Formula 1 2019 - General Discussion Thread

BDI

shamrock55 wrote: »

Does anyone think if danny ric was in a merc/Ferrari that he would be a world champion and what is his contract with renault and will they even be here in the nxt couple of years

Feel sorry for a few drivers that deserved more. Danny Ric, Perez, few over the years I think didn’t reach their full potential just out of not getting a drive they deserved.

AMKC

shamrock55 wrote: »

Does anyone think if danny ric was in a merc/Ferrari that he would be a world champion and what is his contract with renault and will they even be here in the nxt couple of years

He most certainly would be. I think his contract with Renault is for 3 years. They will be there next year and then hopefully the year after too but who knows after that? Maybe another Genii capital type investment company will take it over again if Renault do pull out again or maybe even Liberty Media sure they seem to be into everything else why not an F1 team but that might go against some rules so maybe it will never happen.

El_Duderino 09

shamrock55 wrote: »

Does anyone think if danny ric was in a merc/Ferrari that he would be a world champion and what is his contract with renault and will they even be here in the nxt couple of years

His stock has fallen this year. The car is probably pretty bad though. He’s about level with Hulkenberg which isn’t a sign of a top driver (38-35). I think being about equal with Hulkenberg means he’s currently in the ‘grand’ category. But nothing special and would be look at as a no.2 rather than a rattle challenger.

He’s on multiples of Hulkenberg’s salary so hulk is by far the better value for money driver between them this season.

weisses

BDI wrote: »

Feel sorry for a few drivers that deserved more. Danny Ric, Perez, few over the years I think didn’t reach their full potential just out of not getting a drive they deserved.

If Ric wanted to possibly reach his full potential he should have stayed with RB instead of going for the cash at Renault

So you don't need to feel sorry for the fella

Cork Trucker

https://www.planetf1.com/news/hulkenberg-to-red-bull-rumours-persist/

Red Bull may have denied that Nico Hulkenberg has a shot at the 2020 race seat but the rumours are refusing to die down.

F1 journalist Jack Plooij told Radio Veronica: “Voices that say Nico Hulkenberg will be the new team-mate for Verstappen next year are a growing.

BDI

weisses wrote: »

If Ric wanted to possibly reach his full potential he should have stayed with RB instead of going for the cash at Renault

So you don't need to feel sorry for the fella

He would have been second fiddle to Max who at the time looked like Red Bull would do everything in their power to win him races. Didn’t work out for Max so far but Ricciardo wasn’t to know. Even now Max gets all the coverage albon is treated like an also ran.

El_Duderino 09

BDI wrote: »

He would have been second fiddle to Max who at the time looked like Red Bull would do everything in their power to win him races. Didn’t work out for Max so far but Ricciardo wasn’t to know. Even now Max gets all the coverage albon is treated like an also ran.

I disagree that it didn’t work out for Max. Suggestions are that the car is built around max which means Ric would likely struggle compared to him and would look a lot slower as a result.

weisses

BDI wrote: »

He would have been second fiddle to Max who at the time looked like Red Bull would do everything in their power to win him races. Didn’t work out for Max so far but Ricciardo wasn’t to know. Even now Max gets all the coverage albon is treated like an also ran.

If you are a driver who runs away from a fight with your teammate then you are not world champion material .. period... he went for the cash at Renault, Red Bull is very much capable of getting 2 equally fast cars on the grid ... let's not forget that they want the constructor championship just as much as a driver championship. Albon is not the driver RB needs... to this date he adds nothing that pushes the team forward ...

uchimata83

weisses wrote: »

If you are a driver who runs away from a fight with your teammate then you are not world champion material .. period... he went for the cash at Renault, Red Bull is very much capable of getting 2 equally fast cars on the grid ... let's not forget that they want the constructor championship just as much as a driver championship. Albon is not the driver RB needs... to this date he adds nothing that pushes the team forward ...

I don't think he ran away from Red Bull, he knew that the team were going to focus on Max and Red Bull's image is always going to be focused towards youth as much as success. That Renault is a dog and I wouldn't trust Cyril to run to the shop for me.

Definitely agree with you on Albon. He is doing well in comparison to Gasly, but that wouldn't be too hard. Drove well on Sunday managing tyres but doing nothing of note other than selling cans in Singapore.

El_Duderino 09

weisses wrote: »

If you are a driver who runs away from a fight with your teammate then you are not world champion material .. period... he went for the cash at Renault, Red Bull is very much capable of getting 2 equally fast cars on the grid ... let's not forget that they want the constructor championship just as much as a driver championship. Albon is not the driver RB needs... to this date he adds nothing that pushes the team forward ...

It’s not true to say he ran away. Red bull made clear they were backing Max politically. That means he gets the best stuff, mechanics and more say over development, pit strategy preference etc. That’s not an equal setup. So if anyone were to be world champion at red bull, it would most likely be max.

His next best bet was to go to a constructor. Merc and Ferrari were full, so Renault was the best option. It wasn’t just for the money. It was s as do for the most realistic chance of winning - even though it was also a long shot.

skipper_G

weisses wrote: »

If you are a driver who runs away from a fight with your teammate then you are not world champion material .. period... he went for the cash at Renault, Red Bull is very much capable of getting 2 equally fast cars on the grid ... let's not forget that they want the constructor championship just as much as a driver championship. Albon is not the driver RB needs... to this date he adds nothing that pushes the team forward ...

Albon has finished in the top 6 every race for Red Bull, he's still in his rookie season. The facts suggest that he is comfortable at that level, and with time comes experience. He will likely get better. I can’t take any of what you say seriously

weisses

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

It’s not true to say he ran away. Red bull made clear they were backing Max politically. That means he gets the best stuff, mechanics and more say over development, pit strategy preference etc. That’s not an equal setup. So if anyone were to be world champion at red bull, it would most likely be max.

His next best bet was to go to a constructor. Merc and Ferrari were full, so Renault was the best option. It wasn’t just for the money. It was s as do for the most realistic chance of winning - even though it was also a long shot.

Can you come up with something that clearly shows Verrstappen being favored ?

Remember Ric got pole last year in Mexico, to me that looks like he was getting the same material as Max

weisses

skipper_G wrote: »

Albon has finished in the top 6 every race for Red Bull, he's still in his rookie season. The facts suggest that he is comfortable at that level, and with time comes experience. He will likely get better. I can’t take any of what you say seriously

He is better then Gasly for sure, But in my opinion he is not the driver who will push red bull forward ...

every driver on that grid could have steered the red bull to a P6 in any GP

weisses

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

It’s not true to say he ran away. Red bull made clear they were backing Max politically. That means he gets the best stuff, mechanics and more say over development, pit strategy preference etc. That’s not an equal setup. So if anyone were to be world champion at red bull, it would most likely be max.

His next best bet was to go to a constructor. Merc and Ferrari were full, so Renault was the best option. It wasn’t just for the money. It was s as do for the most realistic chance of winning - even though it was also a long shot.

Most of his DNF's were because of Renault ... I have to hand it to Renault though ..their PR worked well on Ric

And again can you at least post some evidence that Verstappen would have gotten the better material etc this season ? ... Because to me that makes no sense for a team that wants to be a constructors champion and has the money and resources to put to equally good cars on the grid

muckwarrior

weisses wrote: »

He is better then Gasly for sure, But in my opinion he is not the driver who will push red bull forward ...

every driver on that grid could have steered the red bull to a P6 in any GP

Gasly couldn't.

Anyway, Albon doesn't need to be the driver to push Red Bull forward. Verstappen is clearly number 1, Albon just needs to be a solid number 2 and so far he's doing a fairly decent job of that.

weisses

muckwarrior wrote: »

Gasly couldn't.

Anyway, Albon doesn't need to be the driver to push Red Bull forward. Verstappen is clearly number 1, Albon just needs to be a solid number 2 and so far he's doing a fairly decent job of that.

Problem is that to compete on the level RB, Ferrari and Merc are acting you need two top drivers ... So yes the driver next to Verstappen needs to be able to out qualify him and is able to push the team or at least his side of the garage forward ... If you think Albon doesn't need to do that he shouldn't be driving for RB. During Ric last year both drivers pushed each other and used each others data/setup to get faster ....

chicorytip

muckwarrior wrote: »

Gasly couldn't.

Anyway, Albon doesn't need to be the driver to push Red Bull forward. Verstappen is clearly number 1, Albon just needs to be a solid number 2 and so far he's doing a fairly decent job of that.

If Max qualifies in pole position then Red Bull expect their other driver to qualify in second position one tenth of a second behind. If Albon is unable get that close enough to Max over the remaining races of the season I think he will get the chop. The team's young driver programme is not producing the goods at present. Kyvat, Gasly, Albon, Ticktum. The problem they have is that there are no experienced drivers available who could do the job. Hulkenberg is really not good enough. Kubica would be a better option than him, strange as it sounds. Alonso looks like he's finished in F1 for good.

El_Duderino 09

weisses wrote: »

Can you come up with something that clearly shows Verrstappen being favored ?

Remember Ric got pole last year in Mexico, to me that looks like he was getting the same material as Max

A pole position at an individual race proves nothing. The point was that Ric wanted assurance that he would be given equal opportunity at RB and they didn’t give it. There are all sorts of issues behind the scenes. The political wrangling in the background is important. Max had the upper hand and it was clear to Ric that Max was their man for the short to medium term future.

One of the early signs would have been who's input they were taking more seriously for developing the next years car (the current car).

The chances of a red bull winning a championship in the next 3 years is far higher than a Renault. But Ric decided he would have to do it against Max who would have superior support from the team.

I don’t have any concrete evidence because I’m not involved. In only have what Ric said and the analysis of people like Joe Saward.

H3llR4iser

chicorytip wrote: »

If Max qualifies in pole position then Red Bull expect their other driver to qualify in second position one tenth of a second behind. If Albon is unable get that close enough to Max over the remaining races of the season I think he will get the chop. The team's young driver programme is not producing the goods at present. Kyvat, Gasly, Albon, Ticktum. The problem they have is that there are no experienced drivers available who could do the job. Hulkenberg is really not good enough. Kubica would be a better option than him, strange as it sounds. Alonso looks like he's finished in F1 for good.

Nope, they don't; They want the other driver to be out of Max's way and bring in some points. If he is second, close to Max, it's an issue; Daniel Ricciardo, as such, was an issue - especially as he often was ahead of Verstappen. Gasly was underperforming for, well, reasons, but the team themselves were actually reluctant to oust him. By all accounts, bringing Albon in was Helmut Marko's decision alone, no doubt based off the marketing potential in Thailand. What Alex is doing right now, it's what the company wants - be top 6 all the time, without coming near Verstappen.

The fact is, Red Bull are not a manufacturer nor a typical F1 team, they are much more interested to the younger part of the audience than any other outfit on the grid. They don't sell cars or industrial machinery, their name and image drives worldwide sales of a product that is mostly marketed to sub-30-years old people. And that generates massive amounts of revenue.

Max Verstappen is, right now, F1's wonderkid and the centre of attention of the younger spectators. He's young, talented, arrogant, smug, boastful with that aura of the "chosen one" built around him. He's the closest thing in F1 to an action movie hero or a videogame character. It's what 21st century kids all around the world adore, which makes him a money-maker in terms of marketing. Look at the grandstands at most F1 venues full of the "orange army" made up of people, a lot of them quite young, who mostly didn't even know what F1 was until 2016's Spanish Grand Prix.

Ricciardo was in the way of all that - you can't have a random, nearly 30 years old smiley dude from Australia, who's nice and charming but nothing like what kids want to be, beating your "choosen one", can you?

But don't take my words for this, there's Horner's interview in Netflix's documentary, where he goes without a single doubt about the fact that the team's goal is to make Max Verstappen the youngest F1 WDC of all times. They got 1 more season to achieve it - and a problem in the fact they don't have the "next wunderkid" lined up yet.

weisses

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

A pole position at an individual race proves nothing. The point was that Ric wanted assurance that he would be given equal opportunity at RB and they didn’t give it. There are all sorts of issues behind the scenes. The political wrangling in the background is important. Max had the upper hand and it was clear to Ric that Max was their man for the short to medium term future.

It proves he gets equal opportunities and material ... Its not wrong for a team to say that they work with Max to make him world champion .. Ric was looking for a way out ... He didnt want to compete with max so he choose for the big bucks at Renault ... If Ric focus was to be a world champion he would have stayed at RB

Ill emphasize again ...RB can put out to equally competitive cars .. they want to be the best constructor as well

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

One of the early signs would have been who's input they were taking more seriously for developing the next years car (the current car).

So what ? If Ricciardo can potentially win races

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

The chances of a red bull winning a championship in the next 3 years is far higher than a Renault. But Ric decided he would have to do it against Max who would have superior support from the team.

I don’t have any concrete evidence because I’m not involved. In only have what Ric said and the analysis of people like Joe Saward.

Ric choose the money and to be the n1 at Renault ... for what its worth

And again ... there is no evidence Max would get superior support over Ric ... Because it doesnt make any sense for a team as big as RB

Dont know what is bigger .. the mans ego or his bank account ( I still like him though)

weisses

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Nope, they don't; They want the other driver to be out of Max's way and bring in some points. If he is second, close to Max, it's an issue; Daniel Ricciardo, as such, was an issue - especially as he often was ahead of Verstappen. Gasly was underperforming for, well, reasons, but the team themselves were actually reluctant to oust him. By all accounts, bringing Albon in was Helmut Marko's decision alone, no doubt based off the marketing potential in Thailand. What Alex is doing right now, it's what the company wants - be top 6 all the time, without coming near Verstappen.

The fact is, Red Bull are not a manufacturer nor a typical F1 team, they are much more interested to the younger part of the audience than any other outfit on the grid. They don't sell cars or industrial machinery, their name and image drives worldwide sales of a product that is mostly marketed to sub-30-years old people. And that generates massive amounts of revenue.

Max Verstappen is, right now, F1's wonderkid and the centre of attention of the younger spectators. He's young, talented, arrogant, smug, boastful with that aura of the "chosen one" built around him. He's the closest thing in F1 to an action movie hero or a videogame character. It's what 21st century kids all around the world adore, which makes him a money-maker in terms of marketing. Look at the grandstands at most F1 venues full of the "orange army" made up of people, a lot of them quite young, who mostly didn't even know what F1 was until 2016's Spanish Grand Prix.

Ricciardo was in the way of all that - you can't have a random, nearly 30 years old smiley dude from Australia, who's nice and charming but nothing like what kids want to be, beating your "choosen one", can you?

But don't take my words for this, there's Horner's interview in Netflix's documentary, where he goes without a single doubt about the fact that the team's goal is to make Max Verstappen the youngest F1 WDC of all times. They got 1 more season to achieve it - and a problem in the fact they don't have the "next wunderkid" lined up yet.

In your opinion....

pjohnson

weisses wrote: »

Because it doesnt make any sense for a team as big as RB

What? Teams especially top ones always have a main driver and then a lesser back up support driver,
M. Schumacher (Verstappen, Herbert, Irvine, Barrichello, Massa)
Alonso (Fisichella)
Raikkonen (Massa)
Vettel (Webber)
Hamilton (Bottas).



The only times top teams have had equal top level drivers have generally been a disaster due to the strong rivalry and intra team competition Prost/Senna, Hamilton/Alonso, Rosberg/Hamilton.


Midfield teams may run equal level drivers but top teams often go for a top and a lesser as it makes their lives much easier and a good driver in a top car can bring home points consistently (like Albon is doing and Bottas regularly does now and Barrichello, Fisi, Webber et al. used to).

AMKC

chicorytip wrote: »

If Max qualifies in pole position then Red Bull expect their other driver to qualify in second position one tenth of a second behind. If Albon is unable get that close enough to Max over the remaining races of the season I think he will get the chop. The team's young driver programme is not producing the goods at present. Kyvat, Gasly, Albon, Ticktum. The problem they have is that there are no experienced drivers available who could do the job. Hulkenberg is really not good enough. Kubica would be a better option than him, strange as it sounds. Alonso looks like he's finished in F1 for good.

I have to disagree with you there . If it came down to Kubica and Hulkenberg then Hulkenberg would be the better option just because he has been in the sport for the last ten years at least where as Kubica was in it then gone then back again but no where near as good as he was which is sad as he should and could have been a WDC champion.

Alonso is done with F1 I agree there.

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Nope, they don't; They want the other driver to be out of Max's way and bring in some points. If he is second, close to Max, it's an issue; Daniel Ricciardo, as such, was an issue - especially as he often was ahead of Verstappen. Gasly was underperforming for, well, reasons, but the team themselves were actually reluctant to oust him. By all accounts, bringing Albon in was Helmut Marko's decision alone, no doubt based off the marketing potential in Thailand. What Alex is doing right now, it's what the company wants - be top 6 all the time, without coming near Verstappen.

The fact is, Red Bull are not a manufacturer nor a typical F1 team, they are much more interested to the younger part of the audience than any other outfit on the grid. They don't sell cars or industrial machinery, their name and image drives worldwide sales of a product that is mostly marketed to sub-30-years old people. And that generates massive amounts of revenue.

Max Verstappen is, right now, F1's wonderkid and the centre of attention of the younger spectators. He's young, talented, arrogant, smug, boastful with that aura of the "chosen one" built around him. He's the closest thing in F1 to an action movie hero or a videogame character. It's what 21st century kids all around the world adore, which makes him a money-maker in terms of marketing. Look at the grandstands at most F1 venues full of the "orange army" made up of people, a lot of them quite young, who mostly didn't even know what F1 was until 2016's Spanish Grand Prix.

Ricciardo was in the way of all that - you can't have a random, nearly 30 years old smiley dude from Australia, who's nice and charming but nothing like what kids want to be, beating your "choosen one", can you?

But don't take my words for this, there's Horner's interview in Netflix's documentary, where he goes without a single doubt about the fact that the team's goal is to make Max Verstappen the youngest F1 WDC of all times. They got 1 more season to achieve it - and a problem in the fact they don't have the "next wunderkid" lined up yet.

Lol Red Bull or Max are not going to win the WDC next year not unless they find some amazing solution or trick over the winter to make there car faster everywhere and better than Mercedes and Ferrari otherwise it will just be more of the same from them again.

Infoanon

Hamiltons comment that he hopes Albon isn't spat out by Red Bull is possibly an indication that the Hulkenberg rumours are indeed true....

H3llR4iser

Infoanon wrote: »

Hamiltons comment that he hopes Albon isn't spat out by Red Bull is possibly an indication that the Hulkenberg rumours are indeed true....

In such case, chances are he'd be demoted back to Toro Rosso and Gasly would take a hike, in yet another repetition of the Alguersuari - Buemi - Vergne stories. The latter two went on to prove they deserved a better change in F1 by winning Formula E titles.

At this point I'd guess Marko will be wary of sacking Kvyat yet another time again for fear of having to hire him back a third time :D:D

Realistically, I can't see RB hiring Hulkenberg, it'd be sending the wrong message to potential young talents joining their youth program.

AMKC wrote: »

Lol Red Bull or Max are not going to win the WDC next year not unless they find some amazing solution or trick over the winter to make there car faster everywhere and better than Mercedes and Ferrari otherwise it will just be more of the same from them again.

...and that's why I say it's a problem they don't have another 18-years-old waiting in the wings. Never say never, RB have Adrian Newey at their service, but they are indeed...unlikely to produce a dominant car next season. Expect a rumor mill about Verstappen joining Ferrari or Mercedes to start midway through next season, depending on what Vettel and Hamilton decide to do.

shamrock55

Has it been known for a team to pull a great car/engine out of the bag from nowhere or does it generally take time, as in renault who used to have great cars/engines but not so much now, could they get back to the top again or would it take years, I'm thinking if they pulled something outta the bag for nxt year it could save them, otherwise could we be seeing the end slowly but surely

BDI

Hulkenberg and Kubica being compared. Embarrassing.

Why does Hulkenberg keep getting heat. Didn’t Perez outscore him when they were teammates?

Poor checo.

H3llR4iser

shamrock55 wrote: »

Has it been known for a team to pull a great car/engine out of the bag from nowhere or does it generally take time, as in renault who used to have great cars/engines but not so much now, could they get back to the top again or would it take years, I'm thinking if they pulled something outta the bag for nxt year it could save them, otherwise could we be seeing the end slowly but surely

It has happened with big rules overhauls that somebody suddenly came out with a world beater - most recent and obvious case, Brawn in 2009. At the same time, McLaren and Ferrari, who had dominated the previous couple of years, produced absolute nightmares for that season - Ferrari didn't even score a single point until the 4th race, McLaren didn't get a podium until the Hungarian Grand Prix!

Generally, it's a matter of building your way up to success - the way Mercedes did. They DID benefit from a rule change, but they had it planned ahead for years.

Problem is, nowadays the methods used in designing cars and each and every one of their components are optimized within an inch of their lives, entirely based on exact science with the aid of automated tooling. In a nutshell, what happens is that everybody is improving pretty much the same over their levels, which results in the absurdly frozen "pecking order" we've seen over the last 4/5 seasons. The law of diminishing returns (the better you're doing, the smaller your improvements) made Ferrari and RB close a bit to Mercedes and compacted the teams at the back, but the order is pretty much established. Except for extraordinary cases of blunders/incompetence/lack of funding (Williams).

Dont be at yourself

By the sounds of it, the 2021 rules will be so prescriptive that that a Chapman / Brawn / Newey-esque rule-bending innovation will be that much harder to design. Brawn has a team of aerodynamicists intentionally trying to break the rules so they can close any loopholes ahead of time.

tigerboon

H3llR4iser wrote: »

He's the closest thing in F1 a videogame character.

Crash Bandicoot??😂

Inviere

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Realistically, I can't see RB hiring Hulkenberg, it'd be sending the wrong message to potential young talents joining their youth program.

It sends a very Marko'esque message though if you think about it. If you don't cut the mustard, you'll be turfed. That said, I don't really see it happening myself. I'm curious and excited to see the Hulk in a contending car, but would feel very bad for Albon, he's done an absolutely stellar job imo, all things considered.

shamrock55

I thought séb ocon was a reserve driver for Mercedes this year, how come he was driving the force india in mexico

pjohnson

shamrock55 wrote: »

I thought séb ocon was a reserve driver for Mercedes this year, how come he was driving the force india in mexico

? He didnt drive in Mexico. Latifi in FP1 was the only reserve that got any track time......in fact Ocon has had no official track time at all this year in F1


Either way Ocon was the "official" reserve for all Merc-powered teams aswell so he is the reserve for Racing Point and Williams (neither Yelloly or Latifi have the license to race but can test for each team).

shamrock55

pjohnson wrote: »

? He didnt drive in Mexico. Latifi in FP1 was the only reserve that got any track time......in fact Ocon has had no official track time at all this year in F1


Either way Ocon was the "official" reserve for all Merc-powered teams aswell so he is the reserve for Racing Point and Williams (neither Yelloly or Latifi have the license to race but can test for each team).

Jesus I just realised I was watching last year's Mexico grand prix highlights on YouTube there

El_Duderino 09

Inviere wrote: »

It sends a very Marko'esque message though if you think about it. If you don't cut the mustard, you'll be turfed. That said, I don't really see it happening myself. I'm curious and excited to see the Hulk in a contending car, but would feel very bad for Albon, he's done an absolutely stellar job imo, all things considered.

Yeah I’d say if Albon was similar to Gasley then Hulk would be in with a shout for the second seat. But I’d say Albon is safe and sound for next year. Lovely performances in a new car. Perfect no2 to Max next year.

skipper_G

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Yeah I’d say if Albon was similar to Gasley then Hulk would be in with a shout for the second seat. But I’d say Albon is safe and sound for next year. Lovely performances in a new car. Perfect no2 to Max next year.

I've been super impressed by Albon, I think he's adapted incredibly well and his results are solid. Taking into consideration he never drove an F1 car before the first pre season test, it's an even more accomplished debut season. I think Red Bull would be mad not to give him the seat for next season.

pjohnson

skipper_G wrote: »

I've been super impressed by Albon, I think he's adapted incredibly well and his results are solid. Taking into consideration he never drove an F1 car before the first pre season test, it's an even more accomplished debut season. I think Red Bull would be mad not to give him the seat for next season.

Iirc he didnt even get his super licence until during those pre-season testing sessions. He started the tests with a green light on his car as he didnt actually have his full license due to his lack of mileage.

mickdw

skipper_G wrote: »

I've been super impressed by Albon, I think he's adapted incredibly well and his results are solid. Taking into consideration he never drove an F1 car before the first pre season test, it's an even more accomplished debut season. I think Red Bull would be mad not to give him the seat for next season.

Ya people saying he has done nothing special need to look at the overall picture. First season. No experience of F1, 2 teams and being immediately on the pace. Tying verstappen with 1 quali time and outscoring verstappen so far.
If red bull had been offered that, they would have grabbed it without question.

Frank Bullitt

https://twitter.com/F1/status/1189935141008871426

Frank Bullitt

https://twitter.com/WilliamsRacing/status/1189935387596251136

That front view is horrific.

vectra

2021 rules

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/article.2021-f1-rules-the-key-changes-explained.2dCtCkxNofk20K1B4rJwTk.html?utm_keyword=BreakingNews&utm_medium=email&utm_source=Ogilvy&utm_campaign=20191031_BreakingNews&utm_term=20190702_MASTER_FullAudience

El_Duderino 09

Gintonious wrote: »

https://twitter.com/WilliamsRacing/status/1189935387596251136

That front view is horrific.

Completely disagree. I think it looks great!

I’d love to see how closely these predictions match the reality when they are actually built

Frank Bullitt

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Completely disagree. I think it looks great!

I’d love to see how closely these predictions match the reality when they are actually built

That wing looks like some sort of IKEA shelf.

El_Duderino 09

Gintonious wrote: »

That wing looks like some sort of IKEA shelf.

Ah, it’s just different. People say the same about every. single. change. Then they become normal and they forget they ever disliked them and they focus on hating the next change.

I think they look cool.

uchimata83

It looks like a fomula e car and an indy car had a baby. And fair play to williams for being optimistic that they will be on the grid in 21

Cork Trucker

uchimata83 wrote: »

It looks like a fomula e car and an indy car had a baby. And fair play to williams for being optimistic that they will be on the grid in 21

With George Russell in the car at that. Look at the driver number.

Killinator

The F1 render looks much better from the front then the Williams one.
I think (hope) Williams forgot to add perspective to theirs

pjohnson

Killinator wrote: »

The F1 render looks much better from the front then the Williams one.
I think (hope) Williams forgot to add perspective to theirs

The perspective will be on the 2022 model not the 2021 model :pac:

AMKC

It looks a bit short. Are they going to be short wheel base now as well?. The F1 pic of the 2021 car certainly looks better than the Williams pic but that could be because the view is closer.

flazio

Might I make a suggestion we give the 2021 discussion it's own thread?