Nissan Leaf 60kWh

Mike9832

Agree samih

€30,000 Leaf40
€35,000 Leaf60

Is a fair price

krissovo

This guy (Alex on Autos) has become my go to resource for impartial reviews in recent months and he has done a nice one on on the Leaf+. He compares it to the e-Niro, Kona and model 3 with well balanced arguments but ultimately recommends the 40kw leaf or the Model 3 & e-Niro for the longer range EV's.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bXlA7-bMf8o

Padraig Mor

€42100 for the range topping SVE on the road including metallic paint. 40kWh starting from €29690 now. Confirmed on Facebook by a Nissan dealer.

Mike9832

Padraig Mor wrote: »

€42100 for the range topping SVE on the road including metallic paint. 40kWh starting from €29690 now. Confirmed on Facebook by a Nissan dealer.

In nearly 10 years the Nissan Leaf has went from 100km range and €28000 to 300km range and €42000

That's some progress

How much will the 500km Leaf cost lol

Fitz2011

Padraig Mor wrote: »

€42100 for the range topping SVE on the road including metallic paint. 40kWh starting from €29690 now. Confirmed on Facebook by a Nissan dealer.

Absolute madness! Can’t see them selling well! I’d sooner wait a year or two when there should be a lot more competition. At that price you would have to be a high mileage driver to get some value back from fuel savings but for the average driver it doesn’t make sense to switch from an ice to an ev!

Padraig Mor

Mike9832 wrote: »

In nearly 10 years the Nissan Leaf has went from 100km range and €28000 to 300km range and €42000

That's some progress

How much will the 500km Leaf cost lol

It's closer to 400km range but of course you knew that.

Having said that, I bought a 40kWh SVE less than a year ago and its OTR price was €34200 - so that's an extra ~€8000 for the 62kWh. Even allowing for the fact that they've raised the 40kWh too..... it's enough really isn't it? If I was paying 40k+ for an EV it'd be hard to look beyond spending more and getting a Model 3 TBH.

Zenith74

Mike9832 wrote: »

In nearly 10 years the Nissan Leaf has went from 100km range and €28000 to 300km range and €42000

That's some progress

How much will the 500km Leaf cost lol

Ah give over will you. The original Leaf was €29,995 and the same spec Leaf40 is basically the same price today. The real punchline here is that the Leaf has nearly doubled in range for the same money since it arrived. Could it be better sure, but that’s by no means terrible.

The difference this time is that Nissan makes a healthy profit per car instead of losing money like they did at the beginning.

Shefwedfan

Padraig Mor wrote: »

€42100 for the range topping SVE on the road including metallic paint. 40kWh starting from €29690 now. Confirmed on Facebook by a Nissan dealer.

Any news of the supposed “new model” leaf 2 40kWh?

Zenith74

samih wrote: »

The difference this time is that Nissan makes a healthy profit per car instead of losing money like they did at the beginning.

Do you think so? If you factor in inflation, the 2010 €29995 Leaf should be €35k today, Nissan will be seeing increased costs in lots of areas except maybe the batteries (not sure if a 40mWh battery today would cost similar to a 24kWh in 2010?). Not sure there are huge profits there, but not a clue tbh.

Shefwedfan

Cost of car are going up and not down. How much did a RAV 4 start at a few years ago? Now walk in and for base your nearly 40k

The old avensis, the Toyota work horse, withdrawn and gone, it’s replacement? Well a 40k Toyota Camry

Just giving Toyota as example but all of them are pushing up price, whyyou think Nissan kicked the Pulsar? Too cheap, flog a qashqai or leaf to same punter at 30k

porsche boy

Shefwedfan wrote:

... why you think Nissan kicked the Pulsar? Too cheap, flog a qashqai or leaf to same punter at 30k

The pulsar demise is not to do with price as profit percentage is similar to Qashqai & Juke. Pulsar was dropped because the sales flatlined, actually they never really took off. There is little demand for small hatchbacks/saloons these days. My opinion would be that if the trend for softroaders continues the only saloons being built will be executive yokes from Germany.

Mike9832

Padraig Mor wrote: »

Mike9832 wrote: »

In nearly 10 years the Nissan Leaf has went from 100km range and €28000 to 300km range and €42000

That's some progress

How much will the 500km Leaf cost lol

It's closer to 400km range but of course you knew that

Its 385km and of course the Leaf40 will get 285km

Looking at it now its even worse than I thought

€10,000 for an extra 100km range

ELM327

Mike9832 wrote: »

Its 385km and of course the Leaf40 will get 285km

Looking at it now its even worse than I thought

€10,000 for an extra 100km range

not unless you drive at 40km/h or flintstone the last 50-70km it wont

Mike9832

Good review here

https://youtu.be/G4BWU72eA0Y

Charge rates seem pretty crap, struggling to get 40kW on some charges

He mentioned something about 2 hours to get from empty to full on rapid chargers, must really slow down charge rate at high SOC

Bjorn is supposed to get one in July for testing, we will know then

Hopefully he will do performance tests too, it looks quick

Gumbo

Mike9832 wrote: »

In nearly 10 years the Nissan Leaf has went from 100km range and €28000 to 300km range and €42000

That's some progress

How much will the 500km Leaf cost lol

Your not comparing like for like.
At least if you compared like for like, your posts can be taken slightly seriously.

The Leaf 1 at 28k was the base version.
The leaf 2 at 42k is the top version SVE.

Compare both base level prices or both top level prices please for a fair comparison.

Mike9832

kceire wrote: »

Mike9832 wrote: »

In nearly 10 years the Nissan Leaf has went from 100km range and €28000 to 300km range and €42000

That's some progress

How much will the 500km Leaf cost lol

Your not comparing like for like.
At least if you compared like for like, your posts can be taken slightly seriously.

The Leaf 1 at 28k was the base version.
The leaf 2 at 42k is the top version SVE.

Compare both base level prices or both top level prices please for a fair comparison.

Base level doesn't exist

Heard nothing about base Leaf60

Gumbo

Mike9832 wrote: »

Base level doesn't exist

Heard nothing about base Leaf60

Then compare it to too spec SVE of the Gen 1. Surely that’s a more reasoned comparison??

So €37k V €42k

catharsis

kceire wrote: »

Then compare it to too spec SVE of the Gen 1. Surely that’s a more reasoned comparison??

So €37k V €42k

Leaf40 SVE was 33,400 including the delivery charge (so actually 32400?) so not sure where you got the 37K number?

[edited to add]

specifically my quote from Nissan for my Leaf40 in may 2018 was base price €43,600.00 and the quote for a 60KWH SVE in May 2019 was €51,800

same garage, same salesman, same basis

this is an increase of €8,200 - those are the facts.

Old diesel

Mike9832 wrote: »

Good review here

https://youtu.be/G4BWU72eA0Y

Charge rates seem pretty crap, struggling to get 40kW on some charges

He mentioned something about 2 hours to get from empty to full on rapid chargers, must really slow down charge rate at high SOC

Bjorn is supposed to get one in July for testing, we will know then

Hopefully he will do performance tests too, it looks quick

If you see looking to do 0 to 100 percent then it's going to be slow.

Who was the youtuber?????

Mike9832

Old diesel wrote: »

If you see looking to do 0 to 100 percent then it's going to be slow.

Who was the youtuber?????

Mentiond here too 0-80% meant I think

Anyway this guy confirms Leaf60 has rapidgate, the dog was getting 20kW at the end of his trip

Nissan are a disgrace

https://youtu.be/sHS2LPNo8VQ

Shefwedfan

Any details on the updated Leaf 40?

Old diesel

While it does still throttle charging - this test does seem to confirm other initial reports online that L62 is not quite as bad as L40 in terms of how hot the battery runs.

Most bizarre thing is how the battery appears to drop back all of a sudden to 19 kw part way through the charge.

The 1st charge rapidgate on his return actually appeared according to the charger to start at 28 kw.

But it was doing 19 kw at 53 percent.

This also happened at the 1st charge on the previous day where the car started at 43 kw yet was at 19 kw when he returned from his dinner and car was at 64 percent.

Old diesel

So the "not quite as bad as L40 in terms of the battery getting hot".

On the first day after nearly 500 kms of driving with a lot of 120 to 130 km/hr driving the L62 was at 48/49 degrees on arrival at 2nd charge.

Several degrees lower then I'd expect an L40 to be.

It also managed on the last leg of day 2 to not get up to 54/55 degrees even at 110 km/h driving at 24 degrees.

It's STILL not good enough though - but will likely be okay in most Irish driving scenarios.

In Irish conditions it looks to me like we are looking at.....

180 miles to 1st charge - full speed 1st charge.

360 to 400 miles in a day manageable.

Too expensive for what it offers though

Mike9832

Old diesel wrote: »

So the "not quite as bad as L40 in terms of the battery getting hot".

On the first day after nearly 500 kms of driving with a lot of 120 to 130 km/hr driving the L62 was at 48/49 degrees on arrival at 2nd charge.

Several degrees lower then I'd expect an L40 to be.

It also managed on the last leg of day 2 to not get up to 54/55 degrees even at 110 km/h driving at 24 degrees.

It's STILL not good enough though - but will likely be okay in most Irish driving scenarios.

In Irish conditions it looks to me like we are looking at.....

180 miles to 1st charge - full speed 1st charge.

360 to 400 miles in a day manageable.

Too expensive for what it offers though

Agree it's manageable here in our climate, still a disgrace

For that money it should be top class

Did you see the part where his feet were getting warm lol 😂

Underfloor heating as standard in Leaf60

Shefwedfan

Old diesel wrote: »

180 miles to 1st charge - full speed 1st charge.

360 to 400 miles in a day manageable.

Too expensive for what it offers though

Where exactly would you go in Ireland to cover 400 miles in a day?

If doing that distance then diesel is best option.....

Silent Running

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Where exactly would you go in Ireland to cover 400 miles in a day?

If doing that distance then diesel is best option.....

I'm sorry, but that's bollix.

Before Christmas I drove the Ioniq from Wexford to Malin Head, and back again a week later. I regularly drive over 200 kms and back in one day. Now I have the Niro, there will be fewer stops as most of those journeys will be done without a charge.

Diesel me hole!

Shefwedfan

Silent Running wrote: »

I'm sorry, but that's bollix.

Before Christmas I drove the Ioniq from Wexford to Malin Head, and back again a week later. I regularly drive over 200 kms and back in one day. Now I have the Niro, there will be fewer stops as most of those journeys will be done without a charge.

Diesel me hole!

200km v 400miles

They are talking about over 600km in a day

Silent Running

Shefwedfan wrote: »

200km v 400miles

They are talking about over 600km in a day

Ah, sorry. I live in Ireland, we use Kms here.

Shefwedfan

Silent Running wrote: »

Ah, sorry. I live in Ireland, we use Kms here.

So do I, hence why I converted

Every time a new car comes out the requirement get more and more unrealistic. A100kWh car will come out and people will be talking about 1000km in a day

kuro68k

If it's anything like the 40 the issue will be overheating in warm weather. With the 40 we had people getting hit with rapidgate on the first charge.

Some videos coming out show that the 62 is also affected by rapidgate, but maybe not as badly. It's too early to say.

Because the Leaf is so inefficient the realistic range is probably about 300km on the motorway (100-120kph). It's decent but only if you can then charge at a decent rate.

Soarer

Silent Running wrote: »

I'm sorry, but that's bollix.

Before Christmas I drove the Ioniq from Wexford to Malin Head, and back again a week later. I regularly drive over 200 kms and back in one day. Now I have the Niro, there will be fewer stops as most of those journeys will be done without a charge.

Diesel me hole!

Never let the facts get in the way of a good Ioniq story! 😉

Nedved85

Shefwedfan wrote: »

200km v 400miles

They are talking about over 600km in a day

A few times a year I do an IKEA run from Cork to Dublin, aswell as going to Croke Park for a few games. The Chademo accessibility problem combined with Rapidgate are a serious issue here. Kona, eNiro and Model 3 are much better options.

Silent Running

Soarer wrote: »

Never let the facts get in the way of a good Ioniq story! 😉

Well what would you have me say, it's the truth.

I know you're emotionally invested in the Leaf. What is it about people calling Ioniq drivers liars?

I'm not an Ioniq fanboy. I don't even own an Ioniq now. The fact remains that it's a fantastic EV and does so much with such a small battery, which, combined with a fast charging speed, makes it a quick car to charge, which makes it a viable long journey car.

In my opinion, anyone buying a Leaf over an Ioniq needs their head seen to. The only thing favouring the Leaf is supply. No thermal management on even the newer 60kWh car (rapidgate being mentioned already), beam rear axle, analogue speedo? Are they for real? And for that product you get the privilege of spending over €41,000 for the L60. Pure madness!

Luckylow10

Silent Running wrote: »

Well what would you have me say, it's the truth.

I know you're emotionally invested in the Leaf. What is it about people calling Ioniq drivers liars?

I'm not an Ioniq fanboy. I don't even own an Ioniq now. The fact remains that it's a fantastic EV and does so much with such a small battery, which, combined with a fast charging speed, makes it a quick car to charge, which makes it a viable long journey car.

In my opinion, anyone buying a Leaf over an Ioniq needs their head seen to. The only thing favouring the Leaf is supply. No thermal management on even the newer 60kWh car (rapidgate being mentioned already), beam rear axle, analogue speedo? Are they for real? And for that product you get the privilege of spending over €41,000 for the L60. Pure madness!

Saying anyone buying a leaf over an ioniq needs their head examined is a bit much.

I have looked into it and I’m buying a leaf 40 over Ioniq- why? Well-

The ioniqs are ugly inside IMO , those fabric seats are puke, and it’s very boring on the outside to look at too. The leaf also has more head room for passengers and in the booth.

It’s that simple for me. The range and charging capabilities on the leaf are otherwise sufficient for the 14km daily commute to the office .

not everyone is going to be affected by “rapidgate” due to their style of use of the vehicle..

Shefwedfan

Nedved85 wrote: »

A few times a year I do an IKEA run from Cork to Dublin, aswell as going to Croke Park for a few games. The Chademo accessibility problem combined with Rapidgate are a serious issue here. Kona, eNiro and Model 3 are much better options.

That’s infrastructure issue not a car issue

ELM327

Shefwedfan wrote: »

That’s infrastructure issue not a car issue

Chademo is a car problem, as is rapidgate.
Solve the problem? Get a ccs2.0 capable car and charge at Ionity

Or better yet a model 3 and charge at Ionity or Supercharger, no issue with using the public network at all.

Soarer

Silent Running wrote: »

Well what would you have me say, it's the truth.

I know you're emotionally invested in the Leaf. What is it about people calling Ioniq drivers liars?

I'm not emotionally invested in anything, and I've never once called anyone a liar.

Nedved85

Shefwedfan wrote: »

That’s infrastructure issue not a car issue

It is completely a car issue. Nissan refusing to use what is now becoming the standard fast charging adapter, CCS.

As already discussed last year with L40 it's quite sad that the rapidgate issue could have been mitigated with some ducting from the A/C to the front of the battery pack and then exhaust vents out from under the rear seats directed under the rear floor. A dedicated 4 degree air duct from the evaporator should do it nicely and install a dedicated exhaust fan to run the operation. A hoover type filter at the inlet. This would be most effecive with the L40 battery layout as there is more empty space within the pack. Under the car there would be lots of space to install this.

Just copy the setup from Kia Soul mk 1.

Shefwedfan

Nedved85 wrote: »

It is completely a car issue. Nissan refusing to use what is now becoming the standard fast charging adapter, CCS.

I said 2 years ago or more that chademo was dead and CCS was the future.....

In reality they are going to install triple charge points so chademo is not going to go away....unless the European Union tell them they have to not sure Nissan or any of those companies will ever change

ELM327

Shefwedfan wrote: »

I said 2 years ago or more that chademo was dead and CCS was the future.....

In reality they are going to install triple charge points so chademo is not going to go away....unless the European Union tell them they have to not sure Nissan or any of those companies will ever change

Nissan and Nissan really.


Everything else has already changed.
Chademo is stuck at 50kW gross whereas 350kW CCS is nearly here. 250 already here.

Shefwedfan

ELM327 wrote: »

Nissan and Nissan really.


Everything else has already changed.
Chademo is stuck at 50kW gross whereas 350kW CCS is nearly here. 250 already here.

Are Mitsubishi etc not all using it?

ELM327

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Are Mitsubishi etc not all using it?

Do they have an EV?
(plug in hybrids not counting of course)

Shefwedfan

ELM327 wrote: »

Do they have an EV?
(plug in hybrids not counting of course)

Well the outlander of course but PHEV

The iMiev is still knocking around

ELM327

Ok so let's refresh for a second.
What 192 BEVs in EU are coming with a chademo plug. You have the Leaf, and?
Whereas everything else, from model 3 to the ID, from the e soul to the e golf, and everything in between. Even the new Zoe and new Peugeot. All use CCS.

Nissan need to realise that the steadfast refusal to switch to CCS is a negative on their cars. Just like sub 50kW charging and rapidgate. Then again maybe they just don't care.

JohnC.

Shefwedfan wrote: »

In reality they are going to install triple charge points so chademo is not going to go away

Are they though? Aren't Ionity CCS only for rapid? Do we have any guarantee eCars or any others will keep installing Chademo?

ELM327

JohnC. wrote: »

Are they though? Aren't Ionity CCS only for rapid? Do we have any guarantee eCars or any others will keep installing Chademo?

Other networks (eg Electrify America in US) have been installing 4-8+ CCS stalls at 150kW+, and one 50kW chademo.


It's not looking good for chademo, time to put it out of its misery

Shefwedfan

ELM327 wrote: »

Other networks (eg Electrify America in US) have been installing 4-8+ CCS stalls at 150kW+, and one 50kW chademo.


It's not looking good for chademo, time to put it out of its misery

Ecars is a company now that has to make money out of charging cars.....the majority of cars in Ireland now and moving into the future will be Leafs so they can’t close down chademo

Ioniq etc are all great but you can’t get them in any stock, Kona is over priced, same is Tesla....eGolf is rare as hens teeth and 12 months out from ID

Chademo might go, but you could be 10 years from now

Shefwedfan

JohnC. wrote: »

Are they though? Aren't Ionity CCS only for rapid? Do we have any guarantee eCars or any others will keep installing Chademo?

We have 1 Ionity charge installation in Ireland, maybe more opening but probably 24 months out from anywhere near coverage required

As mentioned, Nissan is the most popular car in Ireland and biggest install base, why would eCars or any other provider drop it?

Ionity is owned by companies who will only do CCS so they have no option