Property Market 2019

Bluefoam

Sheeps wrote: »

Just approved for a full mortgage exemption, going now from looking unsuccessfully/bidding for the last year at €330k (~€350 new) price range to being able to look at the 370k (~€390k new) price range. There is a huge difference in the quality of the properties with that €40-50k jump in spending. Can't believe how dramatic the increase in quality of house is at this level.

I am always amazed buy the fact that you can get better stuff by paying more.

*I'm being facetious, but still...

AlmightyCushion

Bluefoam wrote: »

I am always amazed buy the fact that you can get better stuff by paying more.

*I'm being facetious, but still...

He's not saying it's better, he's saying it's that it is much, much better for a relatively small increase in price. I thought that was fairly obvious from his post.

beauf

Its 40k increase or 12%

What sort of qualitative difference are you seeing?

Thargor

Sheeps wrote: »

Just approved for a full mortgage exemption, going now from looking unsuccessfully/bidding for the last year at €330k (~€350 new) price range to being able to look at the 370k (~€390k new) price range. There is a huge difference in the quality of the properties with that €40-50k jump in spending. Can't believe how dramatic the increase in quality of house is at this level.

Any more details on the exemption? Seems a bit late in the year. I think an exemption is my only hope tbh

The_Conductor

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

He's not saying it's better, he's saying it's that it is much, much better for a relatively small increase in price. I thought that was fairly obvious from his post.

Same as a bottle of wine.
Cheap and nasty = a fiver, quite nice = 6.50...…….
A small increase increase in price = a massive increase in desirability/utility value.

Sheeps

beauf wrote: »

Its 40k increase or 12%

What sort of qualitative difference are you seeing?

it's a very difficult thing to describe, but the largest difference for me is the frequency that spacious second hand homes in decent livable condition are now showing up on my daily search results. Smaller homes with more character also appearing more frequently. Feels like and entirely different market than before (largely comprised of cramped 2 bed apartments)

Sheeps

Thargor wrote: »

Any more details on the exemption? Seems a bit late in the year. I think an exemption is my only hope tbh

I had an exemption before from AIB, but it expired. Reapplied through a broker and was able to obtain a much larger exemption in full on a fixed term mortgage for the same length with a lower interest rate, with KBC (although it'll be next year before I can close on a sale), then another with BOI who have a number of exemptions left for the year.

megabomberman

I have noticed the same thing, such a large proportion of people are priced out by that extra €50k that the extra amount represents real value for money.

It can be the difference between an E2 energy rated doer upper with an overgrown mess of a garden, to a C1 rated turn key house which requires very little investment.

VW 1

I'm stuck in between the two, looking in the D9/11 areas with a budget that would/should extend to a turnkey but very few options come on market. Then the lower end of the budget require massive amounts of work, but the work required plus price of property is as high as the turn key stuff.

Dolbhad

Sheeps wrote: »

Just approved for a full mortgage exemption, going now from looking unsuccessfully/bidding for the last year at €330k (~€350 new) price range to being able to look at the 370k (~€390k new) price range. There is a huge difference in the quality of the properties with that €40-50k jump in spending. Can't believe how dramatic the increase in quality of house is at this level.

We are in the exact same boat. We have about 60k more from last year due to a bigger exemption we got due to pay increase and another year of savings.

Yes it’s more money I’m paying but I feel like better value for money. Under 300k it’s hard to get any good value for money because it’s probably the most competitive market.

Benzino

We were told by KBC and BOI that you can't get approved for an exemption until you have an offer accepted on a house, is that not the case?

Dolbhad

Benzino wrote: »

We were told by KBC and BOI that you can't get approved for an exemption until you have an offer accepted on a house, is that not the case?

That’s true but unofficially they BOI should be able to give you an indication of what you could get approved for. At least for us they did but it’s not set in stone. I think AIB and EBS are the only banks to issue exemptions without a house lined up

SozBbz

Dolbhad wrote: »

That’s true but unofficially they BOI should be able to give you an indication of what you could get approved for. At least for us they did but it’s not set in stone. I think AIB and EBS are the only banks to issue exemptions without a house lined up

I havent found this to be true in my experience.

I got a mortgage by myself with BOI in 2015 when the CBI rules were still quite new and they offered me an exception without me having to ask.

I work in a role where bonus payments are likely but obviously the 3.5x is only calculated on your basic (guaranteed) salary - maybe they say my actually income and just jumped into exception mode.

Just this year I got another mortgage via a broker with KBC. This time, obviously its more complicated, so I just asked what the various lenders would offer and again it was straight into exception territory without asking.

Again, I suspect this was to do with their review of our statements, the nature of the fact that I typically earn more than my basic salary would indicate and strong deposits. We were actually offered mad money but decided to not borrow the max, and actually went under 3.5x in the end.

Cuddlesworth

SozBbz wrote: »

I havent found this to be true in my experience.

I got a mortgage by myself with BOI in 2015 when the CBI rules were still quite new and they offered me an exception without me having to ask.

I work in a role where bonus payments are likely but obviously the 3.5x is only calculated on your basic (guaranteed) salary - maybe they say my actually income and just jumped into exception mode.

Just this year I got another mortgage via a broker with KBC. This time, obviously its more complicated, so I just asked what the various lenders would offer and again it was straight into exception territory without asking.

Again, I suspect this was to do with their review of our statements, the nature of the fact that I typically earn more than my basic salary would indicate and strong deposits. We were actually offered mad money but decided to not borrow the max, and actually went under 3.5x in the end.

I don't think the CBI rules were specific about base income, they just stated 3.5 x gross income. Most banks are just being safe around bonus payments or additions to income. I know one bank included my additional payments at a rate of .5 towards my base income. EG, 100k income, 50k bonus, 125k base income x 3.5. Which meant I wouldn't have been a exception for them.

SozBbz

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

I don't think the CBI rules were specific about base income, they just stated 3.5 x gross income. Most banks are just being safe around bonus payments or additions to income. I know one bank included my additional payments at a rate of .5 towards my base income. EG, 100k income, 50k bonus, 125k base income x 3.5. Which meant I wouldn't have been a exception for them.

Yes indeed, but the point I was making in response to another poster is that I was not sale agreed at this point in the process.

The banks were offering me more than 3.5x well ahead of me having a property in mind, and that was on 2 separate occasions with 2 separate banks.

I think if you have to ask the banks for an exemption then you're probably already up against it and they're going to make you jump through hoops. They identify the people they want to make exemptions for and offer them.

I don't think it was really my income being relied upon for future purposes -it was strong deposits in both cases. I work in sales so it is totally possible to get zero if you sell zero. AFAIK commission bases bonuses are not counted by most banks, although I think some will factor in a % these days now that the rules have been in place for a while. I borrowed less that 60% in both cases, so I think that was really the deciding factor for me.

OwlsZat

Seems daftdrop.com is gone never to return. Are there any other market analytics sites?

Dolbhad

SozBbz wrote: »

Yes indeed, but the point I was making in response to another poster is that I was not sale agreed at this point in the process.

The banks were offering me more than 3.5x well ahead of me having a property in mind, and that was on 2 separate occasions with 2 separate banks.

I think if you have to ask the banks for an exemption then you're probably already up against it and they're going to make you jump through hoops. They identify the people they want to make exemptions for and offer them.

I don't think it was really my income being relied upon for future purposes -it was strong deposits in both cases. I work in sales so it is totally possible to get zero if you sell zero. AFAIK commission bases bonuses are not counted by most banks, although I think some will factor in a % these days now that the rules have been in place for a while. I borrowed less that 60% in both cases, so I think that was really the deciding factor for me.

I didn’t ask for an exemption with BOI. I just went in to be approved for 3.5x my salary. I had exemptions elsewhere But liked BoI for its cashback if I didn’t need approval.

The mortgage person in there told me that I would be approved for an exemption if I wanted it. AIP was approved on 3.5x times. She said they can’t issue AIP for exemptions as you need a house lined up. But told me what I could expect to borrow from based on a certain purchase price of house.

Ulster Bank told me same thing - I need a house for exemption and loan offer would issue on that. However they gave me AIP with an exemption (and bigger exemption that what I was initially told I could get). I stopped trying to figure out how banks calculate things at that stage.

That’s all in the last 3 weeks as my initial AIP’s expired start of year so went in for renewal.

I think banks have more discretion than they let on- I have a substantial deposit behind me but was told my three banks it was my job they liked (not necessary my current income levels and deposit saved) and that’s why they would give me exemptions.

OwlsZat

Dolbhad wrote: »

I didn’t ask for an exemption with BOI. I just went in to be approved for 3.5x my salary. I had exemptions elsewhere But liked BoI for its cashback if I didn’t need approval.

The mortgage person in there told me that I would be approved for an exemption if I wanted it. AIP was approved on 3.5x times. She said they can’t issue AIP for exemptions as you need a house lined up. But told me what I could expect to borrow from based on a certain purchase price of house.

Ulster Bank told me same thing - I need a house for exemption and loan offer would issue on that. However they gave me AIP with an exemption (and bigger exemption that what I was initially told I could get). I stopped trying to figure out how banks calculate things at that stage.

That’s all in the last 3 weeks as my initial AIP’s expired start of year so went in for renewal.

I think banks have more discretion than they let on- I have a substantial deposit behind me but was told my three banks it was my job they liked (not necessary my current income levels and deposit saved) and that’s why they would give me exemptions.

It's obviously a fairly recession proof job?

Dolbhad

OwlsZat wrote: »

It's obviously a fairly recession proof job?

That’s the funny thing - it is not at all recession proof - I work as a solicitor (not in conveyance though) and that was not recession proof last time.

At that stage I applied to BOI, Ulster Bank and EBS and it really was a different amount from each bank on what we could borrow jointly and how much of an exemption they would give us. I have decided I have no idea how the banks come to the conclusion of what they take into consideration when giving exemptions. But I did apply last year for exemptions late in the year and some banks had run out of money. Seems this year it’s been staggered better.

Cuddlesworth

Dolbhad wrote: »

That’s the funny thing - it is not at all recession proof - I work as a solicitor (not in conveyance though) and that was not recession proof last time.

At that stage I applied to BOI, Ulster Bank and EBS and it really was a different amount from each bank on what we could borrow jointly and how much of an exemption they would give us. I have decided I have no idea how the banks come to the conclusion of what they take into consideration when giving exemptions. But I did apply last year for exemptions late in the year and some banks had run out of money. Seems this year it’s been staggered better.

It's nothing to do with your job, it's your high deposit and significant disposable income.

Everybody I know in Dublin who has gone in with significant savings both current and historical, get LTI exceptions thrown at them.

Dolbhad

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

It's nothing to do with your job, it's your high deposit and significant disposable income.

Everybody I know in Dublin who has gone in with significant savings both current and historical, get LTI exceptions thrown at them.

Disposable income only manageable because we both live at home so we can save most our income. It was only way we could get the deposit together. Also not based in Dublin so very different money levels at play - neither of us would be a high income earners. I assumed the deposit we had saved would be the clincher but each bank told me it was my job that gave us the exemption.

Anyway I was just throwing it out there as I know some people think you need a high income level of 70k plus to even be considered for an exemption and that wasn't our case.

r93kaey5p2izun

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

It's nothing to do with your job, it's your high deposit and significant disposable income.

Everybody I know in Dublin who has gone in with significant savings both current and historical, get LTI exceptions thrown at them.

I don't think savings is that big a factor in exemptions. I had saved over 100k deposit on my own, while renting in Dublin and earning 55k, but could not get an exemption to bridge a <10k gap. Then I gave up my secure, pensionable public sector job to be self employed on much better money but less job security, and they were throwing exemptions at me. But then I didn't need the exemption anyway because I could save a lot more myself. I find their reasoning on exemptions baffling.

AlmightyCushion

Lewis Noisy Twit wrote: »

I don't think savings is that big a factor in exemptions. I had saved over 100k deposit on my own, while renting in Dublin and earning 55k, but could not get an exemption to bridge a <10k gap. Then I gave up my secure, pensionable public sector job to be self employed on much better money but less job security, and they were throwing exemptions at me. But then I didn't need the exemption anyway because I could save a lot more myself. I find their reasoning on exemptions baffling.

Was there much of a gap between when you applied when working in the public sector vs when you applied whilst self employed? If it was a couple of years then that could explain it. They might have been a lot more risk averse a few years ago. Plus, being on way more money means you're a lot likely to get an exemption as you have a much higher disposable income.

r93kaey5p2izun

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

Was there much of a gap between when you applied when working in the public sector vs when you applied whilst self employed? If it was a couple of years then that could explain it. They might have been a lot more risk averse a few years ago. Plus, being on way more money means you're a lot likely to get an exemption as you have a much higher disposable income.

There was 10 months between applications. Yes I was later earning much more but no real guarantee that will continue! I just think it's ridiculous they wouldn't lend me just 9k extra the first time when I had managed to pay Dublin rent and save 60% of my income consistently over a few years, and was in a secure job with guaranteed increments.

nerrad01

yea from personal experience savings dont play a big role in exemptions, EBS for example require you to have €2600 net disposable income per month before considering you for an exemption. BOI seem to have the most relaxed rules, but property needs to be identified first

Mic 1972

Does anyone know how long it takes for a sale to appear on the property register?
I was keeping an eye on a few 1bed apts in town a while ago, they are all gone now and i was curious to see how much they went for, but not a single one is on the register

r93kaey5p2izun

Mic 1972 wrote: »

Does anyone know how long it takes for a sale to appear on the property register?
I was keeping an eye on a few 1bed apts in town a while ago, they are all gone now and i was curious to see how much they went for, but not a single one is on the register

Houses I was watching in mid-August have been appearing on the register over the past couple of weeks.

Mic 1972

Lewis Noisy Twit wrote: »

Houses I was watching in mid-August have been appearing on the register over the past couple of weeks.

Thanks, I'll keep on checking then. I do wonder if some of them have been pulled due to lack of good offers and might appear again in the near future with a lower asking price

ebayissues

I'm trying to think what should one keep in mind in choosing a bank for mortgage? Obviously the mortgage rate percent, fixed vs floating , anything else?

L1011

House nearby and near identical to mine went up for sale at the start of the summer and I assumed they were overdoing it with the ask. Went for 3k under according to the PPR.

I'm tempted to go ask the new owner (we've spoken already, it wouldn't be a cold call :pac:) if there was much of a bidding war as I'm still vaguely considering moving but had thought the local market had gone very soft. Asking was a little bit less than I'd have hoped to get - but this house is more heavily modernised and C3 vs E1 rated.