Ireland v England 4:45 Aviva Stadium

Shefwedfan

aloooof wrote: »

Wrong. You can sack Schmidt, sack the whole management team and you will still end up with a manager who doesn't pick Zebo because guess what... he plays outside Ireland.

I get it, you don't like Zebo. But he's plenty good enough to be in and around the 23. The last 6 Nations he was available he started all 5 matches. We've had Stockdale and Larmour emerge since then, but to suggest he isn't good enough to be involved is nonsense.

I don't like Zebo :P


It's the same few posters who are on here all the time about Zebo. Someone who hasn't played for Ireland in how many months now?



Maybe, just maybe I can critique the player like most other people seem to be able to do it.



I would prefer to see D Ryan come back from Racing, he would bring some real steel back into the team.


If you forget what Zebo is actually like, watch the semi v Leinster last season.....

troyzer

Shefwedfan wrote: »

aloooof wrote: »

Wrong. You can sack Schmidt, sack the whole management team and you will still end up with a manager who doesn't pick Zebo because guess what... he plays outside Ireland.

I get it, you don't like Zebo. But he's plenty good enough to be in and around the 23. The last 6 Nations he was available he started all 5 matches. We've had Stockdale and Larmour emerge since then, but to suggest he isn't good enough to be involved is nonsense.

I don't like Zebo :P


It's the same few posters who are on here all the time about Zebo. Someone who hasn't played for Ireland in how many months now?



Maybe, just maybe I can critique the player like most other people seem to be able to do it.



I would prefer to see DOC come back from Racing, he would bring some real steel back into the team.


If you forget what Zebo is actually like, watch the semi v Leinster last season.....

Zebo hasn't played a meaningful game in an Ireland jersey in two years

troyzer

troyzer wrote: »

Shefwedfan wrote: »

aloooof wrote: »

Wrong. You can sack Schmidt, sack the whole management team and you will still end up with a manager who doesn't pick Zebo because guess what... he plays outside Ireland.

I get it, you don't like Zebo. But he's plenty good enough to be in and around the 23. The last 6 Nations he was available he started all 5 matches. We've had Stockdale and Larmour emerge since then, but to suggest he isn't good enough to be involved is nonsense.

I don't like Zebo :P


It's the same few posters who are on here all the time about Zebo. Someone who hasn't played for Ireland in how many months now?



Maybe, just maybe I can critique the player like most other people seem to be able to do it.



I would prefer to see DOC come back from Racing, he would bring some real steel back into the team.


If you forget what Zebo is actually like, watch the semi v Leinster last season.....

Zebo hasn't played a meaningful game in an Ireland jersey in two years

And that was all on the left wing as well, not fullback.

Shefwedfan

troyzer wrote: »

Zebo hasn't played a meaningful game in an Ireland jersey in two years

Exactly, Donnacha Ryans last game as well but we don't have thread after thread about him

He would be a better player to parachute into the current Irish squad.

Would you not think he is a better addition than Zebo?

troyzer

Shefwedfan wrote: »

troyzer wrote: »

Zebo hasn't played a meaningful game in an Ireland jersey in two years

Exactly, Donnacha Ryans last game as well but we don't have thread after thread about him

He would be a better player to parachute into the current Irish squad.

Would you not think he is a better addition than Zebo?

Ryan? Meh. Probably not. He's a good lock but ultimately I'd rather throw Dillane, Roux or even Thornbury, Moloney etc into the mix. At least you'll develop them a little rather than resort to what is effectively a joker.

Zebo would not have been playing on Saturday even if he was in Munster. It's unlikely anyway.

aloooof

Shefwedfan wrote: »

I don't like Zebo :P


It's the same few posters who are on here all the time about Zebo. Someone who hasn't played for Ireland in how many months now?



Maybe, just maybe I can critique the player like most other people seem to be able to do it.



I would prefer to see D Ryan come back from Racing, he would bring some real steel back into the team.


If you forget what Zebo is actually like, watch the semi v Leinster last season.....

Look, I agree, it's largely pointless as he won't (and shouldn't) be considered for selection while he's not playing in Ireland. But I think he's clearly good enough to be involved.

And I don't think a sample size of one specific game proves otherwise. This weekend being a perfect illustration of that fact.

Shefwedfan

troyzer wrote: »

Ryan? Meh. Probably not. He's a good lock but ultimately I'd rather throw Dillane, Roux or even Thornbury, Moloney etc into the mix. At least you'll develop them a little rather than resort to what is effectively a joker.

Zebo would not have been playing on Saturday even if he was in Munster. It's unlikely anyway.

Holland was just brought into the squad....maybe repost after that bombshell

troyzer

Shefwedfan wrote: »

troyzer wrote: »

Ryan? Meh. Probably not. He's a good lock but ultimately I'd rather throw Dillane, Roux or even Thornbury, Moloney etc into the mix. At least you'll develop them a little rather than resort to what is effectively a joker.

Zebo would not have been playing on Saturday even if he was in Munster. It's unlikely anyway.

Holland was just brought into the squad....maybe repost after that bombshell

It's an interesting one alright. He's been on good form recently.

Shefwedfan

troyzer wrote: »

It's an interesting one alright. He's been on good form recently.

I would take Ryan a million times over holland

Raisins

TheCitizen wrote: »

So now we're to believe they were late to their seats cos they were in the toilet:pac:

It’s very little you have to be worried about if take the issue of people coming in and out of seats at a sports event this seriously.

Pussyhands

Faugheen wrote: »

****e defender, awful positioning and pretty much has flattered to deceive in a green jersey. His comments after leaving and his constant reference to Sexton’s situation suggests a bad attitude and an air of self-entitlement.

How many more chances does he need?

Look at the most recent RWC winning full backs: Ben Smith, Israel Dagg, Percy Montgomery, Josh Lewsey. What they all have in common is that they did their bread and butter, and weren’t reliant on being flashy or looking good on the eye to deliver for their team. Certainly Dagg and Smith can do that, but they were in their respective positions to marshall the backfield and always did that really well. Zebo does absolutely none of that.

This Zebo nonsense is getting absolutely irritating because it’s the same arguments and the same bull**** every time an international window comes up. “He’s class”, “they did it for Sexton” etc etc etc.

He’s gone. He chose to leave. He chose making a few bob for his family and I for one respect that. However, he’s not coming back because he isn’t playing his rugby here and he’s not good enough. Get. Over. It.

Zebo gets into this team as a winger in place of Earls 10 times out of 10.

And he gets into this team at fullback 100 times out of 100 ahead of Jamie Roberts MKII. Can't believe he put a battering ram at fullback.

FrancieBrady

Pussyhands wrote: »

Zebo gets into this team as a winger in place of Earls 10 times out of 10.

And he gets into this team at fullback 100 times out of 100 ahead of Jamie Roberts MKII. Can't believe he put a battering ram at fullback.

No he doesn't. He isn't available or eligible. Now will you all kindly leave it out.

The Rape of Lucretia

FrancieBrady wrote: »

No he doesn't. He isn't available or eligible. Now will you all kindly leave it out.

Not the case - he is both available, and eligible.
He would like to play for Ireland again.
And it is simply a voluntary restriction by Ireland to prefer not to select players based off the island.

The Rape of Lucretia

I wouldnt pick him in a fit though.

FrancieBrady

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

Not the case - he is both available, and eligible.
He would like to play for Ireland again.
And it is simply a voluntary restriction by Ireland to prefer not to select players based off the island.

Well get that rescinded and get back to us. In the meantime, he is unavailable because he is ineligible.

Pussyhands

Zebo going to france would have been great for Joe. Joe never fancied him anyways so it was an easy excuse to drop him.

Would Joe have selected ringrose, Henshaw, Earls if they went to France? Of course he would!

Joe has his favourites, Sean O'Brien being an obvious one. Lad hasn't done anything in an irish jersey for years, injuries aside.

jm08

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Well get that rescinded and get back to us. In the meantime, he is unavailable because he is ineligible.

If Rob Kearney's form doesn't improve, I think Schmidt would be foolish not to bring Zebo to the world cup as he would actually bring the same kind of confidence and big game mentality that Kearney brings.

Both Larmour and Conway are not options as they are too small at fullback. Both excellent wingers though. And, Zebo will have a couple of months preseason for the world cup, so making sporadic training camps won't be an issue.

It will be interesting to see what Joe does anyway.

Listening to Donnacha Ryan talking last week about how important Dev Toner is to the Ireland lineout as the lineout caller. Said that it takes years to get to his standard of expertise. While he didn't say it, I got the impression that he was withholding praise for the rest of the locks until they sorted out this aspect of their game.

Faugheen

Pussyhands wrote: »

Zebo going to france would have been great for Joe. Joe never fancied him anyways so it was an easy excuse to drop him.

Would Joe have selected ringrose, Henshaw, Earls if they went to France? Of course he would!

Joe has his favourites, Sean O'Brien being an obvious one. Lad hasn't done anything in an irish jersey for years, injuries aside.

Picks on SOB for 'not doing anything' in an Irish jersey while pushing for Zebo, who has actually done the square root of **** all in an Irish jersey for years.

How many chances does Zebo need to show that he's not good enough?

How do you know what Joe would do if those players left? He could easily pick Aki, Farrell and Larmour if those three upped and left.

However fact is they haven't left, because to play for Ireland you have to play in Ireland, which is why they're all still here. Zebo decided to leave.

Once again, get over it.

Faugheen

jm08 wrote: »

If Rob Kearney's form doesn't improve, I think Schmidt would be foolish not to bring Zebo to the world cup as he would actually bring the same kind of confidence and big game mentality that Kearney brings.

Both Larmour and Conway are not options as they are too small at fullback. Both excellent wingers though. And, Zebo will have a couple of months preseason for the world cup, so making sporadic training camps won't be an issue.

It will be interesting to see what Joe does anyway.

Listening to Donnacha Ryan talking last week about how important Dev Toner is to the Ireland lineout as the lineout caller. Said that it takes years to get to his standard of expertise. While he didn't say it, I got the impression that he was withholding praise for the rest of the locks until they sorted out this aspect of their game.

What do you mean if Kearney's form doesn't improve?

Which Rob Kearney have you been watching this season?

One bad game against the Scarlets while half-fit does not equal out of form.

Jesus Christ some people here really don't want Kearney in the team to the point that they make up lies about his 'form'.

jm08

Faugheen wrote: »

What do you mean if Kearney's form doesn't improve?

Which Rob Kearney have you been watching this season?

One bad game against the Scarlets while half-fit does not equal out of form.

Jesus Christ some people here really don't want Kearney in the team to the point that they make up lies about his 'form'.

Cool the jets there. I'm a Kearney fan. I hope he gets back his fitness and form. Hard to ignore now, but he does get injured a fair bit now.

jm08

Faugheen wrote: »

Picks on SOB for 'not doing anything' in an Irish jersey while pushing for Zebo, who has actually done the square root of **** all in an Irish jersey for years.

How many chances does Zebo need to show that he's not good enough?

How do you know what Joe would do if those players left? He could easily pick Aki, Farrell and Larmour if those three upped and left.

However fact is they haven't left, because to play for Ireland you have to play in Ireland, which is why they're all still here. Zebo decided to leave.

Once again, get over it.

Put this another way then - SOB hasn't been doing it in any jersey because he has been mainly injured since the Lions Tour. Zebo is playing regularly at least and earning enough to suggest that the people with the cheque book that he is plenty good (and he had the choice of a couple of clubs in France).

Faugheen

jm08 wrote: »

Put this another way then - SOB hasn't been doing it in any jersey because he has been mainly injured since the Lions Tour. Zebo is playing regularly at least and earning enough to suggest that the people with the cheque book that he is plenty good (and he had the choice of a couple of clubs in France).

And I’ll say it once again - Zebo left. Zebo chose to leave. Get over it.

He has always looked better at club level than he did at international level. Fact is overall for Ireland he was bang average and I’m perfectly fine with a player who has only ever been bang average not being called up if it means players will get the message that if you want to play for Ireland, you play in Ireland.

SOB has had his injuries but when fit and firing he is a world class player. Zebo is nowhere near that level.

The fact you are happy for the floodgates to open because you want a player who was only ever bang average for Ireland being called up worries me. What message does it send to the players who chose to stay?

Think bigger picture here, and not about a man who had a choice and he chose to leave.

If he goes back to Munster, then we can talk about it again. Until then, he shouldn’t be brought back.

This obsession with Zebo from some quarters here, to the point that they want to risk other players getting up to leave so he can be in the Ireland squad, is absolutely baffling. He is not that good and there are better players than him at full back and on the wing.

Deaf student

Ireland didn't have a clue as there was no plan B. They were predictable as England were able to use it with their quick linespeed to prevent another attack. They used Ireland's previous tactics of high ball and breakdown.

Murray was awfully bad as he was kicking all day with no variation. So predictable. Heard that Sexton wasn't playing for 4 weeks until saturday game. Why did Joe pick him even through he wasn't playing for a month? Was he taking a gamble on this which later backfired on him?

Schmidt plan doesnt allow for any creative players to shine or be able to think on their feet when their plan goes awry. Most Irish players weren't able to think for themselves. Bit of a robotic team which was predictable.

Thought SOB made an impact as i understand he was out long due to broken arm but late substitution didn't have any effects. Joe should have called Stander early re subs then perhaps SOB might have an effect.

Also strangely that Murray wasn't replaced until very late into the game as he was very bad that day aimless kicking and very slow at the ruck. It seems to me that Schmidt wasn't quick in his decisions when things go bad as he was slow in reacting to that.Maybe he was too loyal to players.

Cooney was quick when he replaced Murray which was good to see. I would push for him re selection in team next sat. Give Sexton time to recover from rustiness. Henshaw was quite exposed big time as he is clearly not suitable for no 15 position. He often drifts as England were able to spot the gap. Realised now that Kearney is streets ahead re positional placement. Zebo would be my choice or Conway. Schmidt picking Henshaw for a big game was a big gamble. I would have preferred an easier game like Italy to try out Henshaw in no 15 to see if it fits or not. Ringrose played well despite English's attacks.

Earls was quite targeted as no5 englsih lock should be given a YELLOW but ref kept his cards in his pocket.

Glad that Ireland lost cos it gave us a wake up call re Ireland's team so it would be upwards and change of plan or needs to adapt plan B if things go wrong. Could see Scotland beat Ireland.

Schmidt plan doesn't allow any creative players as they must adhere to his plan 100%. Once Schmidt plan doesn't work then players unable to think for themselves re plan B.

kuang1

Should play a drinking game while reading this thread:

"Wake up call" - drink.

That's all.

Some of Murray's kicks were absolutely inch perfect in the first half

tritriagain

Im not zebos biggest fan but find it funny that people are saying he knew he couldn't be picked cos of the unwritten rule. Didn't Jonny know about the rule.... Oh wait it didn't effect him.

Faugheen

tritriagain wrote: »

Im not zebos biggest fan but find it funny that people are saying he knew he couldn't be picked cos of the unwritten rule. Didn't Jonny know about the rule.... Oh wait it didn't effect him.

It wasn't in place then.

Also, Sexton had it written into his contract that he could leave for Ireland camps. Does Zebo have this in his Racing contract? I doubt it, he's not one of the best players in the world so doesn't hold that much clout.

Why do the same points have to be made over, and over, and over again in relation to this?

Rules were brought in to ensure what happened with Sexton didn't happen again. You leave, you don't get picked. Tough sh*t.

Burkie1203

tritriagain wrote: »

Im not zebos biggest fan but find it funny that people are saying he knew he couldn't be picked cos of the unwritten rule. Didn't Jonny know about the rule.... Oh wait it didn't effect him.

IRFU have to protect their interests

-pick player overseas for Ireland, more players could be tempted to go

- that weakens the provinces if any top players go meaning Euro success is less likely

- Ireland prep is compromised for 6n because some top players might not be able to train for almost half of the 6n with the rest of the squad. And if they rock up with knocks they miss some of the few sessions they are available for. Look at France as an example.

- Results suffer, Income drops. Money available to provinces drops. IRFU have invested for a reason. They upped their investment in Connacht for a reason. They are facilitating players moving to other provinces for a reason.


It's all very well throwing Zebos name out there but i guess when you dont have to worry about the other stuff then it sounds like a great idea.

If Zebo was based in Ireland he would make extended squads. Not sure he would make the 23 barring injury. So thats not strong enough to abandon the policy when you consider everything.

This stuff isn't difficult to figure out.


Sexton was the best 10 available by a long way and had release clauses. We have plenty of back 3 options in Zebo's absence (Larmour Kearney Addison Stockdale Conway Byrne Earls)

tritriagain

Burkie1203 wrote: »

IRFU have to protect their interests

-pick player overseas for Ireland, more players could be tempted to go

- that weakens the provinces if any top players go meaning Euro success is less likely

- Ireland prep is compromised for 6n because some top players might not be able to train for almost half of the 6n with the rest of the squad. And if they rock up with knocks they miss some of the few sessions they are available for. Look at France as an example.

- Results suffer, Income drops. Money available to provinces drops. IRFU have invested for a reason. They upped their investment in Connacht for a reason. They are facilitating players moving to other provinces for a reason.


It's all very well throwing Zebos name out there but i guess when you dont have to worry about the other stuff then it sounds like a great idea.

If Zebo was based in Ireland he would make extended squads. Not sure he would make the 23 barring injury. So thats not strong enough to abandon the policy when you consider everything.

This stuff isn't difficult to figure out.


Sexton was the best 10 available by a long way and had release clauses. We have plenty of back 3 options in Zebo's absence (Larmour Kearney Addison Stockdale Conway Byrne Earls)

I agree with the ban on players abroad. But i believe ift happens again with an essential Sexton type player exceptions would be made. This is wrong. It's either a rule or it's not. It's like the argument regarding the corporate spectators , it really all comes down to money.

connemara man

tritriagain wrote: »

I agree with the ban on players abroad. But i believe ift happens again with an essential Sexton type player exceptions would be made. This is wrong. It's either a rule or it's not. It's like the argument regarding the corporate spectators , it really all comes down to money.

The thing is it's not a "rule", it's not written down, theres no set in stone policy.

troyzer

connemara man wrote: »

tritriagain wrote: »

I agree with the ban on players abroad. But i believe ift happens again with an essential Sexton type player exceptions would be made. This is wrong. It's either a rule or it's not. It's like the argument regarding the corporate spectators , it really all comes down to money.

The thing is it's not a "rule", it's not written down, theres no set in stone policy.

Which is why it's so successful.

Former Former

connemara man wrote: »

The thing is it's not a "rule", it's not written down, theres no set in stone policy.

It might not be published but it absolutely is a set in stone rule.

connemara man

Former Former wrote: »

It might not be published but it absolutely is a set in stone rule.

Show me where, by set in stone I mean in an IRFU bye-law or something

The whole point of not doing that is, if a player can get a deal like Sexton did and is as valuable as he is it can be ignored.

Former Former

connemara man wrote: »

Former Former wrote: »

It might not be published

Show me where, by set in stone I mean in an IRFU bye-law or something

You couldn't publish something like this. That doesn't mean it's not policy. Everything we've seen over the last four years says that this is a hardline policy.

connemara man wrote: »

The whole point of not doing that is, if a player can get a deal like Sexton did and is as valuable as he is it can be ignored.

The Sexton deal was six years ago, it was pre-Joe and pre-Nucifora.

Maybe Farrell will have a different take on things. As of now, the policy could not be clearer.

AdamD

Burkie1203 wrote: »

IRFU have to protect their interests

-pick player overseas for Ireland, more players could be tempted to go

- that weakens the provinces if any top players go meaning Euro success is less likely

- Ireland prep is compromised for 6n because some top players might not be able to train for almost half of the 6n with the rest of the squad. And if they rock up with knocks they miss some of the few sessions they are available for. Look at France as an example.

- Results suffer, Income drops. Money available to provinces drops. IRFU have invested for a reason. They upped their investment in Connacht for a reason. They are facilitating players moving to other provinces for a reason.


It's all very well throwing Zebos name out there but i guess when you dont have to worry about the other stuff then it sounds like a great idea.

If Zebo was based in Ireland he would make extended squads. Not sure he would make the 23 barring injury. So thats not strong enough to abandon the policy when you consider everything.

This stuff isn't difficult to figure out.


Sexton was the best 10 available by a long way and had release clauses. We have plenty of back 3 options in Zebo's absence (Larmour Kearney Addison Stockdale Conway Byrne Earls)

Can we just sticky this for those who can't seem to comprehend why Zebo not getting picked has absolutely nothing to do with Zebo and everything to do with the future of the provinces/Irish team.

kingofthekong

You leave Henshaw at Fullback - the risk was already taken the pack lost us that game not Henshaw,

The potential reward of Henshaw being proficient at fullback at the world cup far out weighs trying to come second in the six nations,

I think he'll pick Henshaw again at FB and we'll get the win against Scotland,

Ireland need to learn how to be favorites and still go out and perform with thevsame level of intensity, allblacks do it week invweek out

swiwi_

I’m thinking of engaging the Russians to create a forum virus. Any more mention of zebo and the forum self-implodes.

Place is to be avoided until team announced and a different topic of conversation can be found.

irishbucsfan

Former Former wrote: »

You couldn't publish something like this. That doesn't mean it's not policy. Everything we've seen over the last four years says that this is a hardline policy.



The Sexton deal was six years ago, it was pre-Joe and pre-Nucifora.

Maybe Farrell will have a different take on things. As of now, the policy could not be clearer.

Now come on. You promised us a stone. An actual stone! Show us the stone!

mangobob

swiwi_ wrote: »

I’m thinking of engaging the Russians to create a forum virus. Any more mention of zebo and the forum self-implodes.

Place is to be avoided until team announced and a different topic of conversation can be found.

Completely agree. The whole Zebo question has been done to death a hundred thousand times but each time it rises from the dead like a feckin zombie and marches on. It seems to be immortal and entirely impervious to either rational argument or even basic commonsense. It is fed by provincialism and sustained by tribal emotionalism, not to mention that quintessential Irish characteristic of an elephantine memory. Zebo has long vanished over yonder shores and still its being talked about endlessly as though it is a live issue.

That said I am going to add my tuppence worth for the first and last time on this issue. So apologies in advance!

tritriagain wrote: »

I agree with the ban on players abroad. But i believe ift happens again with an essential Sexton type player exceptions would be made. This is wrong. It's either a rule or it's not. It's like the argument regarding the corporate spectators , it really all comes down to money.

Except its not though. Like you I also agree with the ban on players abroad for all the reasons that Burkie elucidated so well. However its not a black and white rule so much as a general policy to be applied pragmatically and intelligently, not robotically and insensibly. There is a world of a difference between a rule set in stone that must be mechanically applied without any discrimination and a generally agreed policy that can be operated and applied with intelligence and discretion.

It doesnt just come down to money - it also comes down to the perceived value of the player in question relative to other options we may possess in his position. Thats the pragmatic element of the policy I was referring to. Which brings me to the point below.

connemara man wrote: »

Show me where, by set in stone I mean in an IRFU bye-law or something

The whole point of not doing that is, if a player can get a deal like Sexton did and is as valuable as he is it can be ignored.

This is the operative phrase here. IF a player can become as valuable and so far ahead of his competitors as to be absolutely indispensable, then yes the policy can and SHOULD be relaxed in that specific instance. But that is no small matter, and applies to perhaps 1 or at most 2 players in the country at any given time. Its not as if its something a player can simply choose to do - to be so spectacularly ahead of your competition that the team simply must bend to accommodate your needs. You either are or you are not. 99% are not and never will be and thats why the policy works so well for the vast majority.

The reality is that special players get special treatment. Thats true of just about every sport that I am familiar with, and is as applicable to the rugby field as it is to the board room. In summation, the essential difference between the Sexton and Zebo situation is that the former was indispensable, the latter was not and likely never will be. Its not about Joe "playing favourites", its about the cold hard reality that in the case of Johnny there was no one else within an asses roar of him. He has firmly established himself as one of the greatest players in the world and he is the heartbeat of his team, whether at Leinster or Ireland. On the other hand Joe feels there are better options than Zebo available to him. Simple as that. People may of course agree or disagree (often depending on the colour of their jersey), but it doesnt matter. All that matters is that in the coaches estimation there are better options available. End of story.

Full disclosure: I am a fan of Zebos both as a player and a person and I love to watch him play at any level. But its clear that he is not a player who fits the Joe Schmidt mould. Thats not a slight on Zebo, its just a simple reality. He can certainly do a good job for us in either of his favoured positions however something about his style or attitude or skillset does not match what Joe is looking for in a player and there are plenty of other players both at FB and wing who are at least as good or better. Now if that were to change, whether due to an injury crisis, retirements or whatever then the equation would also change and his stock may rise due to a sudden supply shortage. Under those circumstances then we would see the policy being relaxed and him brought back into the fold. But barring such an unlikely chain of events then he is gone for good. Whats more, he chose to go for financial, family and lifestyle reasons and no one here would begrudge him that. He wanted to go and its time everyone here let him go too.

Former Former

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Now come on. You promised us a stone. An actual stone! Show us the stone!

Just waiting for the blood to dry.

dub_skav

There's also another point on the Sexton contract.

At the time it seems that Sexton felt disrespected and low-balled, essentially deciding that he was off before the IRFU brought their final offer. So, perhaps the IRFU feel it was partially their fault that they lost him to France.

Having learned from that they will ensure that they have evaluated the player value and offered appropriately before the player ever leaves.

In that context, if a player leaves Ireland these days, you can assume that the IRFU did not deem it worthwhile keeping them

BBDBB

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Now come on. You promised us a stone. An actual stone! Show us the stone!

aloooof

Burkie1203 wrote: »

- Ireland prep is compromised for 6n because some top players might not be able to train for almost half of the 6n with the rest of the squad. And if they rock up with knocks they miss some of the few sessions they are available for. Look at France as an example.

Brilliant post, but on one point I think I remember hearing from last years 6 Nations that the players were all released to the French team for the duration of the tournament? So don't have to return to their clubs on the off weeks? Someone else might know for certain.

Pussyhands

The box kicks are ****e when you have midgets like Earls and Larmour chasing them, Henshaw out of the picture at fullback.

Ringrose or Aki not known for their aerial prowess.

BAM! uhavechlamydia

Pussyhands wrote: »

The box kicks are ****e when you have midgets like Earls and Larmour chasing them, Henshaw out of the picture at fullback.

Ringrose or Aki not known for their aerial prowess.

Pity that Earls has only been chasing and catching those box kicks for about 9 years with Murray for club and country

aloooof

Pussyhands wrote: »

The box kicks are ****e when you have midgets like Earls and Larmour chasing them, Henshaw out of the picture at fullback.

Ringrose or Aki not known for their aerial prowess.

Larmour replaced Earls. We never had both on the pitch at the same time.

Earls got players player of the year last season. Were the box kicks sh*te then too?

phog

My first post since the match - awful day at the office for the team, I'm not sure any of the 1-23 really stood out as having a great game. Back three & half-backs were the poorest we've seen from them, pack beaten up badly.

In a way this game reminded me of Munster v Exeter, we weren't given space and we didn't seem to know how to create space and we failed to exploit space behind England.

It's a long time since we were beaten by a BP win and not get a LBP - depressing but nothing of concern yet.

aloooof

phog wrote: »

In a way this game reminded me of Munster v Exeter, we weren't given space and we didn't seem to know how to create space and we failed to exploit space behind England.

Funny you should say that cos I remember saying to a friend after Full Time that it reminded me the Munster Saracens semi final a few seasons ago. Found it very difficult to get any territory, go forward ball or foothold in the game.

The Rape of Lucretia

phog wrote: »

My first post since the match - awful day at the office for the team, I'm not sure any of the 1-23 really stood out as having a great game.

Ringrose played very well. As good a day as he has had in an Ireland jersey. The performance needs to be assessed separate from the overall outcome.

Healy was good, Furlong better than that, VdF good.

Others were OK : Secton, Murray, Aki.

Being well beaten doesnt mean they played badly, or were below their usual standard. England played better was more the reason for a perception that some played poorly. I didnt really see the bad day at the office element too much : yes, Earls bad mistake, Stockdale could have been better, a bad line out throw. A price was paid for Henshaws lack of recent time at 15. It doesnt mean he payed badly. He probably wouldnt have done well at 9 either.

I think the idea that Ireland underperformed and can fix that is mistaken. Sometime is goes for you, sometimes against, and some luck, as well as the opposition performance determines the outcome as much as how they performed themselves.

Panic button pressing is seriously premature here folks. Let alone losing ones mind and thinking Zebo is somehow relevant to the discussion.

stephen_n

tritriagain wrote: »

Im not zebos biggest fan but find it funny that people are saying he knew he couldn't be picked cos of the unwritten rule. Didn't Jonny know about the rule.... Oh wait it didn't effect him.

Let’s take an orange and discuss why it doesn’t taste like an apple.