Donald Trump presidency discussion thread V

MadYaker

The simple fact that a sitting president would refuse to be interviewed by a law enforcement official is kind of astonishing.

everlast75

We should make this tweet a sticky on this thread....


https://twitter.com/SethAbramson/status/1074347714282950657?s=19

Thargor

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

It used to be daily brain farts from the orange one but lately it seems like they are hourly!


https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1074313153679450113?s=19

Is it me or has his "support" in this thread thinned out inconsiderably lately?

Should a POTUS even be referring to people who cooperate with law enforcement as "rats"? Imagine if Obama had done that.

mcmoustache

WaPo has just published some extracts from a draft report prepared for the Senate Intel Committee (the sane one). It was performed by Oxford University and a network analysis firm.

This following claim in the article comes as no surprise so let's just get that out of the way.

“What is clear is that all of the messaging clearly sought to benefit the Republican Party--and specifically Donald Trump,” the report says. “Trump is mentioned most in campaigns targeting conservatives and right-wing voters, where the messaging encouraged these groups to support his campaign. The main groups that could challenge Trump were then provided messaging that sought to confuse, distract and ultimately discourage members from voting.”

There was nothing too surprising in there for anyone following this over the past few years but the following bit is interesting.

The report traces the origins of Russian online influence operations to Russian domestic politics in 2009 and says that ambitions shifted to include U.S. politics as early as 2013 over Twitter. Of the tweets the company provided to the Senate, 57 percent are in Russian, with 36 percent in English and smaller amounts in other languages.

The efforts to manipulate Americans grew sharply in 2014 and every year after, as teams of operatives spread their work across more platforms and accounts, in order to target larger swaths of U.S. voters by geography, political interests, race, religion and other factors. The Russians started with accounts on Twitter, then added YouTube and Instagram before finally bringing Facebook into the mix, the report said.

Anyone remember Bannon's gamergate and the rise of the alt-right? I do too and nearly bought into it myself. Let's not forget that the Mercers were bankrolling Milo and others of his ilk. A lot more is yet to come out about the connections between these types and the Russians. With that in mind, the next bit is a bit disappointing.

Facebook, for example, provided the Senate with copies of posts from 81 Facebook “Pages” and information on 76 accounts used to purchase ads, but did not share the posts from other user accounts run by the IRA, the report says. Twitter, meanwhile, has made it challenging for outside researchers to collect and analyze data on its platform through its public feed, the researchers said.

Google submitted information in an especially difficult way for the researchers to handle, providing content such as YouTube videos but not the related data that would have allowed a full analysis. The YouTube information was so hard for the researchers to study, they wrote, they instead tracked the links to its videos from other sites in hopes of better understanding YouTube’s role in the Russian effort.

Thankfully, the House investigations can soon get their subpoena pens out and get these companies to be a bit more forthcoming. To say that they've been dragging their feet would be an understatement.

Cheerful Spring

Captain Obvious wrote: »

An entire floor of the DC courthouse was sealed off for a secret grand jury case today. A lot of speculation that Trump has been subpoenaed to testify.

https://www.ajc.com/news/national-govt--politics/entire-floor-federal-courthouse-sealed-off-for-mystery-case/JyerATnO5wL4gJKcS6nVJP/

Not true Trump lawyer denied it. And conspiracy forums are all over this. A mystery witness is challenging Mueller in a court and presenting new evidence of crimes including 9/11 and Uranium one scandal. There evidence this is the case.

The FBI raided a whistleblower home in the last few weeks. They were looking for files that show Mueller was involved in a cover-up.
https://dailycaller.com/2018/11/29/fbi-whistleblower-clinton-uranium/

Cheerful Spring

There are two different sealed case involving an unknown grand jury which have attracted attention at the D.C. Circuit Court of Appeals – as the relatively speedy nature of the cases – and then today’s sealing off of an entire floor – has prompted intense interest.

“To this day, I can’t fathom what the heck it could be that would move this fast and get this much secrecy,” said national security lawyer Bradley Moss.

New crimes are getting exposed and that why the entire floor was sealed and journalists got moved away.

mcmoustache

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

Not true Trump lawyer denied it. And conspiracy forums are all over this. A mystery witness is challenging Mueller in a court and presenting new evidence of crimes including 9/11 and Uranium one scandal. There evidence this is the case.

The FBI raided a whistleblower home in the last few weeks. They were looking for files that show Mueller was involved in a cover-up.
https://dailycaller.com/2018/11/29/fbi-whistleblower-clinton-uranium/

I'm not sure where to start here but let's take a look at your claims and see where we get.


First of all, a Trump person denying anything is meaningless. Remember how there were no Russian contacts, for example. They lie all the time so a denial means nothing.


You're correct that it's a subpoena being challenged but but then you take the fast train to crazy town. This is not about Hillary. You probably picked that up on some QAnon site or some Russian propaganda site. If this was about Hillary Clinton, the only Trump appointed judge would not have had to recuse himself.

Cunningham argued that this itself was telling, but added that something else was “even more telling,” namely: “President Trump’s sole appointee to that court, Gregory Katsas, recused himself.”

As for the rest of the 911 and Uranium One stuff, I'm not even going to bother - it's the calling card of a disinformed mind.


As for the Daily Caller link, this is not a good source for anything, and that's putting it mildly. It makes stuff up and, strangely enough, echos Russian disinformation too. It is trash.



Let me give you some advice. There are good sources of information online. These are credible places with a record to protect. Then there are other sources that make stuff up and are wrong all the time. The internet makes it easy to tell the difference. You need to learn how to tell the difference.

Cheerful Spring

mcmoustache wrote: »

I'm not sure where to start here but let's take a look at your claims and see where we get.


First of all, a Trump person denying anything is meaningless. Remember how there were no Russian contacts, for example. They lie all the time so a denial means nothing.


You're correct that it's a subpoena being challenged but but then you take the fast train to crazy town. This is not about Hillary. You probably picked that up on some QAnon site or some Russian propaganda site. If this was about Hillary Clinton, the only Trump appointed judge would not have had to recuse himself.





As for the rest of the 911 and Uranium One stuff, I'm not even going to bother - it's the calling card of a disinformed mind.


As for the Daily Caller link, this is not a good source for anything, and that's putting it mildly. It makes stuff up and, strangely enough, echos Russian disinformation too. It is trash.



Let me give you some advice. There are good sources of information online. These are credible places with a record to protect. Then there are other sources that make stuff up and are wrong all the time. The internet makes it easy to tell the difference. You need to learn how to tell the difference.

This only a day ago.
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/fbi-misses-deadline-to-provide-docs-to-judiciary-committee-probing-whistleblower-raid

The evidence is a new witness is challenging Mueller authority in court and that why they're so much secrecy. He exposing Mueller involvement in cover-ups

Cheerful Spring

The Justice Department and FBI have missed a Wednesday deadline to provide information about the government's mysterious raid on a former FBI contractor-turned-whistleblower's home last month.

Sixteen FBI agents on Nov. 19 raided the home of Dennis Nathan Cain, who reportedly gave the Justice Department's Inspector General (IG) documents related to the Uranium One controversy and potential wrongdoing by former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton.

The documents in question allegedly showed that federal officials ( Mueller and others) failed to investigate possible criminal activity related to Clinton, the Clinton Foundation and Rosatom, a Russian nuclear company. Its subsidiary purchased Canadian mining company Uranium One in 2013.

pearcider

You only have to read the insane posts in this thread to know for a certainty that Trump must be doing something right. Trump derangement syndrome

mcmoustache

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

This only a day ago.
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/fbi-misses-deadline-to-provide-docs-to-judiciary-committee-probing-whistleblower-raid

The evidence is a new witness is challenging Mueller authority in court and that why they're so much secrecy. He exposing Mueller involvement in cover-ups

I'm not saying that a raid didn't happen. I'm saying that it has zero to do with the sealed Mueller sessions. And, for the record, FOX is also not a good source. It does this all the time. This is why people who get their information from FOX are less informed than even if they didn't read or watch news. The graph below is from 2012 but it shows how watching FOX makes you less informed.




FOX is mostly trash and you shouldn't take them seriously.

Cheerful Spring

mcmoustache wrote: »

I'm not saying that a raid didn't happen. I'm saying that it has zero to do with the sealed Mueller sessions. And, for the record, FOX is also not a good source. It does this all the time. This is why people who get their information from FOX are less informed than even if they didn't read or watch news. The graph below is from 2012 but it shows how watching FOX makes you less informed.




FOX is mostly trash and you shouldn't take them seriously.

At every level, this matter has commanded the immediate and close attention of the judges involved — suggesting that no ordinary witness and no ordinary issue is involved,” Cunningham wrote in the piece.

The mystery witness or person is challenging Mueller authority to prosecute. He revealing new information in secret, that why they adopted extreme measures like this.

After hearing two other cases this morning, the three-judge panel took significant measures to clear out the fifth floor of the federal courthouse. The courtroom was cleared of everyone except a dozen legal clerks, then they cleared the vestibule. Security guards swept the courtroom for possible recording devices left behind. They checked the coat closet, locked the door to the attorney’s lounge on that floor, and made everyone clear the elevator bank as well as the stairwells leading up and down from the floor. At one point, even the elevators would not open on the fifth floor.

mcmoustache

pearcider wrote: »

You only have to read the insane posts in this thread to know for a certainty that Trump must be doing something right. Trump derangement syndrome

That parses into english but it doesn't make sense. It sounds more like something that a simple person might think would sound clever. I've seen it in AH and in other places where the standards of comments are much lower than in here but it is always by a driveby who can't defend the position beyond making a soundbite. It's like the people who wander into the A&A forum, confident in their belief that the comment that they saw on facebook would destroy the worldview of the regulars; in they pop, all giddy with excitement and with a few taps of their keyboards spew forth "Atheism is just another religion".



Is it your point that Trump being universally disliked implies that he is doing his job well? If it is, good luck defending that but I suspect that repeating what you saw somewhere else is the best that you can do and actually defending the position is beyond your abilities.

mcmoustache

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

At every level, this matter has commanded the immediate and close attention of the judges involved — suggesting that no ordinary witness and no ordinary issue is involved,” Cunningham wrote in the piece.

The mystery witness or person is challenging Mueller authority to prosecute. He revealing new information in secret, that why they adopted extreme measures like this.

After hearing two other cases this morning, the three-judge panel took significant measures to clear out the fifth floor of the federal courthouse. The courtroom was cleared of everyone except a dozen legal clerks, then they cleared the vestibule. Security guards swept the courtroom for possible recording devices left behind. They checked the coat closet, locked the door to the attorney’s lounge on that floor, and made everyone clear the elevator bank as well as the stairwells leading up and down from the floor. At one point, even the elevators would not open on the fifth floor.

Nobody disagrees that the sealed session took place. It's the connections to 911 and Uranium One which are QAnon bullshít. QAnon is a hoax that says that Mueller is really working with Trump to arrest Hillary Clinton. It is nonsense. Please stop reading nonsense.

Cheerful Spring

mcmoustache wrote: »

Nobody disagrees that the sealed session took place. It's the connections to 911 and Uranium One which are QAnon bullshít. QAnon is a hoax that says that Mueller is really working with Trump to arrest Hillary Clinton. It is nonsense. Please stop reading nonsense.

It not QAnon bull****. It's a mainstream news the FBI raided a whistleblower home. He has files that show Mueller covered up crimes.

Cheerful Spring

mcmoustache wrote: »

QAnon is a hoax that says that Mueller is really working with Trump to arrest Hillary Clinton.

QAnon is bull**** and just silly.

There is a mystery witness battling Mueller in court and not Donald Trump. For the court to be sealed like this in secrecy must be a very important witness. That witness would have to appear and present evidence to stop Mueller. With the raid on Whistleblower home, with the FBI looking for documents on Uranium one you can not ignore that ties in with the Russia investigation. You think its untrue but lot of people in mainstream believe Mueller was involved in a cover-up of this affair.

jooksavage

Looking up this story on Google, it's Fox News, Fox News, Daily Caller, Fox News, Epoch Times, Townhall.com,... oh wait there's Forbes - let's see what they have to say. Forbes: "It's bull****".

12gauge dave

I am not the most politically minded or adept person and i have looked at quick facts on russias meddling in us 2016 elections and would just like to ask some questions.

1.Was Putin behind the hacking and meddling?

2.Was trump behind the meddling and co conspire with Putin?

3.Aside from email hacking and advertisments do you believe that Russia hacked the voting machines or directly manipulated vote counts on said machines somehow? And usa doesnt want to admit as it would be too embarrassing or do i need to take off the tin foil hat?:)

Zubeneschamali

12gauge dave wrote: »

3.Aside from email hacking and advertisments do you believe that Russia hacked the voting machines or directly manipulated vote counts on said machines somehow?

No, I have not seen any serious suggestions of that sort of hacking.

dr.fuzzenstein

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

No, I have not seen any serious suggestions of that sort of hacking.

But it would be foolish to suggest that the absolute deluge of hate, lies and propaganda against Hillary and for Trump had absolutely no bearing on the outcome.
It was a constant stream of bullsh*t and mental diarrhea.
The really worrying thing is that there are people who seemingly have single digit IQs that readily swallow the hateful bullsh*t like pizzagate.
I'm beginning to believe that up to 30% of US voters must be abject simpletons.

Zubeneschamali

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

But it would be foolish to suggest that the absolute deluge of hate, lies and propaganda against Hillary and for Trump had absolutely no bearing on the outcome.

Crimes, too. Nixon was brought down because he had a crew break into the offices of the DNC and bug them.


Trump had the Russians hack the DNC and steal emails for him.

listermint

dr.fuzzenstein wrote: »

But it would be foolish to suggest that the absolute deluge of hate, lies and propaganda against Hillary and for Trump had absolutely no bearing on the outcome.
It was a constant stream of bullsh*t and mental diarrhea.
The really worrying thing is that there are people who seemingly have single digit IQs that readily swallow the hateful bullsh*t like pizzagate.
I'm beginning to believe that up to 30% of US voters must be abject simpletons.

US.....

It think that applies to any nation state. Including our own.

duploelabs

jooksavage wrote: »

Looking up this story on Google, it's Fox News, Fox News, Daily Caller, Fox News, Epoch Times, Townhall.com,... oh wait there's Forbes - let's see what they have to say. Forbes: "It's bull****".

I'd be pretty sure that this are the only sources that continue with the Uranium One/HRC is under investigation

prawnsambo

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

No, I have not seen any serious suggestions of that sort of hacking.

I think there was an issue with some machines that had remote access enabled. My memory is hazy, but it was machines from one company iirc.

everlast75

I think it was mcmoustache who posted earlier that he or she nearly fell for the right wing conspiracy stuff.

Personally, I have a hard time understanding why such posters here still see things as they do.

In order to get a handle on that, perhaps mcmoustache could explain what drew him or her to those stories, what gave them credibility and what made him or her see the light, as it were?

dr.fuzzenstein

Article on massive interference in the 2016 elections:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2018/12/16/new-report-russian-disinformation-prepared-senate-shows-operations-scale-sweep/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.a60268e00bbe

You'd want to be either extremely naive or involved (or trolling) to say that there was no interference, or even that this interference had no bearing on the results.

mcmoustache

Cheerful Spring wrote: »

QAnon is bull**** and just silly.

There is a mystery witness battling Mueller in court and not Donald Trump. For the court to be sealed like this in secrecy must be a very important witness. That witness would have to appear and present evidence to stop Mueller. With the raid on Whistleblower home, with the FBI looking for documents on Uranium one you can not ignore that ties in with the Russia investigation. You think its untrue but lot of people in mainstream believe Mueller was involved in a cover-up of this affair.

Two things appear to be true - the sealed session and the whistleblower raid. The problem is connecting the two. This is actually a good example of how some propaganda is disseminated - you take some facts and mix them up with conjecture, supposition and opinion before sending it out to the public.

Seriously, nobody except disinformation sites are pushing this theory.

mcmoustache

12gauge dave wrote: »

I am not the most politically minded or adept person and i have looked at quick facts on russias meddling in us 2016 elections and would just like to ask some questions.

1.Was Putin behind the hacking and meddling?

2.Was trump behind the meddling and co conspire with Putin?

3.Aside from email hacking and advertisments do you believe that Russia hacked the voting machines or directly manipulated vote counts on said machines somehow? And usa doesnt want to admit as it would be too embarrassing or do i need to take off the tin foil hat?:)

1. It wouldn't happen without his approval. The Internet Research Agency which carried out some of it was run by Yevgeny Prigozhin who is a close ally of Putin. Also, the GRU, Russian Military Intelligence are the ones who hacked the DNC and they are unlikely to do anything without Putin's approval.

2. This is unproven as of now but there is a lot of information out there tying his campaign to Russia. One example here would be Roger Stone's interactions with Russian Military Intelligence regarding the DNC hack as well as his interactions with Wikileaks regarding the same data.

3. Nobody has made that claim although I would be surprised if voting machines weren't being hacked by Americans because a lot of them are insecure and have been shown to be easy to manipulate.

duploelabs

pearcider wrote: »

By any metric Trump is doing is job well. He will walk 2020 easily. The proof is in the pudding. Huge successes with China and North Korea. Unemployment at historic lows. Immigration finally being tackled and with what looks like a good result for Ireland.

Nobody cares about fake news war being waged against him by the MSM. CNN and MSNBC are so partisan these days that their ratings are in the toilet. Washington post and New York time sales on the floor. The average person can see right through the virtue signallers in Hollywood. The movie industry is being pummeled too. The ratings for awards shows like the oscars at all time lows. Everyday a new celeb is sacrificed at the altar of public correctness for some comment they made 15 years ago and given a hateful trial by twitter. The left is eating itself and it is glorious to see.

But the real sign that he’s doing a good job is the echo chamber of anguish in this thread. If he’s annoying people like you, he is winning bigly.

You forgot the sarcasm emoji at the end

FreudianSlippers

pearcider wrote: »

By any metric Trump is doing is job well.

I mean other than all the factual metrics, maybe.

pearcider wrote: »

The average person can see right through the virtue signallers in Hollywood. The movie industry is being pummeled too.

:rolleyes:

Not sure what part of the US you live in, but trust me... things are going pretty well in "Hollywood" and the liberal West Coast in general compared to the Trump-loving flyover states, the rust belt and coal mining country which Trump has completely failed.

Trumps economy benefits the wealthy and the wealthy alone; Trump certainly hasn't hurt my bank account, but I'd rather lose the tax breaks and get rid of him.