinator was asked about the Level 2 courses and support for the students ( I can’t remember the exact question)
Her answer was they were working on it and hope to roll it out soon
So what about the children who are 3 years in ???????
RIDICULOUS

The Level 2 Learning Programmes are another example of dumbing down.

In the past we had subjects at ordinary level and foundation-level Maths. Students with a mild/moderate learning difficulty could sit a junior Cert exam. Now foundation Maths is gone and in other subjects, they are sitting the same paper as the brightest in the country.

Their CBA's will be deemed "failed to meet expectations". Lovely term...

In my opinion the standard of the Level 2's are completely at the discretion of the school. There is no external marking, evaluation or moderation.

Teachers are put to the pin of their collar with this new Junior Cycle at Level 3, not to mind having to train themselves up on Level 2's.

☹️

Icsics

LaLa2004 wrote: »

The Level 2 Learning Programmes are another example of dumbing down.

In the past we had subjects at ordinary level and foundation-level Maths. Students with a mild/moderate learning difficulty could sit a junior Cert exam. Now foundation Maths is gone and in other subjects, they are sitting the same paper as the brightest in the country.

Their CBA's will be deemed "failed to meet expectations". Lovely term...

In my opinion the standard of the Level 2's are completely at the discretion of the school. There is no external marking, evaluation or moderation.

Teachers are put to the pin of their collar with this new Junior Cycle at Level 3, not to mind having to train themselves up on Level 2's.

☹️

Can Level 2s only be offered in DES schools?

Moody_mona

I'm giving a one hour test instead of a two hour for my third years this year. I know the CBA is meant to replace them, but science has gone from 65% terminal exam to 90% and I simply can't justify taking away exam practice from them. If I was to replace the 2nd year summer test and 3rd year Christmas test as per recommendations, they'd go from Christmas of 2nd year to mocks in 3rd year without a long exam and I simply don't think that's fair. I've made this point before, sorry for the repetition.

As an aside, that circular was not released two days ago. Its dated 12th November and specifies that the Business and Science CBA2s can start from that date. Is there a reason why JCT or NCCA only put this on twitter yesterday? I see no reason for the delay, and the lack of communication is shocking.

solerina

LaLa2004 wrote: »

The Level 2 Learning Programmes are another example of dumbing down.

In the past we had subjects at ordinary level and foundation-level Maths. Students with a mild/moderate learning difficulty could sit a junior Cert exam. Now foundation Maths is gone and in other subjects, they are sitting the same paper as the brightest in the country.

Their CBA's will be deemed "failed to meet expectations". Lovely term...

In my opinion the standard of the Level 2's are completely at the discretion of the school. There is no external marking, evaluation or moderation.

Teachers are put to the pin of their collar with this new Junior Cycle at Level 3, not to mind having to train themselves up on Level 2's.

☹️

We were told that the L2LP are only for the very very weak SEN students, those who really can’t manage common level papers or the amount of subjects involved, so not dumbed down but made attainable for them.

km79

Moody_mona wrote: »

I'm giving a one hour test instead of a two hour for my third years this year. I know the CBA is meant to replace them, but science has gone from 65% terminal exam to 90% and I simply can't justify taking away exam practice from them. If I was to replace the 2nd year summer test and 3rd year Christmas test as per recommendations, they'd go from Christmas of 2nd year to mocks in 3rd year without a long exam and I simply don't think that's fair. I've made this point before, sorry for the repetition.

As an aside, that circular was not released two days ago. Its dated 12th November and specifies that the Business and Science CBA2s can start from that date. Is there a reason why JCT or NCCA only put this on twitter yesterday? I see no reason for the delay, and the lack of communication is shocking.

They don’t have to go from Xmas of second year to Xmas of 3rd year
We moved all JC and LC exams to start of November (something I had wanted for AGES anyway due to proximity of Xmas tests/reports to mocks)
We did NOT give a summer test in second year as like it or not it’s in . We are giving loads and loads extra to students as part of the new course .
What about our wellbeing ? Why would you willing place extra exam pressures ( preparing and correcting exams) on yourself ?
Our format is now as follows

2nd year Xmas test

Continuous class assessment for remainder of year

CBA 1 April /May
SLAR is the week before summer tests so we have those to correct just before summer tests . And you would wnat another set straight after ? And send home 2 sets of results ? That is the very definition of over assessment .

JC- First week of November house exams

December /January - CBA and SLAR

February Mocks

That’s plenty of assessment to prepare them for an exam you are not supposed to be able to teach them towards now anyway

We had a subject dept meeting about this last year.
There were a few dissenting voices at the start but not by the end when it was all laid out .

I do not agree with the new course . But it is in so I have put a LOAD of class preparation time in to change my teaching techniques to reflect the new content and assessment style
I was not then going to be told by anyone that was grand but we also want the old style of assessment to stay as well.

Moody_mona

I understand km79. Especially about our wellbeing and putting too much corrections on us in the run up to summer tests in 2nd year. I do not teach to a test, but I do not think it's fair to not give students the opportunity to practice sitting down for longer than a class period in an exam setting answering questions on topics they have studied throughout the year. I will be doing my second year CBA when we go back after Christmas so I will not be adding extra corrections to my workload just before the summer tests.

Noveight

This Junior Cert reform was changing for the sake of changing.

Now that their supposedly progressive ideas are being put in to practice they’re proving to be utterly useless.

km79

Moody_mona wrote: »

I understand km79. Especially about our wellbeing and putting too much corrections on us in the run up to summer tests in 2nd year. I do not teach to a test, but I do not think it's fair to not give students the opportunity to practice sitting down for longer than a class period in an exam setting answering questions on topics they have studied throughout the year. I will be doing my second year CBA when we go back after Christmas so I will not be adding extra corrections to my workload just before the summer tests.

When will you be doing the 3rd Year CBA

Mardy Bum

solerina wrote: »

We were told that the L2LP are only for the very very weak SEN students, those who really can’t manage common level papers or the amount of subjects involved, so not dumbed down but made attainable for them.

Yes they are for students with a 4th class understanding. Very very few students should be doing them.

Moody_mona

km79 wrote: »

When will you be doing the 3rd Year CBA

I was always a bit unsure. We actually have Christmas tests next week so I was going to do it after those. I didn't want to do it after Christmas as mocks would be coming up. But now I think I'll do it after February midterm as a bit of a change or scenery.

When I was in school we did February tests, so the whole school did "mocks" if that makes sense. The Christmas tests and mocks can feel very close together.

km79

Moody_mona wrote: »

I was always a bit unsure. We actually have Christmas tests next week so I was going to do it after those. I didn't want to do it after Christmas as mocks would be coming up. But now I think I'll do it after February midterm as a bit of a change or scenery.

When I was in school we did February tests, so the whole school did "mocks" if that makes sense. The Christmas tests and mocks can feel very close together.

So you will in the space of 2 months or so have
2nd year xmas test 2nd year cba
3rd year xmas test 3rd year mocks 3rd year cba?

Ye need to change timing of JC/LC exams imo

Moody_mona

Again I see your point. To be honest if that circular had been released earlier, I would have pushed to have my third year cba done during the exam week, well not done during, but scheduled them for class throughout the week maybe.

I disagree that students shouldn't have that many exams in a short space. Third years have practical art, home ec, music and language orals also within a two month period around March/April. I don't they need to be shielded from work.

km79

Moody_mona wrote: »

Again I see your point. To be honest if that circular had been released earlier, I would have pushed to have my third year cba done during the exam week, well not done during, but scheduled them for class throughout the week maybe.

I disagree that students shouldn't have that many exams in a short space. Third years have practical art, home ec, music and language orals also within a two month period around March/April. I don't they need to be shielded from work.

I was referring to the teachers workload more so ..........