Formula 1 2019 - General Discussion Thread

Harika

eagle eye wrote: »

Sorry basically there is no consideration for racing incidents or for an uncontrolled car?

The regulations were requested this way by the drivers to avoid disambiguation, now it is still wrong....

skipper_G

Harika wrote: »

Article 27.3 of the Sporting Regulations states: "Drivers will be judged to have left the track if no part of the car remains in contact with it and, for the avoidance of doubt, any white lines defining the track edges are considered to be part of the track but the kerbs are not. Should a car leave the track the driver may re-join, however, this may only be done when it is safe to do so and without gaining a lasting advantage.

The last five words are the key to the difference between the two incidents.

You claimed the rule Vettel was punished for is different for race and practice, it's not. The possible sanctions are different. I was just clearing that up, not getting into another debate about Canada.

Harika

skipper_G wrote: »

You claimed the rule Vettel was punished for is different for race and practice, it's not. The possible sanctions are different. I was just clearing that up, not getting into another debate about Canada.

Shame on me for not putting my law hat on.
😉

pjohnson

McLaren looking very promising. Haas just not having a good year.

Adamocovic

pjohnson wrote: »

McLaren looking very promising. Haas just not having a good year.

Same old story for Haas.

Have a decent car when it's firing but always seems to be problems.

HighLine

Think this could be the first time I remember there not being a race thread on here... says it all really about the current interest in F1.

pjohnson

HighLine wrote: »

Think this could be the first time I remember there not being a race thread on here... says it all really about the current interest in F1.

Is anyone allowed make them or was it not a mod that made them?

elperello

There was a lovely filler item there on Sky with Rosberg father and son.
Probably the highlight of the weekend.

Jordan 199

pjohnson wrote: »

Is anyone allowed make them or was it not a mod that made them?

Make one if you want to

pjohnson

Jordan 199 wrote: »

Make one if you want to

I dont have time but can do up my OP later.

pjohnson

Here

https://touch.boards.ie/thread/2057990661/1/#post110500103

Harika

pjohnson wrote: »

Is anyone allowed make them or was it not a mod that made them?

Anyone, just too busy with new job to start one.

Adamocovic

Great qualifying by the McLaren!

Was hoping Dani could go higher but he did well. Hopefully we get some entertainment from the start.

p1akuw47h5r3it

HighLine wrote: »

Think this could be the first time I remember there not being a race thread on here... says it all really about the current interest in F1.

Formula E is where its at! Way more exciting.

Frank Bullitt

DanDan6592 wrote: »

Formula E is where its at! Way more exciting.

pjohnson

When the cars arent stuck at a corner like Galway/Dublin traffic

Darkglasses

This year I've been trying Formula 2 and find it great craic. Just can't quite get onboard with Formula E.

Burkie1203

Darkglasses wrote: »

This year I've been trying Formula 2 and find it great craic. Just can't quite get onboard with Formula E.

FE has two small issues for me

Tracks are too narrow in part
They always have some stupid chicane

But 8 or 9 different winners tells it's own story too about how competitive it is

d8491prj5boyvg

The discussion here of the Hamilton rejoining says it all. Big debate over something so minor. I know the vettel context adds interest, but we really should have many more interesting talking points

pjohnson

Unsurprisingly McLaren announce Alonso is no longer part of their testing team. No suprise as he was replaced by Sirotkin yesterday anyway.

eagle eye

pjohnson wrote:

Unsurprisingly McLaren announce Alonso is no longer part of their testing team. No suprise as he was replaced by Sirotkin yesterday anyway.

I think he is being lined up for a full time move to Indycar. Much better for him, rules in place to ensure everybody has a chance and not just one car manufacturer.

Inviere

vectra wrote: »

What nonsense is this??
What has it got to do with "gaining an advantage"?
The issue I see is Hamilton forced another driver off the track !
IE
Rejoined in a dangerous manner.

Kimi done the same thing to Grosjean later on, I presume you’ll be screaming for justice for Grosjean?

Inviere

DanDan6592 wrote: »

Formula E is where its at! Way more exciting.

The racing is better, definitely. The tracks though, dear god the tracks I still can’t really get into FE at the moment because the battery tech isn’t there yet, ie, needing to race on uninspiring artificial street tracks which may as well be the same track for every race. When FE cars are belting around Silverstone, Spa, Shanghai, etc, at full pace on a single charge, then colour me sold. The whole “bringing the racing to the people” pitch is nothing but pure PR...the cars are still very limited, albeit improving nicely.

Darkglasses

Very superficial but nonetheless important to me - I kinda hate the sound and looks of the Formula E cars too

Inviere

Darkglasses wrote: »

Very superficial but nonetheless important to me - I kinda hate the sound and looks of the Formula E cars too

I actually like the look of them, and the sound doesn’t really bother me. I just can’t accept the tracks, they’re beyond crap.

AMKC

Darkglasses wrote: »

Very superficial but nonetheless important to me - I kinda hate the sound and looks of the Formula E cars too

What sound?

Inviere wrote: »

I actually like the look of them, and the sound doesn’t really bother me. I just can’t accept the tracks, they’re beyond crap.

Yes I agree the tracks are still crap. That should be Formula E's next goal to get better tracks.

PopePalpatine

Agreed, it was frustrating seeing all of those Mickey Mouse chicanes in yesterday's ePrix that forced the drivers into single file.

recyclebin

McLaren are bulding their own wind tunnel. Was very surprised to read that they have been using Toyotas in Cologne for the last tens years. It will be up and running in 2 years.

Inviere

recyclebin wrote: »

McLaren are bulding their own wind tunnel. Was very surprised to read that they have been using Toyotas in Cologne for the last tens years. It will be up and running in 2 years.

You have to hand it to them, they’ve gone from being alongside Williams to fighting just behind Red Bull. Quite impressive really, in such a short time. Williams are just shambolic at this stage.

skipper_G

I'm very impressed with how well Norris has adapted to F1, has it all really, speed and racecraft, good with the media, handles the pressure well. That was a tough situation to manage the problem and still bring the car home in the points.

p1akuw47h5r3it

Darkglasses wrote: »

Very superficial but nonetheless important to me - I kinda hate the sound and looks of the Formula E cars too

Fair enough, I think they decent enough though to be honest!

I like the idea of having mainly street circuits though the problem is that they don't leave alot of room for overtaking, so the sooner they go to proper circuits the better maybe.

I see Hamilton won again today...Shocker!

Joeface

it needs a fair bit to sort the sport out.

I think some of the changes need to be along the lines of ,

Qualifying : only the opening race of the season and the race after the summer break should have full qualifying for all Cars.
every other race one to ten from the previous race can go for pole . 11 to last its your starting place next race.
It would mean teams like Williams wouldn't be wasting time on qual . It means if team link Racing point or Toro get top ten they get to defend that the next day ..or go for better. Your then rewarding Race pace and points finishes more .

Race Distance : Need to be shorted , but fuel capacity needs to remain the same So at least they can push for longer.

The Rubber problem : Too many bloody choices and the tires never work as advertised . Not seen any driver put on the red tires and go on a charge with 10 laps to go . That's what they are suppose to there for but never work. Reduce it to just 2 types. Red or Yellow each race. you can use which every . All Red you would be fast but wear more . Mix it up if you like one red set , one yellow set . Stupid rule having to use all the types specified .

Engine Modes : if the mode cannot do 50% of the race minimum you can't have it all.

Driver engineer : Really should only be telling driver if they see issues with the car . Shouldn't be telling them the tires are hot or cold or all the other rubbish . Actually let the driver race.

I am sure everyone has stuff they want added or changed . That's always the same things in my head. Anything but the bring back refueling ...that would be a disaster .

I am sure my post is out of order , bit of rant going on after watching the race . Loads of potential between teams but nothing panned out. bbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbbaaaaaaaaaaaah

antodeco

At a bare minimum, they should allow any of the cars get points for fastest lap!

chicorytip

antodeco wrote:

At a bare minimum, they should allow any of the cars get points for fastest lap!

It's a complete gimmick. Why award an extra point to Vettel for finishing a distant fifth? If the championship was tightly contested that could possibly be a title winning point at the end of the season. It's all very cynical and unsporting.

Burkie1203

https://twitter.com/tiff_tv/status/1142843654836555776?s=19

Harika

Burkie1203 wrote: »

https://twitter.com/tiff_tv/status/1142843654836555776?s=19

Is indycar the new lmp that does everything right?

Frank Bullitt

Harika wrote: »

Is indycar the new lmp that does everything right?

Its sounding like it, LMP looks very promising for the future as well with the new rules.

Vic_08

Joeface wrote: »

it needs a fair bit to sort the sport out.

I think some of the changes need to be along the lines of ,

Qualifying : only the opening race of the season and the race after the summer break should have full qualifying for all Cars.
every other race one to ten from the previous race can go for pole . 11 to last its your starting place next race.
It would mean teams like Williams wouldn't be wasting time on qual . It means if team link Racing point or Toro get top ten they get to defend that the next day ..or go for better. Your then rewarding Race pace and points finishes more .

So a bad finish or a DNF fuks a drivers prospects for at least one more race, no thanks.

Also reducing the running of backmarkers will limit their exposure and make getting sponsorship money even harder.

Qualy is the one area where F1 has more or less got it right, it doesn't need to be messed around with.

The one thing I think they could take from the likes of Indy is to move the start/finish for qualy to before the last corner so cars can go straight to the pits after a fast lap, it would reduce the amount of slow cars getting in the way of fast laps and allow quicker turnarounds for second/third attempts.

Joeface wrote: »

Race Distance : Need to be shorted , but fuel capacity needs to remain the same So at least they can push for longer.

Nope, the races just need to have enough action in them than 90mns doesn't seem like a lifetime. It's the processional nature of F1 not the length of the races that needs fixing.

The cars fuel capacity is not really an issue any more like it was in 2014-15 but fuel will always be a factor as teams will never put more than just enough in as the extra weight is such a performance killer. At most races the cars do not start with full tanks now.

Joeface wrote: »

The Rubber problem : Too many bloody choices and the tires never work as advertised . Not seen any driver put on the red tires and go on a charge with 10 laps to go . That's what they are suppose to there for but never work. Reduce it to just 2 types. Red or Yellow each race. you can use which every . All Red you would be fast but wear more . Mix it up if you like one red set , one yellow set . Stupid rule having to use all the types specified .

The current tyres are awful, how to fix it is probably more difficult. The perfect tyres would be ones which degrade in a slow curve through use and then become useless at a certain wear % but aren't so sensitive to temperature and conditioning so far less attention needs to be given to looking after the things.

The window for these yokes to be at their best is so small that the teams spend most of the weekend (and god knows how much money in research) chasing it.

Has anybody ever given a toss which driver is best at keeping the Pirelli's in their temp window? I doubt it but it is a massive part of a F1 race weekend now.

I might be wrong but switching from the current doughnuts to low profile tyres might help as the tyres structure would be more stable and not be a secondary suspension for the cars.

recyclebin

Every car to have same size fuel tank and all to be full at start of race. Change the rule so you don't have to run two different compounds during a race.

Stop changing aero and engine rules. The midfield will catch up quicker then and the rate of development from faster cars will tail off.

rock22

There was a time when F1 was interesting and spectacular. So it can be done. Unfortunately it is hard to undo "progress".

I might be a minority of one, but I much preferred the old style qualification. A surprise was always on the cards right up to the last few minutes.

Multiple tyre suppliers would transform the sport. Today, Pirelli are told to create tyres which cannot last the race. This is done to add "excitement". I once drove from Carlow to Dublin at 3 am with a slow puncture in one tyre. I too managed the tyre and is was as exciting as a modern F1 race!. When we had multiple suppliers they tried to make tyres suitable for the racetrack.

Reduce the aerodynamic aids to the cars. This might be impossible now but it is the main reason we cannot get close corner to corner racing. We could get rid of DRS for good.

Look regularly at MotoGP and there is no comparison between it and F1 now. Overtaking at almost every braking point and race right to the chequered flag is a regular occurrence.

Infoanon

Looking at Moto GP their concessions rule has really helped.simply put ,the teams that are not winning/ getting podiums can test as much as they want,change engines /engine specs etc with the result that 4 of the 6 manufacturers now challenge for wins and in all likelihood that will become 5 in the not to distance future.

Imagine what Renault or Honda could achieve. ....

Debub

On the highlights package on C4 Vettel was asked how to make the sport better, he had a few suggestions, let me see if I can get hold of the video somewhere. He basically wants less complicated cars and less transparency of information/data

TCP/IP

Infoanon wrote: »

Looking at Moto GP their concessions rule has really helped.simply put ,the teams that are not winning/ getting podiums can test as much as they want,change engines /engine specs etc with the result that 4 of the 6 manufacturers now challenge for wins and in all likelihood that will become 5 in the not to distance future.

Imagine what Renault or Honda could achieve. ....

This is a great idea did not know about this rule in MotoGP. Also ban pay drivers would be a great idea if you are good enough you will get a drive. Look at Ocon disgrace he does not get a drive and you get seat blockers like Kubica and Stroll taking up seats.

kksaints

TCP/IP wrote: »

This is a great idea did not know about this rule in MotoGP. Also ban pay drivers would be a great idea if you are good enough you will get a drive. Look at Ocon disgrace he does not get a drive and you get seat blockers like Kubica and Stroll taking up seats.

The problem with this idea is that there are a number of teams and always has been that are basically kept afloat by pay drivers. I don't want to see the grid go below 20 cars, anything less than 10 teams makes the grid look small and also makes it harder for drivers to stay in the sport.

Also what defines a pay driver and what quality metrics would you use? For example if we were to look at best performance in the last few seasons. Stroll has had better individual performances and results than other better rated drivers. I won't deny that his qualification performances are atrocious.

antodeco

They should take a leaf out of FE and allow an activation zone, that will allow you to use a higher rate of fuel for x amount of laps. Make it mandatory that each driver has to use it. Would be good for drivers trying to attack or defend.

the_pen_turner

Infoanon wrote: »

Looking at Moto GP their concessions rule has really helped.simply put ,the teams that are not winning/ getting podiums can test as much as they want,change engines /engine specs etc with the result that 4 of the 6 manufacturers now challenge for wins and in all likelihood that will become 5 in the not to distance future.

Imagine what Renault or Honda could achieve. ....

Great idea

I would also allow the lower teams to fix their cars and get back out during the race. Obviously not going to work in a big crash but for small stuff it would help them gain testing.

Or allow them to change parts and make changes if they want. The likes of William's isn't going to get points anyway so stopping and making changes might help them. They cant afford proper testing days etc so may as well get the most out of the race

AMKC

All I can say is lets hope Liberty Media are reading this thread because they seem to have run out of ideas themselves. They started of great promising loads and done a few things like the entertainment at races and some other small things but that can only do so much and has no real effect on the racing.

I think the smaller teams should be allowed to bring aero developments to all races and the big teams only to four or five races that way it would be fairer. This could be looked at and revised every 6 months to a year.

meeeeh

TCP/IP wrote: »

This is a great idea did not know about this rule in MotoGP. Also ban pay drivers would be a great idea if you are good enough you will get a drive. Look at Ocon disgrace he does not get a drive and you get seat blockers like Kubica and Stroll taking up seats.

That won't work. Small teams need drivers who brig their own sponsors. No midfield driver, no matter how talented, is good enough to offset millions in sponsorship money.

AMKC

the_pen_turner wrote: »

Great idea

I would also allow the lower teams to fix their cars and get back out during the race. Obviously not going to work in a big crash but for small stuff it would help them gain testing.

Or allow them to change parts and make changes if they want. The likes of William's isn't going to get points anyway so stopping and making changes might help them. They cant afford proper testing days etc so may as well get the most out of the race

Agreed that should be allowed.

Maybe suspensions if one of the lower drivers cars suspension got broke and it it could be fixed relatively quickly they should be let do it.

Actually I think If any drivers car got damaged by someone else they should be allowed come in a fix it if possible but if its there own fault like hitting a barrier or going onto a runoff area then its hard look except for the teams like Williams who lets face it are not going to be scoring points anytime soon anyway.

muckwarrior

Infoanon wrote: »

Looking at Moto GP their concessions rule has really helped.simply put ,the teams that are not winning/ getting podiums can test as much as they want,change engines /engine specs etc with the result that 4 of the 6 manufacturers now challenge for wins and in all likelihood that will become 5 in the not to distance future.

Imagine what Renault or Honda could achieve. ....

I have a vague recollection of a system like that being in place a decade or so ago. A few of the lower placed teams got an extra practice session on the Friday or something like that. There certainly needs to be something in place to help level the playing field.