Do you think nurses will get their payrise?

Sweetemotion

TheRiverman wrote: »

39 hr week,an extra 12 hr shift has to be worked to make up the hours.They are paid monthly and I think that runs to six weeks over Christmas/ start of New Year.

So it's 3 days on and 4 days off for 3 weeks and 4 days on and 3 days off for 1 week a month?

divillybit

Just a thought, and it may have been highlighted earlier in this thread but given that Australia is often cited as having the best pay and conditions for nurses, you'd have to wonder if there will be pay cuts coming for public sector workers there given the property crash thats happening there...Ireland might seem like a more attractive option for nurses that have emigrated


https://www.thetrumpet.com/17915-australia-waking-up-to-its-housing-crisis

David73

Can everyone stop feeding Feckthisgenie, they have been spouting poo all day without reference to create annoyance.

Smell of poo off them

feckthisgenie

feckthisgenie wrote: »

I could imply to same to you, why dont you work in the public sector if you think things are so good.

I never considered it..... a sh1t gig imo.

Spanish Eyes

On another note, why does nursing now require a degree, whereas there are many nurses who do not have a degree. Same registration etc.

Just wondered if non degree holders feel the same. Don't get me wrong, they are just as well qualified if not moreso than the degree cohort.

Is the difference causing an issue at all?

hawkelady

Getting increasingly likely we will have three consecutive days of strike this week , nurses along with the pna .... who’s going to blink first? I still think the government have too much to lose if they don’t put money on the table !

feckthisgenie

hawkelady wrote: »

Getting increasingly likely we will have three consecutive days of strike this week , nurses along with the pna .... who’s going to blink first? I still think the government have too much to lose if they don’t put money on the table !

It will be resolved this week, the pay increase will be granted and rightly so

They might throw 6% at them. I doubt it though as they haven't up to now....government sticking to the deal.

jimbobaloobob

feckthisgenie wrote: »

It will be resolved this week, the pay increase will be granted and rightly so

Is it a pay increase or is it pay restoration?

David73

hawkelady wrote: »

Getting increasingly likely we will have three consecutive days of strike this week , nurses along with the pna .... who’s going to blink first? I still think the government have too much to lose if they don’t put money on the table !

Let them strike, hopefully the Governemnt will show they actually have some balls.

They are being paid enough, the Gov should just say they will focus on stream lining the HSE to make it more efficient. This won't be achieved by an undeserved pay increase

Give them a ludicrous pay increase now and they'll be out again next year when the pay agreement 2020 expires wanting more.

It's all just tactics, who gives a **** about the patients!

feckthisgenie

jimbobaloobob wrote: »

Is it a pay increase or is it pay restoration?

The latter / pay parity it's an increase on current pay whatever why you look at it

hawkelady

David73 wrote: »

Let them strike, hopefully the Governemnt will show they actually have some balls.

They are being paid enough, the Gov should just say they will focus on stream lining the HSE to make it more efficient. This won't be achieved by an undeserved pay increase

You should know by now that the government will do what gets them the most votes ! Nothing to do with balls

greasepalm

Pay the nurses and reduce wages of the government

David73

greasepalm wrote: »

Pay the nurses and reduce wages of the government

Over my dead body!

tayto lover

David73 wrote: »

Over my dead body!

Well hopefully not. There might be a nurse nearby to revive you.
A TD wont be much use to you if you are ill.

Spanish Eyes

Are the ambulance paramedic personnel paid similar?

Just wondered. At least nurses are indoors and warm.

alloywheel

thomasdylan wrote: »

On the subject of sick leave there's a report published every year that breaks absences down by location and job. The highest absence rates are always in management and admin (who would generally have the least patient contact) and there are always crazy rates of absences of ambulance support staff.

So why is there such high absenteeism rates among the HSE, if it cannot be blamed to not wanting to catch or pass on flues, colds, etc

Why is absenteeism in our HSE much higher than in the NHS?
It would not be because the slightest ache or pain or hangover and they are off?

It is not unknown for there to be 100,000 sick days taken in one month in the HSE! No wonder the service is so bad.

road_high

greasepalm wrote: »

Pay the nurses and reduce wages of the government

You do realise the savings would be minuscule? Supposing politicians were paid zero it would be a drop in the ocean vs 40,000 plus nurses alone?
This is the kind of populist claptrap that’s rampant in Ireland. Rather than collective personal responsibility for the out of control public expenditure, politicians are scapegoats for both 1. not spending enough and also 2. blamed for cuts when we inevitably spend too much. High time people grew the fcuk up and realise fiscal responsibility is a national one, not just a stick to beat politicians with. It’s really infantile stuff

David73

road_high wrote: »

You do realise the savings would be minuscule? Supposing politicians were paid zero it would be a drop in the ocean vs 40,000 plus nurses alone?
This is the kind of populist claptrap that’s rampant in Ireland. Rather than collective personal responsibility for the out of control public expenditure, politicians are scapegoats for both 1. not spending enough and also 2. blamed for cuts when we inevitably spend too much. High time people grew the fcuk up and realise fiscal responsibility is a national one, not just a stick to beat politicians with. It’s really infantile stuff

Good point.

However the TD's and nurses are paid enough already.
The Doctors and Primary Teachers should be given a pay increase instead.

noodler

road_high wrote: »

You do realise the savings would be minuscule? Supposing politicians were paid zero it would be a drop in the ocean vs 40,000 plus nurses alone?
This is the kind of populist claptrap that’s rampant in Ireland. Rather than collective personal responsibility for the out of control public expenditure, politicians are scapegoats for both 1. not spending enough and also 2. blamed for cuts when we inevitably spend too much. High time people grew the fcuk up and realise fiscal responsibility is a national one, not just a stick to beat politicians with. It’s really infantile stuff

Very true, gov are lambasted for a 2k pay restoration given to all who had cuts over 65k and are lambasted. Money is about 300k or 120k after tax.

Whereas it costs roughly 150m each time the government adds a fiver to the State Pension (or roughly the same unemployment payments).

People really have no clue alot of the time.

thomasdylan

alloywheel wrote: »

So why is there such high absenteeism rates among the HSE, if it cannot be blamed to not wanting to catch or pass on flues, colds, etc

Why is absenteeism in our HSE much higher than in the NHS?
It would not be because the slightest ache or pain or hangover and they are off?

It is not unknown for there to be 100,000 sick days taken in one month in the HSE! No wonder the service is so bad.

I'm not sure the reasons for the absenteeism. There's disproportionate levels of absenteeism in some areas of the HSE. Looking at the report I put up, in Limerick there's an absence rate of 25% in client care, 15% in management and admin, 12% in nursing, 0.9% in doctors and 3.9% in other health professionals. It's crazy stuff.

Sweetemotion

tayto lover wrote: »

Well hopefully not. There might be a nurse nearby to revive you.
A TD wont be much use to you if you are ill.

Have they a cure for cancer and the fountain of youth in their back pockets?

Dakotabigone

Make cuts to the rock and roll society. Tighten up on giving out free houses to single mothers that have live in partner on big wages.

jimbobaloobob

David73 wrote: »

Good point.

However the TD's and nurses are paid enough already.
The Doctors and Primary Teachers should be given a pay increase instead.

Not saying i disagree with you on this point, but what reason should the nurses overlooked right now and doctors and teachers rewarded? or are your comments just to wind someone up?

feckthisgenie

jimbobaloobob wrote: »

Not saying i disagree with you on this point, but what reason should the nurses overlooked right now and doctors and teachers rewarded? or are your comments just to wind someone up?

He's a clown and WUM
Wouldn't entertainment the halfwit

Geuze

greasepalm wrote: »

Pay the nurses and reduce wages of the government

There are 15 people in the Govt.

Any pay cut won't save much.

Cbumkin

TheRiverman wrote: »

39 hr week,an extra 12 hr shift has to be worked to make up the hours.They are paid monthly and I think that runs to six weeks over Christmas/ start of New Year.

Every nurse I know is paid fortnightly. Perhaps at the higher echelons (assistant director of nursing level and higher......of which there are too many imo ) they are paid monthly

Cbumkin

mad muffin wrote: »

Any nurse that has only their diploma is already down on the pay scale due to limited promotions.

Many that want to keep getting promoted and also do more specialised nursing like ANP. Would have gotten their degree on their own time whilst still working. And then on to getting their masters.

Every nurse who qualified post 2002 has at least a degree. To get a promotion nowadays you would need to have at least a post grad. To reach ANP level/ nurse tutor/ any administrative management level, a Masters degree is required. Staff nurse pay is the same whether a person was appointed post 2002 with a degree or pre 2002 with a diploma but there aren't too many pre-2002 appointees who haven't gone on to do the degree.

hawkelady

Cbumkin wrote: »

Every nurse I know is paid fortnightly. Perhaps at the higher echelons (assistant director of nursing level and higher......of which there are too many imo ) they are paid monthly

Wrong .... nurses are paid monthly ...
why oh why do you spout nonsense ?

hawkelady

Cbumkin wrote: »

Every nurse who qualified post 2002 has at least a degree. To get a promotion nowadays you would need to have at least a post grad. To reach ANP level/ nurse tutor/ any administrative management level, a Masters degree is required. Staff nurse pay is the same whether a person was appointed post 2002 with a degree or pre 2002 with a diploma but there aren't too many pre-2002 appointees who haven't gone on to do the degree.

Wrong ... a masters is not required for a nurse to achieve any managerial position ..
Why oh why do you spout such nonsense?

hawkelady

hawkelady wrote: »

Wrong .... nurses are paid monthly ...
why oh why do you spout nonsense ?

That's odd. Doctors in the HSE are definitely paid fortnightly, I thought most front line public servants were.

I wonder why nurses are paid monthly and doctors fortnightly?

hawkelady

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

That's odd. Doctors in the HSE are definitely paid fortnightly, I thought most front line public servants were.

I wonder why nurses are paid monthly and doctors fortnightly?

Sorry, must be too early in the morning for me 🀨 .. not all nurses are paid monthly , some actually are paid fortnightly ..... I was just explaining to the other poster that not all nurses are paid fortnightly .
A Monthly payment was tried to be introduced a few years back , some took it , some didn’t. It was meant to be across the board but never worked out. Apologies if my post came across as all nurses were paid monthly ... as I said , too early.

judeboy101

Talks adjourned this morn LC to issue recommendations today, funny feeling strike will be pulled.

I reckon the approach here will be not to offer nurses a pay rise, but some kind of 'allowance', in an attempt to get other PS workers to desist from making an equivalent claim.

feckthisgenie

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

That's odd. Doctors in the HSE are definitely paid fortnightly, I thought most front line public servants were.

I wonder why nurses are paid monthly and doctors fortnightly?

Paid monthly

feckthisgenie

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

I reckon the approach here will be not to offer nurses a pay rise, but some kind of 'allowance', in an attempt to get other PS workers to desist from making an equivalent claim.

When you say allowance do you mean extra for weekends/ night duty? How will this work for nurses in day ward or outpatients who don't work unsociable hours, they won't benefit. For that reason I can't see the IMNO agreeing

suicide_circus

maybe a protest outside paschal donoghue's gaf would get the ball rolling?

feckthisgenie

feckthisgenie wrote: »

When you say allowance do you mean extra for weekends/ night duty? How will this work for nurses in day ward or outpatients who don't work unsociable hours, they won't benefit. For that reason I can't see the IMNO agreeing

I was thinking more along the lines of an allowance to recognise educational training, which was never formally recognised when nurses became obliged to complete a degree programme. Nurses could also be given an enhanced package if they complete postgraduate training.

I'm sure some creative solution will be found.

feckthisgenie

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

I was thinking more along the lines of an allowance to recognise educational training, which was never formally recognised when nurses became obliged to complete a degree programme. Nurses could also be given an enhanced package if they complete postgraduate training.

I'm sure some creative solution will be found.

Cant see that happening. Sure pay is the same for physiotherapy, SALT, OT no matter if degree or masters. Did content or duration of course change from diploma to degree much for nursing I dont know.
If that happened people with 4-5 years experience would be on more money then nurses with 17 or 18 years experience who would have far more clinical experience . That would make no sense whatsoever imo

Cbumkin

hawkelady wrote: »

Wrong .... nurses are paid monthly ...
why oh why do you spout nonsense ?

Ha ha ha!!!! I am a nurse !!!!! I get paid fortnightly!!!! Who is spouting the nonsense now?

feckthisgenie

feckthisgenie wrote: »

Cant see that happening. Sure pay is the same for physiotherapy, SALT, OT no matter if degree or masters. Did content or duration of course change from diploma to degree much for nursing I dont know.
If that happened people with 4-5 years experience would be on more money then nurses with 17 or 18 years experience who would have far more clinical experience . That would make no sense whatsoever imo

Someone mentioned earlier in the thread that most nurses who qualified before the degree requirement, have subsequently had their diploma converted into degrees. I would say there's only a minority who haven't done so, but even they probably have various certifications in clinical practice. In any event, pascales ensure that they'd still be paid substantially more than recent graduates.

Whatever the solution is, I am pretty sure it won't be a direct pay increase, but an alternative way will be found to achieve precisely that.

feckthisgenie

Cbumkin wrote: »

Ha ha ha!!!! I am a nurse !!!!! I get paid fortnightly!!!! Who is spouting the nonsense now?

Obviously depending on part of the country. I'm AHP and was paid fortnightly in Dublin and now monthly down the country . I know the nurses in my area are monthly and HCA fortnightly

brendanwalsh

Labour court are stuck here guys. I reckon they won't have scope to intervene. Nurses have broken an agreement they signed up to. They should be punished in line with the rules for breaking that agreement. Ask yourselves why the other nurses unions aren't striking.

Cbumkin

hawkelady wrote: »

Wrong ... a masters is not required for a nurse to achieve any managerial position ..
Why oh why do you spout such nonsense?

Again repeat....ha ha ha ha ha!!!! Any nurse trying to get an administrative management post (as opposed to a clinical management post) without a masters would have an extremely slim chance....if indeed they'd have a chance at all. With the increased educational profile of nurses, the standard required for promotion has got higher and higher. A degree on its own today will get you nowhere

Philster

Cbumkin wrote: »

Every nurse I know is paid fortnightly. Perhaps at the higher echelons (assistant director of nursing level and higher......of which there are too many imo ) they are paid monthly

I'm a staff nurse almost 23 years and I have only ever been paid monthly, regardless of where I worked or my employer. Same for all my colleagues. I think some nurses on temporary contract are paid fortnightly.

BarryD2

tayto lover wrote: »

Far too much emphasis on “reputation” and “public opinion”.
When you strike you put all that kind of rubbish aside and fight only for what you want.
Individual nurses will stick to what the Union want them to stick to.

So are you saying that nurses are Me Féiners

brendanwalsh wrote: »

Labour court are stuck here guys. I reckon they won't have scope to intervene. Nurses have broken an agreement they signed up to. They should be punished in line with the rules for breaking that agreement. Ask yourselves why the other nurses unions aren't striking.

They're in a pickle alright. You either have an agreement or you don't. The pressure on the INMO executive must be pretty severe.

ohnonotgmail

Does anybody know what happens to people who have outpatient appointments cancelled because of the strike? Do they get their appointments rescheduled as a priority or do they go to the back of the queue again?

iamwhoiam

Philster wrote: »

I'm a staff nurse almost 23 years and I have only ever been paid monthly, regardless of where I worked or my employer. Same for all my colleagues. I think some nurses on temporary contract are paid fortnightly.

I was paid monthly for years .I was a permanent senior staff nurse

Old diesel

brendanwalsh wrote: »

Labour court are stuck here guys. I reckon they won't have scope to intervene. Nurses have broken an agreement they signed up to. They should be punished in line with the rules for breaking that agreement. Ask yourselves why the other nurses unions aren't striking.

Afaik Nurses are looking to clause 3 and 4 of the agreement to argue that they arent in breach.

It's a bit academic as we are looking at a current agreement up to 2020 - so if you take the strict legal view that they shouldnt get anything now - then they can still come back in 20 months time.

I've seen claims that the way the Government handled the pay commision is potentially in breach of the agreement.

Is there not a court that can test all this??????

wonski

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

Does anybody know what happens to people who have outpatient appointments cancelled because of the strike? Do they get their appointments rescheduled as a priority or do they go to the back of the queue again?

I got mine moved to 5th of March. Just a month.

That will probably depend on how busy some departments are. Doubt it will be back of the queue, more likely they will squeeze you in to the first available slot. Got the letter 2 days after my original appointment so fair play to them for gett ing it rearranged so quickly.