Calls for Graham Linehan to be removed from Prime Debate on transgender issues!

donkeykong5

Señor Santa Pants wrote: »

Graham is right.

So is heather.

ceadaoin.

klaaaz wrote: »

What's that got to do with transsexuals who have medically transitioned? Those assaults were committed by men.

I brought it up in response to this post

ceebee1981 wrote: »

Do you think the gender of a changing room or a toilet is currently stopping rapists?

Just to point out that more attacks occur in unisex facilities so clearly it does matter what the gender of the room is. Seperated by sex, or gender if you must, results in less incidents.

klaaaz

Sonic Youth wrote: »

The article says unisex facilities are becoming more and more common so as to appease transsexuals

Here's a simple idea, have separate facilities for men and women.

You misunderstood. Read it again, the poorly written article refers to transgender people in general, not specifically transsexual people as they are not mentioned. Fyi, transgender people include those who have not medically transitioned and those who have medically transitioned(transsexuals), quite a difference in the visual makeup of the human bodies there!

Brego888

Bit odd that Linehan should be on it. But he did speak the truth.

Sonic Youth

klaaaz wrote: »

You misunderstood. Read it again, the poorly written article refers to transgender people in general, not specifically transsexual people as they are not mentioned. Fyi, transgender people include those who have not medically transitioned and those who have medically transitioned(transsexuals), quite a difference in the visual makeup of the human bodies there!

I read it just fine. Unisex changing rooms are more dangerous for women. They're becoming more common to appease the transgender/transexual/transwhatever lobby.

I hope women can stand up to this rubbish.

ceadaoin.

klaaaz wrote: »

You misunderstood. Read it again, the poorly written article refers to transgender people in general, not specifically transsexual people as they are not mentioned. Fyi, transgender people include those who have not medically transitioned and those who have medically transitioned(transsexuals), quite a difference in the visual makeup of the human bodies there!

Hang on, I thought the term transsexual is offensive now?You'll even find people who call themselves transsexual on the receiving end of abuse from trans activists, and labelled "Tru scum" etc

klaaaz

Sonic Youth wrote: »

I read it just fine. Unisex changing rooms are more dangerous for women. They're becoming more common to appease the transgender/transexual/transwhatever lobby.

I hope women can stand up to this rubbish.

Yes, I agree about the dangers of unisex rooms.
The problem is your interpretation of what transgender actually is in reality, transsexuals are not the danger to women, they have the female body of their preferred gender. The likes of Linehan and a few here oppose those who have not medically transitioned being in women's spaces, that is those who retain male body parts.

klaaaz

ceadaoin. wrote: »

Hang on, I thought the term transsexual is offensive now?You'll even find people who call themselves transsexual on the receiving end of abuse from trans activists, and labelled "Tru scum" etc

Omg, that's kids(I call teenagers\young adults kids ) getting all SJW on their own community. Idiots who do not represent the transgender community, attention seekers having too much online access in other words !

James1888

In what way do you mean prepare to suspend reality, the madness in the whole LGBT agenda on minors? Or the scientific fact that your brain isn't fully developed until 25. This sickness is being brought in to primary schools starting in September, it part of the "inclusive ciriculam" of the new sex ed program. Its sickening to think the whole way through that crap rte ****show that was just on and all the questioning they done about why this was happening. 2 mins of research and you have your answer. Brainwashed by idiot so called liberal documentarys on youtube plus poor diets and health Inc mental health no exercise and underdeveloped brains = testosterone and estrogen levels all over the place and causing feminine men and masculine women. Eat some bloody steaks people

RabbleRouser2k

Didn't watch it, had other places to be-but did they talk to any psychologists or experts on gender dysphoria, or transitioning?

Like, Graham is just a writer-he's not a doctor, he's not a psychologist. He wrote bloody Fr Ted.

Did it mention how he worked so hard to get a trans charity called Mermaids from being given funding by the National Lottery (in the UK, not in Ireland)?

https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/mermaids-trans-charity-children-big-lottery-fund-support-transphobia-graham-linehan-a8688701.html

He would have been the first one on the TV screaming his head off if someone had defunded an abortion charity-tweeting away at how disgraceful it is, draconian etc...
And yet here he was blocking folks from getting the much needed counselling they need.

AndrewJRenko

Calhoun wrote: »

Well they want to target kids as young as 12 with some fairly ****ed up drugs, also want to remove psychiatrist from the whole process before getting to this.

So I'd say the harm is to society overall.

I'd also go and far as saying their limited grasp of biology is dangerous when having an opinion on this subject.

Neither of the issues that you mentioned - drugs and gatekeeping - have anything to do with non-binary.. Those issues apply to the broad issue.

So really, what is your particular problem with people who declare themselves non-binary?

AndrewJRenko

freshpopcorn wrote: »

Well in my opinion it was all very suggestive from the parents/family.
It was like x is a little different so let's label him.

Did you listen to what the mother said? Her despair about "why couldn't you just be gay"?

Did that sound like she had suggested the whole thing?

freshpopcorn

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Did you listen to what the mother said? Her despair about "why couldn't you just be gay"?

Did that sound like she had suggested the whole thing?

Partly yes.
People are very quick to label everything I find and that's just my take on it.

AndrewJRenko

Sonic Youth wrote: »

The article says unisex facilities are becoming more and more common so as to appease transsexuals

Here's a simple idea, have separate facilities for men and women.

Do you believe everything you read in the papers?

Unless you know what proportion of pools have unisex changing rooms in the first place, you (and the authors) have no basis for their claim that they are more dangerous. They may well just be more common.

But well done on swallowing an article designed to stir things up. That's a great example of why Brexit happened BTW.

AndrewJRenko

Sonic Youth wrote: »

Because he (it's always a man) is an attention seeking twat. I don't like people like that.

There's a 40 something man in America who 'identifies' as a little girl. He's a freak, the absolute state of him

The person in the show who identified as non-binary was born female. After Prime Time, I turned over to Naked Attraction to see another person who was born female who identified as non-binary.

So based on the sample size of 2 from last night's TV, your claim of "always a man" is 100% wrong.

Grayson

ceadaoin. wrote: »

No but it allows people to challenge why they might be in facilities of the wrong gender or make them think twice about taking the chance. In the UK most sexual assaults in facilities like that take place in unisex ones. It's all about opportunity

How many of them were by trans people? Because unless you can say what you're advocating is keeping men away from woman because men are a danger.

AndrewJRenko

[Deleted User] wrote: »

First, the extraordinary number of teenage females who identify as male and how this is not replicated in the number of males who identify as female. Why? How is this explained?

Why would you expect the numbers to be replicated?

JMNolan

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Why would you expect the numbers to be replicated?

Answering a question with another question is a crappy way to debate

He's a mad looking bastard all the same..His head kind of looks like he spends too much time arguing with idiots on the internet..

Sonic Youth

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Do you believe everything you read in the papers?

Unless you know what proportion of pools have unisex changing rooms in the first place, you (and the authors) have no basis for their claim that they are more dangerous. They may well just be more common.

But well done on swallowing an article designed to stir things up. That's a great example of why Brexit happened BTW.

Impressive mental gymanistics there. You must be a male feminist.

Varik

Deleted User wrote: »

He's a mad looking bastard all the same..His head kind of looks like he spends too much time arguing with idiots on the internet..

It's entertaining sometimes.

Like when he started shouting about the Scottish lad who trained a pug to do a Nazi salute, he wanted the book thrown at him and then a few more books written so they could throw some more. Kept going on about how you should joke about Nazis and about the kind of person who would.

Twitter users kept replying with images of the Nazi father ted episode.

AndrewJRenko

Sonic Youth wrote: »

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Do you believe everything you read in the papers?

Unless you know what proportion of pools have unisex changing rooms in the first place, you (and the authors) have no basis for their claim that they are more dangerous. They may well just be more common.

But well done on swallowing an article designed to stir things up. That's a great example of why Brexit happened BTW.

Impressive mental gymanistics there. You must be a male feminist.

It's just awful when someone brings facts and data to these discussions, isn't it?

gmisk

James1888 wrote: »

In what way do you mean prepare to suspend reality, the madness in the whole LGBT agenda on minors? Or the scientific fact that your brain isn't fully developed until 25. This sickness is being brought in to primary schools starting in September, it part of the "inclusive ciriculam" of the new sex ed program. Its sickening to think the whole way through that crap rte ****show that was just on and all the questioning they done about why this was happening. 2 mins of research and you have your answer. Brainwashed by idiot so called liberal documentarys on youtube plus poor diets and health Inc mental health no exercise and underdeveloped brains = testosterone and estrogen levels all over the place and causing feminine men and masculine women. Eat some bloody steaks people

Maybe stick to watching info wars...and there stories about frogs turning gay....

Sonic Youth

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

It's just awful when someone brings facts and data to these discussions, isn't it?

You haven't brought any facts. You just tried to dismiss findings that show unisex facilities to be more dangerous for women

AndrewJRenko

Sonic Youth wrote: »

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

It's just awful when someone brings facts and data to these discussions, isn't it?

You haven't brought any facts. You just tried to dismiss findings that show unisex facilities to be more dangerous for women

There is no 'finding'. The first question that any first year college researcher would ask is "so what percentage centres have unisex changing rooms". But the reporter didn't ask this, because it's not research. It is tabloid stirring, of exactly the same kind of fake news that brought you Brexit and Trump.

And it seems that many of the idiot readers can't wait to swallow it up, confirming their own personal prejudice.

RandomName2

Meanwhile in Egypt, presenter Mohamed al-Ghiety is sentenced to one year of hard labor and fined 3,000 Egyptian pounds for "promoting homosexuality" by interviewing a gay man on the privately-owned LTC Egypt TV channel last year.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-46946612

LGBT campaigners should stop focusing on low-hanging fruit close to home.

Calhoun

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Neither of the issues that you mentioned - drugs and gatekeeping - have anything to do with non-binary.. Those issues apply to the broad issue.

So really, what is your particular problem with people who declare themselves non-binary?

Just people who don't understand biology shouldn't go anywhere near children.

Just keep away from kids Andrew and we won't have any issues .

ohnonotgmail

Sonic Youth wrote: »

Impressive mental gymanistics there. You must be a male feminist.

You seem to think that this is some kind of insult.

Beta Ray Bill

Right, just watched the thing on the RTE Player (RTE Player looks new btw, I haven't used it in years, I rarely watch RTE.)

Both sides made interesting and valid points about the issues Trans people face and the issues the rest of Society faces.

There were some things which annoyed me though:

1) Graham said prevy men were using this as a way to "get" women, which is ballox, there's easier ways to "get" women than that.

2) The professor who wanted to research people who reversed or wanted to reverse going through the change, but was told "No" as it might hurt peoples feelings as it was a sensitive subject... which is also ballox

3) The person they interviewed that wants to be referred to as "They". This does not make sense to me. You can't be "They", you're an individual.

4) Graham was on the show for about 30 seconds... I don't see what the fuss was about

NIMAN

[Deleted User] wrote: »

A very balanced and hugely informative Prime Time tonight - although I suspect praising an RTÉ programme is akin to a crime in the eyes of some.

Anyway, three things stood out.
First, the extraordinary number of teenage females who identify as male and how this is not replicated in the number of males who identify as female. Why? How is this explained?
Second, the high crossover between the number of people who are transgender and who also have autism. Never knew that. How is this explained?
Third, the very strong link between mental health issues and transgender people. I surmised that almost entirely based on the experience of one of my sibling's transgender children and the hell of pain and heartbreak the recurrent suicide watch and absence of mental health supports inflicted upon them for years. That absence of mental health supports for adolescents is the real scandal in all this, and that couple from Wexford personified the lives of so many parents trying to understand what's happening.

Far too many people here are caught up in bullshít about avoiding "pc" and trying to be "edgy" by "speaking the truth". And they miss the pain, suffering and loneliness of all those people who struggle to come to peace with their gender, never mind have their preferred gender accepted. I can honestly say I don't envy the lives/turmoil of any of the transgender people on that programme. I'd rather not put the boot in by demonising or dismissing their feelings. I'm sure the people who want to demean them could, if they had the balls, find stronger targets for their wrath. There but for the grace of God go we.

Watching the program last night and hearing that we have gone from 6 cases in 2010 to 2300 last year, suggests to me that some huge shift has happened in society that has caused this.

I also only discovered the autism link last night too.

I think most of these are mental health related issues tbh. Plus in the last 8 or so years look at how social media has changed in terms of its influence on the world and our young people. This might explain why 80% of the cases of young girls wanting to identify as boys. They are under increasing pressure to look perfect and are constantly comparing themselves to fake people with these fake lives. So they think their own body and lives are awful and they want to change it somehow.

It's a very serious issue and it has to be nipped in the bud now. We can't let 12 yr old children make decisions that might often ruin their lives as adults. And I'm sure many do. They did say that some people who got physical body changes made have regretted it later in life.

Even that fella who was the main example last night. He said in his story that he never identified as a girl and wanted to be a boy. Now he identifies as neither.

A good piece last night, well done Rte. And I don't think Lenihan said anything too controversial to be honest.

heebusjeebus

grahambo wrote: »

Right, just watched the thing on the RTE Player (RTE Player looks new btw, I haven't used it in years, I rarely watch RTE.)

Both sides made interesting and valid points about the issues Trans people face and the issues the rest of Society faces.

There were some things which annoyed me though:

1) Graham said prevy men were using this as a way to "get" women, which is ballox, there's easier ways to "get" women than that.

2) The professor who wanted to research people who reversed or wanted to reverse going through the change, but was told "No" as it might hurt peoples feelings as it was a sensitive subject... which is also ballox

3) The person they interviewed that wants to be referred to as "They". This does not make sense to me. You can't be "They", you're an individual.

4) Graham was on the show for about 30 seconds... I don't see what the fuss was about

I think point 2 & 4 go hand in hand. There is huge pressure out there to shut down any research or airing of alternate views on this subject.
This is very worrying in my opinion.

Calhoun

heebusjeebus wrote: »

I think point 2 & 4 go hand in hand. There is huge pressure out there to shut down any research or airing of alternate views on this subject.
This is very worrying in my opinion.

Even now you see the usual suspects in this thread scurrying around trying to turn this into a "your all transphobic" issue rather than let folk discuss.

It's only ok if they have full control of the subject matter and people discussing it.

Zorya

professore wrote: »

I thought it was good overall and Graham Linehan added some balance to it. Disappointed the promised debate never materialised.

Very interesting that there is an explosion in girls wanting to transition. Wonder why that is? I think mass hysteria could be a reason, or a backlash against the ridiculous Instagram culture that is almost exclusively the preserve of teenage girls. But I'm just spitballing here.

I would be dead against medical intervention for kids younger than 18 but identifying as the other gender I'd have no issue with.

Lisa Littman of Browns University published a paper in PLOS One in Aug 2018 on the social contagion called Rapid Onset Gender Dysphoria which shows how young girls especially are sucked in online into the trans cult. It is a massive problem. But unlike the way cutting or pro anorexia online gathering is treated as symptomatic of illness instead the culture is to accept what these children say when they say they are male. Radical mastectomy in early teens is increasing, puberty blockers which atrophy the developing sex organs are prescribed from 10 years old and cross sex hormones from 16. At this point in time there is a new mass phenomenon of detransitioning girls who are regarded as traitors to the trans cause. They are finding that the are left with permanent body and facial hair and male pattern baldness even years after stopping T, as they call testosterone. There are almost no studies being done into the effects of long term use of these hormones preceding detransition. These girls were often just butch lesbians who should never have been touched. I'm not replying any more to this because of the nature of the sh!t show this whole trans thing in childhood has become and people defending it. It is mutilation of young children and will be viewed in a decade or so as grotesque.

AndrewJRenko

heebusjeebus wrote: »

grahambo wrote: »

Right, just watched the thing on the RTE Player (RTE Player looks new btw, I haven't used it in years, I rarely watch RTE.)

Both sides made interesting and valid points about the issues Trans people face and the issues the rest of Society faces.

There were some things which annoyed me though:

1) Graham said prevy men were using this as a way to "get" women, which is ballox, there's easier ways to "get" women than that.

2) The professor who wanted to research people who reversed or wanted to reverse going through the change, but was told "No" as it might hurt peoples feelings as it was a sensitive subject... which is also ballox

3) The person they interviewed that wants to be referred to as "They". This does not make sense to me. You can't be "They", you're an individual.

4) Graham was on the show for about 30 seconds... I don't see what the fuss was about

I think point 2 & 4 go hand in hand. There is huge pressure out there to shut down any research or airing of alternate views on this subject.
This is very worrying in my opinion.

You can keep worrying if you choose, but there is no basis for it. No one has tried to 'shut down airing of alternative views'. Linehan is most welcome to air his views. The problem here is that Prime Time somehow positioned a comedy writer as relevant to this debate.

AndrewJRenko

Calhoun wrote: »

heebusjeebus wrote: »

I think point 2 & 4 go hand in hand. There is huge pressure out there to shut down any research or airing of alternate views on this subject.
This is very worrying in my opinion.

Even now you see the usual suspects in this thread scurrying around trying to turn this into a "your all transphobic" issue rather than let folk discuss.

Could you please point out what specific posts in this thread tried to do this? 2 or 3 examples would be great.

AndrewJRenko

Calhoun wrote: »

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Neither of the issues that you mentioned - drugs and gatekeeping - have anything to do with non-binary.. Those issues apply to the broad issue.

So really, what is your particular problem with people who declare themselves non-binary?

Just people who don't understand biology shouldn't go anywhere near children.

Just keep away from kids Andrew and we won't have any issues .

Isn't it strange though how you can't actually explain what you're afraid of? The biggest risk to children are straight men in their own family circle, despite your determination to create a mythical bogeyman to be scared of.

Calhoun

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Isn't it strange though how you can't actually explain what you're afraid of? The biggest risk to children are straight men in their own family circle, despite your determination to create a mythical bogeyman to be scared of.

I never said I was afraid of anything I just believe in the science of two genders. If you don't have a decent grasp of science should you really be on advocating for children to go through this process.

Guess what we also have a fairly big stigma around straight men being around children, if a straight man or men did what happened with the two drag queen children in Canada and America they probably would be ruined right now and in discussion with social services.

So you see it's not me who is building up the bogeyman the LGBT community is doing that themselves, combine the above with the near immunity to criticism and you get the potential for a fairly predatory group.

ohnonotgmail

Calhoun wrote: »

I never said I was afraid of anything I just believe in the science of two genders. If you don't have a decent grasp of science should you really be on advocating for children to go through this process.

Guess what we also have a fairly big stigma around straight men being around children, if a straight man or men did what happened with the two drag queen children in Canada and America they probably would be ruined right now and in discussion with social services.

So you see it's not me who is building up the bogeyman the LGBT community is doing that themselves, combine the above with the near immunity to criticism and you get the potential for a fairly predatory group.

They go through this process only after a psychiatric evaluation. But you think you know better than qualified medical professionals.

Calhoun

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

They go through this process only after a psychiatric evaluation. But you think you know better than qualified medical professionals.

They want to remove the psychiatric evaluation, that is what the trans woman on the program was arguing.

Even with the psychiatrist evaluation though I am not in favor of kids going using hormone blockers or going through surgery.

Gravelly

Calhoun wrote: »

They want to remove the psychiatric evaluation, that is what the trans woman on the program was arguing.

Even with the psychiatrist evaluation though I am not in favor of kids going using hormone blockers or going through surgery.

And didn't the guy (who's name I can't remember) who runs the clinic in Dublin say that people are sidestepping the process in order to go abroad for surgery, and the new proposed law will make this even easier.

canonball5

With 47% of trans people committing suicide post op, it's clearly more of a psychology issue than a biology issue.

Calhoun

Gravelly wrote: »

And didn't the guy (who's name I can't remember) who runs the clinic in Dublin say that people are sidestepping the process in order to go abroad for surgery, and the new proposed law will make this even easier.

What's the new proposed law ?

I guess the next act in this saga is they will claim it's unsafe for then to travel abroad so we should remove all protections so they can do it here .

ohnonotgmail

canonball5 wrote: »

With 47% of trans people committing suicide post op, it's clearly more of a psychology issue than a biology issue.

Or maybe the rate is because of external factors


https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5178031/

Results:

The suicide attempt rate among transgender persons ranges from 32% to 50% across the countries. Gender-based victimization, discrimination, bullying, violence, being rejected by the family, friends, and community; harassment by intimate partner, family members, police and public; discrimination and ill treatment at health-care system are the major risk factors that influence the suicidal behavior among transgender persons.

Gravelly

Calhoun wrote: »

What's the new proposed law ?

I guess the next act in this saga is they will claim it's unsafe for then to travel abroad so we should remove all protections so they can do it here .

Something to do with lowering the age when someone can get a cert saying they identify as whatever gender they want.

Calhoun

Gravelly wrote: »

Something to do with lowering the age when someone can get a cert saying they identify as whatever gender they want.

I am not sure how we would tackle that one, where do 16 year olds get the money to go abroad.

I am sure it will get through without any issues though and next they will lower it to 12 like other jurisdictions.

TCM

Not going to bother reading previous posts. What I will say is that we live in a democracy and he is entitled to express his opinion even if others disagree with his views.

Gravelly

Calhoun wrote: »

I am not sure how we would tackle that one, where do 16 year olds get the money to go abroad.

I am sure it will get through without any issues though and next they will lower it to 12 like other jurisdictions.

I would imagine that in most cases, it's a parent that pays for it - the concern there would be that in some cases, it seems to be a parent that is pushing the whole thing (see the cases mentioned earlier of kids of 8 or younger claiming to be trans).

randd1

canonball5 wrote: »

With 47% of trans people committing suicide post op, it's clearly more of a psychology issue than a biology issue.

Throw in the stat about the amount on the autism scale, and it would suggest something similar.

I've said it before, I think a lot of this trans thing has to do with social media attention/likes/thumbs up and peer pressure to look good amongst young people, and that they're looking for an escape route from the pressures associated with them. The fact that their hormones are all over the place as well doesn't help matters, and simply adds to the confusion.

Let them become adults, get the psychological assessment and then go down the trans route. Playing on young people's insecurities, or worse yet, raising kids as trans for your own sake, is simply not going to end well, hence the depression and suicide rates.

I firmly believe that in 30/40 years time, much in the same we cannot understand some of the notions of 30/40 years ago, people will look back and be critical of society and how ignorant we were of real and obvious psychological problems that instead of being treated, are being celebrated as LGBT diversity and cannot be questioned.

sabat

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

They go through this process only after a psychiatric evaluation. But you think you know better than qualified medical professionals.

One word. Lobotomy.

ohnonotgmail

sabat wrote: »

One word. Lobotomy.

I definitely recommend you have one.