6 Nations 2019 Build Up thread

PTH2009

England were very close to beating the All Blacks last Nov and will be a tough game for us. There out to get us

Wales in Cardiff is very daunting and Joe has never won a championship game over there and this is his last chance.

Scotland of course beat us the last time we played them in Murrayfield and of course our world cup group opponents. Will be a tough game

France are so unpredictable and always seem too bring there A game against us. Sextons magic got us over the line last year in a freak turn of events

Italy should be no problem for us been need too keep concentration

Can't wait for it too start, hard too believe the GS was a year ago

sydthebeat

stephen_n wrote: »

Wonder will Eddie trust him though.

he didnt trust underhill either... sam only got his chance due to an injury crisis to the players eddie would pick. Eddie didnt unearth him as a gem at all, underhill has been available and worth his spot for the last two seasons at least.

curry is decent but not as strong as underhill on the ground or in the tight... better line out option though

stephen_n

sydthebeat wrote: »

he didnt trust underhill either... sam only got his chance due to an injury crisis to the players eddie would pick. Eddie didnt unearth him as a gem at all, underhill has been available and worth his spot for the last two seasons at least.

curry is decent but not as strong as underhill on the ground or in the tight... better line out option though

I wasn’t suggesting he did, which is exactly why I don’t think he will play Curry unless he has no other choice.

conor678

sydthebeat wrote: »

he didnt trust underhill either... sam only got his chance due to an injury crisis to the players eddie would pick. Eddie didnt unearth him as a gem at all, underhill has been available and worth his spot for the last two seasons at least.

curry is decent but not as strong as underhill on the ground or in the tight... better line out option though

I disagree about Underhill being better over the ground. I am based in england and watch alot of the Gallagher premiership and curry is always one of the first players to the ruck for sale. He's always constantly a threat at the ruck. Underhill I feel gets a lot of help from Louw for Bath.

Don't get me wrong defensively he's a phenomenal tackler and neutralizing threat but curry is the smarter player in my book. I do think that he won't have a long career due to his abrasive nature unfortunately and curry will be a long term threat to Ireland especially once Eddie leaves

banchang

Scottish Jodi wrote: »

I am really looking forward to this year's tournament .

I am a Scot living in Ireland so Scotland are who I am supporting but my pick this year is Ireland who I tip to win the world cup.

We had a good summer, apart from the USA loss and a good autumn where we ran South Africa very close. The Wales game was our only bad performance but I blame the clubs for not releasing our top players lol.

I expect us to beat Italy and possibly France and am hopeful of regaining the Calcutta Cup by winning at Twickenham for the first time in a very long time. Wales and Ireland away will be tough but we are close to their level.

I predict we will end 3rd,behind Ireland and Wales .

Flights & accom booked in Edinburgh, but no tickets ! Any thoughts on how to get my hands on 2 ?

troyzer

Does anyone know the earliest Ireland can overtake New Zealand for the top spot?

troyzer

Just worked it out myself:

Currently we're 1.37 points behind. A win over England is worth between 0.21 and 0.31 points.

A win over Scotland is worth between 0.37 and 0.55 points.

Italy and France aren't worth any ranking points at all because they're ranked so low.

So the max we could take into Wales would be 0.89. We'd need 0.49 points in that case to take first.

A blowout win over Wales is worth 1.36 and a normal win is worth 0.91 points at least.

The amount of points a game is worth within those bands depends on the margin of victory and can also change depending on what's happening in the rest of the Six Nations.

So basically, there's no mathematical way to take first before Cardiff. But any sort of ****ty wins along the way will seal it.

I have no idea if it's possible to take first if we don't win a grand slam. I don't think it is. New Zealand can get a maximum of 0.43 points from the RC and that's if they blowout Australia away from home. They get nothing for home wins over Australia or South Africa. I don't think the warm ups count for anything.

Podge_irl

Warm ups count the same as any test match for ranking points.

troyzer

Podge_irl wrote: »

Warm ups count the same as any test match for ranking points.

Really?

In that case, it seems likely that New Zealand will still be number one going into the World Cup.

Podge_irl

troyzer wrote: »

Really?

In that case, it seems likely that New Zealand will still be number one going into the World Cup.

I'm fairly sure yeah. They are just "test matches" that happen to be doubling as warm ups.

twinytwo

shootermacg wrote: »

I think Ireland will have to beat Wales because I don't really see them losing to anyone else this year...maybe England..

I wouldnt go getting too far ahead of ourselves. We now have a target on our backs, everyone is going to have a go.

We need to set down a serious marker against england in round 1.

troyzer

Podge_irl wrote: »

I'm fairly sure yeah. They are just "test matches" that happen to be doubling as warm ups.

I just ran through them again.

New Zealand don't really have any warm ups. They just have the rugby championship and then an extra game against Argentina and Samoa. Neither of which are worth anything in the rankings.

Basically, New Zealand are 1.37 points ahead and can obtain a maximum of 0.43 points (blowout win in Australia) before the world cup.

Ireland can obtain a maximum of 2.25 points by the end of the Six Nations which would be a grand slam whilst annihilating everyone. A grand slam is worth a minimum of 1.47 points. If we have bare minimum wins against everyone and lose to Wales by a small amount, we'll finish 0.59 down on our current position.

The permutations become really complication after that and you can't really calculate anything until we know where the rankings are after the Six Nations but the most important thing is that New Zealand can't make any real gains between now and the world cup. They can only really stand still or lose points.

Dog Botherer

https://twitter.com/_alexbywater/status/1084882503935111168?s=21

Wales will be absolutely fuming with Bath. Rushed back for a dead rubber.

Podge_irl

Are you really more likely to re-break a bone from being "rushed back"?

****ty things happen - look at SOB. Doesn't necessarily mean anyone is at fault.

Dog Botherer

Podge_irl wrote: »

Are you really more likely to re-break a bone from being "rushed back"?

****ty things happen - look at SOB. Doesn't necessarily mean anyone is at fault.

Well yeah, a reoccurrence of an injury that you were recovering from is likely due to not being fully healed.

Dog Botherer

Dog Botherer wrote: »

https://twitter.com/_alexbywater/status/1084882503935111168?s=21

Wales will be absolutely fuming with Bath. Rushed back for a dead rubber.

He needed gametime. No more prem games until mid Feb.

thomond2006

Scotland squad:

Props: Alex Allan (Glasgow Warriors), Allan Dell (Edinburgh), Jamie Bhatti (Glasgow); Simon Berghan (Edinburgh), Willem Nel (Edinburgh), D'Arcy Rae (Glasgow Warriors).
Hookers: Dave Cherry (Edinburgh), Stuart McInally (Edinburgh), Jake Kerr (Leicester Tigers), Grant Stewart (Glasgow Warriors).
Locks: Grant Gilchrist (Edinburgh), Jonny Gray (Glasgow Warriors) Sam Skinner (Exeter Chiefs), Tim Swinson (Glasgow warriors), Ben Toolis (Edinburgh).
Back row: Adam Ashe (Glasgow Warriors), Gary Graham (Newcastle), John Hardie (Newcastle), Jamie Ritchie (Edinburgh), Josh Strauss (Sale Sharks), Hamish Watson (Edinburgh), Ryan Wilson (Glasgow Warriors).

Back three: Darcy Graham (Edinburgh), Stuart Hogg (Glasgow Warriors), Lee Jones (Glasgow Warriors), Blair Kinghorn (Edinburgh), Sean Maitland (Saracens), Tommy Seymour (Glasgow Warriors)
Centres: Chris Dean (Edinburgh), Nick Grigg (Glasgow Warriors), Chris Harris (Newcastle Falcons), Peter Horne (Glasgow Warriors), Sam Johnson (Glasgow Warriors), Huw Jones (Glasgow Warriors).
Fly-halves: Adam Hastings (Glasgow Warriors), Finn Russell (Racing 92).
Scrum-halves: George Horne (Glasgow Warriors), Greig Laidlaw (Clermont Auvergne), Ali Price (Glasgow Warriors).

troyzer

thomond2006 wrote: »

Scotland squad:

Props: Alex Allan (Glasgow Warriors), Allan Dell (Edinburgh), Jamie Bhatti (Glasgow); Simon Berghan (Edinburgh), Willem Nel (Edinburgh), D'Arcy Rae (Glasgow Warriors).
Hookers: Dave Cherry (Edinburgh), Stuart McInally (Edinburgh), Jake Kerr (Leicester Tigers), Grant Stewart (Glasgow Warriors).
Locks: Grant Gilchrist (Edinburgh), Jonny Gray (Glasgow Warriors) Sam Skinner (Exeter Chiefs), Tim Swinson (Glasgow warriors), Ben Toolis (Edinburgh).
Back row: Adam Ashe (Glasgow Warriors), Gary Graham (Newcastle), John Hardie (Newcastle), Jamie Ritchie (Edinburgh), Josh Strauss (Sale Sharks), Hamish Watson (Edinburgh), Ryan Wilson (Glasgow Warriors).

Back three: Darcy Graham (Edinburgh), Stuart Hogg (Glasgow Warriors), Lee Jones (Glasgow Warriors), Blair Kinghorn (Edinburgh), Sean Maitland (Saracens), Tommy Seymour (Glasgow Warriors)
Centres: Chris Dean (Edinburgh), Nick Grigg (Glasgow Warriors), Chris Harris (Newcastle Falcons), Peter Horne (Glasgow Warriors), Sam Johnson (Glasgow Warriors), Huw Jones (Glasgow Warriors).
Fly-halves: Adam Hastings (Glasgow Warriors), Finn Russell (Racing 92).
Scrum-halves: George Horne (Glasgow Warriors), Greig Laidlaw (Clermont Auvergne), Ali Price (Glasgow Warriors).

Only two fly halves?

Buer

Horne and Laidlaw have both played internationally at 10.

Squidgy Black

Buer wrote: »

Horne and Laidlaw have both played internationally at 10.

And Hogg in a pinch.

Buer

Squidgy Black wrote: »

And Hogg in a pinch.

I've tried to forget that.

troyzer

Buer wrote: »

Horne and Laidlaw have both played internationally at 10.

Still seems a bit thin to only have two dedicated fly halves.

Paul Smeenus

Seven debutants. You'd have to wonder, if this is with one eye on the RWC, whether Townie has left it too late to introduce these guys. They won't have a great deal of international rugby under their belt by September.

Buer

troyzer wrote: »

Still seems a bit thin to only have two dedicated fly halves.

Edinburgh don't have a Scottish outhalf. Glasgow's outhalf, Hastings is named as is Finn Russell. Peter Horne is the back up Glasgow outhalf. The other outhalf in the Glasgow squad isn't Scottish

The only other option would have been to call up Duncan Weir from Worcester and they know he's not up to it.

Webbs

Wales' Six Nations squad

Wales: Fowards: Rob Evans (Scarlets), Wyn Jones (Scarlets), Nicky Smith (Ospreys), Elliot Dee (Dragons), Ryan Elias (Scarlets), Ken Owens (Scarlets), Leon Brown (Dragons), Tomas Francis (Exeter Chiefs), Samson Lee (Scarlets), Dillon Lewis (Cardiff Blues), Jake Ball (Scarlets), Adam Beard (Ospreys), Seb Davies (Cardiff Blues),Cory Hill (Dragons), Alun Wyn Jones (Ospreys, capt), Ross Moriarty (Dragons), Josh Navidi (Cardiff Blues), Justin Tipuric (Ospreys),Josh Turnbull (Cardiff Blues), Aaron Wainwright (Dragons), Thomas Young (Wasps).

Backs: Aled Davies (Ospreys), Gareth Davies (Scarlets), Tomos Williams (Cardiff Blues), Gareth Anscombe (Cardiff Blues), Dan Biggar (Northampton), Jarrod Evans (Cardiff Blues), Rhys Patchell (Scarlets), Jonathan Davies (Scarlets), Hadleigh Parkes (Scarlets),Owen Watkin (Ospreys), Scott Williams (Ospreys), Josh Adams (Worcester), Hallam Amos (Dragons), Steffan Evans (Scarlets), Leigh Halfpenny (Scarlets), Jonah Holmes (Leicester), George North (Ospreys), Liam Williams (Saracens).

troyzer

Webbs wrote: »

Wales' Six Nations squad

Wales: Fowards: Rob Evans (Scarlets), Wyn Jones (Scarlets), Nicky Smith (Ospreys), Elliot Dee (Dragons), Ryan Elias (Scarlets), Ken Owens (Scarlets), Leon Brown (Dragons), Tomas Francis (Exeter Chiefs), Samson Lee (Scarlets), Dillon Lewis (Cardiff Blues), Jake Ball (Scarlets), Adam Beard (Ospreys), Seb Davies (Cardiff Blues),Cory Hill (Dragons), Alun Wyn Jones (Ospreys, capt), Ross Moriarty (Dragons), Josh Navidi (Cardiff Blues), Justin Tipuric (Ospreys),Josh Turnbull (Cardiff Blues), Aaron Wainwright (Dragons), Thomas Young (Wasps).

Backs: Aled Davies (Ospreys), Gareth Davies (Scarlets), Tomos Williams (Cardiff Blues), Gareth Anscombe (Cardiff Blues), Dan Biggar (Northampton), Jarrod Evans (Cardiff Blues), Rhys Patchell (Scarlets), Jonathan Davies (Scarlets), Hadleigh Parkes (Scarlets),Owen Watkin (Ospreys), Scott Williams (Ospreys), Josh Adams (Worcester), Hallam Amos (Dragons), Steffan Evans (Scarlets), Leigh Halfpenny (Scarlets), Jonah Holmes (Leicester), George North (Ospreys), Liam Williams (Saracens).

Halfpenny out then. Really sad.

Buer

Backs: Aled Davies (Ospreys), Gareth Davies (Scarlets), Tomos Williams (Cardiff Blues), Gareth Anscombe (Cardiff Blues), Dan Biggar (Northampton), Jarrod Evans (Cardiff Blues), Rhys Patchell (Scarlets), Jonathan Davies (Scarlets), Hadleigh Parkes (Scarlets),Owen Watkin (Ospreys), Scott Williams (Ospreys), Josh Adams (Worcester), Hallam Amos (Dragons), Steffan Evans (Scarlets), Leigh Halfpenny (Scarlets), Jonah Holmes (Leicester), George North (Ospreys), Liam Williams (Saracens).

Mr Tickle

troyzer wrote: »

Halfpenny out then. Really sad.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uBxMPqxJGqI

Squidgy Black

troyzer wrote: »

Halfpenny out then. Really sad.

He's still there. Will miss the first week.

troyzer

I'm blind.

Burkie1203

Buer wrote: »

Backs: Aled Davies (Ospreys), Gareth Davies (Scarlets), Tomos Williams (Cardiff Blues), Gareth Anscombe (Cardiff Blues), Dan Biggar (Northampton), Jarrod Evans (Cardiff Blues), Rhys Patchell (Scarlets), Jonathan Davies (Scarlets), Hadleigh Parkes (Scarlets),Owen Watkin (Ospreys), Scott Williams (Ospreys), Josh Adams (Worcester), Hallam Amos (Dragons), Steffan Evans (Scarlets), Leigh Halfpenny (Scarlets), Jonah Holmes (Leicester), George North (Ospreys), Liam Williams (Saracens).

RWC year. Even if he might not play in 6n he would be part if their plans for RWC so including him makes sense

sydthebeat

only 5 dragons players, and only one of them a starter (due to falatau injury) and another a possible bencher (hill)

they really are a basket case

errlloyd

sydthebeat wrote: »

only 5 dragons players, and only one of them a starter (due to falatau injury) and another a possible bencher (hill)

they really are a basket case

Are there only 5 Connacht players in the Ireland team? And they don't even have to compete with players abroad?

sydthebeat

errlloyd wrote: »

Are there only 5 Connacht players in the Ireland team? And they don't even have to compete with players abroad?

Yes but no Welsh team is standing out and doing well in their league or Europe, whereas leinster and Munster are among the four best in europe....so connacht players have a higher ceiling to meet.

errlloyd

sydthebeat wrote: »

Yes but no Welsh team is standing out and doing well in their league or Europe, whereas leinster and Munster are among the four best in europe....so connacht players have a higher ceiling to meet.

Yeah but they have 6 non region players in that squad. I mean the Dragons are a basket case, but I don't think their lack of Welsh selection is really related.

England squad for Ireland Test

Forwards
Jack Clifford (Harlequins)
Dan Cole (Leicester Tigers)
Luke Cowan-Dickie (Exeter Chiefs)
Tom Curry (Sale Sharks)
Ben Earl (Saracens) *
Ellis Genge (Leicester Tigers)
Jamie George (Saracens)
Nathan Hughes (Wasps)
Maro Itoje (Saracens)
George Kruis (Saracens)
Joe Launchbury (Wasps)
Courtney Lawes (Northampton Saints)
Ben Moon (Exeter Chiefs)
Brad Shields (Wasps)
Kyle Sinckler (Harlequins)
Jack Singleton (Worcester Warriors) *
Billy Vunipola (Saracens)
Mako Vunipola (Saracens)
Harry Williams (Exeter Chiefs)
Mark Wilson (Newcastle Falcons)

Backs
Chris Ashton (Sale Sharks)
Mike Brown (Harlequins)
Joe Cokanasiga (Bath Rugby)
Elliot Daly (Wasps)
Ollie Devoto (Exeter Chiefs)
Owen Farrell (Saracens) captain
George Ford (Leicester Tigers)
Jonny May (Leicester Tigers)
Jack Nowell (Exeter Chiefs)
Dan Robson (Wasps) *
Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs)
Ben Te’o (Worcester Warriors)
Ollie Thorley (Gloucester Rugby) *
Manu Tuilagi (Leicester Tigers)
Ben Youngs (Leicester Tigers)

*Uncapped

Players unavailable due to injury
Piers Francis (Northampton Saints)
Dylan Hartley (Northampton Saints)
Jonathan Joseph (Bath Rugby)
Chris Robshaw (Harlequins)
Sam Underhill (Bath Rugby)
Anthony Watson (Bath Rugby)

Ashton, Tuilagi and Vunipola could cause problems

troyzer

Deleted User wrote: »

England squad for Ireland Test

Forwards
Jack Clifford (Harlequins)
Dan Cole (Leicester Tigers)
Luke Cowan-Dickie (Exeter Chiefs)
Tom Curry (Sale Sharks)
Ben Earl (Saracens) *
Ellis Genge (Leicester Tigers)
Jamie George (Saracens)
Nathan Hughes (Wasps)
Maro Itoje (Saracens)
George Kruis (Saracens)
Joe Launchbury (Wasps)
Courtney Lawes (Northampton Saints)
Ben Moon (Exeter Chiefs)
Brad Shields (Wasps)
Kyle Sinckler (Harlequins)
Jack Singleton (Worcester Warriors) *
Billy Vunipola (Saracens)
Mako Vunipola (Saracens)
Harry Williams (Exeter Chiefs)
Mark Wilson (Newcastle Falcons)

Backs
Chris Ashton (Sale Sharks)
Mike Brown (Harlequins)
Joe Cokanasiga (Bath Rugby)
Elliot Daly (Wasps)
Ollie Devoto (Exeter Chiefs)
Owen Farrell (Saracens) captain
George Ford (Leicester Tigers)
Jonny May (Leicester Tigers)
Jack Nowell (Exeter Chiefs)
Dan Robson (Wasps) *
Henry Slade (Exeter Chiefs)
Ben Te’o (Worcester Warriors)
Ollie Thorley (Gloucester Rugby) *
Manu Tuilagi (Leicester Tigers)
Ben Youngs (Leicester Tigers)

*Uncapped

Players unavailable due to injury
Piers Francis (Northampton Saints)
Dylan Hartley (Northampton Saints)
Jonathan Joseph (Bath Rugby)
Chris Robshaw (Harlequins)
Sam Underhill (Bath Rugby)
Anthony Watson (Bath Rugby)

Would have loved to see James Haskell back in the mix even if it was never going to happen.

Squidgy Black

Robson over Care is such a weird call. I'll never understand what goes on in Eddie's head.

troyzer

Squidgy Black wrote: »

Robson over Care is such a weird call. I'll never understand what goes on in Eddie's head.

jr86

That's a pretty good squad England have to choose from. In terms of injuries they're not too badly off compared to previous seasons, and obviously the two Vunipolas and Tuilagi being available is massive. I'm sure there'll be plenty of nervous English fans with the rosary beads out watching Sarries (and leicester in Tuilagi's case) this weekend however!

stephen_n

jr86 wrote: »

That's a pretty good squad England have to choose from. In terms of injuries they're not too badly off compared to previous seasons, and obviously the two Vunipolas and Tuilagi being available is massive. I'm sure there'll be plenty of nervous English fans with the rosary beads out watching Sarries (and leicester in Tuilagi's case) this weekend however!

Going on previous occasions they should be more worried about them going into camp with Eddie!

troyzer

stephen_n wrote: »

Going on previous occasions they should be more worried about them going into camp with Eddie!

You have to think some of the leaders in that group had a stern talking with Eddie, especially after their poor summer test showing.

I can't imagine Eddie will pull the same bull**** again.

sydthebeat

teo / tuilagi midfield anyone??

englands weakest link is their coach

Dubinusa

That's a very strong squad. They will be a tough side to play.
Just having Billy V makes them so much better.
Cokansiga looks like a future star. He's a massive big winger.
I think England are on the way back.

Squidgy Black

Squidgy Black wrote: »

Robson over Care is such a weird call. I'll never understand what goes on in Eddie's head.

I watched a good bit of Wasps in the build up to the opening round of Europe. Wasps with Robson are a decent team, Wasps without Robson are disjointed and ineffective. He is a clever hard working player that scores tries and pops up in defence all over the park. I'd absolutely have him in the England squad.

sydthebeat wrote: »

teo / tuilagi midfield anyone??

I hope so. Absolutely no nuance in that midfield and the ball will die in the centres repeatedly. Plenty of bosh and hard to match up against physically but an organised Irish defence would be delighted with such a predictable opposition.

English wingers would never see the ball.

Ford, Farrell Tuilagi is what I'd be worrying about.

aloooof

Deleted User wrote: »

Ford, Farrell Tuilagi is what I'd be worrying about.

Agreed, but thankfully Ford-Farrell 10-12 is very unlikely you'd imagine; Eddie Jones seems to have abandoned that selection entirely.

A Teo/Tuilagi midfield would lead to some very cold and bored wingers

RugbyLover123

Slade has been great for Exeter this season anytime I’ve seen him.

Farrell/Tuilagi/Slade would be interesting to see, if Eddie wants to go for a big 12 option.

Dog Botherer

RugbyLover123 wrote: »

Slade has been great for Exeter this season anytime I’ve seen him.

Farrell/Tuilagi/Slade would be interesting to see, if Eddie wants to go for a big 12 option.

Slade is doing his usual thing of playing extremely well in the run up to the international window, everyone calls for his inclusion, he gets in the starting team, then promptly ****s the bed.