No vision for a rapidly changing Ireland

Tell me how

conorhal wrote: »

I remember the front page of the papers with a picture of a sole car puttering down the M50 the day it opened, declaring it a 'white elephant'. Yeah, that actually happened.
That gobsheen economist Colm McCarthy who was full of advice during the bust also has his doubts about the METRO, but he is also the economist that called the DART a waste of money when it opened, so there is that.

I'm a big fan of the Chinese proverb that states, 'the best time to plant a tree is 20yrs ago, the second best time to plant a tree is today.'

The metro would be beneficial. No doubt. And, given the population it is not to say that it is not needed.

But, I would rather see that money going in to facilitating developing other locations in the country. Galway, Cork Limerick etc as mentioned elsewhere.

I feel that would be a better way to consider that national strategy as it is intended (which is what a government should do is it not?). If it goes ahead, Dublin will have the most extensive public bus service, and what would be then 3 separate rail networks to serve the city. While no other metropolitan area has anything other than a rudimentary bus service.

As it stands, the populations of our cities as a % of our national population are as a follows.

Ireland = 4,784,000 (100%)
Cork = 190,384 (3.98%)
Dublin = 1,308,027 (27.34%)
Limerick = 90,054 (1.88%)
Galway = 70,686 (1.48%)
Waterford = 47,904 (1%)

This disparate accumulation of the population in one area of the country should never have gotten this bad. And our focus is not best meeting the needs of the country.
A second runway at Dublin while Shannon and Cork are under utilised for what they could serve is one example of not best using our available resources because the focus is too narrow.

Consider another Chinese proverb, "A bad beginning makes a bad ending."

snotboogie

Tell me how wrote: »

The metro would be beneficial. No doubt. And, given the population it is not to say that it is not needed.

But, I would rather see that money going in to facilitating developing other locations in the country. Galway, Cork Limerick etc as mentioned elsewhere.

I feel that would be a better way to consider that national strategy as it is intended (which is what a government should do is it not?). If it goes ahead, Dublin will have the most extensive public bus service, and what would be then 3 separate rail networks to serve the city. While no other metropolitan area has anything other than a rudimentary bus service.

As it stands, the populations of our cities as a % of our national population are as a follows.

Ireland = 4,784,000 (100%)
Cork = 190,384 (3.98%)
Dublin = 1,308,027 (27.34%)
Limerick = 90,054 (1.88%)
Galway = 70,686 (1.48%)
Waterford = 47,904 (1%)

This disparate accumulation of the population in one area of the country should never have gotten this bad. And our focus is not best meeting the needs of the country.
A second runway at Dublin while Shannon and Cork are under utilised for what they could serve is one example of not best using our available resources because the focus is too narrow.

Consider another Chinese proverb, "A bad beginning makes a bad ending."

Cork is about 210k, Limerick is 95k, Galway is 80k and Dublin is about 1.1 million according to the 2016 census: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_urban_areas_in_the_Republic_of_Ireland_by_population you aren’t majorly wrong but you have slightly overstated Dublin’s population and understated the other cities

Tell me how

snotboogie wrote: »

Cork is about 210k, Limerick is 95k, Galway is 80k and Dublin is about 1.1 million according to the 2016 census: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_urban_areas_in_the_Republic_of_Ireland_by_population you aren’t majorly wrong but you have slightly overstated Dublin’s population and understated the other cities

I went with figures from following location

Irish cities

And crudely added Swords, Dun laoghaire and Tallaght to Dublins figure.

snotboogie

Tell me how wrote: »

I went with figures from following location

Irish cities

And crudely added Swords, Dun laoghaire and Tallaght to Dublins figure.

The wiki figures are taken directly from the CSO website 2016 census

Tell me how

snotboogie wrote: »

The wiki figures are taken directly from the CSO website 2016 census

Ok...

I don't think the figures I used are so far out to invalidate the point.

jackofalltrades

Tell me how wrote: »

The metro would be beneficial. No doubt. And, given the population it is not to say that it is not needed.

But, I would rather see that money going in to facilitating developing other locations in the country. Galway, Cork Limerick etc as mentioned elsewhere.

I feel that would be a better way to consider that national strategy as it is intended (which is what a government should do is it not?). If it goes ahead, Dublin will have the most extensive public bus service, and what would be then 3 separate rail networks to serve the city. While no other metropolitan area has anything other than a rudimentary bus service.

There are already plans for major infrastructural spending in the cities that you mentioned.
I don't think it's asking too much for a rail link between Dublin Airport and the city centre.
That and the Green line needs an upgrade or it will have major capacity issues in the future.
Can you find a scheme somewhere else in the country that would deliver the same cost benefit ratio?

A second runway at Dublin while Shannon and Cork are under utilised for what they could serve is one example of not best using our available resources because the focus is too narrow.

And how do you want to address this?
Airlines are free to set up routes where they want.
Long gone are the days of the Shannon stopover style of government interference.

smurgen

jackofalltrades wrote: »

Tell me how wrote: »

The metro would be beneficial. No doubt. And, given the population it is not to say that it is not needed.

But, I would rather see that money going in to facilitating developing other locations in the country. Galway, Cork Limerick etc as mentioned elsewhere.

I feel that would be a better way to consider that national strategy as it is intended (which is what a government should do is it not?). If it goes ahead, Dublin will have the most extensive public bus service, and what would be then 3 separate rail networks to serve the city. While no other metropolitan area has anything other than a rudimentary bus service.

There are already plans for major infrastructural spending in the cities that you mentioned.
I don't think it's asking too much for a rail link between Dublin Airport and the city centre.
That and the Green line needs an upgrade or it will have major capacity issues in the future.
Can you find a scheme somewhere else in the country that would deliver the same cost benefit ratio?

A second runway at Dublin while Shannon and Cork are under utilised for what they could serve is one example of not best using our available resources because the focus is too narrow.

And how do you want to address this?
Airlines are free to set up routes where they want.
Long gone are the days of the Shannon stopover style of government interference.

Get the DAA out of running Cork for a start.

lisasimpson

Young people are always going to be attracted to cities for college life a better social life etc. Generally people move back down the country in their 30s and 40s when they have young families and thats not going to change.

Unfortunately the following would help parts of rural but in reality will never happen.
1. Develop and upgrade rail services into our regional cities. At the moment their is a proposal to convert the old midleton to youghal railline to a greenway instead of reopening it as an extention of the rail services for communting. This is the exact line that would serve not only cork city centre where there is loads of office development taking place within a stones throw of kent station and serves Little Island where traffic congestion is a big issue at rush hrs
Same can be said for the limerick to ballybrophy line. At times you would be quicker walking than using that train. If that rail line was anyway half decent (with a stop near the back Thomand Park that would serve the students and staff of LIT) for comuting towns and villages like Roscrea Nenagh cloughjordan would all benfit from it. Similar examination of services at cork and shannon airports .shannon is way underperforming considering its hinterland

2 Speaking from experience in my own local home town, a town where the population declined according to the last 2 census, some towns only have themselves partly to blame. Last year I rang a garage in the town I grew up in to book the car in for new tyres and tracking done some saturday. They didnt open the workshop on a saturday. Now this is a small struggling town many people commute 5 days a week to either limerick or kilkenny some even train it to dublin both for work and college. Unless you took a day off you couldnt get the car serviced or tyres done. Massive opportunity missed their even if they opened for a half day. In a lot of communter towns many business like beauticans hairdresser etc wont open late say till 7 on a thurs or friday to faciliate communter who works 9 to 5/5.30. Come to think of it my denstist in a nearby larger town doesnt do saturdays either. Such business should look at their operating hours maybe close earlier or open later on a mon or tues and use these hours to open when their are more potential customers locally.The local physio does it so more should try it esp the likes beauticans in the summer and in the run up to christmas.

3. Im not calling for another big wave of decentralisation but as society changes the needs of the country evolve and so does the role of the civil services. There is a significant number of civil servants on the redeployment list esp for a move out of dublin. As it stands the dept of education has a significant presence in athlone between thurles and templemore a number of dept of justice function. As these departments evolve more roles could be based outside of dublin. Im sure the same could be said for the dept of social welfare in Sligo and may moreWith the role of technology no need for everything to be happening in dublin. Just look at our multinationals a lot opperate and co work with other locations around the world via the use of video and conferance calling. Surely we could manage it within the country. Plus this would help manage wage demands for the state as these areas have lower cost of living etc

4. No brainer but broadband. No before people jump down my throat i not just referring to one off housing. Even witin many rural towns and villages here the broadband is v poor. The way we work has changed dramaticlly in the last 10 15 years with the increase of remote working and work from home and its an area that will continue to grow. It does take maturity on the employees part that work from home is an effective way to work. But increasingly many companies in the tech and financial services industries allow employees to do it. This model of work should be of rural ireland advantage. When you work from home you may pop down to your local shop or cafe on your lunch for your break and then your not communting for 1 or 2 hrs each way so you get that time bacl to spend with your family, spend in your local gym sports club or getting involved in a local community group.

Tell me how

Big news yesterday that the bill to allow for the expansion of Cork city boundaries has passed and will go to the president to be signed.



Link

With this expansion the population of the city will grow by 85,000 to 210,000 in June 2019. However, the city is expected to further grow over the next two decades to circa 350,000.

The result of this larger City Council administrative area, with responsibility for the city, its immediate suburbs and adjoining settlements, will allow the City Council take a lead role in driving the growth of the city and metropolitan region.

The boundary extension will provide scope for improvements in the capacity of the city to maintain, improve and expand services. The expanded City Council can better identify and respond to the differing strategic needs and priorities of the urban and wider metropolitan areas, including areas that form part of the natural hinterland of Cork city.

I think this is a great opportunity put together a long term development in terms of transport, industry, housing and entertainment to ensure that it develops in a sensible manner rather than loads of house first, then try to fit roads and amenities in and that industry locations are identified upfront and allocated for such.