11 yr/old drag kid worshiped within LGBTQ community (Mod warning op)

Joeytheparrot

Joeytheparrot wrote:

Ok. Thats fine but if she continuously for months on end said it and refused to accept your answer and displayed extreme emotional upset and challenging behaviour for months on end, what then?

I would treat it in the same way as if she wouldn't accept that she was a unicorn.

She is 5. She is a girl

Because she thinks something, doesn't make it so.

She is 5. She is a girl.

klaaaz

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Because trousers are not gender associative. Skirts are.
If a boy want to wear a skirt, then he needs help with the source of the problem prompting the desire to wear a skirt, not a free pass to wear one and so compound his problems. It is flagrantly neglectful to let him wear it.

That's a very peculiar how an item of clothing on a person offends you.

Boys have been wearing skirts aka kilts for generations in Irish dancing and marching on Paddy's Day and none of the boys turned out to have "gender issues" despite the wearing of kilts going against the "gender norms".

gw80

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Yeah, when you start to see this sort of craic you nearly think there might be some truth to the Church's take on sexual morality..

No, the church or any religion should not have any say on people's sexuality, definitly not.
They are already obsessed with sex and death as is.
Society, yes.

Timberrrrrrrr

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Because trousers are not gender associative. Skirts are.
If a boy want to wear a skirt, then he needs help with the source of the problem prompting the desire to wear a skirt, not a free pass to wear one and so compound his problems. It is flagrantly neglectful to let him wear it.

Tell it to these men





You wouldn't blink an eye if you seen these. It's amazing how upset some if you get at the thoughts of anyone not conforming to your personal idea of what is normal.

How many of you have piercings? Tattoos? Dyed hair? Many of these things would have been "abnormal" decades ago yet all these things are now accepted as "societal norms".

Times change, maybe some of you need to do the same?

klaaaz

klaaaz wrote:

What age of a child is suitable for you to tolerate that child showing their individuality?

That depends.

At what age should a child be able to decide they want to have body modification surgery? At what age should a child be able to decide they don't need schooling?

I never said a child shouldn't be able to be an individual. I said they shouldn't be making life defining decisions when they are children.

If your child is even contemplating such things at an early age, I would argue that you have failed as a parent.

The Rape of Lucretia

klaaaz wrote: »

That's a very peculiar how an item of clothing on a person offends you.

How do you make out it offends me ? (Maybe you were replying to another poster )?

mad muffin

I’m increasingly convinced that this is an alien experiment.

klaaaz

Deleted User wrote: »

That depends.

At what age should a child be able to decide they want to have body modification surgery? At what age should a child be able to decide they don't need schooling?

I never said a child shouldn't be able to be an individual. I said they shouldn't be making life defining decisions when they are children.

If your child is even contemplating such things at an early age, I would argue that you have failed as a parent.

Trying to deflect you are, we're talking about an item of clothing not surgery!! The law dictates that a child attends school, there is no law about fashion!

Quite amazing how wearing an item of clothing is a "life defining decision" for the sensitive offended objectors, thankfully we live in a democracy but unfortunately the fashion police are still dictating what a person can and cannot wear.

Timberrrrrrrr

Timberrrrrrrr wrote:

Tell it to these men

Timberrrrrrrr wrote:

You wouldn't blink an eye if you seen these. It's amazing how upset some if you get at the thoughts of anyone not conforming to your personal idea of what is normal.

If I saw a Maori in full traditional dress I most certainly would blink an eye. It would be quite unusual.

Kilts, not so much. If it wasn't for a wedding and they were just wearing it to the pub on a random Wednesday I may find it strange. Same as if I saw a girl wearing a wedding dress in McDonald's. Or someone who identifies as a clown dressing as one at a funeral.

I would find it bizarre. Sure they can choose to wear what they want, but I will find it bizarre and inappropriate

klaaaz

klaaaz wrote:

Trying to deflect you are, we're talking about an item of clothing not surgery!! The law dictates that a child attends school, there is no law about fashion!

Ok Yoda. No deflection intended. I was pointing out that children shouldn't be left to make up their own rules.

klaaaz wrote:

Quite amazing how wearing an item of clothing is a "life defining decision" for the sensitive offended objectors, thankfully we live in a democracy but unfortunately the fashion police are still dictating what a person can and cannot wear.

You know it's not about fashion. It's about boys wearing girls clothes and girls wearing boys clothes.

Perhaps I will frame it in a way you will understand.

Are you against cultural appropriation?

Brian?

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I would treat it in the same way as if she wouldn't accept that she was a unicorn.

She is 5. She is a girl

Because she thinks something, doesn't make it so.

She is 5. She is a girl.

What about if she still says it when she’s 6

Or 7,8,9,10,11,12.....18

When do you decide to listen?

Brian?

Brian? wrote:

What about if she still says it when she’s 6

Brian? wrote:

Or 7,8,9,10,11,12.....18

Brian? wrote:

When do you decide to listen?

When would you accept she was a unicorn?

klaaaz

Deleted User wrote: »

Ok Yoda. No deflection intended. I was pointing out that children shouldn't be left to make up their own rules.

On fashion according to you.

Deleted User wrote:

You know it's not about fashion. It's about boys wearing girls clothes and girls wearing boys clothes.

Perhaps I will frame it in a way you will understand.

Are you against cultural appropriation?

No, what's culture got to do with what we wear in Ireland? We do dress westernised yes.
It is about fashion, you've just gendered clothes into boys and girls sections!

Girls can wear boys clothes like trousers and even a tie with nothing said by the objectors yet a boy cannot wear a piece of clothing outside the "gender norms". Girls never became transgender when they started to wear trousers!

klaaaz

klaaaz wrote:

Girls can wear boys clothes like trousers and even a tie with nothing said by the objectors yet a boy cannot wear a piece of clothing outside the "gender norms". Girls never became transgender when they started to wear trousers!

They sure can. Boys can wear dresses too. There are no laws around it. My dog can wear a burka, my mam can wear a vampire costume, my uncle could wear a burlesque outfit. They may get alienated and bullied for it but that's their choice.

Anyway, I still think it's inappropriate for an adult drag troupe to read to kids.

klaaaz

klaaaz wrote:

On fashion according to you.

On anything.

Brian?

[Deleted User] wrote: »

When would you accept she was a unicorn?

False equivalency. Gender dysphoria is a very real issue. Mythical creature dysphoria isn’t.

Are you telling me if your daughter was transgender you would never accept it? Or what are you actually saying?

Brian?

Brian? wrote:

Are you telling me if your daughter was transgender you would never accept it? Or what are you actually saying?

I would never accept that she is a male. It's factually incorrect. If she chose to live her life as a man, I would support her in any way I could. That doesn't mean lying to her.

If my daughter was anorexic, I don't think it would be healthy to capitulate and agree with her that she could lose a few pounds just because it's her reality.

Brian?

Brian? wrote: »

What about if she still says it when she’s 6

Or 7,8,9,10,11,12.....18

When do you decide to listen?

A year or two after puberty.

Zorya

Sigh. All this crap about clothes. That is not the problem.

One of my boys regularly wore dresses until he was about 4 or so, and all my kids, male and female, had very long hair until almost adolescents. Not once, never, did I suggest to the boys that they might be girls, simply because it literally NEVER crossed my mind. They were children. Full stop.

The utter irony now is the slavish squareness of progressive parents who would see in a Childs choice of clothes, activities or general expression that they might be the opposite sex.

Because such people label behaviour, clothing etc as gendered which is the epitome of backwardness. And yet they imagine they are being modern. Young children have largely worn tunics and long hair through history and tribes still do. But the wise well balanced people of yore did not pollute their children's minds with gender or sexual ideology.

People have moved so far from sense and nature. It's depressing. I'm done arguing about it, deal with the damage ye are sowing.

Just leave kids alone, regarding gender, sexuality, drag, gay pride. Just effing leave them alone.

BattleCorp

Brian? wrote: »

What about if she still says it when she’s 6

Or 7,8,9,10,11,12.....18

When do you decide to listen?

A friend's daughter said she wanted to be a boy when she was about five. She insisted on it. Wanted to wear boys clothes, wanted to be called him etc. Her mother met her halfway and allowed her to wear boys clothes etc. but she didn't give in to the 'she's a boy' idea. She insisted that her daughter is a girl but is free to do boys things if she wanted.

This went on for about four or five years and guess what, the girl has totally grown out of wanting to be a boy. She's still tomboyish at times but she's sure she wants to be a girl.

We think that she wanted to be a boy because her older brother was a boy and he was allowed to do things that she wasn't allowed to do. He was only allowed to do them because he was older but I suppose a 5 year old mightn't have had the mental capacity to understand that.

Anyway, my friend didn't give in and her daughter is now happy being her daughter and all ideas of being a boy have gone out the window.

Five year olds shouldn't be making life-defining decisions.

shutup

@Brian
Genuine question. What would you do if your 5 year old daughter said her dolls were talking to her. And she kept saying it at 6,7,8, ....16,17,18.

Beechwoodspark

I’m beginning to wonder do people realise young children don’t have the mental capacity to make these life changing decisions?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

shutup wrote: »

@Brian
Genuine question. What would you do if your 5 year old daughter said her dolls were talking to her. And she kept saying it at 6,7,8, ....16,17,18.

IN what way is wanting to be the opposite gender on a par with hearing voices in your head, or am I misunderstanding your point?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

I’m beginning to wonder do people realise young children don’t have the mental capacity to make these life changing decisions?

Boys wearing dresses at five or girls wantimg to play football is hardly a "life-changing decision".

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote:

IN what way is wanting to be the opposite gender on a par with hearing voices in your head, or am I misunderstanding your point?

Because neither of them are reality.

Spon Farmer

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

I’m beginning to wonder do people realise young children don’t have the mental capacity to make these life changing decisions?

Most adults don't either.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote:

Boys wearing dresses at five or girls wantimg to play football is hardly a "life-changing decision".

Nobody ever said that it was.

Dave0301

Brian? wrote: »

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I would treat it in the same way as if she wouldn't accept that she was a unicorn.

She is 5. She is a girl

Because she thinks something, doesn't make it so.

She is 5. She is a girl.

What about if she still says it when she’s 6

Or 7,8,9,10,11,12.....18

When do you decide to listen?

The crux of this whole thing is where to draw that line.

If you extrapolate gender identity to other issues a similar logic should be applied.

A 9 year old wants to engage in sexual activity? That is a no, and for very good reasons.

A 9 year old wants to get a permanent tattoo? That's a no.

A 9 year old feels that they are the wrong gender and wants to transition? Surgery? Hormones? That's a no.

Supportive parenting and discussions, as well as including CAMHS? That would be a good idea.

Blindingly accepting the child's wishes on the issue or other issues that can negatively impact on their wellbeing? Bad idea.

klaaaz

Deleted User wrote: »

They sure can. Boys can wear dresses too. There are no laws around it. My dog can wear a burka, my mam can wear a vampire costume, my uncle could wear a burlesque outfit. They may get alienated and bullied for it but that's their choice.

Anyway, I still think it's inappropriate for an adult drag troupe to read to kids.

There you go equating a boy wearing a dress to a costume, belittling the child. There should be no bullying at all for a boy on what he chooses to wear just like no-one bats an eyelid at what a girl chooses to wear.

Zorya wrote: »

Sigh. All this crap about clothes. That is not the problem.

It is a significant part of the problem. Tell your post thankers who object to a boy wearing an item of clothing outside the "gender norm" to stop genderising clothes and the world be a better place free from bullies.

BattleCorp wrote: »

Five year olds shouldn't be making life-defining decisions.

How is a child aged five making a life defining decision by wearing a particular item of clothing? It never affected Zorya's kids for example so you'll have to explain that one.

Brian?

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I would never accept that she is a male. It's factually incorrect. If she chose to live her life as a man, I would support her in any way I could. That doesn't mean lying to her.

If my daughter was anorexic, I don't think it would be healthy to capitulate and agree with her that she could lose a few pounds just because it's her reality.

You’re on a roll with the false equivalency. Supporting her any way you could means accepting her, that’s not lying to her that’s showing compassion.