Property Market 2019

alwald

hmmm wrote: »

Whether apartments are sold for rent or for purchase, they are extra supply. The REIT thing is just leftie distractions.

Define extra supply please? have we satisfied the needs of all FTB to call it an extra supply?
In relation to the REIT, it isn't a leftie distraction but rather a reality that was raised also by a UN report which is totally unbiased.

hmmm wrote: »

Similarly the reason why the government has allowed the "homeless" exceed 10k, is because most voters know there aren't actual 10,000 people truly homeless. And most people don't want to live beside social housing.

I am lost for words so I will skip this part completely.

hmmm wrote: »

Supply seems to be rising and prices seem to be levelling off which can only be good news. The rental market is still in a mess, a lot of which is due to rules endorsed by leftwing parties.

Supply doesn't seem to be rising, it's in fact rising but it's nowhere close to the required supply over the next 10 years or so to meet the demand.

And finally, what left wing rules are you referring to?

hmmm

alwald wrote: »

Supply doesn't seem to be rising, it's in fact rising but it's nowhere close to the required supply over the next 10 years or so to meet the demand.

Prices seem to be levelling off, so supply is meeting demand.

If you're saying demand for cheaper houses, that's never going to happen unless we reduce the cost of building.

Whether it's a REIT renting 100 apartments, or 100 buyers living in apartments, it's 100 units of supply.

Pussyhands

Rex Disgusting Tariff wrote: »

Lies, two developers I know are cancelling / postponing phase 2 and 3 of two sites unless it’s clarified that the HTB is being extended at the end of the year. You are making up so much stuff it’s hilarious.

What are the name of the estates?

alwald

hmmm wrote: »

Prices seem to be levelling off, so supply is meeting demand.

Are prices leveling off in the entire country? and is it because of the ~18K units built last year or the CBI lending restrictions?

hmmm wrote: »

If you're saying demand for cheaper houses, that's never going to happen unless we reduce the cost of building.

Quote where I said that please and then I will reply.

hmmm wrote: »

Whether it's a REIT renting 100 apartments, or 100 buyers living in apartments, it's 100 units of supply.

The topic wasn't whether 100 units are supply or not but rather why allow REIT to buy these units instead or genuine FTB with a deposit in this current housing crisis?

q85dw7osi4lebg

Pussyhands wrote: »

What are the name of the estates?

Given I work with them I wouldn't be stupid enough to give away such specifics. Leinster.

backspin.

Prices are dropping in my area. When i look at daft drop its significantly red v green.

mkdon

backspin. wrote: »

Prices are dropping in my area. When i look at daft drop its significantly red v green.

what is your area


factor in that people wont sell now for what they deem less than they deserve so that has to be factored in too in what is sale

shenanagans

Is the HTB incentive just leading to an increase in the price of new builds?

Went to an open viewing recently of a new development (Galway City). Couldn't believe the asking prices. Thought the houses were 50-70k overpriced. The place was full of young couples. I wasn't impressed at all with the development but the houses were great with A rating. The development had no green area, very high density so little privacy and just felt very claustrophobic.

I wonder why more young people aren't willing to look at older houses. I mean you'll do a lot of updating with 40k....new bathrooms/kitchen/insulating/doors etc particularly if you're able to do some of the work yourself (painting etc) And the older houses are often in more central areas with better green areas etc.

You learn so much after you buy the first time, you realise the importance of privacy, space, aspect, sunlight etc. Having bought a few years ago (second hand), I would definitely buy an older house and do it up if it meant more green areas, more light, more privacy. An A rated house is great but it's definitely not the most important thing....you can always improve your BER rating with improvements. It's location and the potential of the house all the way for me.

HTB should include second hand homes. It's crazy to exclude second hand homes ...only benefits developers.

Zenify

shenanagans wrote: »

Is the HTB incentive just leading to an increase in the price of new builds?

Went to an open viewing recently of a new development (Galway City). Couldn't believe the asking prices. Thought the houses were 50-70k overpriced. The place was full of young couples. I wasn't impressed at all with the development but the houses were great with A rating. The development had no green area, very high density so little privacy and just felt very claustrophobic.

I wonder why more young people aren't willing to look at older houses. I mean you'll do a lot of updating with 40k....new bathrooms/kitchen/insulating/doors etc particularly if you're able to do some of the work yourself (painting etc) And the older houses are often in more central areas with better green areas etc.

You learn so much after you buy the first time, you realise the importance of privacy, space, aspect, sunlight etc. Having bought a few years ago (second hand), I would definitely buy an older house and do it up if it meant more green areas, more light, more privacy. An A rated house is great but it's definitely not the most important thing....you can always improve your BER rating with improvements. It's location and the potential of the house all the way for me.

HTB should include second hand homes. It's crazy to exclude second hand homes ...only benefits developers.

A lot of second hand homes went sale agreed and have come back on the market after the prospective buyers realised the cost of renovations. 40k wouldn't turn an old damp house into modern living standards even if you're good at DIY.

Paul_Mc1988

Zenify wrote:

A lot of second hand homes went sale agreed and have come back on the market after the prospective buyers realised the cost of renovations. 40k wouldn't turn an old damp house into modern living standards even if you're good at DIY.

Depends on who you know. As an electrician I have done many flavours throughout the years. Currently looking in South Dublin at the moment and am budgeting 30k all in for a good finish on a standard 3 bed kitchen and bathroom included. Rewire, replumb warmboard plaster paint etc.

Bluefoam

Paul_Mc1988 wrote: »

Zenify wrote:

A lot of second hand homes went sale agreed and have come back on the market after the prospective buyers realised the cost of renovations. 40k wouldn't turn an old damp house into modern living standards even if you're good at DIY.

Depends on who you know. As an electrician I have done many flavours throughout the years. Currently looking in South Dublin at the moment and am budgeting 30k all in for a good finish on a standard 3 bed kitchen and bathroom included. Rewire, replumb warmboard plaster paint etc.

So... Rather than pay money for the work, you are bartering? There is a value to that in time and a monetary value... Just because you can offset the cost through barter and DIY, does not make it economical for most people. But fair play to you. You are in a good position to get the property you want and the quality you want.

Paul_Mc1988

Bluefoam wrote:

So... Rather than pay money for the work, you are bartering? There is a value to that in time and a monetary value... Just because you can offset the cost through barter and DIY, does not make it economical for most people. But fair play to you. You are in a good position to get the property you want and the quality you want.

Yeah there is definatly a value in the time it took me to perform the jobs and only ever charged for materials but the majority of the time it was when work was slack. Wouldnt call it bartering as I never explicitly asked for a favour in return. It will just be expected. Could be told to feck off by a few but I'll cross that bridge when i come to it :P

JJJackal

Paul_Mc1988 wrote: »

Yeah there is definatly a value in the time it took me to perform the jobs and only ever charged for materials but the majority of the time it was when work was slack. Wouldnt call it bartering as I never explicitly asked for a favour in return. It will just be expected. Could be told to feck off by a few but I'll cross that bridge when i come to it :P

You will have paid for this work in "time" - most young couples buying a house dont have a trade e.g. I suspect you will obviously do all the wiring etc and get materials at builders rates?

How much would what you plan to do cost someone who didnt have a trade? Realistically DIY if you dont have a skill set eg timber flooring can turn out horribly wrong!

awec

Paul_Mc1988 wrote: »

Depends on who you know. As an electrician I have done many flavours throughout the years. Currently looking in South Dublin at the moment and am budgeting 30k all in for a good finish on a standard 3 bed kitchen and bathroom included. Rewire, replumb warmboard plaster paint etc.

Good luck.

Fol20

awec wrote: »

Good luck.

He can do the rewire himself sinces hes an electrician. Depending on replumb, im sure he has contacts in the trade so 30k can go a decent way when you know the right people

awec

shenanagans wrote: »

Is the HTB incentive just leading to an increase in the price of new builds?

Went to an open viewing recently of a new development (Galway City). Couldn't believe the asking prices. Thought the houses were 50-70k overpriced. The place was full of young couples. I wasn't impressed at all with the development but the houses were great with A rating. The development had no green area, very high density so little privacy and just felt very claustrophobic.

I wonder why more young people aren't willing to look at older houses. I mean you'll do a lot of updating with 40k....new bathrooms/kitchen/insulating/doors etc particularly if you're able to do some of the work yourself (painting etc) And the older houses are often in more central areas with better green areas etc.

You learn so much after you buy the first time, you realise the importance of privacy, space, aspect, sunlight etc. Having bought a few years ago (second hand), I would definitely buy an older house and do it up if it meant more green areas, more light, more privacy. An A rated house is great but it's definitely not the most important thing....you can always improve your BER rating with improvements. It's location and the potential of the house all the way for me.

HTB should include second hand homes. It's crazy to exclude second hand homes ...only benefits developers.

Go back a few pages and read the thread, HTB would not work on second hand homes, it would just be stupid.

Anyway, if a second hand house is in a condition where superficial work will bring it up to modern standards then it will be expensive. If it's in a condition where a lot of work is needed, it will be cheaper.

As for this DIY stuff, many people think they can do things themselves but make a bollocks of it. Someone who has never painted a house before is probably not going to do a great job of it. A wooden floor laid by an amateur will be very obvious. Much of what needs done needs a professional if you want it done right.

shenanagans

Zenify wrote: »

A lot of second hand homes went sale agreed and have come back on the market after the prospective buyers realised the cost of renovations. 40k wouldn't turn an old damp house into modern living standards even if you're good at DIY.

I've seen first hand over the last few years what 30k can do to an older property. Total transformation. New bathrooms, new Kitchen, flooring, etc. I'm now talking about houses that need total renovation, I meant 20-30 year old houses that need updating.

In my area you could buy a second hand home for 80-100 k cheaper than buying a new home at the moment. I think people should consider buying second hand and doing the work.

This need for perfection, walk in ready standard in non sense. If it was me I won't pay the overinflated price of a new build.

And I don't have a trade. But I've painted my house inside and out and am not afraid of doing work if it saves me money. Anybody could gut a kitchen or bathroom and throw it all in a hired skip..... saving yourself a load of money paying someone else to do it.

30k does a great update job (I know)
80-100k would do major work.
People just need to be willing to do it.

Just my opinion. If I sold in the morning, I'd want a house with potential in a good area. I'd have no problem rolling up my sleeves.

But I understand that not for everyone.

awec

There's a good chance that even with your new kitchen etc it won't be up to the same standard as a new build (depending on the new build, obviously).

Anyway, it's not a laziness thing, more a practical thing. Second hand doer-uppers can very easily be a time and money sink, people think it'll cost x and take y months, and it ends up taking double of both.

The only sensible way to renovate is to do it all at once. You always hear this "we'll move in, and do a room at a time". Bollocks. So while it's happening, they either have to live elsewhere or live in a ****hole that's being worked on, which is often not possible if they have a family.

Then you have to pay for it, somehow.

bri007

I thinks you addressed some interesting points.

We are in the process (end stage) of our house purchase. The house needs a fair bit of work granted, but the location, size is second to none.

New houses that would be near it were way out of our budget, the house we bought needs windows in the future, insulation, new doors and possibly electrical but we understand that and can lice in it currently the way it is. There’s light and heat, no leaks so we will survive and the location made it for us.

We have a big driveway to the front and nice back garden. The newer houses didn’t have that, communal parking and tiny back garden and all houses on top of each other.

It works for some, just felt paying the extra 80-100k on new build wasn’t worth it (we couldn’t afford it anyway) but even if we did we wouldn’t have considered it.

shenanagans wrote: »

I've seen first hand over the last few years what 30k can do to an older property. Total transformation. New bathrooms, new Kitchen, flooring, etc. I'm now talking about houses that need total renovation, I meant 20-30 year old houses that need updating.

In my area you could buy a second hand home for 80-100 k cheaper than buying a new home at the moment. I think people should consider buying second hand and doing the work.

This need for perfection, walk in ready standard in non sense. If it was me I won't pay the overinflated price of a new build.

And I don't have a trade. But I've painted my house inside and out and am not afraid of doing work if it saves me money. Anybody could gut a kitchen or bathroom and throw it all in a hired skip..... saving yourself a load of money paying someone else to do it.

30k does a great update job (I know)
80-100k would do major work.
People just need to be willing to do it.

Just my opinion. If I sold in the morning, I'd want a house with potential in a good area. I'd have no problem rolling up my sleeves.

But I understand that not for everyone.

fret_wimp2

awec wrote: »

Anyway, if a second hand house is in a condition where superficial work will bring it up to modern standards then it will be expensive. If it's in a condition where a lot of work is needed, it will be cheaper.

More often than not I have found this not to be the case. I know of two D6 properties that had to be gutted and rebuilt. 60 year old houses with little work done during that time. One uninhabited for the past year. They were literally brought back to a shell and rebuilt.

Houses were north of 650k before any of the considerable "renovations", renovations being upward of 150k. Were talking about needing considerable roof work, stairs work, and complete internal refurb.

Its D6, so upper end of the market, in an area that commands a premium for the site alone, but it happens everywhere relative to the price, an older house, needing 60+k of work, but the house is priced identically to a new build or modernized older build just down the road.

shenanagans

bri007 wrote: »

I thinks you addressed some interesting points.

We are in the process (end stage) of our house purchase. The house needs a fair bit of work granted, but the location, size is second to none.

New houses that would be near it were way out of our budget, the house we bought needs windows in the future, insulation, new doors and possibly electrical but we understand that and can lice in it currently the way it is. There’s light and heat, no leaks so we will survive and the location made it for us.

We have a big driveway to the front and nice back garden. The newer houses didn’t have that, communal parking and tiny back garden and all houses on top of each other.

It works for some, just felt paying the extra 80-100k on new build wasn’t worth it (we couldn’t afford it anyway) but even if we did we wouldn’t have considered it.

Congrats and good luck with it. Sound like you won't need to upgrade in future either. You got the major points correct.... Space and location. In time it's possible to upgrade and update your home..... But you can make garden bigger or pick house up and move it elsewhere.

House with potential and location everytime!

The Mulk

Fol20 wrote: »

He can do the rewire himself sinces hes an electrician. Depending on replumb, im sure he has contacts in the trade so 30k can go a decent way when you know the right people

Yep, rewire, new heating system, warmboard throughout, new kitchen and new floors throughout. circa 20 k for a 4 bed detached (I'm an electrician and have a plumber and flooring contractor in the family) all labour by myself. Paying for it all would have set me back at least 3 times that

shenanagans

awec wrote: »

Go back a few pages and read the thread, HTB would not work on second hand homes, it would just be stupid.

Anyway, if a second hand house is in a condition where superficial work will bring it up to modern standards then it will be expensive. If it's in a condition where a lot of work is needed, it will be cheaper.

As for this DIY stuff, many people think they can do things themselves but make a bollocks of it. Someone who has never painted a house before is probably not going to do a great job of it. A wooden floor laid by an amateur will be very obvious. Much of what needs done needs a professional if you want it done right.

Went back. Saw nothing to change my mind. Actually reaad plenty that reinforced my opinion.

JJJackal

The Mulk wrote: »

Yep, rewire, new heating system, warmboard throughout, new kitchen and new floors throughout. circa 20 k for a 4 bed detached (I'm an electrician and have a plumber and flooring contractor in the family) all labour by myself. Paying for it all would have set me back at least 3 times that

so the average joe doing an average size refurb with no family trade connections or connections themselves will spend >60k (probably not done to the standard you can do it when doing it for yourself)

Edit -

Assuming you can get people to do it in a timely fashion

The Mulk

JJJackal wrote: »

so the average joe doing an average size refurb with no family trade connections or connections themselves will spend >60k (probably not done to the standard you can do it when doing it for yourself)

Edit -

Assuming you can get people to do it in a timely fashion

Yes, i priced a small 3 bed in South Dublin for electrical works, my quote was 10 % of the work. Overall price was 65k for all listed above.

From the work above in my own place. I had to blitz the house over a summer (after living in it for 6 months), but it was the trade off.
I'd never been able to afford a house to the standard I have now without doing the work myself.

P.S. i found a great kitchen workshop for supplying kitchen unit, save me a fortune a a pleasure to deal with!

(I think i'll take further post to the DIY forum :pac:)

shenanagans

awec wrote: »

There's a good chance that even with your new kitchen etc it won't be up to the same standard as a new build (depending on the new build, obviously).

Anyway, it's not a laziness thing, more a practical thing. Second hand doer-uppers can very easily be a time and money sink, people think it'll cost x and take y months, and it ends up taking double of both.

The only sensible way to renovate is to do it all at once. You always hear this "we'll move in, and do a room at a time". Bollocks. So while it's happening, they either have to live elsewhere or live in a ****hole that's being worked on, which is often not possible if they have a family.

Then you have to pay for it, somehow.

It won't be up to the same standard?. You mean it wouldn't be PERFECT. How do people survive living in ordinary B, C or D rated houses. They only account for most of the population.

Anyone considering doing up a house would bring a builder with them. Get an idea of price of work you want done. Double the price?? Only of you're totally clueless and don't get quotes before purchasing..

The doer upper is for some people... Clearly not you. But good luck to you if you're in the market.

I know its very hard for anyone in Dublin area.

shenanagans

The Mulk wrote: »

Yes, i priced a small 3 bed in South Dublin for electrical works, my quote was 10 % of the work. Overall price was 65k for all listed above.

From the work above in my own place. I had to blitz the house over a summer (after living in it for 6 months), but it was the trade off.
I'd never been able to afford a house to the standard I have now without doing the work myself.

P.S. i found a great kitchen workshop for supplying kitchen unit, save me a fortune a a pleasure to deal with!

(I think i'll take further post to the DIY forum :pac:)

Far play to you. Hard work. And the sense to buy what you could afford. Good luck in you new (old) home.

The Mulk

shenanagans wrote: »

Far play to you. Hard work. And the sense to buy what you could afford. Good luck in you new (old) home.

Cheers, it is our second home. We lived in a new built home for 15 years.
I bought it when i was 24, had to go for a new house as there was no stamp duty on new builds at the time.(2003).
After 15 years the house needed some investment se we decided to move to a fixer upper. I'd never buy in a new build again, house quality aside it takes too long for the community to establish itself, trees to grow, roads to be finished etc. The developers can pull fast ones with green areas too, but i'm not sure if this is as common now
Looking at an existing estate, you can figure out the lay of land etc. fairley handy, but you also have bidding wars so there is that downside

IspeakcozIcan

Article in Bloomberg today "Dublin Home Prices are Falling Again", reiterating a lot of what was published in the national media this week.

machalla

IspeakcozIcan wrote: »

Article in Bloomberg today "Dublin Home Prices are Falling Again", reiterating a lot of what was published in the national media this week.

According to this mortgage approvals both fell and rose within a month of each other compared to last year. Is that indicative of anything other than seasonal factors?

"The slowdown may also reflect tougher mortgage lending rules imposed by the central bank. The volume of mortgage approvals fell in January compared with a year earlier, according to Banking & Payments Federation Ireland, though figures released Thursday showed a recovery, rising 7 percent in February. "