Donald Trump presidency discussion thread V

ancapailldorcha

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

It's quite clear Trump does not see all the press or media as the enemy of the people, just the mainstream fake news peddlers like CNN, NBC etc. It's dishonest to suggest also (which many do) that he is against the press having the powers that they do and that he is somehow is against even the concept of the press. The following tweet makes that abundantly clear.

To summarise, Trump only sees outlets which portray him in a critical light as being fake news. It's like a Man Utd fan refusing to watch Liverpool TV because it says things he doesn't want to hear. That's the thing with Trump's followers. They're not following him for political reasons, it's for emotional reasons. He's made them feel special or listened to or he's triggered liberals or whatever similarly insipid reason they have for treating him like some sort of Messianic figure.

Have you any proof whatsoever that all of these outlets you mention and allude to are pumping out fake news?

Timberrrrrrrr

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

I said he didn't call the media (as a whole) the enemy of the people, not the press, but AGAIN (given I've addressed this before) he is clearly referencing certain fractions within the press, not all the press, when he makes those comments.

For example:

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1026069857589227520

And of course 'Fake news media' is more often than not what he says but even if he doesn't, it's always what he means and we know this because when he given longer form avenues to speak on this, like an interview for example, he makes that very clear.

Easy to take a tweet out of context given it's limitations and were it a lone tweet (where the person had never spoken on the matter before) it would be understandable, but Trump has made comments in this regard thousands of times at this stage and so there is no excuse for this nonsense as we know who he is referring to with such remarks.

More examples, this time with clarity:


https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1025115155632455680
https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1035122954697433088

So you see: "Much of the media..." / "Large percentage of the media..." etc. Not all.

It's quite clear Trump does not see all the press or media as the enemy of the people, just the mainstream fake news peddlers like CNN, NBC etc. It's dishonest to suggest also (which many do) that he is against the press having the powers that they do and that he is somehow is against even the concept of the press. The following tweet makes that abundantly clear:


https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1082268365081767936

Any chance you could reply to the question in this post? You seem to have missed it........again.

Billy Mays wrote: »

Media that doesn't blow smoke up Trump's hole = enemy of the people


Now that you're here Pete could you answer the questions you previously ignored about Trump's 10,000+ lies he's told since he took office and Ingraham saying Trump never said he held up the D-day commemorations for her despite video evidence to the contrary?


Thanks

MrFresh

Didn't he call the Fox News polls fake news recently?

marno21

MrFresh wrote: »

Didn't he call the Fox News polls fake news recently?

Yes fake polls. And attacked Fox News for painting him negatively, in a Tweet which included something about the Hillary:

https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1140768516288782336

He also said his own internal polls which were leaked "didn't exist", and the internal polls he has show him winning everywhere

These polls were so good that he responded by firing his own pollsters.

Outlaw Pete

Good to see young black voters getting out there and supporting Trump and not believing the fake news propaganda from the likes of CNN which suggest that the POTUS is a racist. This young man is well clued up and knows that the mainstream media (sorry, a large percentage of it - don't want to get taken out of context) are lying to the American public and trying to get them to believe in a false sinister narrative about their president.

https://twitter.com/ChuckCallesto/status/1141165957332787200
The 'first step' act referenced in the clip looks like it could do some real good for a lot of people.
It's things like this which the mainstream media should be focusing on far more than they do.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ReDT1EL3j7w

Kimsang

ancapailldorcha wrote: »

I think that it's incredibly facile and disingenuous to divide the media into pro and anti Trump camps and then only criticize one side while pretending the other is a paragon of virtue or turning a blind eye to it.

The tweet that mcmoustache linked to above is quite clear. Trump is trying to undermine the free press which is a dangerously authoritarian thing to do.

Trump is rarely portrayed in a positive light by the dominant left-wing media, it's usually spun to make him look as bad as possible.

Fox and other right-wing journalists however frequently criticize trump, especially for the things he says, but also give him his dues when necessary.

This for me at least, has exposed a hypocrisy in the media. For me the only TV journalists with any credibility left are at fox(some of the worst also though).

Take a look at the 'bias rating' give by democrats and republicans:
Democrats: Fox(-87) MSNBC(-1) CNN (+29) HuffPo (-9) NYT(+44)
Republicans: Fox(+3) MSNBC(-85) CNN (-87) Huffo(-61) NYT(-74)

So while you may argue he is undermining the free press, one could also argue he's exposing parts of the free press(he didn't ban everyone from the WH news conferences)

Chips Lovell

Mod Note

As we've pointed out before on this thread and previous iterations, let's ease up on the "fake news" thing.

Characterising legit news outlets as fake news is a form of trolling and will be sanctioned if it continues.

Professor Moriarty

Kimsang wrote: »

Trump is rarely portrayed in a positive light by the dominant left-wing media, it's usually spun to make him look as bad as possible.

Fox and other right-wing journalists however frequently criticize trump, especially for the things he says, but also give him his dues when necessary.

This for me at least, has exposed a hypocrisy in the media. For me the only TV journalists with any credibility left are at fox(some of the worst also though).

Take a look at the 'bias rating' give by democrats and republicans:
Democrats: Fox(-87) MSNBC(-1) CNN (+29) HuffPo (-9) NYT(+44)
Republicans: Fox(+3) MSNBC(-85) CNN (-87) Huffo(-61) NYT(-74)

So while you may argue he is undermining the free press, one could also argue he's exposing parts of the free press(he didn't ban everyone from the WH news conferences)

Interestingly, your survey shows that the joint top most biased media outlets, way ahead of the others, are Fox and Breitbart both at -51. CNN were way behind in 5th place at -27. So your survey shows that Trump-supporting right wing media outlets are considered least trustworthy.

pixelburp

Kimsang wrote: »

So while you may argue he is undermining the free press, one could also argue he's exposing parts of the free press(he didn't ban everyone from the WH news conferences)

President Trump isn't trying to expose anything, when he explicitly claims polls or reports that have a negative light don't exist, or are fake. Trump just doesn't like bad promotion (he famously threw a huff for his Fresh Prince cameo because the writers called him a "millionaire" instead of a "billionaire") As already said by others, his campaign fired a polling company for leaking stats which showed him already trailing Democratic candidates. Or see another tweet where he waggles his eyebrows when Fox deigns to report negatively (similar in tone to the famous "3 million illegal" votes that conveniently accounted for him losing the popular vote). The narcissist can't condone the world not loving him.

And even if he was fighting the good fight, that doesn't forgive or excuse the leader of a democratic nation throwing obvious, dangerous grenades like "Enemy of the People" into the conversation. That's irresponsible and utterly reckless, especially in a country already steeped in violence against social or political opponents. If Erodgan came out with that remark, this wouldn't surprise, yet with Trump it's a messianic action?

This attempt to reframe the narrative as Trump the true guardian of the Free Press is disingenuous, and patently false when the language he uses is so obviously coded.

We all know American new media is heavy editorialised and bias, that doesn't forgive or justify effectively throwing redmeat to every anarchist, libertarian or red-stater itching to attack the 4th estate.

Kimsang

pixelburp wrote: »

President Trump isn't trying to expose anything, when he explicitly claims polls or reports that have a negative light don't exist, or are fake. Trump just doesn't like bad promotion (he famously threw a huff for his Fresh Prince cameo because the writers called him a "millionaire" instead of a "billionaire") As already said by others, his campaign fired a polling company for leaking stats which showed him already trailing Democratic candidates. Or see another tweet where he waggles his eyebrows when Fox deigns to report negatively (similar in tone to the famous "3 million illegal" votes that conveniently accounted for him losing the popular vote). The narcissist can't condone the world not loving him.

And even if he was fighting the good fight, that doesn't forgive or excuse the leader of a democratic nation throwing obvious, dangerous grenades like "Enemy of the People" into the conversation. That's irresponsible and utterly reckless, especially in a country already steeped in violence against social or political opponents. If Erodgan came out with that remark, this wouldn't surprise, yet with Trump it's a messianic action?

This attempt to reframe the narrative as Trump the true guardian of the Free Press is disingenuous, and patently false when the language he uses is so obviously coded.

I agree Trump has repeatedly shown to be an egomaniac, and also agree he isn't trying to expose anything, and most things he does are in his self interest. But it is in his self interest to do a good job.

He is inadvertently exposing a doctrine attached with the far-left today, a self-righteous, spiteful, vindictiveness as often seen in the media.

Look at how the media are treating the leaked OPCW report from the gas attack in Douma. To give some context, this incident was used as a pretext for France/UK/US to bomb Syria, and for the US to enter Syria, despite Trump not wanting to do so.

duploelabs

Seems like Trump has lost some serious financial backers for 2020

http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/06/the-mercer-family-has-reportedly-bailed-on-trump-in-2020.html

esteve

Trumps constant bashing of the mainstream media is calculated and intentional. He is right though, nowadays there is a huge issue with fake news but it is not from the mainstream media outlets, whether on the left or the right of the political spectrum. The majority of mainstream and traditional news agencies have always had a narrative and agenda based on their political alignment, but when reporting they usually cover the same stories from their own bias.

The real fake news comes from YouTube contributors (both on the far right and far left), new 'news agencies' such as Breitbart on the right and similar publications like 'New Yorker Slate' on the left. Some of these 'news sources', particularly Youtube Contributors, have people who are not journalists selling opinion pieces as fact. Some of the rhetoric used is extremely divisive and dangerous. Worst part is that young people are lapping it up, in their millions! The younger generation do not turn to the traditional mainstream media sources but get their information online, subscribing to Youtube channels where nothing is fact checked. They are literally lied to by some of the most biased, twarted opinion pieces and don't even critically analyse it.

This is the real Fake News and it is a very real threat to us all.

pixelburp

Kimsang wrote: »

I agree Trump has repeatedly shown to be an egomaniac, and also agree he isn't trying to expose anything, and most things he does are in his self interest. But it is in his self interest to do a good job.

He is inadvertently exposing a doctrine attached with the far-left today, a self-righteous, spiteful, vindictiveness as often seen in the media.

Look at how the media are treating the leaked OPCW report from the gas attack in Douma. To give some context, this incident was used as a pretext for France/UK/US to bomb Syria, and for the US to enter Syria, despite Trump not wanting to do so.

CNN, MSNBC et al are many things, but not "far left" and it's frankly hyperbolic if not conspiratorial to take political bias and lean it into some overarching intent; and you're also dancing around the part where Trump frequently uses dangerous, autocratic language against outlets that report polls or news putting him in a negative light. As said, if Erodgen or his ilk talked of "Enemies of the People", there'd rightly be international outrage; instead you're equivocating around the mentality of "well they deserve it".

As for Trumps self-interest, I've never been convinced he even wanted to win the election in the first place.

Professor Moriarty

Kimsang wrote: »

I agree Trump has repeatedly shown to be an egomaniac, and also agree he isn't trying to expose anything, and most things he does are in his self interest. But it is in his self interest to do a good job.

He is inadvertently exposing a doctrine attached with the far-left today, a self-righteous, spiteful, vindictiveness as often seen in the media.

Look at how the media are treating the leaked OPCW report from the gas attack in Douma. To give some context, this incident was used as a pretext for France/UK/US to bomb Syria, and for the US to enter Syria, despite Trump not wanting to do so.

Could you point to the "far-left" in the US?

mcmoustache

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

I said he didn't call the media (as a whole) the enemy of the people, not the press, but AGAIN (given I've addressed this before) he is clearly referencing certain fractions within the press, not all the press, when he makes those comments.

You're putting words in Trump's mouth again.

It's up there with your impressive gymnastics when Trump said "I didn't know that she was nasty" and you tried your "What he meant was..." shtick.

Trump's a grown man. If he wanted to say the things that you're incorrectly attributing to him, he could have done so.

Igotadose

esteve wrote: »

Trumps constant bashing of the mainstream media is calculated and intentional. He is right though, nowadays there is a huge issue with fake news but it is not from the mainstream media outlets, whether on the left or the right of the political spectrum. The majority of mainstream and traditional news agencies have always had a narrative and agenda based on their political alignment, but when reporting they usually cover the same stories from their own bias.

The real fake news comes from YouTube contributors (both on the far right and far left), new 'news agencies' such as Breitbart on the right and similar publications like 'New Yorker Slate' on the left. Some of these 'news sources', particularly Youtube Contributors, have people who are not journalists selling opinion pieces as fact. Some of the rhetoric used is extremely divisive and dangerous. Worst part is that young people are lapping it up, in their millions! The younger generation do not turn to the traditional mainstream media sources but get their information online, subscribing to Youtube channels where nothing is fact checked. They are literally lied to by some of the most biased, twarted opinion pieces and don't even critically analyse it.

This is the real Fake News and it is a very real threat to us all.

Uhh. exactly what Fake news comes from Slate? Or the New Yorker? The only fake news comes from 1) Trump's mouth 2) Trump's mouth organs like Alex "Dumb enough to forward child porn to the FBI" Jones, Fox **** like Ingraham and Hannity, Ben Shapiro, Yiannopolous, and organizations founded by convicted criminals like Breitbart. Let's not equate these slimedwellers with legitimate news organizations.

Also, there's really no plague of 'fake news.' There's extremist conspiracy theorists peddling lies, morons like Trump and his deplorable base lapping them up (either they believe them, or they simply get their jollies trying to be clever and annoying). If it weren't for Trump and his Russian friends in 2016, this lot'd be on the fringes still.

TomOnBoard

Kimsang wrote: »

He is inadvertently exposing a doctrine attached with the far-left today, a self-righteous, spiteful, vindictiveness as often seen in the media.

I'm not having a pop at you. However, I simply don't understand what you're saying. What is the doctrine in your opinon? And who comprises the 'far-left'?

As to the "self-righteous, spiteful, vindictiveness", do you have something in mind that would illustrate the point?

Kimsang wrote: »

Look at how the media are treating the leaked OPCW report from the gas attack in Douma. To give some context, this incident was used as a pretext for France/UK/US to bomb Syria, and for the US to enter Syria, despite Trump not wanting to do so.

Thanks, I'm going to take a look at that.

jochenstacker

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

I said he didn't call the media (as a whole) the enemy of the people...

Aaand I don't need to dead the rest of this drivel.
The way Trump talks about the press is inexcusable. End of. I don't care for any rationalisation of his hate speech.
If you disagree, you're wrong or pissing down my back and tell me it's raining.
Only an idiot or troll would defend him.

Kimsang

pixelburp wrote: »

CNN, MSNBC et al are many things, but not "far left" and it's frankly hyperbolic if not conspiratorial to take political bias and lean it into some overarching intent; and you're also dancing around the part where Trump frequently uses dangerous, autocratic language against outlets that report polls or news putting him in a negative light. As said, if Erodgen or his ilk talked of "Enemies of the People", there'd rightly be international outrage; instead you're equivocating around the mentality of "well they deserve it".

As for Trumps self-interest, I've never been convinced he even wanted to win the election in the first place.

To be specific the doctrine I referred to as attached to the CNN, MSNBC et al is that of identity politics. Though please note I'm not calling them far-left, but the ideology that many of the journalists subscribe to I would deem to be.

When identity politics are played on the far right, everyone rightfully calls them out. Nobody likes white supremacists or ultra nationalists. But nobody likes chauvinists either, this is the hypocrisy.

Largely I believe it to be a case of 'the enemy of my enemy is my friend' so even though many might not agree with his methods, the fact of who and what he is fighting, lends him many allies.

Professor Moriarty

Kimsang wrote: »

To be specific the doctrine I referred to as attached to the CNN, MSNBC et al is that of identity politics. Though please note I'm not calling them far-left, but the ideology that many of the journalists subscribe to I would deem to be.

When identity politics are played on the far right, everyone rightfully calls them out. Nobody likes white supremacists or ultra nationalists. But nobody likes chauvinists either, this is the hypocrisy.

Largely I believe it to be a case of 'the enemy of my enemy is my friend' so even though many might not agree with his methods, the fact of who and what he is fighting, lends him many allies.

Which journalists have "far-left" ideology?

relax carry on

The way things are at the moment, there's a danger this thread could still be going in 6 years time pointing out yet another insane thing Trump has done or said that day. Would it be nice to have a president Warren or Buttigieg thread in 2 years time criticising or praising them for some political decision which might have some grounding in reality?

Despite the polls showing Trump losing ground, it's time the Democrats and those functional Republicans stop playing Trump's game. Trump is not a politician, Republican or Democrat. He's a third rate conman who's also a crappy reality TV star. Until they stop trying to play politics and deal with him as he is, then I don't think they'll ever make his base see him for what he is. And even then, there are those who'll never believe Trump is anything other than the Messiah who'll lead them to their own version of the promised land.

Kimsang

TomOnBoard wrote: »

As to the "self-righteous, spiteful, vindictiveness", do you have something in mind that would illustrate the point?
Thanks, I'm going to take a look at that.

Its difficult to paint a picture of a snowstorm one flake at a time, but look at the State of the Union address by Trump, and how the media treated it afterwards.
The identitarians are clearly dressed in white, and they only clapped at things that suited them.
<edit URL fixed>

Professor Moriarty

Kimsang wrote: »

Its difficult to paint a picture of a snowstorm one flake at a time, but look at the State of the Union address by Trump, and how the media treated it afterwards.
The identitarians are clearly dressed in white, and they only clapped at things that suited them.

You do know that is two hours long?

TomOnBoard

Kimsang wrote: »

Its difficult to paint a picture of a snowstorm one flake at a time, but look at the State of the Union address by Trump, and how the media treated it afterwards.
The identitarians are clearly dressed in white, and they only clapped at things that suited them.

Are you talking about the Democrat Congresswomen? AFAIK, they were the only ones who were grouped as a homogenous 'white-wearing' cohort.

If that's who you're talking about, you're arguing that women who were celebrating the struggles around suffragettes by wearing white were actually white supremacists refusing to applaud Trump's SOTU address. Help me understand that leap...

Kimsang

TomOnBoard wrote: »

Are you talking about the Democrat Congresswomen? AFAIK, they were the only ones who were grouped as a homogenous 'white-wearing' cohort.

If that's who you're talking about, you're arguing that women who were celebrating the struggles around suffragettes by wearing white were actually white supremacists refusing to applaud Trump's SOTU address. Help me understand that leap...

I don't quite know how you can come to that conclusion.
I'm only highlighting the self-righteousness and spitefulness I alluded to earlier. You must note that they all sat there arms folded, about all the good things that he was saying for everybody. Only when what he was saying mattered to those dressed in white did they clap. Please watch to the point where the ones in white started applauding for the first time and they even gave Trump a somewhat reluctant standing ovation.

<edit> my use of identitarians was wrong. I mean people that play identity politics</edit>

vladmydad

Ok Im out. This thread used to be somewhat balanced but it’s just become an echo chamber therapy session for TDS sufferers.

He calls the press the enemy of the people because they are. They are hyper partisan and 96% democrat voters. They spent 8 years ignoring the drone war , down played the Benghazi murders, the destruction of Libya and an anemic economy. But now all of a sudden they are truth tellers lol. Democrat activists pretending to be journalists.

Kids are separated from parents because many are not related to the adults and are used to gain entry, also many of the kids have been molested. Also that picture is from 2014.

It’s important that the us embassy was moved because every president for the past 30 years promised to do so. It was also strategic as it takes the issue off the table in future negotiations and now gives the US leverage over the Israelis for them to make difficult concessions in the future.

As for the Muller report it was predicted on the fake Steele dossier as paid for by the Clinton campaign. FISA warrants were obtain by omitting this information from the FISA Judge. The Trump campaign was surveilled and FBI agents were sent in to infiltrate the campaign, this is a first in US electoral history. If the Bush administration had done this to the incoming Obama campaign it would have been a national scandal. The Muller report found that no us citizen engaged in collusion with the Russians. As for obstruction of justice, the president was entitled to express his innocence in tweets and statements throughout the investigation just as much as any citizen can protest their innocence during an investigation.

The trade war with China was two decades in the making and must be fought. Even the democrats privately support this and Hillary suggested this was a fight she was going to have to take on.

As for N Korea it’s once again a bipartisan policy failure that was handed to him. He’s in a terrible bind. He must try the carrot now but I fear the stick will be needed.

He was correct to pull out of the Paris climate agreement. One of the most anti American treaties I’ve ever read. It gave a decades long pass to China India and others whilst putting life changing and economical unpalatable burdens on Americans. It’s perfectly reasonable to seek a fairer distribution of the burden.

The Iran deal was a disaster. It only put a temporary reduction on uranium enrichment for 10 years then its back to full enrichment all the while flooding that regime with billions. It would only lead to a North Korean situation of allowing them nuclear weapons than trying to close the door after the horse has bolted. Now he’s strangling them and forcing them to act out, which they have just done. The Americans are hoping this will lead to the Europeans to withdraw from the agreement, which is beginning. And ultimately a coup.

The man has deep personal flaws, but remarkable political savvy. He ain’t no mad man. Most of his Twitter storms are calculated, he is the master of throwing the media and you folks on here, off on a side tangent. He sets the narrative. A perfect example is the Iranian situation in the gulf. He doesn’t want that to be front and center right now because no doubt there’s things happening on the ground as we speak, so he goes and gives a fiery campaign speech in Florida knowing that will consume the media and Trump haters. There’s 64 other specific incidents of him doing this over the past 2 years. Truly a political genius. I can almost always see when he’s about to do it. And then bingo he flashes a shiny thing over there to divert you all away from what he’s doing over here. If there was some way of betting on it I’d be a rich man by now. He’s going to destroy joe.

On a side note, joe is slurring his speech and regularly becoming confused in his speech’s. I take no pleasure in watching that, clearly he’s had some minor strokes, but the irony of a party that constantly attacks elderly wealthy white men having their 2 front runners being 2 elderly wealthy white men. Lol

Kimsang

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

You do know that is two hours long?

A more condensed version. Up until this point, these women sat arms crossed not applauding anything about verterans, war heros, how the economy was doing, how education was doing. Only when it was about women their ears spiked.

You weren't supposed to do that!

Trump knew exactly what he was doing here.

TomOnBoard

[QUOTE=Kimsang;110477797]I don't quite know how you can come to that conclusion.
I'm only highlighting the self-righteousness and spitefulness I alluded to earlier. You must note that they all sat there arms folded, about all the good things that he was saying for everybody. Only when what he was saying mattered to those dressed in white did they clap. Please watch to the point where the ones in white started applauding for the first time and they even gave Trump a somewhat reluctant standing ovation.

<edit> my use of identitarians was wrong. I mean people that play identity politics</edit>[/QUOTE]

So, you can now see how I came to that conclusion, yeah? Its basically what you said.

Now moving on to "You must note that they all sat there arms folded, about all the good things that he was saying for everybody" how would you expect the Democrats in 2019 to act any differently than Republicans acted repeatedly to Obama's Joint sessions of Congress? Should the women in white have suddenly reversed years of Congressional play-acting during the SOTU by forgetting how the last Democrat President was treated by a Republican Congress? No chance!

Michelle Obama hoped that "When they go low, We go high!" And I believe that she meant it. But that strategy simply cannot be followed when you're dealing with a grifter who has no word and only spouts insults and division.

BTW, your YouTube link resolves back to the 2018 SOTU. That was the year the women wore all black as a statement in support of the #MeToo movement. The white- suited women were a feature of both the 2017 and 2019 SOTU, those coordinated fashion statements having been organised as a tribute to the early Suffragette movement and the reminder to women across America that the Vote was hard- won and must be constantly fought for.

TomOnBoard

vladmydad wrote: »

Ok Im out.

Well, before you go, consider this:

"Soapboxing is a cheap substitute for principled arguments. Insofar as it involves glibly characterizing other people’s motives, it has a corrosive effect on mutual goodwill. Plus, moral cudgels are a suboptimal way to win a political debate if you have better arguments at your disposal. This is a free country. For better or worse, the people decide. Anyone who feels strongly about an issue or a candidate should be busy persuading their fellow citizens to consider their perspective, not issuing proclamations about their own enlightenment or otherwise preaching to the choir. And when it comes to elections, especially, stridency should strike voters as suspicious. If a candidate deserves their support, there would be no reason for the cudgels to come out in the first place."

That comes from a September 2016 article in https://www.texasmonthly.com/burka-blog/a-time-for-soapboxing/

Interesting perspectives dont ya think?

Kimsang

TomOnBoard wrote: »

So, you can now see how I came to that conclusion, yeah? Its basically what you said.

Now moving on to "You must note that they all sat there arms folded, about all the good things that he was saying for everybody" how would you expect the Democrats in 2019 to act any differently than Republicans acted repeatedly to Obama's Joint sessions of Congress? Should the women in white have suddenly reversed years of Congressional play-acting during the SOTU by forgetting how the last Democrat President was treated by a Republican Congress? No chance!

Michelle Obama hoped that "When they go low, We go high!" And I believe that she meant it. But that strategy simply cannot be followed when you're dealing with a grifter who has no word and only spouts insults and division.

BTW, your YouTube link resolves back to the 2018 SOTU. That was the year the women wore all black as a statement in support of the #MeToo movement. The white- suited women were a feature of both the 2017 and 2019 SOTU, those coordinated fashion statements having been organised as a tribute to the early Suffragette movement and the reminder to women across America that the Vote was hard- won and must be constantly fought for.

Yes I accept that, weirdly I didn't know Itenditarians were a far right type group that espoused hateful identity politics. I wonder what the word is for people that play identity politics! Or does this mean we accept identity politics as a bad thing only when one group of people play it. Personally, I'm against it in all its forms.

Apologies for incorrectly linking to the 2018 SOTU.

Michelle Obama's sentiment historically is what the left is about and it is a sentiment I could get on board with. But hypocrisy is revealed when they stoop to his level, and in some cases, far beyond.

The part in bold some might call vindictive. Which is why I was highlighting their action in the first place.