Man, 65, convicted of purchasing sex in landmark prostitution case

skooterblue2

Johnny Red Cab wrote: »

Nope. He was caught up in a raid.

They obtained a confession that he had paid for sex. If he had stayed quiet and denied all he would have not have been convicted.

Sweet jesus. All he should have said was he was a plumber just quoting for a job. "That is the only reason I was there, I do not know these women or what is their business. My business here was to give a quote for a trades job", while being under the advisement of a lawyer. The cost over benefit of pursuing a prosecution wouldnt be worth it in that case. But here "Chatty Cathy" gave them a whole confession and possibly gave them a tour of the brothel as well.

Moral of the story is if you are caught, "No comment until my solicitor arrives". When you call for a solicitor over the phone, the less you say the better.

Despite what you may think you would have a very hard time disproving his story in court if had said nothing until the solicitor arrived.

Berserker

skooterblue2 wrote: »

Sweet jesus. All he should have said was he was a plumber just quoting for a job. "That is the only reason I was there, I do not know these women or what is their business. My business here was to give a quote for a trades job", while being under the advisement of a lawyer. The cost over benefit of pursuing a prosecution wouldnt be worth it in that case. But here "Chatty Cathy" gave them a whole confession and possibly gave them a tour of the brothel as well.

Moral of the story is if you are caught, "No comment until my solicitor arrives". When you call for a solicitor over the phone, the less you say the better.

Despite what you may think you would have a very hard time disproving his story in court if had said nothing until the solicitor arrived.

Been watching '24 Hours in Police Custody', have we? Think the police would have been able to prove that he wasn't a plumber giving someone a quote quite easily. He was caught in the premises by the police. Is being present in a brothel an offence?

Johnny Red Cab

Is being present in a brothel an offence?

Not as a punter no.

They could have caught him balls deep and without a confession they would be unable to prove the elements of the offence.
The police would have to have witnessed him handing over money. The only ways that would happen would be if the police were using an undercover operative and/or there was a camera in the room.

skooterblue2

Berserker wrote: »

Been watching '24 Hours in Police Custody', have we? Think the police would have been able to prove that he wasn't a plumber giving someone a quote quite easily. He was caught in the premises by the police. Is being present in a brothel an offence?

No I had that from a lawyer who was telling me about drugs case. He said first mistake was talking to the guards without a lawyer. Second mistake admitting it was his, and the third was admitting it was cannabis. It was only a negligible amount(far less than 10,000 worth need to make a test viable to secure a conviction). If he admitted he was in a brothel then the guards didnt have to prove it was a brothel. Remember the man regardless of what you think of him is innocent in the eyes of the law until proven guilty.

The man could have said he was any other trade from removing rubbish to tech support or giving a quote for painting and it would be difficult to prosecute. How ever if he was going at it like hells bells then he could have said it was just a one night stand.

It was probably that he got such a shock that he started talking or he got gobby with the police. I hope I am still able to hoist the flag up the pole at 65.

As for Ibrihim Halawa, its been debated on Boards to death. The lad was caught on video lying and his sister were caught out and out. Egyptian law is very different to the protections you have in Europe. As I have said before "That was an Egyptian matter".

skooterblue2

Johnny Red Cab wrote: »

Not as a punter no.

They could have caught him balls deep and without a confession they would be unable to prove the elements of the offence.
The police would have to have witnessed him handing over money. The only ways that would happen would be if the police were using an undercover operative and/or there was a camera in the room.

I am still going with the shock of the arrest and raid, he started talking. I cannot say I would have done differently under the same stress. Remember Rathoat is still a small rural place still and well ....... in that size of a community? The man probably has kids and grandkids.

I would like to think I would say nothing until a solicitor arrived.

skooterblue2

professore wrote: »

I think you mean Ivana Bacik. She has lived in the ivory tower of Trinitay her whole life. Not a person who lives in the real world.

That isn't true, she was a senator once and went to interview in RTE once or twice.... but yeah aparts from that. I am not sure she has even practiced law. You should her some of her view that women shouldnt be incarcerated and what not even if found guilty. I once foolish said she would be a viable presidential candidate (as in she had the public profile, the understanding of law and presentably, would both accept and could be elected), I was quickly put straight on that one. Ever hear about herself and the dispute with Marty Whealan (Yes that Marty Whealan) when he was running with the IRSP/INLA and he send a few pals around to ask her to step down from the student presidency race. LOADS of skeletons in that closet.

Berserker

skooterblue2 wrote: »

That isn't true, she was a senator once and went to interview in RTE once or twice.... but yeah aparts from that. I am not sure she has even practiced law. You should her some of her view that women shouldnt be incarcerated and what not even if found guilty. I once foolish said she would be a viable presidential candidate (as in she had the public profile, the understanding of law and presentably, would both accept and could be elected), I was quickly put straight on that one. Ever hear about herself and the dispute with Marty Whealan (Yes that Marty Whealan) when he was running with the IRSP/INLA and he send a few pals around to ask her to step down from the student presidency race. LOADS of skeletons in that closet.

She has a degree and Masters in Law. She practises as a barrister, and teaches courses in criminal law still, I believe.

sbsquarepants

skooterblue2 wrote: »

I was quickly put straight on that one. Ever hear about herself and the dispute with Marty Whealan (Yes that Marty Whealan) when he was running with the IRSP/INLA and he send a few pals around to ask her to step down from the student presidency race. LOADS of skeletons in that closet.

Sorry, what the ****?

Marty Whelan........ INLA.......I must be tripping?:D

skooterblue2

sbsquarepants wrote: »

Sorry, what the ****?

Marty Whelan........ INLA.......I must be tripping?:D

Yeah he hoisted the Starry Plough in Trinity college Dublin. That is a little know part of his life

AndrewJRenko

skooterblue2 wrote: »

That isn't true, she was a senator once and went to interview in RTE once or twice.... but yeah aparts from that. I am not sure she has even practiced law. You should her some of her view that women shouldnt be incarcerated and what not even if found guilty. I once foolish said she would be a viable presidential candidate (as in she had the public profile, the understanding of law and presentably, would both accept and could be elected), I was quickly put straight on that one. Ever hear about herself and the dispute with Marty Whealan (Yes that Marty Whealan) when he was running with the IRSP/INLA and he send a few pals around to ask her to step down from the student presidency race. LOADS of skeletons in that closet.

Bacik has been Reid Professor of Criminal Law, Criminology and Penology at Trinity College, Dublin (TCD) Law School since 1996, and was a made a Fellow of Trinity College Dublin in 2005, so yeah, it's safe to say she knows a bit more about the law than you or me.


As for Marty Whelan, he's 12 years older than her - so were they really in Trinity at the same time? No mention of being at college at all on his wiki. It says that he went straight from school to work in insurance, as many people did in those days. When did this amazing incident happen?

Franz Von Peppercorn

skooterblue2 wrote: »

Ever hear about herself and the dispute with Marty Whealan (Yes that Marty Whealan) when he was running with the IRSP/INLA and he send a few pals around to ask her to step down from the student presidency race. LOADS of skeletons in that closet.

You think you know someone.

skooterblue2

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Bacik has been Reid Professor of Criminal Law, Criminology and Penology at Trinity College, Dublin (TCD) Law School since 1996, and was a made a Fellow of Trinity College Dublin in 2005, so yeah, it's safe to say she knows a bit more about the law than you or me.


As for Marty Whelan, he's 12 years older than her - so were they really in Trinity at the same time? No mention of being at college at all on his wiki. It says that he went straight from school to work in insurance, as many people did in those days. When did this amazing incident happen?

I never said she didnt know about law, I said you should hear her view, particularly about men and . News flash college prepares you academically it does not prepare you for life. I very foolish said she would have made a great presidential candidate until I heard her views on men.

I would never quote a wikipedia article. I have noticed a lot of things disappear off the internet, or reference to them. You would have to be graduated and practicing a few years before you would be made a lecturer.

elperello

I don't know if this is a joke or not but here goes anyway.

You do know the Marty Whelan you mentioned is the former Fianna Fail press secretary and not the national treasure?

skooterblue2

elperello wrote: »

I don't know if this is a joke or not but here goes anyway.

You do know the Marty Whelan you mentioned is the former Fianna Fail press secretary and not the national treasure?

No, I assumed it was same one. So there is truth to the story?

elperello

skooterblue2 wrote: »

No, I assumed it was same one. So there is truth to the story?

Yes it is true there are two Marty Whelans.

skooterblue2

elperello wrote: »

Yes it is true there are two Marty Whelans.

Is there truth that there was Marty send a few lads around to have a chat about the Student Union presidency election that it was in her best interest to step aside?

elperello

skooterblue2 wrote: »

Is there truth that there was Marty send a few lads around to have a chat about the Student Union presidency election that it was in her best interest to step aside?

Can't say.

AndrewJRenko

skooterblue2 wrote: »

No, I assumed it was same one.

Isn't it funny how assumptions like that come back to bite you in the ass. You might highlight which of your future claims are based on similar assumptions in future.

skooterblue2

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Isn't it funny how assumptions like that come back to bite you in the ass. You might highlight which of your future claims are based on similar assumptions in future.

It could happen to a bishop, you yourself never, ever made a similar assumption?

AndrewJRenko

skooterblue2 wrote: »

It could happen to a bishop, you yourself never, ever made a similar assumption?

I'm fairly sure I've never said "the dispute with XXXX(Yes that XXXX)" when I didn't actually know that it was XXXX, particularly when the context of the issue makes it fairly unlikely (due to the age difference in this case)

skooterblue2

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

I'm fairly sure I've never said "the dispute with XXXX(Yes that XXXX)" when I didn't actually know that it was XXXX, particularly when the context of the issue makes it fairly unlikely (due to the age difference in this case)

As a person who never made a mistake in their life, I take my hat off to you, sir.

sparksfly

A simple code of practice can be introduced between the two parties to eliminate the risk of falling foul of the law. E.g., the client asks the lady to first show him her "undercarriage", perfectly legal if no mention of payment occurs. I doubt very much if an undercover cop would oblige. If she baulks, run like fkuc.

professore

sparksfly wrote: »

A simple code of practice can be introduced between the two parties to eliminate the risk of falling foul of the law. E.g., the client asks the lady to first show him her "undercarriage", perfectly legal if no mention of payment occurs. I doubt very much if an undercover cop would oblige. If she baulks, run like fkuc.

Only problem with that is that the Gardai are probably their best customers.

AndrewJRenko

skooterblue2 wrote: »

As a person who never made a mistake in their life, I take my hat off to you, sir.

I've made lots of mistakes - but I don't throw around allegations about named people lightly.

Guy:Incognito

sparksfly wrote: »

A simple code of practice can be introduced between the two parties to eliminate the risk of falling foul of the law. E.g., the client asks the lady to first show him her "undercarriage", perfectly legal if no mention of payment occurs. I doubt very much if an undercover cop would oblige. If she baulks, run like fkuc.

I very much doubt a prostitute is going to show any man that ask her "undercarriage" for free either.

skooterblue2

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

I've made lots of mistakes - but I don't throw around allegations about named people lightly.

You will often find that people sign up with silly organisations at college for the sake a few free pints or a free calculator and it comes back to haunt them later in life. I believe there is a picture of one Hilary Rodham burning an American flag. Proinsias De Rossa was involved in forging £5 notes when he was with some far left wing of the workers party.

I have never been one to get involved in college politics, but careers are made and sunk there. There is always an old school friend in the background willing to come out and spill the beans at an opportune moment.

sparksfly

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

I very much doubt a prostitute is going to show any man that ask her "undercarriage" for free either.

How about a feel of the headlights then?

AndrewJRenko

skooterblue2 wrote: »

You will often find that people sign up with silly organisations at college for the sake a few free pints or a free calculator and it comes back to haunt them later in life. I believe there is a picture of one Hilary Rodham burning an American flag. Proinsias De Rossa was involved in forging £5 notes when he was with some far left wing of the workers party.

I have never been one to get involved in college politics, but careers are made and sunk there. There is always an old school friend in the background willing to come out and spill the beans at an opportune moment.

Are you sure that's the Hilary Rodham Clinton and the Proinsias De Rossa?


I'm not sure really the student politics thing has been that big of an issue over here.

skooterblue2

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Are you sure that's the Hilary Rodham Clinton and the Proinsias De Rossa?


I'm not sure really the student politics thing has been that big of an issue over here.

Over here most politics has been clannish but in the university circuit a Student Union president has often gone to be a Senator.

Johnny Red Cab

skooterblue2 wrote: »

Over here most politics has been clannish but in the university circuit a Student Union president has often gone to be a Senator.

Or a pariah! Katie Ascough is a good case in point.

elperello

skooterblue2 wrote: »

You will often find that people sign up with silly organisations at college for the sake a few free pints or a free calculator and it comes back to haunt them later in life. I believe there is a picture of one Hilary Rodham burning an American flag. Proinsias De Rossa was involved in forging £5 notes when he was with some far left wing of the workers party.

I have never been one to get involved in college politics, but careers are made and sunk there. There is always an old school friend in the background willing to come out and spill the beans at an opportune moment.

You might care to link to the HRC allegation.

The other allegation I'd advise you to delete.
That was tested all the way to the Supreme Court and cost Independent Newspapers £IR 300,000.

skooterblue2

elperello wrote: »

You might care to link to the HRC allegation.

The other allegation I'd advise you to delete.
That was tested all the way to the Supreme Court and cost Independent Newspapers £IR 300,000.

That sort of thing has been going on for years. Remember them lads from the INLA who went over to North Korean for training? The North Koreans gave them loads of counterfeit US bills to launder in Ireland. You could make a film of it.

elperello

skooterblue2 wrote: »

That sort of thing has been going on for years. Remember them lads from the INLA who went over to North Korean for training? The North Koreans gave them loads of counterfeit US bills to launder in Ireland. You could make a film of it.

No comment.

Robert Wolfe

Good God Ivana Bacik is ugly.

elperello

No need for that.

skooterblue2

elperello wrote: »

No comment.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/official-iras-terror-trip-to-north-korea-29760564.html


The "interview" isnt a patch on the real life story. :D:D:D

skooterblue2

Robert Wolfe wrote: »

Good God Ivana Bacik is ugly.

Sir, you should go where no man has gone before.........

Robert Wolfe

skooterblue2 wrote: »

Sir, you should go where no man has gone before.........

If me and her were the last two people on earth, I would rather smash my head open with a rock.

Johnny Red Cab

sparksfly wrote: »

A simple code of practice can be introduced between the two parties to eliminate the risk of falling foul of the law. E.g., the client asks the lady to first show him her "undercarriage", perfectly legal if no mention of payment occurs. I doubt very much if an undercover cop would oblige. If she baulks, run like fkuc.

sparksfly wrote: »

How about a feel of the headlights then?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W3aCTNvAmF0

skooterblue2

Robert Wolfe wrote: »

If me and her were the last two people on earth, I would rather smash my head open with a rock.

ahhhh Jaysus!!!

AndrewJRenko

Robert Wolfe wrote: »

Good God Ivana Bacik is ugly.

skooterblue2 wrote: »

Sir, you should go where no man has gone before.........

Robert Wolfe wrote: »

If me and her were the last two people on earth, I would rather smash my head open with a rock.

This says so much more about you two big brave lads than it does about the lady concerned.

Robert Wolfe

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

This says so much more about you two big brave lads than it does about the lady concerned.

I can't stand that witch.

She looks like a human that was half assimilated by The Thing.

skooterblue2

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

This says so much more about you two big brave lads than it does about the lady concerned.

"Ohhhhh she looks like the lost Disney Irish princess, I would approach her only that would be inappropriate because I am using my masculine toxicity in an inappropriate way in this post modern era". Does that make you happy?

Why dont you ask her out? Valentines day is coming up. Go up and ask her to take pity on you!!

AndrewJRenko

Robert Wolfe wrote: »

I can't stand that witch.

She looks like a human that was half assimilated by The Thing.

Most civilised adults find it possible to disagree with somebody's position without being personally insulting about someone's appearance.

skooterblue2 wrote: »

"Ohhhhh she looks like the lost Disney Irish princess, I would approach her only that would be inappropriate because I am using my masculine toxicity in an inappropriate way in this post modern era". Does that make you happy?

Why dont you ask her out? Valentines day is coming up. Go up and ask her to take pity on you!!

She's married with kids as it happens, so I'd guess her attractiveness to you and the other big lads here is fairly low on her list of concerns.



Did you ever watch Ballroom of Romance, with the thick, ignorant sneering big lads on the far side of the hall eyeing up the women?

skooterblue2

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Did you ever watch Ballroom of Romance, with the thick, ignorant sneering big lads on the far side of the hall eyeing up the women?

No, I havent had the privilege, I am a straight red blooded male. but carry on!!
Have you ever seen Gladiator, Hannibal Brooks or As good as it gets?

skooterblue2

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

She's married with kids as it happens, so I'd guess her attractiveness to you and the other big lads here is fairly low on her list of concerns.

Christ on a bike .... they are breeding them, notice not "husband" but "Domestic partner"...... totally a "house-bound".

AndrewJRenko

skooterblue2 wrote: »

Christ on a bike .... they are breeding them, notice not "husband" but "Domestic partner"...... totally a "house-bound".

Are you drunk tonight or what?

skooterblue2

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Are you drunk tonight or what?

What does it matter? I still wouldnt go on a date with her!!!

AndrewJRenko

skooterblue2 wrote: »

What does it matter? I still wouldnt go on a date with her!!!

I think you can rest assured that she won't be looking for your phone number.


She prefers people with an IQ in three figures.

skooterblue2

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

I think you can rest assured that she won't be looking for your phone number.


She prefers people with an IQ in three figures.

Oh I am fine with that I am engaged, all properly sorted. I was worried you wouldn't be getting any action.