Donald Trump presidency discussion thread V

RIGOLO

pixelburp wrote: »

With his own hands? Few CEOs outside of the Jobs mould are detail oriented to the point of building a skyscraper (one that is 10 storeys lower than claimed in the lobby) and being involved in the nitty gritty. Let's not be complete fantasists here

Im not sure how much mortar he mixed personally, but it does have his name on it.

Not a bad achievement for a man who some people say 'he doesnt plan '

Id imagine theres ALOT of planning goes into getting a 52 storey skyscraper erected on 5th Avenue.

RIGOLO

GSRNBP wrote: »

The fact that "Space Force" is a phrase that is genuinely being used will never cease to amaze me (not in a good way).

Yep some people are amused at the concept.

And perhaps this article might also provide the same people with the same amusement.

The epic tale of China's out of this world plan for space domination

https://www.wired.co.uk/article/china-space-moon-base-mars-landing

The Chinese come out with a public road map of their plans for among other things, establishing a permanent base and colonising the moon, developing their own ISS , extensively developing their space program and who knows what else that ISNT on the public roadmap.

Trump Administration comes out with a number of sound directives as well as funding to drive the US Space industry forward and all there is is ridicule.
The anti-Trump bias is so obvious its funny.

Next time the anti-Trumpers look up at the moon, remember the Chinese are up there right this minute, working on their projects.

And the best the anti-Trumpers can come up with is biased ridicule for POTUS 45 and US efforts to get ahead of them .
Or perhaps your holding out hope for 2021 and for Elizsabeth Warren or Kamala Harris to get teh US to stay abreast of Chinese space development...

Igotadose

RIGOLO wrote: »

pixelburp wrote: »

With his own hands? Few CEOs outside of the Jobs mould are detail oriented to the point of building a skyscraper (one that is 10 storeys lower than claimed in the lobby) and being involved in the nitty gritty. Let's not be complete fantasists here

Im not sure how much mortar he mixed personally, but it does have his name on it.

Not a bad achievement for a man who some people say 'he doesnt plan '

Id imagine theres ALOT of planning goes into getting a 52 storey skyscraper erected on 5th Avenue.

Oh please.

Did he plan to get into a spat on camera regarding the term MOU with his chief negotiator to the amusement of the Chinese contingent? Didn't he plan to know full well what was being discussed? Every business meeting I've been in with senior managers in IT you planned EVERY detail and never surprised anyone.

So where was Trump's plan ? It was his meeting.

As for building his tower, he had a talented crew. That was the extent of his planning. Trump's mixed business success (Casinos?) don't show any special planning ability.

pixelburp

RIGOLO wrote: »

Im not sure how much mortar he mixed personally, but it does have his name on it.

Not a bad achievement for a man who some people say 'he doesnt plan '

Id imagine theres ALOT of planning goes into getting a 52 storey skyscraper erected on 5th Avenue.

Indeed there is, and I'd be confident, based on what I've read of the man pre and post election, that he had nothing to do with the construction bar the classical helicopter management style of reviewing the broad strokes.

Mind you, he was certainly involved enough - publicly too, in his capacity as Trump spokesman John Barron - with the controversy of the Art Deco friezes destroyed during Trump Tower's construction (and the levelling of the Bonwit-Teller building, from which the friezes came). Friezes mysteriously destroyed after the court ruled that they must be removed to a museum...

Leroy42

RIGOLO wrote: »

Im not sure how much mortar he mixed personally, but it does have his name on it.

Not a bad achievement for a man who some people say 'he doesnt plan '

Id imagine theres ALOT of planning goes into getting a 52 storey skyscraper erected on 5th Avenue.

Of course when we say he doesn't plan it doesn't mean he is incapable of it. Clearly, like every other person in the world, he is capable of planning. But he has shown absolutely no planning in terms of his time in office. None.

The fact that you have to refer back to his previous job, something he was basically doing for himself, simply add weight to the idea.

But he acknowledged himself that a lot of his business is really down to branding, he doesn't get involved. But why simply bring up the tower. Why not bring up the University, the casino, the steaks.

And of course if you want to hark back to a Tower block in which he was deeply involved, how then can you say that he had nothing to do with and knew of the planned Trump Tower Moscow? Had he given up being involved, in which case your example is way out of date.

RIGOLO

Igotadose wrote: »

Oh please.

Did he plan to get into a spat on camera regarding the term MOU with his chief negotiator to the amusement of the Chinese contingent? Didn't he plan to know full well what was being discussed? Every business meeting I've been in with senior managers in IT you planned EVERY detail and never surprised anyone.

So where was Trump's plan ? It was his meeting.

As for building his tower, he had a talented crew. That was the extent of his planning. Trump's mixed business success (Casinos?) don't show any special planning ability.

Yep thats a typical anti-Trumper response, when he does somethign, they always claim it wasnt because of him, it was in spite of him.

So talented in fact there over 8 Skyscapers of 150 meters or more with his name on them .

Not a bad acheivement for a what some people call 'a guy who cant plan ' .

I always laugh when posters knock Mar-A-Lago .. not many people know that
Mar-A-Lago , Trumps resort in Florida was previously the US Presidential retreat.
some rich old wan left it to the US government in 1973 to use as a Presidential retreat, but the US government couldnt maintain it, so Trump bought it in 1985 .
Talk about serendipity.
Trump bought the US Presidential Retreat 30 years before becoming President , and then he became the US President and now uses The Presidential Retreat as his Presidential Retreat... .. hows that for planning ...

Leroy42

RIGOLO wrote: »

Yep thats a typical anti-Trumper response, when he does somethign, they always claim it wasnt because of him, it was in spite of him.

So talented in fact there over 8 Skyscapers of 150 meters or more with his name on them .

Not a bad acheivement for a what some people call 'a guy who cant plan ' .

I always laugh when posters knock Mar-A-Lago .. not many people know that
Mar-A-Lago , Trumps resort in Florida was previously the US Presidential retreat.
some rich old wan left it to the US government in 1973 to use as a Presidential retreat, but the US government couldnt maintain it, so Trump bought it in 1985 .
Talk about serendipity.
Trump bought the US Presidential Retreat 30 years before becoming President , and then he became the US President and now uses The Presidential Retreat as his Presidential Retreat... .. hows that for planning ...

Sorry, are you seriously trying to suggest that Trump bought Mar A lago with a view to becoming POTUS? Yet he claims, due to his visits to Russia in 2012, that he didn't even think about running for POTUS until 2014.

So which is it?

Stallingrad

RIGOLO wrote: »

And the best the anti-Trumpers can come up with is biased ridicule for POTUS 45 and US efforts to get ahead of them .

It is not bias, it is opinion based on the evidence. He cheats, in relationships and business, he defrauds contractors, lies constantly, bullies and belittles, he appears utterly immoral with no obvious vision bar what he saw on Fox News and his own enrichment. You wouldn't want him for a neighbor, or near your daughter. He is not a credible person, never mind President. Yet you and others continue to defend certain actions while utterly ignoring the great majority of his obvious failings.

You might appear more credible in your arguments if you acknowledged that.

RIGOLO

Leroy42 wrote: »

Sorry, are you seriously trying to suggest that Trump bought Mar A lago with a view to becoming POTUS? Yet he claims, due to his visits to Russia in 2012, that he didn't even think about running for POTUS until 2014.

So which is it?

Of course not, I know you tend to always accuse people of saying things they never said, but thats ridiculous ... ... did you not see the SMILEY !!!!!!

I said serendipity .. look it up .

Stallingrad

Also this 'Anti Trump' moniker is also a cheap partisan cop out.

Most right mined people are repulsed the qualities I mentioned above, it just so happens that by some grotesque gestation they all converge in a person with that name.

circadian

RIGOLO wrote: »

Yep some people are amused at the concept.

And perhaps this article might also provide the same people with the same amusement.

https://www.wired.co.uk/article/china-space-moon-base-mars-landing

The Chinese come out with a public road map of their plans for among other things, establishing a permanent base and colonising the moon, developing their own ISS , extensively developing their space program and who knows what else that ISNT on the public roadmap.

Trump Administration comes out with a number of sound directives as well as funding to drive the US Space industry forward and all there is is ridicule.
The anti-Trump bias is so obvious its funny.

Next time the anti-Trumpers look up at the moon, remember the Chinese are up there right this minute, working on their projects.

And the best the anti-Trumpers can come up with is biased ridicule for POTUS 45 and US efforts to get ahead of them .
Or perhaps your holding out hope for 2021 and for Elizsabeth Warren or Kamala Harris to get teh US to stay abreast of Chinese space development...

So the Chinese are moving forward with their space exploration endeavours. So what? Is China the big scary bogey man or something?

I really don't get the point you're trying to make here. NASA exists, funding for it was crushed by Nixon shortly after the successful moon landing. If that hadn't happened then imagine where NASA would be right now. There's absolutely no need for this Space Force, of which there are zero details on what it will actually be.

It's clear that this is just a lobbyists wet dream, as was refunding NASA to such an extent. Who was behind the birth of lobbying in Nixon's campaign? Oh yeah, none other than Roger Stone and Paul Manafort. Whoever is pushing this space force idea, I suspect Boeing or similar, is rubbing their hands at the prospect of inflated government budgets coming their way.

Leroy42

RIGOLO wrote: »

Of course not, I know you tend to always accuse people of saying things they never said, but thats ridiculous ... ... did you not see the SMILEY !!!!!!

I said serendipity .. look it up .

Right, so you were joking, fair enough. So have you any actual examples, save for Towers built 30 years ago and your own version of a joke to point to his planning.

Remember that people have put forward many examples of his lack of planning which you want to disagree with. So go on.

RIGOLO

circadian wrote: »

So the Chinese are moving forward with their space exploration endeavours. So what? Is China the big scary bogey man or something?

I really don't get the point you're trying to make here. NASA exists, funding for it was crushed by Nixon shortly after the successful moon landing. If that hadn't happened then imagine where NASA would be right now. There's absolutely no need for this Space Force, of which there are zero details on what it will actually be.

It's clear that this is just a lobbyists wet dream, as was refunding NASA to such an extent. Who was behind the birth of lobbying in Nixon's campaign? Oh yeah, none other than Roger Stone and Paul Manafort. Whoever is pushing this space force idea, I suspect Boeing or similar, is rubbing their hands at the prospect of inflated government budgets coming their way.

I watch alot of NIPPON TV, as well as Al Jazeera and South East Asia news.
If you watched it too, you would already know the answer to that question.

I guess you make the call, do you want a Chinese mission on the moon staring down at you, or a US Mission on hte moon staring down at you, or perhaps both.
in which case you have to decide do you want that program started now, or do you want to wait 2 perhaps 6 more years for 'Spartacus' booker to get in and then you will support US space advancement.

It might be Boeing, Honeywell, LockheedMartin, Northrup Grumman, United Technologies... anyone of 20 companies , all of whoms stock has risen considerably since Trump took office.

So the markets and industry are taking this all very seriously, even if boards posters just use it as another vehicle to pillory Trump Administration. I just hope Im not forced back to the days when I worked on such projects and had to tape black out material on my windows so no one could see the screen, which sucked on really hot days ;-)

Quin_Dub

RIGOLO wrote: »

Yep thats a typical anti-Trumper response, when he does somethign, they always claim it wasnt because of him, it was in spite of him.

So talented in fact there over 8 Skyscapers of 150 meters or more with his name on them .

Not a bad acheivement for a what some people call 'a guy who cant plan ' .

I always laugh when posters knock Mar-A-Lago .. not many people know that
Mar-A-Lago , Trumps resort in Florida was previously the US Presidential retreat.
some rich old wan left it to the US government in 1973 to use as a Presidential retreat, but the US government couldnt maintain it, so Trump bought it in 1985 .
Talk about serendipity.
Trump bought the US Presidential Retreat 30 years before becoming President , and then he became the US President and now uses The Presidential Retreat as his Presidential Retreat... .. hows that for planning ...

To a point of clarification - It was never ever a "Presidential retreat" - Not one single president (prior to Trump) ever set foot in the place , ever.

The "old wan" as you call her, Marjorie Merriweather Post talked about it becoming such a thing in her will when she bequeathed it to the state , but as you correctly say , it was going to be too expensive to maintain so they gave it back to the charitable foundation that the Post family ran.

phater phagan

Schnitzler Hiyori Geta wrote: »

Space Force has nothing to do with NASA.

The Space Force is just Trump's version of Reagan's "Star Wars" initiative, which never got off the ground ( if you'll excuse the pun).

Schnitzler Hiyori Geta

Quin_Dub wrote: »

To a point of clarification - It was never ever a "Presidential retreat" - Not one single president (prior to Trump) ever set foot in the place , ever.

The "old wan" as you call her, Marjorie Merriweather Post talked about it becoming such a thing in her will when she bequeathed it to the state , but as you correctly say , it was going to be too expensive to maintain so they gave it back to the charitable foundation that the Post family ran.

I think it was only ever actually owned by the US government for 10 years - Nixon had his own house in Florida which was somehow involved in Watergate IIRC and Carter preferred building houses on his holidays! US government gave it back to the Post family in the 1981.

RIGOLO

Quin_Dub wrote: »

To a point of clarification - It was never ever a "Presidential retreat" - Not one single president (prior to Trump) ever set foot in the place , ever.

The "old wan" as you call her, Marjorie Merriweather Post talked about it becoming such a thing in her will when she bequeathed it to the state , but as you correctly say , it was going to be too expensive to maintain so they gave it back to the charitable foundation that the Post family ran.

That makes it an even better anecdote...

So Trump bought what was meant to be a US Presidential Retreat but never became a US presidential Retreat , 30 years before becoming President , and then he became the US President and so defacto it became a US Presidential Retreat as its his personal retreat.
and
Dear old Marjorie, finally got her wish.. another promise delivered by DT.

Schnitzler Hiyori Geta

RIGOLO wrote: »

I know thats why I said....

FEB 19th 2019 - Trump issues SPD-4 - Tasks the Secreatray of Defense to establish a Space Force as a 6th branch of the military.

What you also said is:

RIGOLO wrote: »

Im looking forward to seeing what developments come out of the Trump Administration support and push of NASA, The Pentagon and commercial space
bodies. As NASA's itself claims , for every 1 dollar invested in Space , its a $10 boost for the economy.

When the reality is that NASA's budget has been fairly consistent and stagnant for two decades.

phater phagan

Trump claimed 14 million dollars for damages to Mara Largo after the Hurricane Irma devastated a lot of the coastal properties in Florida. He pocketed most of that money, because it's now coming to light that his Mara Largo property received very little damage.

RIGOLO

Schnitzler Hiyori Geta wrote: »

What you also said is:



When the reality is that NASA's budget has been fairly consistent and stagnant for two decades.

I clearly stated ...

Trump Administration support and push of NASA, The Pentagon and commercial space bodies.

let me know if I left anyone out.

Dont worry about the NASA budget , 2017 the Defense budget was 590 Billion, but thanks to the Dems for signing off on Trump Administration whopper 690 billion. Thats more than enough to go around with a bit left over for a wall and get some early stage ignition on a Space Force.

Why else do you think all those stocks I mentioned are on the up.

Schnitzler Hiyori Geta

RIGOLO wrote: »

I clearly stated ...



let me know if I left anyone out.

Dont worry about the NASA budget , 2017 the Defense budget was 590 Billion, but thanks to the Dems for signing off on Trump Administration whopper 690 billion. Thats more than enough to go around with a bit left over for a wall and get some early stage ignition on a Space Force.

Why else do you think all those stocks I mentioned are on the up.

Again, not in any way clear what the budget of the Department of Defense has to do with NASA, commercial or civilian space aviation.

Leroy42

So Rigolo, any answer to why you think it a good idea that federal investigation reports should be buried.

everlast75

Spike Lee said:

“The 2020 presidential election is around the corner. Let’s all mobilize, let’s all be on the right side of history, let’s choose love over hate, let’s do the right thing.”

Trump replied with


https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1100000030319169537


Notice Lee actually said nothing about Trump - yet Trump interpreted it as an attack on him. Why is that I wonder...

prawnsambo

everlast75 wrote: »

Spike Lee said:

“The 2020 presidential election is around the corner. Let’s all mobilize, let’s all be on the right side of history, let’s choose love over hate, let’s do the right thing.”

Trump replied with


https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1100000030319169537


Notice Lee actually said nothing about Trump - yet Trump interpreted it as an attack on him. Why is that I wonder...

To be fair, it couldn't have been about anyone else.

pixelburp

Yeah, it was obvious & plain as day who Lee was referring to; but it speaks to a great deal of insecurity, and a lack of nous, that Trump couldn't resist sh*tposting on Twitter. I know not being a politician is supposed to be his big selling point, but even the most workaday of politicians can ignore trolling & WUMs.

everlast75

prawnsambo wrote: »

To be fair, it couldn't have been about anyone else.

The point is that Trump interpreted "asking people to do the right thing" to be akin to voting against him.

That's a pretty sh1tty indictment of his presidency and how he really believes people see it.

pixelburp

As ever, it's probably lost within the morass of the 24 hour news cycle, but you can add Former Secretary of the Interior Ryan Zinke to the list of 'Trump appointees under investigation and inevitably corrupt'

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/grand-jury-is-examining-whether-former-interior-secretary-ryan-zinke-lied-to-federal-investigators/2019/02/22/0fb2427a-36c4-11e9-854a-7a14d7fec96a_story.html?utm_term=.4e2fb9341413

At this stage, sarcastically referencing the "Drain the Swamp" narrative just feels kneejerk and not particularly insightful - but I do legitimately wonder: is this the most corrupt administration in US history? Or rather: does this administration have the most investigations into its current & former staff in US history? Because it certainly feels like every major appointment has found him/herself embroiled in some form of scandal.

Prosecutors have begun presenting evidence to a grand jury in Washington in their probe of whether former interior Secretary Ryan Zinke lied to federal investigators, according to two individuals briefed on the matter.

...
Investigators with the Interior Department’s inspector general’s office came to believe Zinke had lied to them in the course of that inquiry and referred the matter to the Justice Department late last year.

Making false statements to federal officials constitutes a crime, but it can be difficult to prove because it requires prosecutors to show a person “knowingly and willfully” lied, rather than simply misstated a fact.

RIGOLO

pixelburp wrote: »

As ever, it's probably lost within the morass of the 24 hour news cycle, but you can add Former Secretary of the Interior Ryan Zinke to the list of 'Trump appointees under investigation and inevitably corrupt'

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/health-science/grand-jury-is-examining-whether-former-interior-secretary-ryan-zinke-lied-to-federal-investigators/2019/02/22/0fb2427a-36c4-11e9-854a-7a14d7fec96a_story.html?utm_term=.4e2fb9341413

At this stage, sarcastically referencing the "Drain the Swamp" narrative just feels kneejerk and not particularly insightful - but I do legitimately wonder: is this the most corrupt administration in US history? Or rather: does this administration have the most investigations into its current & former staff in US history? Because it certainly feels like every major appointment has found him/herself embroiled in some form of scandal.

Another potential 'process crime' as the say in legal circles.
Still no inkling of any Russian collusion by Trump , wasnt that what the left were hoping to impeach him on.

6 million for a dossier, the might of FB and Google behind you, a DOJ thats riddled with supporters and deep state fifth column elements supporting you, 24x7 main stream media support and still the best they can come up with is some process crimes against a former admin official.

No wonder it got lost it the news cycle, its a nothing story.

RIGOLO

Leroy42 wrote: »

So Rigolo, any answer to why you think it a good idea that federal investigation reports should be buried.

If you can find where I said that, I might have an answer.

but once again theres no need for me to answer a question about something I didnt say.

We been down this road before,
For future reference im just going to ignore questions about things you claim I said but I didnt.

Chips Lovell

I'll repost this mod warning from a few months ago. It still applies.

Baron de Charlus wrote: »

Mod Warning

OK folks, in recent weeks this thread has frequently gotten out of hand. Despite numerous warnings, cards, and bans, we've still got far too many people just ignoring the forum charter.

So this is a final warning. If you can't keep to the rules, don't post here, because we're rapidly nearing the point where we're going to have to start banning people, either from this thread or from the forum as a whole.

If you haven't read the charter, please do so now. And, it should go without saying, but in relation to this thread, let us stress the following:

1. If you think this warning applies to one side of the debate, think again. We've had to intervene with posters from both sides on a regular basis.

2. Just because someone else is acting the maggot, doesn't give you licence to do the same. Report their posts, ignore them and move on. Responding in kind just amplifies the problem and turns the thread into an even bigger mess.

3. If you want to talk about the "deep state" or any kind of conspiracy theory, don't do so here. This is a place for fact-based discussion.