JFK Assassination Autopsy Details Revealed After 55 Years

Cheerful Spring

Dohnjoe wrote: »

Then present it, instead of hiding it behind another made-up conspiracy.

According to you there's plenty of evidence, so let's start off with the shooters, their names? their locations? what guns did they use? at what times and how many times did they fire in relation to Oswald's shots?

List here involved.

Cheerful Spring

Wallace who listed by the image was stopped by the police in Del Tex building after the shooting. He was a known Mafia hitman. Strange enough he was also seen in the same city when brother Robert was murdered.

Cheerful Spring

King Mob wrote: »

I would like to see a picture of the explosive bullet that was supposedly used, along with a complete chain of custody.

The bullet performance is radically different.

The Carcano bullet exploded into dozens of fragments. Yet the single bullet theorists what you to believe the same bullet would be pristine when it hit two different men and shattered rib bone and fractured wrist bone.

King Mob

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

The bullet performance is radically different.

The Carcano bullet exploded into dozens of fragments. Yet the single bullet theorists what you to believe the same bullet was pristine when hit two different men and shattered rib bone and fractured wrist bone.

Cool.
Show us the real bullet that exploded then.
Pictures would be nice, but you're going to need a complete chain of custody.

Oh, and also the gun used by the other shooters. And their names.

Cheerful Spring

King Mob wrote: »

Cool.
Show us the real bullet that exploded then.
Pictures would be nice, but you're going to need a complete chain of custody.

We don't have them most of the bullets fragments are missing from the JFK collection.

If the bullet was like the magic bullet then would have got removed from Kennedy skull and be available to see?

King Mob

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

We don't have them

Lol.
Great chain of custody you have there.

So gun and name of the people who really shot Kennedy?

Cheerful Spring

King Mob wrote: »

Lol.
Great chain of custody you have there.

So gun and name of the people who really shot Kennedy?

Well isn't that point I am making the autopsy was botched and there were shenanigans taking place.

Kennedy was hit by a Carcano bullet in the head is ridiculous. If the bullet is blowing apart it was an explosive round.

Who shot at Kennedy in the image I provided. It well is known the Grassy Knoll shooter was a Frenchman hired by the Mafia, he had help there. The shooters in Dal-Tex was Wallace and Nicoletti. There maybe have been another team on South knoll, it would explain the breakage in the front window. Seymour and Santana are the names linked to the South knoll, they are CIA killers.

King Mob

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

Who shot at Kennedy in the image I provided. It well is known the Grassy Knoll shooter was a Frenchman hired by the Mafia, he had help there.

So that's 5 people to shoot Kennedy?
Who was this rando french guy?
Are the French involved too?

What was his name?
How much was he paid?
What gun did he use? Where is the picture of that gun?

Dohnjoe

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

List here involved.

That didn't answer the question at all, you just paste-dumped something you found on a conspiracy site

I'll repeat the question since asking about your theories seems like kryponite to you

"so let's start off with the shooters, their names? their locations? what guns did they use? at what times and how many times did they fire in relation to Oswald's shots?"

In your words, not a paste-dump thanks, and if you do, please source where you are borrowing the theory from

The Nal

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

It was the HSCA conclusion there was a conspiracy and there was a second shooter. You lying.

Based on now debunked acoustic evidence. Which you know but still lie about.

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

There plenty of evidence to believe there was a conspiracy. HSCA is a political hearing so they only went so far to blame the mob. There plenty of evidence gathered over 50 years to show Oswald was not the only shooter. And recent actions with the JFK files is further proof the conspiracy theorists are right.

What evidence then?

The evidence that it was Oswald alone.

Motive - He tried to kill Walker proving his intention to be a political assassin.

Hard evidence - His gun, with his prints and clothes fibre on it, he was in the building, he shot Tippet, there was no other piece of any other bullet or fragment from any other gun found anywhere, no one saw or heard a gunman and theres no gunman in any of the pictures of videos taken that day.

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

The Warren Commission classified all their evidence for 75 years
The HSCA for 50 years.

None of these investigations wanted ordinary folk to read everything they found out

The WC didn't classify all their evidence. There are 26 volumes of evidence in the report, 552 witnesses and 3,100 exhibits. A huge amount of information.

A lot of evidence was classified for 75 years not by the Warren Commission but because of an old US law regarding national archives policy on all federal investigations.

Dohnjoe wrote: »

That didn't answer the question at all, you just paste-dumped something you found on a conspiracy site

That chart he posted is one of the saddest things I've ever seen. Also hilarious. Actually believing that James Files was one the gunmen. My God. Bargain basement stuff.

Cheerful Spring

The Nal wrote: »

Based on now debunked acoustic evidence. Which you know but still lie about.



What evidence then?

The evidence that it was Oswald alone.

Motive - He tried to kill Walker proving his intention to be a political assassin.

Hard evidence - His gun, with his prints and clothes fibre on it, he was in the building, he shot Tippet, there was no other piece of any other bullet or fragment from any other gun found anywhere, no one saw or heard a gunman and theres no gunman in any of the pictures of videos taken that day.



The WC didn't classify all their evidence. There are 26 volumes of evidence in the report, 552 witnesses and 3,100 exhibits. A huge amount of information.

A lot of evidence was classified for 75 years not by the Warren Commission but because of an old US law regarding national archives policy on all federal investigations.



That chart he posted is one of the saddest things I've ever seen. Also hilarious. Actually believing that James Files was one the gunmen. My God. Bargain basement stuff.

Facts, not waffle.

The unpublished portion of those records was initially sealed for 75 years (to 2039) under a general National Archives policy that applied to all federal investigations by the executive branch of government.

Robert Blakey, The Chief Counsel of the HSCA Committee, later changed his views that the CIA was being cooperative and forthcoming with the investigation when he learned that the CIA's special liaison to the Committee researchers, George Joannides, was actually involved with some of the organizations that Lee Harvey Oswald was involved with in the months leading up to the assassination, including an anti-Castro group, the DRE, which was linked to the CIA, where the liaison, Joannides, worked in 1963.

.I no longer believe that we were able to conduct an appropriate investigation of the [Central Intelligence] Agency and its relationship to Oswald.... We now know that the Agency withheld from the Warren Commission the CIA–Mafia plots to kill Castro. Had the commission known of the plots, it would have followed a different path in its investigation. The Agency unilaterally deprived the commission of a chance to obtain the full truth, which will now never be known. Significantly, the Warren Commission's conclusion that the agencies of the government co-operated with it is, in retrospect, not the truth. We also now know that the Agency set up a process that could only have been designed to frustrate the ability of the committee in 1976–79 to obtain any information that might adversely affect the Agency.

Of course, people like you think the Warren Commission report was true and factual, it was not.

According to a 2015 Politico report,[25] newly declassified documents show that CIA director, John A. McCone, hid evidence from the Warren Commission, set up by Lyndon Johnson to investigate JFK's assassination. According to a once-secret report[26] written in 2013 by the CIA's top in-house historian, David Robarge, the CIA admits McCone and other senior CIA officials withheld 'incendiary' information from the Warren Commission thereby perverting the course of justice

James Files was involved in the mob. He definitely had the connections to be there that day. What I think most likely though he got the real story from Johnny Rosselli https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Roselli and placed himself into the story. We know from files the grassy knoll shooter was mostly likely Lucien Serti a Frenchman hired by Marcello. Howard E Hunt also confirmed the shooter was a frenchman.

Cheerful Spring

Dohnjoe wrote: »

That didn't answer the question at all, you just paste-dumped something you found on a conspiracy site

I'll repeat the question since asking about your theories seems like kryponite to you

"so let's start off with the shooters, their names? their locations? what guns did they use? at what times and how many times did they fire in relation to Oswald's shots?"

In your words, not a paste-dump thanks, and if you do, please source where you are borrowing the theory from

You asked who the suspected shooters are I provided you with real names. I post whatever I like you don't own this forum.

Eugene Hale Brading was arrested in Dal-Tex building after the shooting acting suspiciously. Brading had links with Carlos Marcello, Santos Trafficante and David Ferrie. Why was he in this building during the time of the shooting?

How likely is he be in the same city when two Kennedy brothers got murdered?
In 1968 Brading was interviewed by the Los Angeles Police Department because of his presence in Los Angeles on the night that Robert Kennedy was murdered.

Two to three shots came from behind. Oswald alone or with someone else? Another shooter team was set up in the Dal Tex building, it right next to TSBD.

Another team was set up on the grassy knoll. And another team was set up near the underpass and south knoll. Two shots came from the front one hitting Kennedy in the throat and the side of the head.

Cheerful Spring

George Joannides story is very important to know so we can figure out what kind of relationship Oswald had with the CIA. He oversaw a group of anti–Castro Cubans with whom Lee Harvey Oswald came into contact in New Orleans three months before the assassination.

In 1978, he was the CIA’s liaison with the House Select Committee on Assassinations. Robert Blakey later suspected foul play by the CIA to cover up.

Some background.

News Report from 2018
15-year lawsuit over mysterious CIA agent drags as final files await a release
https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2018/03/19/jfk-files-15-year-lawsuit-over-mysterious-cia-agent-drags-final-files-await-release/435989002/

The government needs to inform the public of its activities. Morley wants the appeals court in Washington to force the government to pay his legal fees and to get the CIA to reveal some of Joannides' record

Oswald had a bizarre interaction with a DRE member in New Orleans the summer leading up to Kennedy's Nov. 22 murder, in Dallas — to which Oswald moved from New Orleans. And just after the assassination, the DRE publicized that encounter with Oswald, and Oswald's avowed support of Castro.

Committee staffers wanted to know more about Oswald and the DRE, but they were stymied by Joannides and the CIA, who did not tell the committee that the agent handled the DRE in 1963 was ... Joannides himself.

Dohnjoe

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

You asked who the suspected shooters are I provided you with real names.

You didn't.

You pasted a jpg from somewhere, with dozens of names plastered all over it. What is the source? which ones are the shooters?

1. How many shooters were there and what were their names? (just take them from the .jpg then and write them down)
2. How many of them shot at JFK and how many times each? and how many hit their target?
3. What guns did they use in each case?

Cheerful Spring

Dohnjoe wrote: »

You didn't.

You pasted a jpg from somewhere, with dozens of names plastered all over it. What is the source? which ones are the shooters?

1. How many shooters were there and what were their names? (just take them from the .jpg then and write them down)
2. How many of them shot at JFK and how many times each? and how many hit their target?
3. What guns did they use in each case?

There were three to four gunman and back up team of watchers

The alleged assassin on the grassy knoll is Lucien Sarti or Michel Victor Mertz. All we know for sure is the grassy knoll assassin was not American. Howard E hunt confirmed years before he died, the contract was handed to a French hitman and he came through the Mexican border and arrived in Dallas to carry out the killing. He was hired by the Mafia. Mafia sources have also confirmed over the years the assassin on the grassy knoll was French.

The Dal-Tex. The shooter was Charles Nicoletti. He was called to testify in front of the HSCA, he was found murdered before he done that. Eugene Brading was a known Mafia guy and he was arrested in the Dal-Tex building shortly after the shooting, so we know for certain Mafia members were in Dallas. Who else was in this building with Nicoletti and Brading unsure?

South Knoll. It claimed William Seymour, Lawrence Howard, a Cuban exile named Santana was this team mostly CIA connected guys.

Kennedy was hit in the back by a bullet. That shot came from the TSBD or Dal-Tex building.

One bullet missed the target for some reason and hit the curbstone near the underpass. It came from behind.

Gov Connelly was hit by a bullet in the right shoulder.

One bullet came from the front and hit Kennedy in the throat ( South knoll shot or grassy knoll?) I open a small bullet fragment exited through Kennedy's throat or something else like glass caused that wound.

One bullet came from the front and hit Kennedy in the side of the head.

Guns used unknown. We do know the FBI withheld evidence for 30 years about finding different bullets. A 7.65mm bullet was found by the FBI and kept secret.

Dohnjoe

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

There were three to four gunman and back up team of watchers

This is so difficult

Is it 3 or is it 4?

Please break it down simply, give the name of the shooter, where they shot from, and how many shots they fired and where those shots went

e.g. Shooter 1: Joe Bloggs. Location: Grassy Knoll Fired 1 shot from X rifle, the shot came from e.g. hit JFK from the back and exited in direction Y

And can you please confirm you believe that the conspiracy was carried out by the FBI, CIA, LBJ and Mafia?

Is this correct yes or no?

The pic you posted includes the Cubans and Teamsters (Hoffa), do you believe they were involved, yes or no?

The Nal

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

Howard E hunt confirmed years before he died, the contract was handed to a French hitman and he came through the Mexican border and arrived in Dallas to carry out the killing.

Evidence for this please.

Actually Ill save you the hassle. The "French hitman" was in a prison in Marseille on 22nd November 1963.

You're also lying again about Hunts confession. It was a death bed "confession", lead by his two sons who are not reputable - read about them - the claims have been investigated and dismissed.

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

The unpublished portion of those records was initially sealed for 75 years (to 2039) under a general National Archives policy that applied to all federal investigations by the executive branch of government.

Yes I told you that! So you admit you were lying again about all of the info being sealed. Good.

So no evidence then for the rest of it. Just random speculation and a mish mash or irrelevant facts. Everything you waffled on about above has been debunked years ago.

Cheerful Spring

The Nal wrote: »

Evidence for this please.

Actually Ill save you the hassle. The "French hitman" was in a prison in Marseille on 22nd November 1963.

You're also lying again about Hunts confession. It was a death bed "confession", lead by his two sons who are not reputable - read about them - the claims have been investigated and dismissed.



Yes I told you that! So you admit you were lying again about all of the info being sealed. Good.

So no evidence then for the rest of it. Just random speculation and a mish mash or irrelevant facts. Everything you waffled on about above has been debunked years ago.

If Lucien Sarti was in prison there had to be a record of that and nobody produced that record and certainly not the French authorities. All evidence shows Sarti was a freeman during the assassination of Kennedy If you can produce a prison record we can rule him out as one of the French hitmen.

Howard E hunt produced the tape for his son only seven years before he died. He expanded on the tapes shortly before he died. He never said tell the world about this. His son released the tapes after he died, wrong or rightly. You dismiss Howard Hunt even though well known he was involved in one of biggest US scandals in American history (Watergate) and was deeply involved in CIA black projects. Howard E hunt was lucid when he was talking about who conspired to kill Kennedy. You swear he was punch drunk and was mumbling his words

Debunked years ago:rolleyes:

Cheerful Spring

Dohnjoe wrote: »

This is so difficult

Is it 3 or is it 4?

Please break it down simply, give the name of the shooter, where they shot from, and how many shots they fired and where those shots went

e.g. Shooter 1: Joe Bloggs. Location: Grassy Knoll Fired 1 shot from X rifle, the shot came from e.g. hit JFK from the back and exited in direction Y

And can you please confirm you believe that the conspiracy was carried out by the FBI, CIA, LBJ and Mafia?

Is this correct yes or no?

The pic you posted includes the Cubans and Teamsters (Hoffa), do you believe they were involved, yes or no?

Not difficult at all unless you want it to be?. I listed the shooters you asked for with their names, no need to debate this with you anymore.

I just told you where the shots came from, can you read?

Just for clarification shots from behind.
One bullet I believe lodged or broke apart in Kennedy's chest area after it entered through the back of Kennedy. This bullet was traced back to the 3rd floor of Dal-Tex building by a laser.

One bullet fired from TSBD or Dal-Tex building missed completely and hit a curbstone near the triple underpass.

One bullet fired from the TSBD or Dal-Tex building hit Gov Connelly near the right shoulder, and left the chest near the right nipple, and hit his wrist and thigh.

Just for clarification shots from the front.

One bullet entered through the throat area or small piece of a bullet exited through the throat area. The wound in the throat area was too small for a full bullet exit wound. If it was bullet it came in from the south knoll area near the underpass.

One bullet hit Kennedy at the side of the head, Grassy Knoll.

CIA and Mafia were involved in the shooting. FBI covered up the evidence under hoover direction.

The Nal

More fact free waffle above. Thats 4 or 5 shots but 80%+ of the people there heard 3 shots. Only 5% heard 4 shots or more.

This is an excellent documentary for anyone interested. Fairly rare. Completely debunks Jim Garrisons case, The Men Who Killed Kennedy and most of the nonsense Cheerful Spring has been posting.

Cheerful Spring

The Nal wrote: »

More fact free waffle above. Thats 4 or 5 shots but 80%+ of the people there heard 3 shots. Only 5% heard 4 shots or more.

This is an excellent documentary for anyone interested. Fairly rare. Completely debunks Jim Garrisons case, The Men Who Killed Kennedy and most of the nonsense Cheerful Spring has been posting.

Shots came in not far apart 1 to 2 seconds. Easily can be confused by the number of shots fired, that day. Jean Hill heard 4 to 5 shots and she was right next to the car Kennedy was travelling in. She even on the record that she was brought into office by two men and she was told forcibly there only three shots before it was even known to be. She was told don't be saying there 4 to 5 shots or you be in trouble. Over 50 years the witnesses are bombarded with the three shots story.

The Nal

3 shots were reported within seconds of the shooting. You ignore 95% of people if you want to suit your agenda. Let the rest of us deal with facts.

Cheerful Spring

The Nal wrote: »

3 shots were reported within seconds of the shooting. You ignore 95% of people if you want to suit your agenda. Let the rest of us deal with facts.

Really show me those witnesses statements from the day of the shooting. Not collected data that was done months and years after the fact, when the official cover story got spread and witnesses were told what to say. Jean hill had no reason to lie.

The Nal

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

Really show me those witnesses statements from the day of the shooting. Not collected data that was done months and years after the fact, when the official cover story got spread and witnesses were told what to say. Jean hill had no reason to lie.

But the other 95% of people did have a reason to lie.

Right.

King Mob

The Nal wrote: »

But the other 95% of people did have a reason to lie.

Right.

They were all involved with the conspiracy, along with the FBI, CIA, the Mafia, the teamsters, the lizard people, the Mythbusters...

Cheerful Spring

Anyway it nuts that you guys believe a bullet can be undeformed when hits the clothing of Kennedy, then enters his back, moves through the chest, bruises Kennedy right lung, moves out through the throat area, does a magical side tumble, then moves through Connelly clothing, enters through his back right shoulder, travels in the chest, shatters the fifth rib 10cm then, exits out near the right nipple breaking flesh in the chest again,then hits Connelly wrist bone and fractures it and then embeds bullet fragments in the thigh and loses only some metal at the back of the bullet.

Cheerful Spring

The Nal wrote: »

But the other 95% of people did have a reason to lie.

Right.

Majority of the eyewitnesses reported shots coming from the grassy knoll. Three shots cannot be correct.

Dohnjoe

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

Not difficult at all unless you want it to be?. I listed the shooters you asked for with their names, no need to debate this with you anymore.

You are deliberately being obscure and vague, which is why I am trying to pin down the details

Simple question, name the shooters, here is your response

The alleged assassin on the grassy knoll is Lucien Sarti or Michel Victor Mertz. All we know for sure is the grassy knoll assassin was not American. Howard E hunt confirmed years before he died, the contract was handed to a French hitman and he came through the Mexican border and arrived in Dallas to carry out the killing. He was hired by the Mafia. Mafia sources have also confirmed over the years the assassin on the grassy knoll was French.

Your response: the shooter is Lucien Sarti or Michel Victor Mertz or someone not American or a French hitman

That doesn't answer the question.

You then go on to "name" the other shooters, but you again fill it full of random speculation and waffle

he Dal-Tex. The shooter was Charles Nicoletti. He was called to testify in front of the HSCA, he was found murdered before he done that. Eugene Brading was a known Mafia guy and he was arrested in the Dal-Tex building shortly after the shooting, so we know for certain Mafia members were in Dallas. Who else was in this building with Nicoletti and Brading unsure?

South Knoll. It claimed William Seymour, Lawrence Howard, a Cuban exile named Santana was this team mostly CIA connected guys.

So once again, list the shooters and their locations. No waffle, no speculation.

In response to my question about your theory on who was involved

CIA and Mafia were involved in the shooting. FBI covered up the evidence under hoover direction.

Good. Can you explain what the references to the Cubans and Hoffa are in the picture you posted?

The Nal

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

Majority of the eyewitnesses reported shots coming from the grassy knoll. Three shots cannot be correct.

We've been through this. You haven't read their statements. I have. You won't because it doesn't support your agenda. More people claim to have heard 2 shots than 4 or more.

The same people you falsely and ignorantly claim heard shots from the knoll also heard 3 shots. So you take the "heard shots from the knoll" as gospel but then also reject what the same people say about the number of shots which is utterly ridiculous.

Cheerful Spring

Dohnjoe wrote: »

You are deliberately being obscure and vague, which is why I am trying to pin down the details

Simple question, name the shooters, here is your response



Your response: the shooter is Lucien Sarti or Michel Victor Mertz or someone not American or a French hitman

That doesn't answer the question.

You then go on to "name" the other shooters, but you again fill it full of random speculation and waffle



So once again, list the shooters and their locations. No waffle, no speculation.

In response to my question about your theory on who was involved

Good. Can you explain what the references to the Cubans and Hoffa are in the picture you posted?

Howard E hunt and Mafia figures have said the grassy knoll shooter was hired by Carlos Marcello. A French hitman from Europe. We have two different sources to pin down who fired the gun. Ruby was Carlos Marcello man in Dallas. It no coincidence Oswald was taken out by Ruby two days later. An informer for the FBI revealed in the 70s that Carlos Marcello revealed to him why Ruby was involved. He was heavily in debt and could not pay it back. Carlos Marcello said he wipe that debt if he took out Oswald for them.

Cuban exiles working with the CIA. The sniper team were Cuban Exiles working with the CIA.

Hoffa connection with the Kennedy, links with the Mafia. He was aware of the plan by the Mafia to take out Kennedy in Chicago.