Liverpool FC Team Talk, Gossip, Rumours 2019

Agent Coulson

Mane did indeed come second again.

ERG89

Agent Coulson wrote: »

Edit: Keita, Mane & Salah named in the African team of the year.

Pretty odd team, kinda shows all African teams flopped in the World Cup.

https://twitter.com/CAF_Online/status/1082736544287469569

Osmosis Jones

Agent Coulson wrote: »

Mane did indeed come second again.

Strange one, Koulibaly beat him to Senegal POTY

ElTel

Sofa Spud wrote: »

Get the sentiment, but leave him where is, getting the full 90 nearly every game, scoring worldies and heading into a promotion battle, with all the pressure and experience that brings and then see if he can fight for a squad place next year. No point bringing him back when he's peaking to likely play with the u23's or maybe keep a bench warm. Will he be good enough to break into the first team or a regular place? Best to let him develop in the fire of a promotion battle and if it doesn't work with us, his value will increase after being in the shop window...

It's gas, even I'm starting to think this way. We're now a business and we have assets with resale value. :eek:
I'd be tempted to recall him and would not have let Clyne go.

Harry Palmr

Mirror report that Rafa Camacho has joined Sporting for 18 months, some earlier reports seemed to suggest his would join them permanently in 2020 but it seems this is not the case. Worth pointing out that Sporting games are shown regularly on Freesports which is FTA so we'll have to keep an eye out.

noodler

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Do peiple realise Keita hadnt played more than 3 games in a row as he done nothing to justify starting more games ,
If he was showing enough in training and games hed be starting

Someone said judge him after a dozen games in a row are they for real !!!! You cant play somone every week at a top club in the hop that after 11 games he comes good , its not some Sunday leauge team you preform when called upon amd if u don't that call won't come often

He has time on his side but so far he doesnt deserve to be starting its that simple reallt

I'm not sure if you are doing this on purpose, but Klopp has chosen the workhorse three over any other options, including Shaq and Fabinho, many times this season. Its not just Keita.

And injury has contributed to his lack of a run.

I dunno were you this dismissive of Shaq or Fabinho two months ago?

Or. Crouch his first six months?

Or Robertson's first six months?

You surely didn't subscribe to the "Klopp ain't playing them so they are ****" points you are now making?

The idea that players at top clubs don't get performances to come good is simply untrue.

Agent Coulson

https://twitter.com/jamespearceecho/status/1082749929225928710?s=21

5starpool

. I'm sure most are aware, but the game at Brighton is the 3pn sky Ireland game on Saturday.

citytillidie

I seen the echo are also running a story on how other fans are calling Wolves and Man City fans living in the past with there sign on and feed the scouters chants

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/news/liverpool-news/sign-on-feed-scousers-chants-15644719

Riesen_Meal

https://mobile.twitter.com/OussamaOmais/status/1082742501512019969

Salah and Mane having the craic at that AFON show...

Mo looks scared...

ERG89

citytillidie wrote:

I seen the echo are also running a story on how other fans are calling Wolves and Man City fans living in the past with there sign on and feed the scouters chants

Nothing will beat the stupidity of Watford fans chanting "your going to work in the morning" at I assumed the Woking players last Sunday. That'll stay with me for quite a while. :rolleyes:

BorneTobyWilde

Agent Coulson wrote: »

https://twitter.com/jamespearceecho/status/1082749929225928710?s=21

gimli2112

AB on why he chose Liverpool.


"Chelsea were changing their manager and not playing in the Champions League. I’ve also always admired Liverpool’s history.
“This is a club with five European Cups in their trophy cabinet. I really wanted to be part of that history."
“I came very close to winning the competition with Roma and I’m working hard to make it happen now with Liverpool.
“What’s life if not fighting for your dreams? I dream of winning the Champions League.”


No mention of the FA Cup Finals or our record 8 League Cup wins.

rob316

Agent Coulson wrote: »

https://twitter.com/jamespearceecho/status/1082749929225928710?s=21

Flopp the trophy dodger

davyboy1975

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Mirror report that Rafa Camacho has joined Sporting for 18 months, some earlier reports seemed to suggest his would join them permanently in 2020 but it seems this is not the case. Worth pointing out that Sporting games are shown regularly on Freesports which is FTA so we'll have to keep an eye out.

He is out of contract at the end of the loan deal, unless we give him a new contract if he develops out there then its the last we will see of him in a red shirt

citytillidie

Seeing Spurs fans complain about their Xmas schedule to Liverpool this season, teams will be screwed over i remember Liverpool having to play 2 games in less than 48 hours not so long ago over the Xmas schedule

Dcully

5starpool wrote: »

. I'm sure most are aware, but the game at Brighton is the 3pn sky Ireland game on Saturday.

Is that Sky one or is there an actual sky ireland channel?

Vicxas

citytillidie wrote: »

Seeing Spurs fans complain about their Xmas schedule to Liverpool this season, teams will be screwed over i remember Liverpool having to play 2 games in less than 48 hours not so long ago over the Xmas schedule

Wasnt that Sunderland and City?

citytillidie

Yep City 5:30pm New Years Eve and Sunderland 3pm on Jan 2nd, while also playing on the 27th and not Stephens Day

yourdeadwright

noodler wrote: »

I'm not sure if you are doing this on purpose, but Klopp has chosen the workhorse three over any other options, including Shaq and Fabinho, many times this season. Its not just Keita.

And injury has contributed to his lack of a run.

I dunno were you this dismissive of Shaq or Fabinho two months ago?

Or. Crouch his first six months?

Or Robertson's first six months?

You surely didn't subscribe to the "Klopp ain't playing them so they are ****" points you are now making?

The idea that players at top clubs don't get performances to come good is simply untrue.

Not at all as 2 months is a bedding in period its January now so its more of a worry with Keita,

Crouch was poor for his first six month's what is wrong with syaing what was true ?

Robertson proved everyone wrong which was fantastic, but doesn't mean everyone will turn out like he did ,

Keita has been very poor for his high standard's I don't get why its so bad to say what true ?

I hope he turns it around and I hope he is a superstar i'm a fan I want the guy to be amazing ,but at the same time i'm going to call it as it currently is ,

So far he has been a huge disappointment no way around that ,

citytillidie

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Not at all as 2 months is a bedding in period its January now so its more of a worry with Keita,

Crouch was poor for his first six month's what is wrong with syaing what was true ?

Robertson proved everyone wrong which was fantastic, but doesn't mean everyone will turn out like he did ,

Keita has been very poor for his high standard's I don't get why its so bad to say what true ?

I hope he turns it around and I hope he is a superstar i'm a fan I want the guy to be amazing ,but at the same time i'm going to call it as it currently is ,

So far he has been a huge disappointment no way around that ,

How many other top players have been bad in their 1st season in England to come good once they were used to the speed of the game in the PL

MD1990

Keita has not been that bad at all.

Looks very good technically. He will hot form soon.

gimli2112

citytillidie wrote: »

How many other top players have been bad in their 1st season in England to come good once they were used to the speed of the game in the PL

I remember being unimpressed by Suarez early on, fortunately I said nothing

garra

citytillidie wrote: »

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Not at all as 2 months is a bedding in period its January now so its more of a worry with Keita,

Crouch was poor for his first six month's what is wrong with syaing what was true ?

Robertson proved everyone wrong which was fantastic, but doesn't mean everyone will turn out like he did ,

Keita has been very poor for his high standard's I don't get why its so bad to say what true ?

I hope he turns it around and I hope he is a superstar i'm a fan I want the guy to be amazing ,but at the same time i'm going to call it as it currently is ,

So far he has been a huge disappointment no way around that ,

How many other top players have been bad in their 1st season in England to come good once they were used to the speed of the game in the PL

Chelsea signed Jorginho, similar age and money, plays well from day one.

City signed Bernardo Silva, same story.

Arsenal signed Torreira, now I'm starting to feel scarlet for you.

Hope and pray he Keita comes good soon, we need his energy. it's worrying to hear he is struggling to even learn English and only talks to Mane in the squad.

Yourdead is fairly calling out what he sees in front of him, there's not enough of that in this echo chamber at times

SlickRic

MD1990 wrote: »

Keita has not been that bad at all.

Looks very good technically. He will hot form soon.

yup, he's been very 'safe' shall we say?

i'm not going to lie. i've been disappointed, but i know there have been mitigating circumstances. the flashes at the start of the season can't have been an accident. he will come good. the problem is that with the lack of Ox, we really, really need him to step up soon.

i still think, in an ideal world, our best midfield 3 is Fab, Gini and Keita. that is the dream; with Ox rotating with Keita, Milner with Gini, and Henderson with Fab.

even against Wolves, there a couple of times he did put the afterburners on and drive into the Wolves midfield and defence and you saw how good he could be. something just needs to click; whether it's a purely fitness thing, or whether it's in his head.

sweetie

garra wrote: »

Chelsea signed Jorginho, similar age and money, plays well from day one.

City signed Bernardo Silva, same story.

Arsenal signed Torreira, now I'm starting to feel scarlet for you.

Hope and pray he Keita comes good soon, we need his energy. it's worrying to hear he is struggling to even learn English and only talks to Mane in the squad.

Yourdead is fairly calling out what he sees in front of him, there's not enough of that in this echo chamber at times

Torreira and Jorgingo have disimproved after admittedly very good starts.
Bernardo Silva only started about half city's league games last year IIRC but was good,
he's on another level this season.

yourdeadwright

citytillidie wrote: »

How many other top players have been bad in their 1st season in England to come good once they were used to the speed of the game in the PL

I don't get this mentality

If he comes good then great , I'm a Liverpool fan I hope he rips the Prem up i'd be delighted ,

but "SO FAR " he has been poor and not lived up to the hype, I'm not saying anything that isn't true, Can he come good in the future YES but no lets pretend he hasn't been a let down so far , more so because he was suppose to be so so good ,

citytillidie

garra wrote: »

Chelsea signed Jorginho, similar age and money, plays well from day one.

City signed Bernardo Silva, same story.

Arsenal signed Torreira, now I'm starting to feel scarlet for you.

Hope and pray he Keita comes good soon, we need his energy. it's worrying to hear he is struggling to even learn English and only talks to Mane in the squad.

Yourdead is fairly calling out what he sees in front of him, there's not enough of that in this echo chamber at times

Some players adopt right away others take time, you are not going to get every player hit it off right away. While we would like it you just have to give people some time to settle and get used to a new manager, team and league

yourdeadwright

garra wrote: »

Chelsea signed Jorginho, similar age and money, plays well from day one.

City signed Bernardo Silva, same story.

Arsenal signed Torreira, now I'm starting to feel scarlet for you.

Hope and pray he Keita comes good soon, we need his energy. it's worrying to hear he is struggling to even learn English and only talks to Mane in the squad.

Yourdead is fairly calling out what he sees in front of him, there's not enough of that in this echo chamber at times

Correct we can only judge a player on what he has produced so far for the club we can not judge a player on what hey may possible do in the future ,

Just cause he plays for us doesn't mean you don't call it as you see it,I judge players at all clubs with the same outlook ,

He's our version of Fred at Old Trafford signed for big money and failed to live up to the hype so far ,

yourdeadwright

citytillidie wrote: »

Some players adopt right away others take time, you are not going to get every player hit it off right away. While we would like it you just have to give people some time to settle and get used to a new manager, team and league

I think everyone knows this and agree's with you but its ok to say far he has been a disappointment SO FAR

Luckycharms_74

Regarding Keita, I'm hoping that he comes good and next season hits the ground running.
By all accounts LFC was shocked, to say the least at his lack of English, especially he had nearly a year before he came to England to learn (which is not good).

You could also say its 18 months of poor form for him since the deal was struck with Leipzig. As I said I hope he comes good but some players just don't settle and if he doesn't do the business he should be moved on

gimli2112

gimli2112 wrote: »

AB on why he chose Liverpool.
..............

Who is AB?

davyboy1975

Augeo wrote: »

Who is AB?

Allison becker

Boom_Bap

sweetie wrote: »

Torreira and Jorgingo have disimproved after admittedly very good starts.
Bernardo Silva only started about half city's league games last year IIRC but was good,
he's on another level this season.

Torreira and Jorgino were dropped into teams in the same position that play the same or similar systems at the same pace.

It took Bernardo Silva a year to settle at City, it's only this season where he is flourishing.


Keita has been asked to do alot more positional-wise with us.
Fab has been dropped into a team where he needs to adapt to the pace of the team. In his first game for us, he had a really sloppy first 20 minutes, from then on you can see how he is adapting and progressing.


Whereas if you compare to someone like Fred with apparently bags of potential, he has been lost at Utd and can' even complete a pass.
I'm sure given time he will come good, but he will be much slower at progressing than the LFC lads or Torreira or Jorgino.

Agent Coulson

Torreira and Jorgino's levels have dropped off dramatically from the first ten games of the season once teams worked out to play against them.


Where as Fabinho is growing into his role and I expect Ketia to do the same and it's not like Keita has actually been bad.

yourdeadwright

Boom_Bap wrote: »

Torreira and Jorgino were dropped into teams in the same position that play the same or similar systems at the same pace.

It took Bernardo Silva a year to settle at City, it's only this season where he is flourishing.


Keita has been asked to do alot more positional-wise with us.
Fab has been dropped into a team where he needs to adapt to the pace of the team. In his first game for us, he had a really sloppy first 20 minutes, from then on you can see how he is adapting and progressing.


Whereas if you compare to someone like Fred with apparently bags of potential, he has been lost at Utd and can' even complete a pass.
I'm sure given time he will come good, but he will be much slower at progressing than the LFC lads or Torreira or Jorgino.

Just because he's a United player doesn't make him any different to Keita ,both have been let downs,

You said Fred can't pass yet Keita had two simple passes v Wolves to set up chances one to Salah he totally messed up and one to Moreno which he waited far to long and Moreno went offside,

Vicxas

Keita was more a free roamer at RB wasnt he? I think with the added responsibility he's been given it'll take time to settle in.

As Boom_Bap said it took Silva ages to settle at City and now look at him.

x43r0

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Correct we can only judge a player on what he has produced so far for the club

I would argue that given the limited game time and injuries he's had that it's not fair to judge him at all at this stage good or bad

Making judgements on anything without a reasonable sample size is foolish in my experience

Boom_Bap

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Just because he's a United player doesn't make him any different to Keita ,both have been let downs,

You said Fred can't pass yet Keita had two simple passes v Wolves to set up chances one to Salah he totally messed up and one to Moreno which he waited far to long and Moreno went offside,

This is not a diss of Utd by the way.
Keita has had many many great passes so far for us. He's received the ball and driven with it and made offensive passing. He's got back, nicked the ball as well and has been asked to overhaul his positioning and tempo in a game. He just hasn't been consistently in the team, had spasm injuries and is still adapting.



Fred hasn't been able to control a ball, pass it or pick up and looked lost on the pitch. He's had some flashes of why he was signed, but nowhere near where he should be.
If Keita was asked to play his 'normal' position for us, he would be great, but he's not been asked to do that. 2 awry passes in a game would not write him off for me. As opposed to Fred who can't complete a 2 yard sideways pass (again I think he will come good with time).


So going back to the earlier comparisons of new mids this season, Jorgino and Torreira have somewhat plateaued, Keita is on the rise and Fred is on a much slower rise.


Given the ammunition we have in mid, I'm happy with his progression and would be better judged with 2 or 3 games on the trot.

SM01

"THE NABY KEÏTA CONUNDRUM: WHY LIVERPOOL ARE YET TO SEE THE BEST OF THE ALL-ACTION GUINEAN"


Excuse the caps. I copied the headline from the article. Sam McGuire is a decent writer and here's his take on Naby:

https://www.internationalchampionscup.com/en/articles/the-naby-keita-conundrum

yourdeadwright

x43r0 wrote: »

I would argue that given the limited game time and injuries he's had that it's not fair to judge him at all at this stage good or bad

Making judgements on anything without a reasonable sample size is foolish in my experience

He has had one injury which had him out for 19days and miss 4 games,
Played in 17 games and did very well in Spurs & Burnley away and Westham at home .,

Can he get better Yes,
Has he been a let down so far Yes,

Making judgements on what you have seen is not foolish how do you make that out ? Infact its making an informed judgement,

No one is saying he is written off and should be sold , People are simply saying so far he has been a let down nothing wrong with that,

yourdeadwright

Boom_Bap wrote: »

This is not a diss of Utd by the way.
Keita has had many many great passes so far for us. He's received the ball and driven with it and made offensive passing. He's got back, nicked the ball as well and has been asked to overhaul his positioning and tempo in a game. He just hasn't been consistently in the team, had spasm injuries and is still adapting.



Fred hasn't been able to control a ball, pass it or pick up and looked lost on the pitch. He's had some flashes of why he was signed, but nowhere near where he should be.
If Keita was asked to play his 'normal' position for us, he would be great, but he's not been asked to do that. 2 awry passes in a game would not write him off for me. As opposed to Fred who can't complete a 2 yard sideways pass (again I think he will come good with time).


So going back to the earlier comparisons of new mids this season, Jorgino and Torreira have somewhat plateaued, Keita is on the rise and Fred is on a much slower rise.


Given the ammunition we have in mid, I'm happy with his progression and would be better judged with 2 or 3 games on the trot.

Take the Liverpool tinted glasses off both have been as bad as each other, the stat's back it up , Both can come good that is for sure but so far neither is missed when they do not play ,



Fred has slightly better passing than Keita so far,
Fred is playing in a worse team than Keita so far
Fred has made slightly more tackles than Kieta so Far
Fred has scored slightly more goals than Keita so far ,

Fred started 7 Prem games 3subs
Scored one goal / 0 assists
Passing accuracy stat's 88.3 %
Tackles 1.7 per game

Keita started 8 Prem games 6 subs
Scored 0 goals / 0 assists
Passing accuracy stats 87.7%
tackles 1.1 per games

x43r0

yourdeadwright wrote: »

He has had one injury which had him out for 19days and miss 4 games,
Played in 17 games and did very well in Spurs & Burnley away and Westham at home

This is where language blurs the detail a bit. It's one thing to say he played in X games, but by doing that you're grouping in instances where a players may be subbed on with 15min but it counts as an 'appearance'.

Looking purely at minutes played, the list of players below him in this ranking is comprised of names like Sturridge, Matip, Moreno, Lallana et al so that alone shows you how little he has been on the pitch relative to the rest of the squad

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Making judgements on what you have seen is not foolish how do you make that out ?

It is when what you've seen is relatively little.

There's never anything wrong with saying "I've not really seen enough to make an informed judgement on this"

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Infact its making an informed judgement

It's not - See above.

yourdeadwright wrote: »

No one is saying he is written off and should be sold

...and rightly so, I'd be seriously concerned if people were

yourdeadwright wrote: »

People are simply saying so far he has been a let down nothing wrong with that

Kinda addressed this above but for someone to look at the details and still make that kind of statement is foolish

yourdeadwright

x43r0 wrote: »

This is where language blurs the detail a bit. It's one thing to say he played in X games, but by doing that you're grouping in instances where a players may be subbed on with 15min but it counts as an 'appearance'.

Looking purely at minutes played, the list of players below him in this ranking is comprised of names like Sturridge, Matip, Moreno, Lallana et al so that alone shows you how little he has been on the pitch relative to the rest of the squad



It is when what you've seen is relatively little.

There's never anything wrong with saying "I've not really seen enough to make an informed judgement on this"



It's not - See above.



...and rightly so, I'd be seriously concerned if people were



Kinda addressed this above but for someone to look at the details and still make that kind of statement is foolish

Simply question and be honest

When we signed Keita did you expect it to be January and him not being one of the first names on the team sheets ?

I certainly thought he would have been better than he has been , i expected more him n the first 6 months, I hope he comes good and is undroppable

Fred had to endure Mourinho management, surely that's a factor to be considered. Utd were really poor under Jose this season, really poor........an entire squad under performing.

yourdeadwright

Looking purely at minutes played, the list of players below him in this ranking is comprised of names like Sturridge, Matip, Moreno, Lallana et al so that alone shows you how little he has been on the pitch relative to the rest of the squad

You make some good points but , he hasn't played as he hasn't deserved to like the other guys you have mentioned,
The lads you mentioned above are not trusted by the manger to be given more than bit part rolls, ( bar maybe Matip )

Enzokk

SM01 wrote: »

"THE NABY KEÏTA CONUNDRUM: WHY LIVERPOOL ARE YET TO SEE THE BEST OF THE ALL-ACTION GUINEAN"


Excuse the caps. I copied the headline from the article. Sam McGuire is a decent writer and here's his take on Naby:

https://www.internationalchampionscup.com/en/articles/the-naby-keita-conundrum

Nice link, the pitch heat map with his position from last season compared to this makes for an interesting visual. As mentioned in the article at Leipzig he was central and he could go either way past a defender where now he can only go inside which makes it harder for him.

yourdeadwright

Does anyone watch the Germany league much,

What is the standard like outside of the Dortmund and Bayern

x43r0

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Simply question and be honest

When we signed Keita did you expect it to be January and him not being one of the first names on the team sheets ?

I certainly thought he would have been better than he has been , i expected more him n the first 6 months, I hope he comes good and is undroppable

I don't watch any Bundesliga teams outside of what see in CL games so I didn't have a clue who he was or how good he was supposed to be

Admittedly all the hype around him did build up my expectations a bit but I recognise that any expectations I had were purely based on hype and youtube highlight videos

So what I know of Naby Keita right now is not as much as I'd like to know given that I haven't seen a lot of him. So, I guess in short: I've not really seen enough to make an informed judgement on him

yourdeadwright

x43r0 wrote: »

I don't watch any Bundesliga teams outside of what see in CL games so I didn't have a clue who he was or how good he was supposed to be

Admittedly all the hype around him did build up my expectations a bit but I recognise that any expectations I had were purely based on hype and youtube highlight videos

So what I know of Naby Keita right now is not as much as I'd like to know given that I haven't seen a lot of him. So, I guess in short: I've not really seen enough to make an informed judgement on him

That's fair enough
I hope he gets man of the match the weekend
In the end of the day as fans we all want the lad to do well,