I will never visit Moville

Graniteville

enricoh wrote: »

I basically winning the lotto for the hotel owner. actually no, its like winning the euro millions, god bless paddy taxpayer -

.

So why are many centres ending their agreements and turning their places back into commercial businesses?

Also, those in dp are now entitled to work and contribute to the costs and pay taxes. (over 500 are now employed)

But the racist anti dp types would never mention that.

Firblog

enricoh wrote: »

I basically winning the lotto for the hotel owner. actually no, its like winning the euro millions, god bless paddy taxpayer -

Mosney plc operates a direct provision centre for 600 asylum seekers at Mosney in County Meath and the €8m it received last year brings to €127.4m the company has received from the State between 2002 and 2017 for its direct provision service.

8,000,000 / (600 X 365) = €36.365 per person per day = cost to the state for person in Direct provision. (Plus a couple of euro per week for walkabout money)

Graniteville wrote: »

Also, those in dp are now entitled to work and contribute to the costs and pay taxes. (over 500 are now employed)

But the racist anti dp types would never mention that.

I'm sure there are many people who are very anti Direct Provision that would be stunned to be called racist.

malinheader

Graniteville wrote: »

So why are many centres ending their agreements and turning their places back into commercial businesses?

Also, those in dp are now entitled to work and contribute to the costs and pay taxes. (over 500 are now employed)

But the racist anti dp types would never mention that.

Ahh the racist shout again. Ask a question that some people think you shouldn't be asking or ask a question that some people don't want people to know and your racist. No surprise at your post to be honest.

Spanish Eyes

Ask yourselves this question..... why are traffickers getting these people to Ireland, as opposed to Bulgaria, Romania, Albania and even UK god bless us?

The answer is obvious. But some refuse to believe that we are being had.

Anyway the soft touchy feely shyte has started now. How welcoming the people of Moville are, everyone in Ireland wants to help people in distress.

Apart from UN sanctioned and vetted Syrian refugees, I reckon the rest of them are scamming a leaky system. Everyone knows it.

Our own indigenous population really needs looking after too.

Anyway, before I lose my rag, they are laughing out loud at our naivety. And the refugee industry is stifling debate by the use of the R word too. It's a disgrace Joe.

TireeTerror

Its got to the stage these days that if I get called a racist I know I'm asking the questions everyone really wants to ask but is too afraid to. If that continues, being called a racist will start meaning you have your finger on the pulse.

enricoh

Whats the disability allowance in Bulgaria? Probably a tenner a week, that aint gonna butter no parsnips!

Well the owner of mosney is now in the irish times rich list so there must be a few quid in it!

Gimme A Pound

The irony of condemning racism and then condemning the whole village for an act by one or two people.

malinheader

Are the communities in these areas asked how they feel about these centres or even informed of what is being planned for a hotel near them or is the decision made without consultation. First I heard of this myself was in a local paper.

tretorn

If the local people were to be consulted nothing would happen.

This is why these isolated areas are chosen, there simply isnt the population to mount an effective protest. Donegal is forgotten about, it has one of the worst road traffic accident fatalitities in the country so obviously not enough Gardai to monitor drunk and or dangerous driving.

This is the home of the Mc Brearty scandal too and its not somewhere I would choose to go on holidays, I wouuldnt feel safe either walking or driving because of the amount of lunatics on the roads.

I am actually not surprised the hotel was burned down and if its repaired and re opened it will be burned down again. Its a totally unsuitable location no matter what criteria you take into account and its definitely designed to make refugees and asylum seekers leave for somewhere else as soon as possible. If people sent to a place like this just up and leave will it be possible to identify where they have gone so they can be deported ASAP.

L1011

tretorn wrote: »

This is why these isolated areas are chosen, there simply isnt the population to mount an effective protest.

They're chosen because they have cheap hotels that aren't making enough money from tourism. Wicklow Town isn't exactly isolated, nor is Clondalkin (Clondalkin Towers hotel has been a DP centre for years)

Fann Linn

malinheader wrote: »

Are the communities in these areas asked how they feel about these centres or even informed of what is being planned for a hotel near them or is the decision made without consultation. First I heard of this myself was in a local paper.

That's how the people of Roosky found out also. Locals aren't really part of the equation. Hotels might start getting burnt down.

mgn

Great to see the do gooders out in force again.I bet if a 100 refuges were to be housed beside them the would have a different story.A typical example would be like the homeless hub in Clontarf.The had plenty of the usual type who preach about homeless but are very quick to object when its beside them.Or like Lord of the Manor Pat Kenny objecting to planning permission beside is stately home after preaching about the housing crisis for the last few years.

4068ac1elhodqr

So anyone thinking of building cheap hotels (possibly using grant, industry or enterprise supported funds),
can now add to their business plan, a short footnote on the appendix at the back, for a simple low-cost, high-yield, 'Plan B' option.
Suits the owner and suits the bank manager. Suits the town?

I.e. Sure we did our market research on footfall and location for likely customer catchment areas before building it, and don't mind spending a couple of bob on marketing, innovation and staff investment if needed.

...But should a lovely big monthly check come in from some pen pusher, mmm yes that'll do nicely.

L1011

Brooklyn Unkempt Starvation wrote: »

So anyone thinking of building cheap hotels (possibly using grant, industry or enterprise supported funds),
can now add to their business plan, a short footnote on the appendix at the back, for a simple low-cost, high-yield, 'Plan B' option.
Suits the owner and suits the bank manager. Suits the town?

I.e. Sure we did our market research on footfall and location for likely customer catchment areas before building it, and don't mind spending a couple of bob on marketing, innovation and staff investment if needed.

...But should a lovely big monthly check come in from some pen pusher, mmm yes that'll do nicely.

There are no grants or enterprise support and you aren't going to get loans for a hotel with that business plan either. And its far from a "big monthly check" at that. Board and food for 36 quid a head (taking the Mosney figures) isn't going to leave much margin and would not come close to covering finance costs.

You're fantasising.

This is an old, long established hotel in an area where traditional tourism and commercial traveler business has fallen off a cliff, and competing with newer hotels would require hefty investment.

malinheader

L1011 wrote: »

There are no grants or enterprise support and you aren't going to get loans for a hotel with that business plan either. And its far from a "big monthly check" at that. Board and food for 36 quid a head (taking the Mosney figures) isn't going to leave much margin and would not come close to covering finance costs.

You're fantasising.

This is an old, long established hotel in an area where traditional tourism and commercial traveler business has fallen off a cliff, and competing with newer hotels would require hefty investment.

Over 25000 a week 52 weeks of the year. Guaranteed. And I'm led to believe it's mainly self catering. Would there be many rural hotels making this kind of turnover every week. And no hefty investment needed.

L1011

malinheader wrote: »

Over 25000 a week 52 weeks of the year. Guaranteed. And I'm led to believe it's mainly self catering. Would there be many rural hotels making this kind of turnover every week. And no hefty investment needed.

Work out the daily rate for 100 people at that. And it really isn't mostly self-catering - converting the hotel to provide that would be hefty investment and the residents don't have the cash to buy the food anyway. DP is full-board whether the food is eaten or not and there is almost always complexities in provision (halal, vegeterian, etc)

Its clearly going to make more than operating a run down rural hotel - or else they wouldn't do it, would they - but its no goldmine. The difference is going to come from getting that income on a wet week in December every December, despite the total margin being well below what a decent summer brings.

malinheader

L1011 wrote: »

Work out the daily rate for 100 people at that. And it really isn't mostly self-catering - converting the hotel to provide that would be hefty investment and the residents don't have the cash to buy the food anyway. DP is full-board whether the food is eaten or not and there is almost always complexities in provision (halal, vegeterian, etc)

Its clearly going to make more than operating a run down rural hotel - or else they wouldn't do it, would they - but its no goldmine. The difference is going to come from getting that income on a wet week in December every December, despite the total margin being well below what a decent summer brings.

Mosney as far as I know is self catering and other places put in communal areas for cooking due to the different dietary requirements for different cultures. Not sure what was to happen in Moville.But i think 25000 a week guaranteed would be a lot more than a local hotel would make over 52 weeks of a year. Stand to be corrected on this as I have no idea what a hotel would call good.

L1011

They all provide food, its part of the contract.

Its definitely more money than they'd take in - but with massively increased costs. Clearly the owners expect to make more profit from it but it's no lotto win or even close.

malinheader

Is it still a condition that you have to leave the hotel from 11 am till 5pm or has this changed or was it never a requirement do you know.

L1011

That'd be down to the DP centre itself I'd imagine but I've never heard of it. Its common for homeless shelters though

If you have more time to burn than is healthy there are detailed inspection reports on DP centres here - http://www.ria-inspections.gov.ie - which detail everything from the food provided down to when their fire alarm panels were last service. They're scans of printed documents for some idiotic reason so you can't search the damn things.

The hotel in Clondalkin I mentioned is apparently closing as a DP centre in two weeks, suspect so it can re-open as a hotel. Clondalkin is clearly a massively different market to Moville!

recedite

Contract values from some previous years are shown here.

Mosney seemed to be mostly €6.617 M per year, for 600 persons.
That is €11K per person/year, or €30/day.

Moville Holiday Hostel in 2004 took in €83,187 in contracts, for 12 persons.
That is €6,932 per person/year, or €20/day.
It would be interesting to know why the hostel discontinued.

Anyway, these figures do not represent particularly bad value for the taxpayer on a per person basis. But what is staggering is the overall scale of the asylum industry, and the speed of its growth. And the fact that it seems to be almost considered as a replacement for the tourism industry. Despite the fact that one of these industries costs the country money, and the other brings money into the country.
They are opposites in many respects, not alternatives to each other.


Now check the latest Reception and Colonisation Agency monthly report.

A couple of things jump out at me.
The pie chart on P.8; the dominant group by far are young single males. These are exactly the kind of people who need to be working, if they are left hanging around for years doing nothing they will get themselves into trouble. That is not a racist comment, it applies to young single males anywhere in the world. But it is forbidden for asylum seekers to work.

The map of Ireland on P.13. It shows the distribution of DP centres and hence the migrants. There are a couple of obvious gaps that "need" to be filled in... Donegal, Wicklow and Mayo.

The top 5 countries they came from in 2017; Syria, Georgia, Albania, Zimbabwe, Pakistan, Nigeria.
Of those, only Syria was at war, and that civil war is more or less finishing up now with the Islamic State having been defeated.

Albania and Georgia are well known as centres of eastern european organised crime, and are the hub of people trafficking routes into the EU from Africa and Asia, which is a major moneyspinning industry for mafia types.

Pakistan has a population more than 200 million people and rapidly growing. They can supply as many asylum seekers as we want.
Nigeria has a similar population. Both it and Zimbabwe are corrupt countries that possess a wealth of natural resources. Nigeria has a huge amount of oil, and Zimbabwe (formerly Rhodesia) has some of the best farmland in the world. Why are these people coming to colonise Ireland? Quite simply, its because most of them are opportunists and we offer them free stuff.

We are a small country of 4.7 million living on a windswept island with no great resources, other than the hardworking people who live on it.
The big question is WHY are we doing this to ourselves?

malinheader

The irony is were not doing it to ourselves it is being pushed upon a lot of places without a say in the matter. Look if this sounds racist so be it.I cannot figure this out perhaps I'm missing something but nearly every day on radio and tv there is a piece about immigrants and asylum seekers being put up in direct provision or becoming citizens in the next piece it's some poor man or woman having to wait 2 or 3 years for a hip replacement or some patients having to travel 5 or 6 hours to Galway and that's only a few examples of how the services in this country are failing it's own people. I could go on the list is endless. Do people not think we should get our own country in order to meet the demands of our population before bringing in more people into an already broken system.

Nokia6230i

What's not helping the situation is lack of services being provided and I understand the anger as a result.

Would it placate me if increased SNAs, Language Resource Teachers were part of the plan? Yes
Would it please me if school spaces increased along with the number of teachers and bus services to & from the local Primary, National and Secondary Schools? Yes.
Would I be happier if my GP, Dr. & Nurse were provided with Locums and other assistance via a Medical Centre perhaps?
Yes.

All this would benefit the community generally; if you've already got waiting times to see your GP, Dr., PHN, Psychologist, Psychiatrist then you're going to fear the impact of 100 People being "dumped" into your community.

Having the services in place locally in advance of their arrival would mean the likes of Gran Torino, the Liberal, Identity Ireland, National Party, Kilkenny Journal, Burkean Journal could be told to do one with their pitchforks.

The other issue is Moville means some A/S will have to travel to Dublin to sign in at the INIS at Burgh Quay etc.; how do we expect someone to integrate if they're gone out of the community for a day or two each week etc.?

This should be achievable locally via INIS Outreach Centres; even in Letterkenny or Donegal Town where it's only an hour there and back.

I'm not in favour of DP; we made a hames of it and aren't helping those in it; we're only greasing the palms of the lawyers involved and the operators of these centres.

We're warehousing people like prisoners; we did it to women and children; now we're doing it to men, women and children.

We need to streamline the situation to make better value for tax payers; currently I think it's apply, get refused, appeal, get refused, appeal to High Ct., get refused and all this can drag on and on for months, for years; this is unfair on the applicant and it makes it less easier to deport them.

To my knowledge this process can begin again; you simply reapply for asylum; it should be incarceration following a refusal to remain for a brief period and then being escorted to a country outside of the EU if not their home country.

Deportation is something that is rare as hens teeth; I can't fathom why.
If you've done all the aforementioned you've had your three turns at it, you've had weeks, months, years to get yours together in terms of documents to back up your claim.

Our system isn't working for anybody but the operators and lawyers.

malinheader

The system is definitely not working and when you keep adding more and more pressure on it how will it ever be fixed. Some decisions these politicians make sometimes makes me wonder if there calling the shots or is it the EU .

Greasy Tool

malinheader wrote: »

The system is definitely not working and when you keep adding more and more pressure on it how will it ever be fixed. Some decisions these politicians make sometimes makes me wonder if there calling the shots or is it the EU .

Why would Varadker ( the unelected Indian ) , or those who put him in, care about the Irish people ? They are globalists . They hold the Irish people in blatant contempt , and if you question immigration in any way shape or form you will be labelled a racist . I see a new DPC was feted at the Hotel Rosslare in Wexford without any consultation with the community . "Our" politicians will sell us out without a moments hesitation if it gets them a cushy EU/UN position to top up the meagre govt pension .

Allinall

Greasy Tool wrote: »

Why would Varadker ( the unelected Indian ) , or those who put him in, care about the Irish people ? They are globalists . They hate the Irish , and if you question immigration in any way shape or form you will be labelled a racist . I see a new DPC was feted at the Hotel Rosslare in Wexford without any consultation with the community . "Our" politicians will sell us out without a moments hesitation if it gets them a cushy EU/UN position to top up the meagre govt pension .

Lots of racism and ignorance in that post.

Not a clue.

Greasy Tool

Graniteville wrote: »

Obviously a lot of racist scum in the town with this fire
https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/gardai-investigating-fire-that-caused-extensive-damage-to-hotel-due-to-be-used-as-direct-provision-centre-37563307.html

Well, if that's the type of people that live in the town, I for one will not be revisiting it. (OK, just saying this to get a reaction)

Maybe I'll have the wrong accent and a local will take umbrage. Maybe a friend will have the wrong colour skin or maybe they'll be from another country and the racist scum that obviously permeate the Moville area will decide they are not welcome.

Edit...
Interesting reaction from posters. But towns like moville need to be very wary of a certain type of person that rouses trouble and can cause untold damage to the locality.

Moville and Greencastle are fantastic places, yet all the news about Moville in the past few days has been about how a small minority are small minded racists. Unfortunately, like many small minded people, they shout loudly and get heard above the quiet, more decent / intelligent folk that are the vast majority of residents in the area.

Jaysus , if the OP takes that attitude s/he'll be running out of places to visit fairly soon by the look of things , lol !! I'd give Rosslare a wide berth if I was him/her !!

Nokia6230i

Greasy Tool wrote: »

Why would Varadker ( the unelected Indian ) , or those who put him in, care about the Irish people ? They are globalists . They hold the Irish people in blatant contempt , and if you question immigration in any way shape or form you will be labelled a racist . I see a new DPC was feted at the Hotel Rosslare in Wexford without any consultation with the community . "Our" politicians will sell us out without a moments hesitation if it gets them a cushy EU/UN position to top up the meagre govt pension .

Where do I start?

An Taoiseach is NOT Indian. He was born here and he was born here prior to the inherently racist 2004 Referendum which a lot of people were hoodwinked by.

The DPC in Hotel Rosslare didn't happen; fake news; it was spread by an Irish Right Wing Facebook and Twitter account which bears no responsibility and takes no accountability for anything wrong it says.

Unelected? Is it because LV is "Indian" you're saying that?

Because Leo was elected; I appreciate politics isn't your strong suit.

Gaspode

We've had a mod warning on this thread already, it's getting dangerously close to being locked. Be civil, make sense and back up your posts.

recedite

Nokia6230i wrote: »

An Taoiseach is NOT Indian. He was born here and he was born here prior to the inherently racist 2004 Referendum which a lot of people were hoodwinked by.

The referendum was not "racist" and by saying it was, you insult the people of Ireland who passed it. The whole notion that people could come here just to drop "anchor babies" which would get EU passports for the whole family was unsustainable.


Leo's own family call him "a Global Indian". He spent several years living in India as an intern. I'd call him an Irishman of Indian heritage.

When Prime Minister Narendra Modi talks of global Indians, says Shubhada, there cannot be a better example of it that their cousin who is the new Prime Minister of Ireland. "Leo has Indian roots and is the first Indian origin PM of Ireland," she said.

He became Taoiseach as a result of an internal coup within his political party, and not as a result of a general election. All of which was lawful. Nevertheless, the people of Ireland did not place him in that role.


Were taking in migrants now that have become a problem in Calais and Greece, because they have sneaked into those places and then got stuck there after being unable to get to their preferred destination countries (UK, Germany Sweden)
Its not Leo's Indian heritage that is bringing us these problems, its his doffing of the cap to Brussels.