Brexit discussion thread VII (Please read OP before posting)

Imreoir2

downcow wrote: »

The irony is that it is the very insistence on an indefinite backstop that is going to ensure a very hard border and very poor long term relationships between UK & ireland. Genuinely very sad.

Without the backstop we get a hard border anyway, nothing lost by insisting the British abide by their commitments.

Roanmore

Strazdas wrote: »

https://twitter.com/HMcEntee/status/1094208023369633793

Who is Eoin O'Malley to insist the Irish Government responds, just gives JRM more sense of importance than he already has.

Mr.Nice Guy

https://twitter.com/pmdfoster/status/1094272467256963072

Do the ERG types like Rees-Mogg not realise the more they threaten the more people realise the necessity of the backstop?

Zubeneschamali

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

May should feel proud of her part in all of this.

I think May would be very pleased - this has been her entire agenda as Home Secretary and PM: Go home Johnny Foreigner.


Well, she'd be pleased if it weren't for the upcoming end of her career, the UK and worse, the Tory party, that is.

Imreoir2

Imreoir2 wrote: »

Without the backstop we get a hard border anyway, nothing lost by insisting the British abide by their commitments.

Every time I try to reply to this guy, I find out he has been banned later on in the thread.

VinLieger

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

I think May would be very pleased - this has been her entire agenda as Home Secretary and PM: Go home Johnny Foreigner.


Well, she'd be pleased if it weren't for the upcoming end of her career, the UK and worse, the Tory party, that is.

Dont foret without the eu they dont have to worry about any pesky data protection or citizen surveillance laws, that was her big thing as home sec

Enzokk

Capt'n Midnight wrote: »

The only thing she has kept steady on is her hatred of the European Human Rights Courts. Which means red lines for Norway or EFTA too.

And if she pulls out of the ECtHR (European Court of Human Rights) she pulls out of the ECHR (European Convention of Human Rights) as the courts are where disputes on the ECHR is held. The GFA is quite clear on this and there is no grey areas like the border. It mentions that the UK will incorporate the ECHR into NI law so even if she somehow keeps NI in the customs union and single market by having an Irish Sea, she cannot just leave the ECHR or ECtHR unless she uncouples NI even more from the UK.

Good Friday Agreement

United Kingdom Legislation
2. The British Government will complete incorporation into Northern Ireland law of the
European Convention on Human Rights (ECHR), with direct access to the courts, and
remedies for breach of the Convention, including power for the courts to overrule Assembly
legislation on grounds of inconsistency.

Capt'n Midnight

Zubeneschamali wrote: »

I think May would be very pleased - this has been her entire agenda as Home Secretary and PM: Go home Johnny Foreigner.


Well, she'd be pleased if it weren't for the upcoming end of her career, the UK and worse, the Tory party, that is.

Austerity continues.
She has reduced EU immigration by making the UK a worse place to live for most people.




At the same time the only thing she has done about non-EU immigration , something that has been under her control for the last 8 years, is to put the UK in a position were India will be getting more Visas in any trade deal.




One side benefit for the Tory party is getting rid of Johnny Foreigner will undermine the NHS making it easier to push for a "rescue plan" using a US for profit.

Marcusm

prawnsambo wrote: »

The point he was making is that while the deal was ongoing, Arklow were kept out of the limelight in order to maximise value. Now that it's over, there's no need to keep it quiet.

Arklow SHipping's fleet is based on bulk shipping whereas the Ramsgate based operation was going to be roll on-roll off to supplement what might get delayed through Dover and/or the Chunnel.

I suspect that when it came down to it that Arklow Shipping couldn't;t acquire sufficient vessels (i.e. it's own fleet was not suitable) at a price which made sense. I don't see any sharp practice in what they have done whatsoever.

fash

ThePanjandrum wrote: »

By the way, regarding all this panic about chlorinated chicken

1. There is no danger from it, according to EU studies, it's a non-tariff method of restricting imports
2. The EU produces chlorine washed salad anyway, same process
3. How many of you who go on holiday or live in the USA refuse to eat the chicken and other food anyway?
4, Chlorine washing is a good method of health protection anyway.

Please provide these studies - my information is that chlorine washing is ineffective and leaves salmonella spread around kitchens etc.

Marcusm

Deleted User wrote: »

I also like the subtle message in the incredibly petty act to have meringue as a dessert. Presumably the caterers would have been aware that May is a diabetic and couldn't eat it.

"Let them eat meringue?"

Doesn't mean she can't eat it, just means she has to adjust her insulin dose (she is type 1). The fruit is also heavy in sugar but accompanied by fibre etc doesn't get absorbed so quickly.

I have more problem in a cheese course being described as dessert.

Charles Babbage

murphaph wrote: »

I wouldn't bank on anything if it's a hard Brexit. Personally I would be surprised if there isn't panic buying of food possibly leading to a run on the banks as people scramble to convert their savings to some other currency.

A crash out Brexit completely changes the British economy. It's a seismic change we are talking about.

I'm not sure that some of the more dramatic predictions are justified. But things are calm because half the English haven't considered the implications, once people start stocking up then it becomes a self fulfulling prophecy.

Marcusm

Enzokk wrote: »

Except the time of civil servants working on the contracts for these, there was no public money spent.

Here is an interesting exchange about the Seaborne saga and why they used the justification of circumstances out of the ordinary to award the contract without a public tender.

https://twitter.com/joannaccherry/status/1082996064179970053

So more smoke and mirrors and no reason given.





I doubt they will get enough votes for any MPs, much like UKIP. They may get a million in total all over the country but not enough to make a difference to the arithmetic in parliament. If Labour keeps their focus on the policies that matter the votes they will gain will be from the Tories mainly. I mean will they have a clear plan for housing? What about the NHS and funding for local councils and services? Just banging on about the EU when people are already fed up about it may not be the best plan.

THey're getting prepared for the local elections in May and any possible European election. UKIP won 24/73 of the UK MEP positions at the 2014 election, i.e. the largest number. Quite a few of them (including FArage) are no longer associated with UKIP. If the Euro elections are run in the UK, expect to see an even larger protest vote against established parties. The list system (a type of PR) used for Euro elections produces vastly different results than first past the post.

An Ciarraioch

SDLP-FF partnership approved by 70%:

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-47179888

Infini

Imreoir2 wrote: »

Every time I try to reply to this guy, I find out he has been banned later on in the thread.

In fairness whoever they are doesnt seem willing to debate objectively which is a pity as I think everyone would appreciate someone who could debate this with the facts we have rather than end up going round in circles from selective responces without any factual backup. c_c

Also a ty to the mods for their hard work trying to keep this thread on rails!

Infini

An Ciarraioch wrote: »

SDLP-FF partnership approved by 70%:

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-47179888

Wish them well on this.Its a pity the SDLP have declined in recent years though maybe they might be able to turn things around in the coming months.

prawnsambo

Charles Babbage wrote: »

I'm not sure that some of the more dramatic predictions are justified. But things are calm because half the English haven't considered the implications, once people start stocking up then it becomes a self fulfulling prophecy.

Most of the predictions are necessarily quite coarse. Things like mass movement of financial assets are already happening, but the effect on the exchequer won't be felt for some time and financial services jobs will just be a slow bleed rather than a massive whack like say Nissan closing. The same with supply of goods, which again are showing some early signs wrt some of the rarer medications. It's the more subtle stuff that will be hard er to predict this far out and the possible domino affects as each economic butterfly wing flap causes another and another.

Just think what a further large drop in sterling, coupled with the imposition of tariffs could cause on inflation.

Infini

Charles Babbage wrote: »

I'm not sure that some of the more dramatic predictions are justified. But things are calm because half the English haven't considered the implications, once people start stocking up then it becomes a self fulfulling prophecy.

In fairness theres a lull still that the UK will still get a deal though. The minute that facade fails though and things will accelerate and turn nasty. If theres a vote in late march in westminster on any deal things will turn nasty very quickly unless theres the prospect of an A50 withdrawal in the event of no agreement happening on the WA.

An Ciarraioch

And Labour already tweet their response, but hardly have the resources to go North now?

https://mobile.twitter.com/labour/status/1094289747021885441/photo/1

Infini

An Ciarraioch wrote: »

And Labour already tweet their response, but hardly have the resources to go North now?

https://mobile.twitter.com/labour/status/1094289747021885441/photo/1

In fairness Labour down here will likely be a damage brand for the immedate time being in part due to the water fiasco. Tis a pity though but people have long memories on them still.

Mr.Nice Guy

An Ciarraioch wrote: »

And Labour already tweet their response, but hardly have the resources to go North now?

I'd say it's more likely the UK Labour party will enter the NI scene now. Hard to see them still regarding the SDLP as a 'sister party' under this new arrangement and it's clear there's little warmth between Eastwood and Corbyn.

fash

Inquitus wrote: »

LOL, the British are about the most intolerant people in the EU, I spent 20 years living there. Nice attempt at trolling though.

In Europe, I’ve lived in the UK, Germany, Spain, France and Austria (aside from Ireland and outside the EU) - and 100% agree.

fash

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

https://twitter.com/pmdfoster/status/1094272467256963072

Do the ERG types like Rees-Mogg not realise the more they threaten the more people realise the necessity of the backstop?

Do you think he cares about NI? All he wants is a no deal and the end justifies any means. The only thing that would help is to seize Somerset Capital for financial irregularities.

Charles Babbage

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

I'd say it's more likely the UK Labour party will enter the NI scene now. Hard to see them still regarding the SDLP as a 'sister party' under this new arrangement and it's clear there's little warmth between Eastwood and Corbyn.

Corbyn would likely give the franchise to SF.

Imreoir2

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

I'd say it's more likely the UK Labour party will enter the NI scene now. Hard to see them still regarding the SDLP as a 'sister party' under this new arrangement and it's clear there's little warmth between Eastwood and Corbyn.

Hard to see UK labour, especially under Corbyn picking up many votes from Nationalists given how they have handeled Brexit to date. At best they could slightly dilute the Unionist vote but I can't see them making much headway on either side.

Strazdas

Imreoir2 wrote: »

Hard to see UK labour, especially under Corbyn picking up many votes from Nationalists given how they have handeled Brexit to date. At best they could slightly dilute the Unionist vote but I can't see them making much headway on either side.

It's a good point. Also, I sense that Corbyn has shot his bolt in the Republic and is not a popular figure here either. Even from personal conversations, people have very little respect for him and the way he is enabling Brexit.

Adamcp898

Marcusm wrote: »

Doesn't mean she can't eat it, just means she has to adjust her insulin dose (she is type 1). The fruit is also heavy in sugar but accompanied by fibre etc doesn't get absorbed so quickly.

I have more problem in a cheese course being described as dessert.

I'd say the meringue was a nod to this whole 'Eton Mess'

Or if nothing else it's a much more entertaining way to read the menu.

Water John

The problem of chlorinated chicken is that the process is used to cover lower hygiene standards in processing units and poultry farms in the US.
Never liked it being used on salads either. Far better to minimise contamination risk with high standards.

prawnsambo

Water John wrote: »

The problem of chlorinated chicken is that the process is used to cover lower hygiene standards in processing units and poultry farms in the US.
Never liked it being used on salads either. Far better to minimise contamination risk with high standards.

What was that horrifying statistic about food-borne illnesses in the US? One in four people or something very high like that suffer one every year.

Infini

prawnsambo wrote: »

What was that horrifying statistic about food-borne illnesses in the US? One in four people or something very high like that suffer one every year.

https://www.cdc.gov/foodsafety/foodborne-germs.html

48million people a year according to US CDC.