Do you think nurses will get their payrise?

facehugger99

Twenty Grand wrote: »

Care to elaborate on how the NHS and US healthcare system have benefitted from Reagan and Thatcher, and how ordinary people are much better off?

Last time I checked, both were f*cked.

Ordinary people don’t have to pay outrageous taxes in the UK or USA.

Care to elaborate what we get for our taxes other than a generously renumerated PS.

Because it ain’t a good healthcare system.

David73

Twenty Grand wrote: »

50 to 60k isn't a good wage, especially if it's at the top of the payscale, takes 15 years to get, and you need to put your mental and physical health on the line to get it.

I wouldn't begrudge any Irish nurse heading abroad for better opportunities. If you have a skill that's in high demand then make the most of it.

Doctors are in the sh*t for years, same as nurses, but they'll eventually move into GP and consultancies and outearn all of us. I fully support junior doctors in their own industrial action.

Would it make you feel better about yourself if nurses were crying on the picket?

"move into GP and consultancies and outearn all of us."............hahahahaha

Have you any idea of how much a GP earns even running their own practice?

That's hilarious!

wrangler

David73 wrote: »

"move into GP and consultancies and outearn all of us."............hahahahaha

Have you any idea of how much a GP earns even running their own practice?

That's hilarious!

They don't get away with working a meagre 40 hours either,
an unfortunate comparison

Varta

Quote:
Originally Posted by brendanwalsh View Post
Sorry guys, we have an effective tax rate of 50%, if nurses hold us at gun point now and empty the coffers you can expect basic tax rate and use to rise. This is a smash and grab by a profession . Reality is, if these girls get their 12% , they'll still be back working in sh1te conditions the next morning, an extra hundred quid a week won't change the fact the hse and system is a total sh1tshow.
Thankfully a bit of sense at last.

Why are the Doctors crisis which is far greater than that of the whiney nurses being ignored??

I'll point out the elephant in the room, this strike has a total whiff of the MeToo movement and feninism about it. Just like the proposal to recruit more women as Professors, T.D's and to pay women more than men because they can make babies.

It's always the same rhetoric!

I should have realised.

Varta

road_high wrote: »

They really don’t ! If they did the govt would have caved.
Because it goes way beyond political parties despite PBP SF and all other looney tunes joining in the anarchy which is their raison detre.
It doesn’t matter a damn whose in power- the exchequer can’t afford this pay demand. End of story

Nope, it's not the end of the story. You can keep spinning until you fall over, the fact is the public support the nurses.

Twenty Grand

David73 wrote: »

"move into GP and consultancies and outearn all of us."............hahahahaha

Have you any idea of how much a GP earns even running their own practice?

That's hilarious!

Yes. The information is freely available online.
I deal with doctors and surgeons regularly. They're very well paid, compared to the top of the nurses payscale, which you equated them to. Not as well paid as they would be in other countries, which is why they're also leaving Ireland in droves.

Varta

road_high wrote: »

If anything boards.ie is probably more on point due to it’s anonymity. People are reticent to publicly declare what they actually think due to the hysterical narrative the nursing unions have cultivated. Most people wouldn’t say what they actually think for fear of verbal attacks that they’d attract from the union mobs.

If anything it's the way FG conduct business by utilising social media. But you know what, most people have copped onto it.

yegorzima

As for me thay get enough now, but it's possible

iebamm2580

Alot of the people that support the nurses are in the public sector themselves or scroungers on the dole who the blame the government for everything while they are unwilling to work themselves.

Twenty Grand

iebamm2580 wrote: »

Alot of the people that support the nurses are in the public sector themselves or scroungers on the dole who the blame the government for everything while they are unwilling to work themselves.

Prove it.

Varta

facehugger99 wrote: »

We’ve never had a Thatcher or Reagan here to smash the unions.

It bequeathed us a overpaid, overprotected and militant public sector.

This strike needs to be faced down.

Or you could just move to the north east of England and live the life bequeathed by Thatcher after she broke the unions.

road_high

Varta wrote: »

Nope, it's not the end of the story. You can keep spinning until you fall over, the fact is the public support the nurses.

I’m not spinning anything! I’m telling it how it is. Just because you chose to believe the public fully support it doesn’t mean they actually are-saying it’s a “fact” doesn’t mean it is.
This strike is going nowhere because there’s just no money to meet Nurses unrealistic and indeed unfounded pay demands.

iebamm2580

Twenty Grand wrote: »

Prove it.

Ha i will not attempt to prove anything to somebody who compared docs and nurses in the one post, laughable to remotely compare.

road_high

Twenty Grand wrote: »

Prove it.

SF, PBP etc are the only ones politically in vocal support of nurses- look at who supports them and go figure!

Varta

iebamm2580 wrote: »

Alot of the people that support the nurses are in the public sector themselves or scroungers on the dole who the blame the government for everything while they are unwilling to work themselves.

And a lot of them are like me, self-employed. You see that's what happens when you have huge support, people of all hues come out behind you.

road_high

Varta wrote: »

If anything it's the way FG conduct business by utilising social media. But you know what, most people have copped onto it.

Social media is an echo chamber for the interminably outraged. Not an accurate gauge of public support on anything but find solace in it if it pleases you

Varta

road_high wrote: »

I’m not spinning anything! I’m telling it how it is. Just because you chose to believe the public fully support it doesn’t mean they actually are-saying it’s a “fact” doesn’t mean it is.
This strike is going nowhere because there’s just no money to meet Nurses unrealistic and indeed unfounded pay demands.

The independent polls are telling us that the nurses are enjoying in excess of 75% support from the public. No matter how many times you state that it is otherwise, unless you can come up with some independent polls that support your position you'll just have to accept that you are wrong and that in excess of 75% of people don't believe what you say.

Varta

road_high wrote: »

SF, PBP etc are the only ones politically in vocal support of nurses- look at who supports them and go figure!

Instead of using 'etc.' why don't you list them all? Is it because FG is the only party that doesn't support them?

iebamm2580

Varta wrote: »

The independent polls are telling us that the nurses are enjoying in excess of 75% support from the public. No matter how many times you state that it is otherwise, unless you can come up with some independent polls that support your position you'll just have to accept that you are wrong and that in excess of 75% of people don't believe what you say.

You hardly think in this day and age somebody is going to come out and say what they really think, look at peter caseys poll numbers before the election.

David73

Twenty Grand wrote: »

Yes. The information is freely available online.
I deal with doctors and surgeons regularly. They're very well paid, compared to the top of the nurses payscale, which you equated them to. Not as well paid as they would be in other countries, which is why they're also leaving Ireland in droves.

Are you for real???

Doctors 'They're very well paid'

They start on 30k FFS!!!

Doctors are not at all in comparison to nurse.

Doctors study a much more academic course for 5 years, work 80 to 100 unsociable hrs a week and start on 30k.


Then nurses create a big drama for studying for 3 years with 9 months paid placement. Pharmacy students no longer get paid for placement. Nursing has much lower CAO points with more spaces. Nurses then cry that they have to work unsociable hours and want more wages than Doctors. Wha Wha Wha .....like was it advertised as a 9 to 5


Absolute shambolic

Varta

road_high wrote: »

Social media is an echo chamber for the interminably outraged. Not an accurate gauge of public support on anything but find solace in it if it pleases you

Clearly that is your reason for using social media. It's not mine.

Twenty Grand

iebamm2580 wrote: »

Ha i will not attempt to prove anything to somebody who compared docs and nurses in the one post, laughable to remotely compare.

I pointed out they were not comparable.

A nurse tops out in the high 50k, a doctor tops out much higher, depending on speciality, qualification, location, size of practice and many other factors.

Varta

iebamm2580 wrote: »

You hardly think in this day and age somebody is going to come out and say what they really think, look at peter caseys poll numbers before the election.

So the people polled were all telling porkies? C'mon, at least try to deal with reality.

iebamm2580

Twenty Grand wrote: »

I pointed out they were not comparable.

A nurse tops out in the high 50k, a doctor tops out much higher, depending on speciality, qualification, location, size of practice and many other factors.

Yes which is totally the way it should be, docs saves lives, nurses are the helpers simple as.

Twenty Grand

David73 wrote: »

Are you for real???

Doctors 'They're very well paid'

Absolute shambolic

You asked if I knew what GPs earn. I said I did. Read the post. Then you started talking about junior doctors.

iebamm2580

Varta wrote: »

So the people polled were all telling porkies? C'mon, at least try to deal with reality.

Yes a good share would be afraid to disagree in public, nothing im saying is sensational, look at trump ffs. You need to deal with reality i think.

wrangler

Varta wrote: »

So the people polled were all telling porkies? C'mon, at least try to deal with reality.

What percentage of the country are public servants or dependents,What percentage of the country is living off the state. Private sector workers supporting this strike are turkeys voting for Christmas

David73

Twenty Grand wrote: »

I pointed out they were not comparable.

A nurse tops out in the high 50k, a doctor tops out much higher, depending on speciality, qualification, location, size of practice and many other factors.

What is your point exactly?

The Hospital cleaners salary tops out at about 23k, let give them a pay rise in comparison then!


Errr.........last time I checked Doctors are GP's and consultants??

road_high

Varta wrote: »

Instead of using 'etc.' why don't you list them all? Is it because FG is the only party that doesn't support them?

I couldn’t give a ****e about FG- they happen to be the ones in govt so have to be responsible with the public finances and not put us all in grave financial jeopardy like has happened in the recent past.
Obviously other parties will politicize this for ideological reasons as they lean towards big government, massive taxation, huge welfare and social expenditure. There’s no votes for them in controlling public expenditure as their voters aren’t the ones picking up the tab.

Wanderer78

wrangler wrote:

What percentage of the country are public servants or dependents,What percentage of the country is living off the state. Private sector workers supporting this strike are turkeys voting for Christmas

Turkeys that know at some stage they ll require the help of nurses to stay alive, the fools!

Varta

iebamm2580 wrote: »

Yes a good share would be afraid to disagree in public, nothing im saying is sensational, look at trump ffs. You need to deal with reality i think.

You do realise that people are asked their opinion privately in a poll?

iebamm2580

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Turkeys that know at some stage they ll require the help of nurses to stay alive, the fools!

if you think a nurse is going to keep you alive you are the fool/

Wanderer78

iebamm2580 wrote:

if you think a nurse is going to keep you alive you are the fool/

Really!

Gael23

David73 wrote: »

Show us your payslip or it never happened!

Gross or Net?
Working full hours?
Working unsociable hours?

Gross on regular office hours

iebamm2580

Varta wrote: »

You do realise that people are asked their opinion privately in a poll?

What poll are you referring too?

road_high

Varta wrote: »

Clearly that is your reason for using social media. It's not mine.

Did I say I use it? I said it’s an echo chamber, I don’t partake in social media debates as they are usually infantile rubbish about how evil politicians are.
If you didn’t know better you’d think SF and their ilk were the dominant political forces in Irish politics if you only read social media as a barometer. As we know it’s actually mainstream FG and FF that dominate politically. PBP register support circling 1%.

Varta

iebamm2580 wrote: »

if you think a nurse is going to keep you alive you are the fool/

Cal down. You will think better as a result.

iebamm2580

Varta wrote: »

Cal down. You will think better as a result.

Perfectly calm, this is just passing away some time at work.

Varta

road_high wrote: »

Did I say I use it? I said it’s an echo chamber, I don’t partake in social media debates as they are usually infantile rubbish about how evil politicians are.
If you didn’t know better you’d think SF and their ilk were the dominant political forces in Irish politics if you only read social media as a barometer. As we know it’s actually mainstream FG and FF that dominate politically. PBP register support circling 1%.

?????????? You are using it right now!!!!!!!!!!!

wrangler

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Really!

Half a billion paid out in five years in negligence claims....go figure

David73

Gael23 wrote: »

Gross on regular office hours

handy number.

Varta

iebamm2580 wrote: »

Perfectly calm, this is just passing away some time at work.

You're not a nurse then.

Wishbone Ash

David73 wrote: »

... Nursing has much lower CAO points with more spaces....

You appear to be shooting yourself in the foot with that argument. The entry points for nursing are low because of lack of demand. Medicine remains one of the highest, if not the highest. If pay and conditions are so bad for doctors, why is there such demand for places?

Varta

iebamm2580 wrote: »

What poll are you referring too?

Any poll conducted by a reputable polling company.

David73

I've seen nurses play Solitare on the computer in the hospital

road_high

Varta wrote: »

?????????? You are using it right now!!!!!!!!!!!

Boards.ie isn’t social media in the sense of twitter or Facebook which are public. Much more balanced as a result

Miike

wrangler wrote: »

Half a billion paid out in five years in negligence claims....go figure

:pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac::pac:

That is all I've to say on that.

David73

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

You appear to be shooting yourself in the foot with that argument. The entry points for nursing are low because of lack of demand. Medicine remains one of the highest, if not the highest. If pay and conditions are so bad for doctors, why is there such demand for places?

One does not become a Doctor for the 30k starting salary and the 100k debt, i'll give you some time to think why!

Wanderer78

wrangler wrote:

Half a billion paid out in five years in negligence claims....go figure

All due to the negligence of nurses, and nurses alone?

animaal

A Shropshire Lad wrote: »

TI suppose we who vote are partly to balme. We elect the governments knowing full well they will repeat the process. But I dont see much of an appetite for change either

The classical left/right economic divide was the tendency for the Left to increase taxes and spending. The Right would lower taxes and spending. Both have advantages and disadvantages.

In a balanced economy, you'd either have intervening periods of both, or coalitions between them. In either case, you're likely to get a fairly balanced situation in the long term. Neither a North Korea nor a USA. As a result there would be a need in the public sector to have value for money. No magic money tree.

In this country, where's the party proposing to lower taxes and spend less? No party speaks about spending less. Fine Gael is probably the party closest to the economic Right. It talks about reducing taxes, but I haven't seen it. The rates reduced very slightly recently, but this was balanced by other increases, and the lack of band indexation. Of course, if spending keeps increasing there's little scope to reduce taxes.

I judge a party by its actions rather than by its words. The only choice we have is parties that will to increase spending to various degrees, and set taxes to be whatever they need to be to accommodate this.

We're not given an alternative at the moment. That suits many people.