JFK Assassination Autopsy Details Revealed After 55 Years

The Nal

Sure it has, hes a hero.

Back to reality, something conspiracy nuts never look at is Oswald. Heres a fascinating read on Oswalds escape. Plays out like a Thriller.

Its chapter 12 of Case Closed by Gerald Posner.

And the points here are hard to overcome

http://oswald-is-guilty.blogspot.com/

JJayoo

Maybe the wife did it, looks like she leans in to him before his head explodes.

Cheerful Spring

The Nal wrote: »

Sure it has, hes a hero.

Back to reality, something conspiracy nuts never look at is Oswald. Heres a fascinating read on Oswalds escape. Plays out like a Thriller.

Its chapter 12 of Case Closed by Gerald Posner.

And the points here are hard to overcome

http://oswald-is-guilty.blogspot.com/

Oswald probably knew of the other characters involved in the killing. I don't think Jim Garrison was far off the mark he just could not prove it conclusively in court. I think Oswald was an asset of the CIA. He could have got betrayed or was part of the team who was shooting at Kennedy from behind.

Oswald was introduced to Ruth Paine by https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_de_Mohrenschildt

Mohrenchildt is likely CIA or least is friends with people in this agency. It obvious by who he spends time with he was an asset. Oswald was likely playing both sides pretending to be Pro Castro to infiltrate Cuban groups. Oswald was spotted with David Ferrie in a taxi one time so it obvious he playing both sides. David Ferrie was running anti-Castro insurgency camps for the CIA

Cheerful Spring

Oswald and David Ferrie in 1955.





Ferrie claimed he did not know Oswald after the shooting but that a lie. Ferrie was found dead in suspicious circumstances one week after Garrison announced David Ferrie as a suspect in the JFK killing.

Cheerful Spring

David Ferrie death 5 days after the announcement he was a suspect.

The Nal

Oh God we've gone full Jim Garrison now.

Never go full Jim Garrison.

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

Oswald probably knew of the other characters involved in the killing. I don't think Jim Garrison was far off the mark he just could not prove it conclusively in court. I think Oswald was an asset of the CIA. He could have got betrayed or was part of the team who was shooting at Kennedy from behind.

Oswald was introduced to Ruth Paine by https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_de_Mohrenschildt

Mohrenchildt is likely CIA or least is friends with people in this agency. It obvious by who he spends time with he was an asset. Oswald was likely playing both sides pretending to be Pro Castro to infiltrate Cuban groups. Oswald was spotted with David Ferrie in a taxi one time so it obvious he playing both sides. David Ferrie was running anti-Castro insurgency camps for the CIA

"probably", "could have", "likely".

Absolute drivel.

Whiplash85

What about the testimony of Lee Bowers. Much has been made about the possibility that the 2 men he placed at the picket fence would have had to be 9 feet tall is disingenuous in the extreme. Here we have eye witness testimony where Lee Bowers outlines badge man and hard hat man (maybe this explains disproportion in Orwell Nix tape). Also 44 witnesses gave accounts of hearing a double bang. With shots sounding like they were fired almost simultaneously. Given that it takes 2.5 seconds to reload the carcano this would point in the direction of 2 shooters and hence a conspiracy. So we are expected to believe an average at best marksman can fire 2 shots that hit Kennedy from that range which they have tried to replicate at Quantico using the most skilled riflemen in the US army and failed. Anyway why doesn't Oswald fire when he is coming up Houston rather than going away at Elm. I have been there, seen it and it is a much much easier shot.

BloodBath

The Nal wrote: »

Either did the 3 people who were standing even closer to this shooter. A few feet away. No one standing in and around the knoll said the shots came from there.

As for Umbrella Man, Spring has gone into idiot mode again. Umbrella Man was identified 40 years ago. This has been pointed out to him before. A couple of times.

33+ witnesses reported shots from or behind the knoll towards the tracks, the majority of them located near it and not the TSBD. Some inside the TSBD even reported shots from the knoll/track area and not the building they were in. Some of these witnesses were well experienced with firearms.

For someone who claims to be clued in on the case you clearly are talking out of your arse and calling others idiots in the process.

I've read all of the police testimonies and WC statements which are available online. I suggest you do the same if you want to call yourself informed.

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/wit.htm

Or if you want an easy compiled list of the crucial location statements they are listed here.

http://22november1963.org.uk/jfk-assassination-grassy-knoll-witnesses#victoria-adams

You're wasting your time trying to educate these people.

Cheerful Spring

The Nal wrote: »

Oh God we've gone full Jim Garrison now.

Never go full Jim Garrison.



"probably", "could have", "likely".

Absolute drivel.

Garrison trial of Clay Shaw was in the 1960s. Since then it found out in 1996 he had a security clearance in 1949 and he had worked for the CIA. This was just speculation back then by Garrison.

Cheerful Spring

Whiplash85 wrote: »

What about the testimony of Lee Bowers. Much has been made about the possibility that the 2 men he placed at the picket fence would have had to be 9 feet tall is disingenuous in the extreme. Here we have eye witness testimony where Lee Bowers outlines badge man and hard hat man (maybe this explains disproportion in Orwell Nix tape). Also 44 witnesses gave accounts of hearing a double bang. With shots sounding like they were fired almost simultaneously. Given that it takes 2.5 seconds to reload the carcano this would point in the direction of 2 shooters and hence a conspiracy. So we are expected to believe an average at best marksman can fire 2 shots that hit Kennedy from that range which they have tried to replicate at Quantico using the most skilled riflemen in the US army and failed. Anyway why doesn't Oswald fire when he is coming up Houston rather than going away at Elm. I have been there, seen it and it is a much much easier shot.

There so many problems with the official story. Nal and his pals overlook and believe not weird that a guy was up in the grassy knoll flashing a fake secret service badge! The Secret Service made a public statement they had nobody stationed on the grassy knoll. So we have got an imposter on the grassy knoll a couple or so minutes after the shooting. The Dallas police, when they found the rifle at TSBD, claimed it was German Mauser. They identified because it was labelled on the side of the barrel 7.65 Mauser. 24 hours later the FBI said it was Carcano Italian made rifle.

In 1996 an envelope was found in an FBI archive and written on it said 7.65 bullet found at Dealey Plaza and the date. The bullet was missing. 7.65 bullet is the calibre of bullet used with a German Mauser.

Dohnjoe

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

There so many problems with the official story.

Oh right, who did it then?

The names, dates, times, etc with credible supporting evidence that stands up to scrutiny

Call me crazy but it's almost as if there is a hobby where a collection of people on the internet with contradictory (or no) theories all work together to blindly discredit the facts of an event to hint as some sort of conspiracy they can never support..

The Nal

Whiplash85 wrote: »

What about the testimony of Lee Bowers. Much has been made about the possibility that the 2 men he placed at the picket fence would have had to be 9 feet tall is disingenuous in the extreme. Here we have eye witness testimony where Lee Bowers outlines badge man and hard hat man (maybe this explains disproportion in Orwell Nix tape). Also 44 witnesses gave accounts of hearing a double bang. With shots sounding like they were fired almost simultaneously. Given that it takes 2.5 seconds to reload the carcano this would point in the direction of 2 shooters and hence a conspiracy. So we are expected to believe an average at best marksman can fire 2 shots that hit Kennedy from that range which they have tried to replicate at Quantico using the most skilled riflemen in the US army and failed. Anyway why doesn't Oswald fire when he is coming up Houston rather than going away at Elm. I have been there, seen it and it is a much much easier shot.

It is but he had no time for that shot. When the motorcade turns onto Houston from Main theres only about 50m until it turns onto Elm. We're looking back now retrospectively but Oswald wouldn't have even known what car JFK was in, where he was sitting. He didn't see the motorcade until it turned off Main street. He may have been expecting secret service men all over the car or the bubble top on. And then he risked missing the shot from the front and the car speeding away down Houston St behind the TSBD.

As for the double bang, most people heard 3 shots. And lots of people said they had no idea where they came from and lots heard echoes. Its quite a complicated place acoustically. Buildings to the back, concrete, fences and trees on the knoll side and then a huge open area and underpasses lower down the road. Zapruder couldn't tell where the shots came from. "Too much reverberation.....There was an echo which gave me a sound all over".

The main thing for me which no one can answer about a grassy knoll shooter is how the people closest to the knoll - Zapruder, Marilyn Sitzman, Emmett Hudson - didn't hear a rifle going off at ear level mere feet from them. Marilyn Sitzman in particular dismissed the knoll shooter. "I would have heard the sounding of the gun much closer, and I probably had a ringing in my head because the fence was quite close to where we were standing, very close.".

They didn't hear it? Sorry, but thats just impossible.

BloodBath wrote: »

33+ witnesses reported shots from or behind the knoll towards the tracks, the majority of them located near it and not the TSBD. Some inside the TSBD even reported shots from the knoll/track area and not the building they were in. Some of these witnesses were well experienced with firearms.

For someone who claims to be clued in on the case you clearly are talking out of your arse and calling others idiots in the process.

I've read all of the police testimonies and WC statements which are available online. I suggest you do the same if you want to call yourself informed.

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/russ/wit.htm

Or if you want an easy compiled list of the crucial location statements they are listed here.

http://22november1963.org.uk/jfk-assassination-grassy-knoll-witnesses#victoria-adams

You're wasting your time trying to educate these people.

Yes yes they heard shots, a lot thought it came from that direction, maybe over there etc. Maybe 600 people in the plaza at the time and Ed Hoffman aside, no one claims to have seen a shooter on the knoll. However Howard Brennan saw Oswald in the window, with a rifle, shooting. James Jarman, Bonnie Ray Williams and Harold Norman were on the 5th floor and could hear the action of the bolt and the cartridges drop on the floor. Theres a man in the 6th floor window who looks like Oswald, wearing a white tshirt, moments before the shooting. Thats on video. Oswald was the only person on that 6th floor at the time. It was Oswalds rifle. He brought a rifle into the building that day. He fled the scene. He killed Tippet. These are facts.

You cant just chuck all this out because of ear witnesses, a lot of whom "thought" the shots or a shot came from that direction and so on. Theres no factual basis for a shooter on the knoll.

Cheerful Spring

Dohnjoe wrote: »

Oh right, who did it then?

The names, dates, times, etc with credible supporting evidence that stands up to scrutiny

Call me crazy but it's almost as if there is a hobby where a collection of people on the internet with contradictory (or no) theories all work together to blindly discredit the facts of an event to hint as some sort of conspiracy they can never support..

E. Howard Hunt, was an American intelligence officer and published author of 73 books. From 1949 to 1970, Hunt served as an officer in the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA). Along with G. Gordon Liddy and others, Hunt was one of the Nixon administration "plumbers", a team of operatives charged with identifying government sources of national security information "leaks" to outside parties. Hunt and Liddy plotted the Watergate burglaries and other clandestine operations for the Nixon administration. In the ensuing Watergate scandal, Hunt was convicted of burglary, conspiracy, and wiretapping, eventually serving 33 months in prison.

This is a brief video of his statement on video to his son. The big event was the JFK assassination.

He listed some of the people involved in the planning the plot to kill Kennedy.

Lyndon Baines Johnson
Cord Meyer, David Atlee Phillips, Frank Sturgis and David Sanchez Morales.

Cheerful Spring

In 2014, the Assassination Archives and Research Center held a conference on the occassion of the 50th Anniversary of the release of the Warren Commission Report. The highlight of the conference was a statement by Cuban exile leader Antonio Veciana.

"On November 22nd, 1963, President John F. Kennedy was assassinated in Dallas. In reality, what happened that day was a coup d’état. President Kennedy’s death was a result of a conspiracy planned by CIA operatives and supported by a handful of high-ranking military officers and members of the Mafia. The conspirators believed that the President was a traitor who had jeopardized national security by established a foreign policy of dialogue and conciliation with the traditional enemies of the United States. I want to unequivocally state that Maurice Bishop was David Atlee Phillips. Here are the factors that point to a conspiracy. I traveled to Dallas at the end of August or beginning of September of 1963 to meet with Maurice Bishop, my CIA handler. We had agreed to see each other in the lobby of a downtown Dallas bank. There, I observed Bishop with a young man I later identified without a doubt as Lee Harvey Oswald. This encounter was unplanned. It would not have happened had I not arrived to the interview 15 minutes before Bishop expected me."

Dohnjoe

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

E. Howard Hunt, was an American intelligence officer and published author of 73 books. From 1949 to 1970, Hunt served as an officer in the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA). Along with G. Gordon Liddy and others, Hunt was one of the Nixon administration "plumbers", a team of operatives charged with identifying government sources of national security information "leaks" to outside parties. Hunt and Liddy plotted the Watergate burglaries and other clandestine operations for the Nixon administration. In the ensuing Watergate scandal, Hunt was convicted of burglary, conspiracy, and wiretapping, eventually serving 33 months in prison.

Why did you leave out this part when copy-pasting from Wikipedia?

"Hunt supported the Warren Commission's conclusion that Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone in the assassination of John F. Kennedy.[39]"

and this bit

"After Hunt's death, Howard St. John Hunt and David Hunt stated that their father had recorded several claims about himself and others being involved in a conspiracy to assassinate President John F. Kennedy.[3][68] Notes and audio recordings were made. In the April 5, 2007, issue of Rolling Stone, St. John Hunt detailed a number of individuals purported to be implicated by his father, including Lyndon B. Johnson, Cord Meyer, David Phillips, Frank Sturgis, David Morales, Antonio Veciana, William Harvey, and an assassin he termed "French gunman grassy knoll" who many presume was Lucien Sarti.[3][69] The two sons alleged that their father cut the information from his memoirs to avoid possible perjury charges.[68] According to Hunt's widow and other children, the two sons took advantage of Hunt's loss of lucidity by coaching and exploiting him for financial gain and furthermore falsified accounts of Hunt's supposed confession.[68] The Los Angeles Times said they examined the materials offered by the sons to support the story and found them to be "inconclusive".[68]"

Cheerful Spring

Dohnjoe wrote: »

Why did you leave out this part when copy-pasting from Wikipedia?

"Hunt supported the Warren Commission's conclusion that Lee Harvey Oswald acted alone in the assassination of John F. Kennedy.[39]"

and this bit

"After Hunt's death, Howard St. John Hunt and David Hunt stated that their father had recorded several claims about himself and others being involved in a conspiracy to assassinate President John F. Kennedy.[3][68] Notes and audio recordings were made. In the April 5, 2007, issue of Rolling Stone, St. John Hunt detailed a number of individuals purported to be implicated by his father, including Lyndon B. Johnson, Cord Meyer, David Phillips, Frank Sturgis, David Morales, Antonio Veciana, William Harvey, and an assassin he termed "French gunman grassy knoll" who many presume was Lucien Sarti.[3][69] The two sons alleged that their father cut the information from his memoirs to avoid possible perjury charges.[68] According to Hunt's widow and other children, the two sons took advantage of Hunt's loss of lucidity by coaching and exploiting him for financial gain and furthermore falsified accounts of Hunt's supposed confession.[68] The Los Angeles Times said they examined the materials offered by the sons to support the story and found them to be "inconclusive".[68]"

When did he state the Warren Commission conclusion was correct?

That last part is bull. Hunt was not coached or exploited as he own lawyer confessed on video also he was told by Hunt in private in the '90s the JFK killing was a conspiracy.

weisses

Dohnjoe wrote: »

Oh right, who did it then?

The names, dates, times, etc with credible supporting evidence that stands up to scrutiny

Stop demanding stuff you selectively refuse to provide yourself (depending on the CT) Its hypocritical

Cheerful Spring

weisses wrote: »

Stop demanding stuff you selectively refuse to provide yourself (depending on the CT) Its hypocritical

When you provide evidence he doesn't accept it anyhow. I provided him with the NIST video of them claiming freefall could not have happened in Aug 2008. And this was a conference of them presenting the draft of the final report.

Dohnjoe

weisses wrote: »

Stop demanding stuff you selectively refuse to provide yourself (depending on the CT) Its hypocritical

Thanks not to police the thread or attempt to drag other threads into this one

Question wasn't directed at you.

Dohnjoe

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

When did he state the Warren Commission conclusion was correct?

That last part is bull. Hunt was not coached or exploited as he own lawyer confessed on video also he was told by Hunt in private in the '90s the JFK killing was a conspiracy.

There are a lot of JFK conspiracies, so you are going with the Lyndon one correct? (any other theory is completely false)

Cheerful Spring

Dohnjoe wrote: »

Thanks not to police the thread or attempt to drag other threads into this one

Question wasn't directed at you.

You don't find it odd there were men on the grassy knoll and near the TSBD flashing fake secret service badges? You don't find it odd the doctors saw different wounds? You don't find it odd the Warren Commission own ballistics experts disagreed and found no evidence that magic bullet caused the injuries to both Connelly and Kennedy. Even the photographer at the Autopsy claims the images in the archives were not taken by him and he was only one allowed to take photographs during the autopsy. You don't find it odd the Dallas Police made sworn statements they found a German Mauser in TSBD and when the rifle was taken away and returned by the FBI it was then declared it was not Mauser but a Carcano made rifle Italian made.

Dohnjoe

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

You don't find it odd there were men on the grassy knoll and near the TSBD flashing fake secret service badges? You don't find it odd the doctors saw different wounds? You don't find it odd the Warren Commission own ballistics experts disagreed and found no evidence that magic bullet caused the injuries to both Connelly and Kennedy. Even the photographer at the Autopsy claims the images in the archives were not taken by him and he was only one allowed to take photographs during the autopsy. You don't find out it the Dallas Police made sworn statements they found a German Mauser in TSBD and when the rifle was taken away and returned by the FBI it was then declared it was not Mauser but a Carcano made rifle Italian made.

According to you, which of the JFK conspiracies is the correct theory? When I asked who did it, you replied with E Hunt, who is related to the Lyndon theory, so is that the one you support?

Cheerful Spring

Dohnjoe wrote: »

According to you, which of the JFK conspiracies is the correct theory? When I asked who did it, you replied with E Hunt, who is related to the Lyndon theory, so is that the one you support?

They are theories but E hunt was involved and planned clandestine operations for the Nixon administration. He probably one of the guys who would know what happened to Kennedy.

All I know for sure is a cover-up happened

The Nal

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

In 2014, the Assassination Archives and Research Center held a conference on the occassion of the 50th Anniversary of the release of the Warren Commission Report. The highlight of the conference was a statement by Cuban exile leader Antonio Veciana.

"On November 22nd, 1963, President John F. Kennedy was assassinated in Dallas. In reality, what happened that day was a coup d’état. President Kennedy’s death was a result of a conspiracy planned by CIA operatives and supported by a handful of high-ranking military officers and members of the Mafia. The conspirators believed that the President was a traitor who had jeopardized national security by established a foreign policy of dialogue and conciliation with the traditional enemies of the United States. I want to unequivocally state that Maurice Bishop was David Atlee Phillips. Here are the factors that point to a conspiracy. I traveled to Dallas at the end of August or beginning of September of 1963 to meet with Maurice Bishop, my CIA handler. We had agreed to see each other in the lobby of a downtown Dallas bank. There, I observed Bishop with a young man I later identified without a doubt as Lee Harvey Oswald. This encounter was unplanned. It would not have happened had I not arrived to the interview 15 minutes before Bishop expected me."

Oswald was still living in New Orleans at that time. A well documented fact.

Cheerful Spring

The Nal wrote: »

Oswald was still living in New Orleans at that time.

Not True Oswald and wife moved to Dallas in September. He got the job in TSBD sometime in Oct or early Nov if I remember
correctly?

They stayed with Ruth Paine in September.

The Nal

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

Not True Oswald and wife moved to Dallas in September.

Nope. Oswald didnt move back to Dallas until October.

Next.

weisses

Dohnjoe wrote: »

Thanks not to police the thread or attempt to drag other threads into this one

Question wasn't directed at you.

Just pointing out the obvious hypocrisy in your contributions ... stop demanding stuff you cannot provide yourself ... its silly

weisses

The Nal wrote: »

Nope. Oswald didnt move back to Dallas until October.

Next.

So Oswald could not have been at that meeting because he didn't move house then ?

Cheerful Spring

The Nal wrote: »

Nope. Oswald didnt move back to Dallas until October.

Next.

According to the story he didn't. He was supposedly in Mexico even though it widely reported that nobody matching his description was photographed there. Hoover even wrote a memo that somebody was using Oswald name in Mexico. Further evidence of an intelligence operation in the works months before the killing of JFK.

Lot of this weird stuff detailed here.

http://mcadams.posc.mu.edu/clueless3.htm

The Central Intelligence Agency advised that on October 1, 1963, an extremely sensitive source had reported that an individual identified himself as Lee Oswald, who contacted the Soviet Embassy in Mexico City inquiring as to any messages. Special Agents of this Bureau, who have conversed with Oswald in Dallas, Tex., have observed photographs of the individual referred to above and have listened to a recording of his voice. These Special Agents are of the opinion that the above-referred-to individual was not Lee Harvey Oswald.

The Nal

weisses wrote: »

So Oswald could not have been at that meeting because he didn't move house then ?

Theres no evidence of Oswald making a 1000 mile round trip at that time. Marina can account for his whereabouts every day that summer up until she went back to Dallas in late September. She testified that he spent every night in the house.