Donald Trump presidency discussion thread V

manual_man

stoneill wrote: »

I noticed that the American flag was flying at half mast at the ambassadors residence in the Phoenix park while I was on my way to the Bloom festival on Monday - was he in mourning for the upcoming visit of his boss?

Probably someone mourning the demise of the Trump Baby balloon

BonnieSituation

golfball37 wrote: »

There are less than 20 people outside Shannon Airport protesting as I type. There are more out on side street of Doonbeg hoping to see the president. How will RTÉ spin this one?

Given that local people in Doonbeg met with potential protesters and asked them not to protest his visit in the village and they agreed to, I fail to see how it could be "spun".

Also, where near Shannon could people protest in view of Trump himself. The place is locked down and he's going via helicopter. Seems like a waste of a protest when they could gain a critical mass elsewhere.

You're just looking to moan and be contrary about this.

How are these protests (potential or otherwise) affecting you outside of giving you an outlet to be edgy?

manual_man

pixelburp wrote: »

https://www.snopes.com/news/2016/07/28/donald-trump-criticized-for-mocking-disabled-reporter/



Trump has a habit of denying first, particularly when it comes to people; "I don't know him, I never met him" is a pretty common mantra. If he has never heard of the person, then they're "losers", or "low IQ individuals".

And that's ignoring the fact that Trump has literally not made those physical gestures when talking about anyone else, in any interview. He was mocking the guy's disability, it's pretty stark.

Right. So zero facts. Just assertions made as to the extent of their 'relationship' from 30 odd years ago - which if true surely would have been dug up by fact checkers.

Leroy42

manual_man wrote: »

Right. So zero facts. Just assertions made as to the extent of their 'relationship' from 30 odd years ago - which if true surely would have been dug up by fact checkers.

How many other journalists has he done the same with?

pixelburp

manual_man wrote: »

Right. So zero facts. Just assertions made as to the extent of their 'relationship' from 30 odd years ago - which if true surely would have been dug up by fact checkers.

LOL. Ah, so basically you want a convenient photo of the two men, maybe smiling? Shaking hands? Perhaps a copy of a newspaper in the background to confirm the time?

Trump says he didn't know Kovaleski; Kovaleski says he interviewed him a number of times during Trumps heyday as the celebrity Real Estate magnate. Despite Trump making gestures never since repeated relating to anyone else, that just so happen to match Kovaleski's own physical ailment, nope. Has to be coincidence. Because no interns have gone deep-diving into the Daily News' pre-internet records.

Look, I get Devils Advocate and taking the sceptical position, but seriously. Trump has form, he likes mocking people (the constant nicknames, "bleeding out of her whatever" etc), and took a swing at a man's disability. It's pretty clear cut.

BonnieSituation

manual_man wrote: »

Right. So zero facts. Just assertions made as to the extent of their 'relationship' from 30 odd years ago - which if true surely would have been dug up by fact checkers.

So the assertion by the man himself on Snopes.com, a well regarded fact check website isn't enough for you?

Maybe if you told us what "facts" and "standards" you require we might be able to help. I guess.

manual_man

Leroy42 wrote: »

How many other journalists has he done the same with?

Look. Trump regularly mocks all sorts of people. He uses his hands a lot. Sometimes makes faces. He's Trump. I think we get this by now. I'm simply not assuming that while criticizing this reporter that he was doing so in a way to mock his disability. Others can assume this is what he meant to do if they so wish, that's their prerogative. But it's not my game to assert knowledge of someone's intentions.

tonycascarino

golfball37 wrote: »

There are less than 20 people outside Shannon Airport protesting as I type. There are more out on side street of Doonbeg hoping to see the president. How will RTÉ spin this one?

20 numbskulls who obviously tune in to Pat Kenny on a daily basis. Trump is very welcome in Ireland as President of America .

manual_man

BonnieSituation wrote: »

So the assertion by the man himself on Snopes.com, a well regarded fact check website isn't enough for you?

Maybe if you told us what "facts" and "standards" you require we might be able to help. I guess.

Facts, not assertions. I'm wholly confident you can differentiate between the two

Leroy42

manual_man wrote: »

Look. Trump regularly mocks all sorts of people. He uses his hands a lot. Sometimes makes faces. He's Trump. I think we get this by now. I'm simply not assuming that while criticizing this reporter that he was doing so in a way to mock his disability. Others can assume this is what he meant to do if they so wish, that's their prerogative. But it's not my game to assert knowledge of someone's intentions.

But you have already assumed his intentions. You are claiming, despite the evidence in front of you, that it had nothing to do with the mans disability.

This despite the man in question stating that Trump had met him plenty of times, that Trump used the man's name and not just 'a journalist' and that Trump is a well documented liar and is happy to openly mock anything he sees as different or less in other people.

Those that are asserting that it was a jibe at the journalist are simply taking the video at face value, with the rest of what we know of Trump backing it up. You on the other hand are looking to place something entirely different on the situation.

So where is your evidence that he wasn't mocking the journalist? Have you any other instances of Trump talking about other people using the same hand gestures?

Quin_Dub

manual_man wrote: »

Look. Trump regularly mocks all sorts of people. He uses his hands a lot. Sometimes makes faces. He's Trump. I think we get this by now. I'm simply not assuming that while criticizing this reporter that he was doing so in a way to mock his disability. Others can assume this is what he meant to do if they so wish, that's their prerogative. But it's not my game to assert knowledge of someone's intentions.

Have a look at exactly what Trump does , then have a look at Video of the Journalist.

Trumps hand movements and actions are a direct copy of exactly how the journalists disability impacts him.

But given your absolute insistence that it's purely coincidence I doubt that will sway you.

manual_man

Leroy42 wrote: »

But you have already assumed his intentions. You are claiming, despite the evidence in front of you, that it had nothing to do with the mans disability.

I have not said this. So please don't lie about what i've said. I've simply expressed my refusal to assume his intentions when i don't know them. Others are assuming they know what his intentions were.

20Cent

manual_man wrote: »

Look. Trump regularly mocks all sorts of people. He uses his hands a lot. Sometimes makes faces. He's Trump. I think we get this by now. I'm simply not assuming that while criticizing this reporter that he was doing so in a way to mock his disability. Others can assume this is what he meant to do if they so wish, that's their prerogative. But it's not my game to assert knowledge of someone's intentions.

Some coincidence that trump happens to make gestures that exactly mimick the guys disability. The reason trump was angry with him was because he contradicted another of trump's lies that there were thousands of muslims celebrating on 911.

Christy42

Leroy42 wrote: »

But, I thought Trump was the man that said it as it is. That isn't afraid of all the PC nonsense.

It seems very much to me that Trump doesn't ever say anything at all, that everything he says can be interpreted any number of ways.

But if that is true, if his supporters are so sure that those that don't like are simply twisting his words and actions to suit their own agenda, then how can they be certain that how they are interpreting him is any more true?

How can they be cure that he really is speaking for them?

My favourite on here was when he was talking about NATO. You had posters saying how great he was for encouraging NATO development and others saying how great he was for taking NATO down a few pegs and he had seen what a horrible organisation it was.

tonycascarino

Varadkar looking delighted to meet Trump and so he should be. He is almost as excited as he was when he met his hero Kylie Minogue.

20Cent

Christy42 wrote: »

My favourite on here was when he was talking about NATO. You had posters saying how great he was for encouraging NATO development and others saying how great he was for taking NATO down a few pegs and he had seen what a horrible organisation it was.

My favourite was an interview where he's asked about minimum wage. He thought it should be increased, left the same, let the states decide and it should be a federal issue all at the same time.

everlast75

manual_man wrote: »

We don't even know if Trump had any idea the man in question had a disability. He claims he didn't.

Don't just dump videos please

Outlaw Pete

20Cent wrote: »

Some coincidence that trump happens to make gestures that exactly mimick the guys disability.

This has been debunked numerous times.

Watch the following clip and you will see that he has made the same gestures (and sounds) when mocking people over the years:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5aYFC_7ZIn4

The Nal

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

This has been debunked numerous times.

Watch the following clip and you will see that he has made the same gestures (and sounds) when mocking people over the years:

Yup. Its his standard mocking gesture. People still outraged.

Leroy42

But he is clearly mocking other people in that video. Is that your evidence against him mocking people? That he openly mocks them.

So it then has to stand on the issue of whether he knew of the reporter or not. We only have his word that he didn't. But yet he knew enough of him to comment about him in a speech during an election campaign. But we know Trump is a liar. Surely even you can appreciate that.

We know that Trump will lie to save himself.

So lets look at this then.

A known liar.
A man who openly mocks people.
A man that thinks that everyone else is beneath him.
A man that holds grudges.

Of course none of that proves what he meant. None of us are in his head. But I simply cannot understand why you would give him the benefit of the doubt given all we know about him. On the balance of probabilities what do you think is more likely?

That he talked about this person in a speech without having any idea who it was and simply pulling out that particular gesture in a moment of bad luck. Or, that he was making fun of the person in order to negate the bad press he was getting and avoiding having to actually deal with the issues?

Billy Mays

Not forgetting the bit where he actually said you should see this guy

Leroy42

manual_man wrote: »

I have not said this. So please don't lie about what i've said. I've simply expressed my refusal to assume his intentions when i don't know them. Others are assuming they know what his intentions were.

The video clearly shows him making mocking gestures when talking about this journalist. To come to any other conclusion other than it was deliberate mean you have to assume it wasn't.

To say you don't know, or assume, one way or another is to ignore what is in front of your eyes.

Larbre34

It should worry his opponents that visible over the UK visit and now in the Shannon press huddle, he's getting better at this statesman bit.....

MrFresh

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

This has been debunked numerous times.

Watch the following clip and you will see that he has made the same gestures (and sounds) when mocking people over the years:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5aYFC_7ZIn4

Ah so he wasn't mocking this disabled person personally, he just mocks people he doesn't like as being disabled. Or am I grasping at straw, as the man says?

Hurrache

The press huddle was a bit manic and shouty.

Larbre34

Hurrache wrote: »

The press huddle was a bit manic and shouty.

Absolutely normal.

Hurrache

Larbre34 wrote: »

Absolutely normal.

Dunno, more shouty and mildly aggro compared to other presidential pleasantries when one gets off a plane.

Larbre34

Hurrache wrote: »

Dunno, more shouty and mildly aggro compared to other presidential pleasantries when one gets off a plane.

Perhaps, but the briefing was that the moment would just be a brief exchange of pleasantries, I guess when he started responding in a bit of detail to questions that the correspondents sought to make the most of it in a less than ideal space. Neither man seemed perturbed.

Berserker

Hurrache wrote: »

Dunno, more shouty and mildly aggro compared to other presidential pleasantries when one gets off a plane.

The US reporters were the loudest of all. Turnout at the Shannon protest is very low according to TV3. Doubt there's one hundred people in attendance judging by the latest pictures. Why is the other protest being held in Dublin? Trump isn't going to be in Dublin.

Outlaw Pete

Leroy42 wrote: »

"I didn't know she was nasty" is what he said. The rest you have attributed based on what you think he meant.

It has zero to do with what I think he meant as it is clear what he meant, to anyone that doesn't have an agenda at least.

The man THREE TIMES said that he didn't know "THAT" in reference to her comment (about leaving the US should he be elected) and so when he says "No, no, I don't know that, I didn't know she was nasty" he clearly means that he didn't know she was nasty ABOUT HIM.

Why would what he didn't know suddenly change from not knowing about her comment, to then in the next breath be suddenly that he did not know she was a nasty individual? It makes zero damn sense but yet you have people on here falling over themselves to backslap each other for posting such nonsense.

I wouldn't mind, but he said what he did in a calm and friendly tone and followed it up by complimenting her and saying he thought it was a good thing to have an American princess and that he felt she would do excellently..... right after calling HER nasty?? :P

I suggest listening again, this time paying particular attention to his tone and what he says right before and after it:

https://twitter.com/TrumpWarRoom/status/1134809885957414917

Wouldn't it be nice to have a POTUS that can actually say what he means and make it clear. I thought Trumps appeal was that he 'Tells it like it is'?

It was clear, when you don't take the sentence out of context, but sure it would be great if he was more articulate than he is, but he's not and just because he's not, doesn't give people carte blanche to take advantage of that and suggest the guy meant things which it's abundantly clear he did not.