Donald Trump presidency discussion thread V

Kimsang

FrostyJack wrote: »

"The left" didn't go anywhere, you just moved right because you don't like SJW. You must listen to the JRE too much.

There you go, the left pushing out of the left again. If you don't conform to SJWs that makes you on the right you say? Since when? Oh yeah, the left hasn't moved.... sure. How old are you... 20? My last post details my position if you care to critique it.

The fact that you said Hilary played the woman card exposes where you are now. You are conflating one spectrum of an ideology (extreme SJW) to the whole "Left" movement.

I am doing nothing of the sort. I am merely pointing out(if you care to look back over the nature of this thread of conversation and how it started) that the left doesn't criticize it's own extreme ideology. This is shown in how dominant liberals are in journalism and academia and the bias that they show.

As stated 1 million times already, I don't know anyone (on here or) in the real World who supports voting for people because they are women, a certain race or sexual identity etc or shutting down people like Ben Shapiro at college campus's.

I don't disagree with you. They are in the extreme minority. What I'm pointing out is that you and all the people you know in the real world and on here don't denounce them. The media(left-wing) don't denounce them, academia doesn't denounce them. Anyone who stands up to these guys is labelled as a racist, misogynist, homophobe, etc.. That's why the left stay silent. This small minority is given a huge platform and apparentl immunity on the likes of twitter. That's why Trump got elected. . Where are all the sane leftists calling out to stop gender quotas and the likes? No where to be seen.
The left are much slower to disassociate and denounce and they never apologize. Do you accept that or not? This is where the discussion should lie.

I'm a centrist: I hold some conservative views and some liberal views.
But I'm more afraid of talking to my liberal friends about my conservative views than I am talking to my conservative friends about my liberal views-Melissa Chen

So who exactly are you rallying against? Yes the Left eats its own and has circular firing squads like this week with Biden and Booker, which is not ideal for getting elected, but the flip side is to always following the same script even when it is the most dishonest and amoral line to take, like the GOP/Trump sycophants do every news cycle.

Thank you, that was the point I was making earlier, and someone was disagreeing. By the left eating its own, it becomes smaller as a group. This moves the left further to the left- its pretty simple. Look at how TERFs are being treated. It's disgusting discourse, or do you disagree?
When I debate Christians, Jews, Creationists, climate deniers etc. they are unfailingly polite, respectful, thoughtful, discerning, & listen to my arguments. Far Left SJWs do not. They simply look for fault & pounce - Michael Shermer.
Trump is not the evil boogeyman people paint him to be. He is an egomaniac, but he is a genious when it comes to social media and 'public relations'. He acts in his best interests, but luckily they align with the country as he is an egomaniac which wants to be seen to be doing a good job. Why do you think he never wanted the job in the first place. He only wanted to win. Now he wants to be seen to do a good job. I'm not sure people realize how left Trump was before he ran as a Republican.

The Democrats are still pro :environment, science, education, infrastructure, fiscal responsibility, equality. The GOP are for the opposite, so unless there is a 3rd party in the US you must support the GOP now with the endless lies and corruption all because some fools wear blue hair and throw milkshakes.

I disagree the democrats are 'pro science' considering the amount of gender quotas in STEM fields and universities.
I disagree the democrats are 'pro education', the only people I see shutting down campus' like last months J4MB event at Cambridge are on the left. They do not get denounced in the media or social media.
I disagree the democrats are 'pro fiscal responsibility' have you seen AOC's green new bill? I laughed out loud at this.
I disagree the democrats are "pro enviroment", "pro infrastructure" or "pro science"if they oppose the building of our cheapest cleanest energy, nuclear.
I disagree the democrats are 'pro equality' in the way they treat white men.


You may say "oh look these are all fringe extreme leftists" but show me the left leaning publication that calls them out for it. This is inherently my point. The left is moving, if you choose to ignore it- that's your choice.

hill16bhoy

So...

supporting concentration camps

claiming that a man who has been credibly accused by 16 women of sexual assault including two rape allegations - one by his wife under oath - is not a vicious sexual predator

supporting a man who claims man made climate change is a Chinese hoax

supporting a man who invites Russia to meddle in US elections, authorises an act of war against Iran, and thinks white supremacist terrorism is not terrorism at all...

is now classed as "centrism"

Wow, you learn something new every day, don't you.

Kimsang

hill16bhoy wrote: »

So...

supporting concentration camps

claiming that a man who has been credibly accused by 16 women of sexual assault including two rape allegations - one by his wife under oath - is not a vicious sexual predator

supporting a man who claims man made climate change is a Chinese hoax

supporting a man who invites Russia to meddle in US elections, authorises an act of war against Iran, and thinks white supremacist terrorism is not terrorism at all...

is now classed as "centrism"

Wow, you learn something new every day, don't you.

Honestly its posts like this that make me look at lefties and think, you're too far gone. Its impossible to save you now. I'm sure it will receive the adequate thanks, from the usual suspects.

salmocab

Kimsang wrote: »

Honestly its posts like this that make me look at lefties and think, you're too far gone. Its impossible to save you now. I'm sure it will receive the adequate thanks, from the usual suspects.

It’s posts like this that make left leaning centrists think that the right leaning centrists don’t know what lefties mean and somehow try to use it in some strange demeaning way.

hill16bhoy

Kimsang wrote: »

Honestly its posts like this that make me look at lefties and think, you're too far gone. Its impossible to save you now. I'm sure it will receive the adequate thanks, from the usual suspects.

I think you'd do well to have a look at yourself before throwing around such childish words

You appear to have a bit of a complex where you simply cannot comprehend anything or anybody who doesn't live in your Trump-adoring echo chamber

That's been pretty obvious since you started posting here

Kimsang

All Americans, not only in the state's most heavily affected, but in every place in this country, are rightly disturbed by the large numbers of illegal aliens entering our country. The jobs they hold might otherwise be held by citizens or legal immigrants- the public service they use impose burdens on our tax payers. That's why our administration has moved aggressively to secure our borders more, by hiring a record number of new border guards, by deporting twice as much illegal aliens as ever before, by cracking down on illegal hiring, by borrowing welfare benefits to illegal aliens, in the budget I will present to you we will try to do more to speed the deportation of illegal aliens who are arrested for crimes, to better identify illegal aliens in the workplace as recommended by the commission headed by former congresswoman Barbara Jordan. We are a nation of immigrants, but we are also a nation of law.

State of the union address

Would left people clap at this today? No- they react with emotional vitriol.

Kimsang

Dog Man Star wrote: »

You're absolutely right. The details on her rape is astonishing, we all know he did it. She is inviting nothing but trouble on herself, but eventually the dam breaks. Christine Blasey-Ford may feel that she achieved nothing, but she is wrong. She is a hero. None of this would have happened without her.

Can you imagine doing what Trump did? What level of depravity it takes to do that? To rip a woman's tights down and ram your cock in? Who does that? Imagine the level of violence and agrression to do that.

You're kidding right, do you know how much money Christine Ford made?
You calling Ford a hero is en par with anyone who calls Trump a hero.

Kimsang

hill16bhoy wrote: »

I think you'd do well to have a look at yourself before throwing around such childish words
You appear to have a bit of a complex where you simply cannot comprehend anything or anybody who doesn't live in your Trump-adoring echo chamber

That's been pretty obvious since you started posting here

You toe the party line quite well. Undermine the enemy and completely ignore the arguments. Well played.

Kimsang

Professor Moriarty wrote: »

No. The Donald's integrity is defended come what may. All of those women are liars. Mueller is a liar. The FBI are liars. The Justice Department are liars. Reporters are liars etcetera ad nauseam. Everyone who criticises The Donald is a liar. The Donald is never wrong because 'lefties' cannot be seen to be right.

Well executed straw-man. Well done. Beat that strawman!

Christy42

Kimsang wrote: »

You're kidding right, do you know how much money Christine Ford made?
You calling Ford a hero is en par with anyone who calls Trump a hero.

Wasn't she forced to move? More of the both sides argument.

Stop comparing people to Trump. They are no where near as bad he is. 10,000 lies. Calling people walking by a Nazi flag fine people. No one else in the west is matching that except some who support him.

Manic Moran

aloyisious wrote: »

Just in passing, would there be an ETA for the US carrier battle group to arrive in the Persian Gulf area, seeing as the P-8 is working the area? I'm assuming that land-based port watchers will be out and about.

I wouldn't deign to guess. I would have thought that given the Iranians have subs, the P-8s would be working the area as a matter of course.

everlast75

https://twitter.com/kylegriffin1/status/1142508807660199936?s=19

This is mental.

Most know that KA Conway's husband takes pot shots st her employer online via twitter frequently. Now, he is calling on Republicans to believe that his wife's employer raped this woman!!

Kimsang

Christy42 wrote: »

Wasn't she forced to move? More of the both sides argument.

Stop comparing people to Trump. They are no where near as bad he is. 10,000 lies. Calling people walking by a Nazi flag fine people. No one else in the west is matching that except some who support him.

I'm comparing the extremes as equally bad. Anyone that engages with, supports or does not critique identity politics are just as bad as any extreme on the right. In fact they are worse, the right calls out its extremes, while the extremes of the left are allowed to run rampant.
This really must be watched to really feel what I mean.
Clip from Evergreen College of when the far left ran riot.
(The time starts at the relevent time, although the entire 3 part series is extremely en-lightening, as to what I'm getting at- Documentary made by a left-wing journalist(Mike Nayna) who rose to fame by covering racism in Australia)
Evergreen is one of the most liberal colleges in US
This story is extremely well documented for anyone wishing to research.

The Politically Correct Left is a cancer, too. It diagnoses societal symptoms far too simplistically and, largely just by calling them bigots, smears anyone who questions their moral pronouncements. Their assessment possesses no more nuance than accusing those on the Right of holding policy positions because they’re bigots: racist, sexist, homophobic, transphobic, Islamophobic, xenophobic, and anything else -phobic or -ist that their imaginations allow. This impolitic attitude and the concomitant name-calling prevent honest discourse about pressing issues, such as immigration policy, health care, and the global concerns orbiting around Islamist terrorism. The Politically Correct Left cannot even hear the need for such conversations, though, over the sound of its bellowing accusations of bigotry. Trump bulldozes their objections and couldn’t care less. Certainly, his policy proposals on these issues are both practically and morally repellent, but democracy demands the national-level conversation he’s forcing.

- Peter Boghossian and James Lindsey

jochenstacker

Your argument is "lefties bad!". If this is the entirety of your argument, we get. Well done. Thanks for stopping by. Good lad.

Kimsang

jochenstacker wrote: »

Your argument is "lefties bad!". If this is the entirety of your argument, we get. Well done. Thanks for stopping by. Good lad.

While quippy, your strawman forgets the part of my argument where extremism is allowed to breed within the left. Trump got elected and BRexit happened because of the left.

I can cite you numerous right-wing media that insults, mocks, derides and embarrasses Trump.
Could you cite me left-wing media that shines him in a good light for anything he's done? Oh, but I guess he's the devil and has never done anything right. I can understand how this kind of thinking can lead to believing a majority of a population are deplorable.

Trump’s rise follows directly from backlash to two words: political correctness. These two words are two of Trump’s favorites, and not arbitrarily. It is almost impossible to find a Trump supporter who doesn’t back him explicitly because of his unflinching, dismissive, even hostile stance against political correctness. “Don’t be afraid to speak your mind. Vote Trump!”

8-10

Kimsang wrote: »

While quippy, your strawman forgets the part of my argument where extremism is allowed to breed within the left. Trump got elected and BRexit happened because of the left.

Because of Russia, and horrifically poor campaigning for the opposite result in both cases

everlast75

Kimsang wrote: »

Could you cite me left-wing media that shines him in a good light for anything he's done?

Yes! CNN and MSNBC ran stories after Trump's SOTU address with compliments of how well he did in sounding "presidential" and even wondered if it was a turning point.

So, now thst I've done that...

Could you cite me good things that *he has done*, backed up with credible sources?

Could you then weigh them up against the complete and utter sh1tshow that this administration continues to be on a daily basis?

45 is the worst president ever, and by some margin, and effectively you're saying that when the media doesn't give him a cookie when he manages not to soil himself is proof of bias.

Kimsang

everlast75 wrote: »

Yes! CNN and MSNBC ran stories after Trump's SOTU address with compliments of how well he did in sounding "presidential" and even wondered if it was a turning point.

So, now thst I've done that...

Could you cite me good things that *he has done*, backed up with credible sources?

Could you then weigh them up against the complete and utter sh1tshow that this administration continues to be on a daily basis?

45 is the worst president ever, and by some margin, and effectively you're saying that when the media doesn't give him a cookie when he manages not to soil himself is proof of bias.

Again my argument is just strawmanned. I'm saying the liberal media and academia are so biased, that people were so sick of it, they even voted for Trump. It was like pulling the pin of a grenade.

I agree there's plenty of terrible things he's done and said and I think he has been well criticized for this. I once complained about trump criticism which was when he spoke about Charlottesville, I debated several people, and finally some agreed 'there were good people on both sides'.

Calling trump presidential is not in the spirit of 'good light' in my opinion. Putin is presidential.


Good things he's done: Given the finger to political correctness. On a near hourly basis.

Leroy42

You thik it is good that people don't care if what they say causes offence?

What is your definition of political correctness?

Kimsang

Leroy42 wrote: »

You thik it is good that people don't care if what they say causes offence?

What is your definition of political correctness?

Political correctness is moving us from a guilt to a shame culture. It is also making other worrying changes in our culture in regards to group identity and shame&guilt. It has been amplified by social media. It is now prevalent in academia, certainly the humanities.
Of course it has some merit, but the way in which it is enforced is the true problem. Every one of these stories is well documented, and extremely interesting for examples of how political correctness goes to far. What is more interesting left-wing media covered these stories.

Father Ted Creator, Graham Linehan) --"TERF"
The story of Brett Weinstein at Evergreen college --"Racist"
James Damore at google --"Misogynist"
Peter Boghossian at Portland State --"Troll"
Hoax papers: The shoddy, absurd and unethical side of academia
Laura Kennedy: A ‘grievance studies’ hoax has identified a disturbing cultural shift- Irish Times --"Trolls"
Christina-Hoff sommers of the American Enterprise Institute "--Internalized Misogyny"
Erin Pizzey; founder of the first women's domestic abuse shelter in the modern world --"TERF", Misogynist & terrorist sympathiser(Andrew Marr).
Majiid Nawaz --"Anti-Muslim Extremist"

jochenstacker

Kimsang wrote: »

While quippy, your strawman forgets the part of my argument where extremism is allowed to breed within the left. Trump got elected and BRexit happened because of the left.

I can cite you numerous right-wing media that insults, mocks, derides and embarrasses Trump.
Could you cite me left-wing media that shines him in a good light for anything he's done? Oh, but I guess he's the devil and has never done anything right. I can understand how this kind of thinking can lead to believing a majority of a population are deplorable.

And extremism is worse on the right.
I'd rather have militant vegan feminists that demand 27 gender pronouns for asparagus than Neonazi skinheads or NRA gun nuts any day, thanks.
Why would anyone say anything positive about Trump?
He lies, bullies, insults and anyone with an IQ over 50 can see him for what he is. Only an idiot or troll woul support him.
I said it before, HE is the one that has brought the sh*storm on himself. I have never argued with any Trump supporter that was able to argue their case beyond "But! But! Libtards! Hillary! Vegans! Feminists! Ecologists!"
If someone is threatened by environmentalism, equal rights for women or minorities or socialist ideals (you know, sharing and stuff), they are just an asshole.
And if they blame the other side for being an asshole, that's not even worth debating or listening to.
So if you don't like it, it's YOUR problem.
People are scared of new stuff and this is the inevitable backlash.
It'll die down and the world will continue.

Kimsang

jochenstacker wrote: »

And extremism is worse on the right.
I'd rather have militant vegan feminists that demand 27 gender pronouns for asparagus than Neonazi skinheads or NRA gun nuts any day, thanks.
.

What you don't realize is that when these people win power, they are the first lined up against a wall and shot. Then the real revolution begins.

Yuri Bezmenov - KGB Defector on "Useful Idiots" and the True Face of Communism

1984 (!)

After being assigned to a station in India, Bezmenov eventually grew to love the people and the culture of India, but at the same time, he began to resent the KGB-sanctioned oppression of intellectuals who dissented from Moscow's policies. He decided to defect to the West. Bezmenov is best remembered for his anticommunist lectures and books from the 1980s

StringerBell

Out of curiosity kimsang, what site is it you would most often copy paste from?

RIGOLO

jochenstacker wrote: »

And extremism is worse on the right.
I'd rather have militant vegan feminists that demand 27 gender pronouns for asparagus than Neonazi skinheads or NRA gun nuts any day, thanks.
Why would anyone say anything positive about Trump?
He lies, bullies, insults and anyone with an IQ over 50 can see him for what he is. Only an idiot or troll woul support him.
I said it before, HE is the one that has brought the sh*storm on himself. I have never argued with any Trump supporter that was able to argue their case beyond "But! But! Libtards! Hillary! Vegans! Feminists! Ecologists!"
If someone is threatened by environmentalism, equal rights for women or minorities or socialist ideals (you know, sharing and stuff), they are just an asshole.
And if they blame the other side for being an asshole, that's not even worth debating or listening to.
So if you don't like it, it's YOUR problem.
People are scared of new stuff and this is the inevitable backlash.
It'll die down and the world will continue.

Black unemployment rate is at its lowest .

Theres an obvious reason to say something positive about Trump.

So then the question becomes
WHY WOULD ANYONE NOT HAVE SOMETHING POSITIVE TO SAY ABOUT TRUMP ?

Leroy42

Kim sang, what is your definition of political correctness as I fear we may be talking about two different things?

You mentioned that it had some merit, but is either too much or massaged wrong. Could you clarify what you mean?

And you mentioned shame and guilt. There is nothing inherently wrong with either of these, in fact society relies on them. It is when they are abused, for example religion using guilt to control, that they become a problem.

Do you think it wrong that people should feel shame for hurting others?

Christy42

Kimsang wrote: »

While quippy, your strawman forgets the part of my argument where extremism is allowed to breed within the left. Trump got elected and BRexit happened because of the left.

I can cite you numerous right-wing media that insults, mocks, derides and embarrasses Trump.
Could you cite me left-wing media that shines him in a good light for anything he's done? Oh, but I guess he's the devil and has never done anything right. I can understand how this kind of thinking can lead to believing a majority of a population are deplorable.

It is only biased if Trump has done good things. I wouldn't go with the line of the devil (and you are complaining of straw men...) but he is in a very difficult job and he is a selfish idiot. It does not result in a long list of positive policies from the man.

everlast75

Kimsang wrote: »

Again my argument is just strawmanned. I'm saying the liberal media and academia are so biased, that people were so sick of it, they even voted for Trump. It was like pulling the pin of a grenade.

I agree there's plenty of terrible things he's done and said and I think he has been well criticized for this. I once complained about trump criticism which was when he spoke about Charlottesville, I debated several people, and finally some agreed 'there were good people on both sides'.

Calling trump presidential is not in the spirit of 'good light' in my opinion. Putin is presidential.


Good things he's done: Given the finger to political correctness. On a near hourly basis.

Ah right.

You asked for an example and I gave you one. Now you say that's not good enough. Not a strawman argument - but surely there's a name for that?

You then go on to say that Putin is your example of what presedential means (magnitsky would disagree). That's quite the indication of how you believe a person in power should act, given he's a dictator who jails his political opponents at the very least and assassinates others.

You then cite Trump sticking a finger up at political correctness as one good thing he did. This is exactly the type of minimalistic thing he could do. Give him a cookie!

He is the most powerful men in the world and ?*that's* what he has done that springs to your mind?

Utter utter nonsense.

RIGOLO

everlast75 wrote: »

Ah right.

You asked for an example and I gave you one. Now you say that's not good enough. Not a strawman argument - but surely there's a name for that?

You then go on to say that Putin is your example of what presedential means (magnitsky would disagree). That's quite the indication of how you believe a person in power should act, given he's a dictator who jails his political opponents at the very least and assassinates others.

You then cite Trump sticking a finger up at political correctness as one good thing he did. This is exactly the type of minimalistic thing he could do. Give him a cookie!

He is the most powerful men in the world and ?*that's* what he has done that springs to your mind?

Utter utter nonsense.

So you dont support PUTIN attempts to make RUSSIA the largest Organic Farm Producer in the world ?
Do you support PUTINS complete ban of ALL GM food crops ?

I thought the liberal left were predominantly organic, and anti GM foods and big phama-bio nvolvement in the growing of our food.

Shouldnt they be lauding Putin for the measures he has taken to turn the wast Steppes of Russia into an organic oasis.

This article is from 2015, Putins work on organic farming stretches back that far...
I guess the liberal left organinc Green supporters will have to figure out if they embrace Putins orgnanic farming measures or if as they do with ALL uncomfortable truths , simply ignore it and trash the orange hair man ..

Putin: Russia Will be World’s Largest Supplier of Healthy Organic Food
https://sustainablepulse.com/2015/12/03/putin-russia-will-be-worlds-largest-supplier-of-healthy-organic-food/

Brian?

RIGOLO wrote: »

So you dont support PUTIN attempts to make RUSSIA the largest Organic Farm Producer in the world ?
Do you support PUTINS complete ban of ALL GM food crops ?

I thought the liberal left were predominantly organic, and anti GM foods and big phama-bio nvolvement in the growing of our food.

Shouldnt they be lauding Putin for the measures he has taken to turn the wast Steppes of Russia into an organic oasis.

This article is from 2015, Putins work on organic farming stretches back that far...
I guess the liberal left organinc Green supporters will have to figure out if they embrace Putins orgnanic farming measures or if as they do with ALL uncomfortable truths , simply ignore it and trash the orange hair man ..

Putin: Russia Will be World’s Largest Supplier of Healthy Organic Food
https://sustainablepulse.com/2015/12/03/putin-russia-will-be-worlds-largest-supplier-of-healthy-organic-food/

You know the “liberal left” don’t hold meetings where we agree on every issue? There is nothing wrong with GM food.

There’s plenty wrong with assassination and imprisonment of political opponents.

Why are you bugging up an autocrat?

listermint

RIGOLO wrote: »

So you dont support PUTIN attempts to make RUSSIA the largest Organic Farm Producer in the world ?
Do you support PUTINS complete ban of ALL GM food crops ?

I thought the liberal left were predominantly organic, and anti GM foods and big phama-bio nvolvement in the growing of our food.

Shouldnt they be lauding Putin for the measures he has taken to turn the wast Steppes of Russia into an organic oasis.

This article is from 2015, Putins work on organic farming stretches back that far...
I guess the liberal left organinc Green supporters will have to figure out if they embrace Putins orgnanic farming measures or if as they do with ALL uncomfortable truths , simply ignore it and trash the orange hair man ..

Putin: Russia Will be World’s Largest Supplier of Healthy Organic Food
https://sustainablepulse.com/2015/12/03/putin-russia-will-be-worlds-largest-supplier-of-healthy-organic-food/

Reads liberal left.

Automatically switches off, because any content after that is drivel.


6 out of 10 Regolo