VW e-Golf

Mike9832

Augeo wrote: »

You'd rarely see ICE models discounted to this degree.... The eGolf must be an absolute fooker to shift out of showrooms.
With all the spec & everything..... It's the p1ss poor range I suppose is the issue now that they are priced about right ish for what they are.

Agree market correction is coming at last

Autogiants have to produce in volume very soon and have to sell, no compliance cars and selling at a loss, its real now

35k ID3 58kWh will be produced in volume and to sell in volume they might have to sell it at close to 30k, might not sell it at 35k

Low hanging desperate fish have been caught in alot of markets and real consumers who see battery cars as a joke will be a tough tough sell

Anyone buying a Leaf62, Kona, new Ioniq, eNiro this year for close to 40k are going to see massive depreciation as sub 35k ID 3 is coming and vastly superior, they are 30k cars compared to ID3

Zoe, eGolf, e208 are sub 25k cars compared to ID3

eGolf imo is not even worth 25k compared to 35k ID3

Tiny battery, slow charging, slow as hell

Feel a bit for guys like Shefwedfan who paid full retail for one, ouuch

unkel

Augeo wrote: »

Cheapest 2011 auris on carzone....
https://m.carzone.ie/used-cars/Toyota/Auris-1.4-D-4D-SPORT-NCTED-IMMACULATE--/201912115247854

Fair enough, but that car would cost thousands more to own per year compared to a same year same value Leaf. Which makes the Leaf look very good value for money. And that is my point exactly. 99.99% of people didn't realise this 2 years ago. Nobody wanted an older Leaf with a degraded battery. They were 6 years old and only worth €4k. Now 10-20% of people do realise it, leading to negative depreciation for cheap second hand EVs. That same Leaf is now 8 years old, has had significant further degradation, yet it is worth 50% more now than it was 2 years ago :eek:

Eventually the people that are generally very slow in getting their heads around change (laggards) will cop on and the impact of that is that ICE second hand values drop even further while BEV second hand values remain strong, or even go (further) up

...... nowhere near 10/20% of people want to drive an 8 year old leaf with a degraded battery.
Let's not get carried away..... Who knows what they'll be worth in a year.
Ole barges etc are going for more now then a few years ago also.....

User1998

unkel wrote: »

ICE second hand values drop even further while BEV second hand values remain strong, or even go (further) up

Yeah as each day passes the market for ICE will get smaller and the EV market will get larger.

Unkel what way do you think the value PHEV’s will go? Hold their value better than ICE but not as much as EV ?

KCross

Mike9832 wrote: »

Agree market correction is coming at last

I wouldnt go that far. The eGolf is correcting itself because ID.3 is just around the corner so current eGolf pricing makes no sense at all (it never did) but the overall market has a ways to go yet before you could say it is correcting itself.

Mike9832 wrote: »

Autogiants have to produce in volume very soon and have to sell, no compliance cars and selling at a loss, its real now

35k ID3 58kWh will be produced in volume and to sell in volume they might have to sell it at close to 30k, might not sell it at 35k

Come 2H 2020 the OEM's are going to be looking very closely at their fleet emissions figures and I think there will be price drops, scrappage schemes, low APR's etc to encourage people to go for the lower emission cars.... not necessarily BEV's, just lower emissions.

The OEM's are going to control EV adoption all the way to 2030.

Mike9832 wrote: »

... real consumers who see battery cars as a joke will be a tough tough sell

Those people will exist till they literally die. ICE all the way baby!
You dont have to convice them though, just get the large volume of people in the middle.

Mike9832 wrote: »

Anyone buying a Leaf62, Kona, new Ioniq, eNiro this year for close to 40k are going to see massive depreciation as sub 35k ID 3 is coming and vastly superior, they are 30k cars compared to ID3

Leaf62 maybe. eNiro etc, I dont think so.
They are very similar price to ID.3 but have longer range. Only a grand or two in it. Why do you think they would have "massive depreciation"?

Alot of people wont care about 0-100 times or RWD etc.

Mike9832 wrote: »

Zoe, eGolf, e208 are sub 25k cars compared to ID3

? Why do you say €25k for those?

Zoe, e208 and ID.3 are all 27k+ for entry level models. Closer to €30k when you add metallic and delivery and any options.

User1998 wrote: »

Unkel what way do you think the value PHEV’s will go? Hold their value better than ICE but not as much as EV ?

Its impossible to tell at this stage. PHEV's are only just starting to be released in volume in 2020. They really help the manufacturers meet their emissions targets and suit alot of people where 80,90% of their driving will be in EV mode so excellent mpg overall and none of the BEV downsides around charging infrastructure.

I think they'll hold up quite well but as you say maybe not as good as BEV but not as bad as ICE.

unkel

User1998 wrote: »

Unkel what way do you think the value PHEV’s will go? Hold their value better than ICE but not as much as EV ?

Very hard to say and I certainly am no expert when it comes to PHEV. I think KCross said it well. Depends also on fiscal and climate change government policy going forward. But I'd say people buying new diesels now or who have done so in the past year will see the worst depreciation of all cars.

Mike9832

unkel wrote: »

Very hard to say and I certainly am no expert when it comes to PHEV. I think KCross said it well. Depends also on fiscal and climate change government policy going forward. But I'd say people buying new diesels now or who have done so in the past year will see the worst depreciation of all cars.

I think PHEVs make alot of sense and used correctly workout almost cheaper than BEV day to day

Take Kiro Niro phev for example that's what €8000 cheaper to buy over BEV

If you have a 40km daily commute you can manage all that on electric and then at weekend if you do a 300km family trip you will use about €25 petrol

Maybe €1000 a year on fuel cost

When 80-100km PHEVs come with 15-20kWh batteries will make even more sense

Mercedes have a nice A250e 15kWh 225bhp PHEV out now for 35k

I think that's great value and might prefer it over ID 35k

Wonder what would be more practical/sell more

A 20kWh Golf GTE with 100km range vs ID3 58kWh 300km range both at 35k in 2021/22

I'd say more would go for Golf GTE?

Mike9832

KCross wrote: »

Zoe, e208 are all 27k+ for entry level models. Closer to €30k

In ICE world

Clio, 208, Yaris, Polo are all 20k etc and for 10k more you get much bigger and powerful Corolla, Golf

If ID3 is the standard everyone is judged against at 35k and Golf sized, then all the tiny and less powerful Zoe, e208 are worth 25k if we go with ICE pricing model

Soarer

Would love a Passat GTE Estate.

Couldn't afford a new one though.
Secondhand is strong money in the UK.
Don't think the electric range is great.
And I'm not sure of the reliability of the engine (highly strung?)

But other than that, I'd love one!

IrishHomer

Soarer wrote: »

Would love a Passat GTE Estate.

Couldn't afford a new one though.
Secondhand is strong money in the UK.
Don't think the electric range is great.
And I'm not sure of the reliability of the engine (highly strung?)

But other than that, I'd love one!

I'm same.

I see you can get stunning UK ones for approximately 20k

https://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201911264761231?advertising-location=at_cars&postcode=l40th&model=PASSAT&page=1&aggregatedTrim=GTE&make=VOLKSWAGEN&fuel-type=Hybrid – Petrol/Electric&fuel-type=Hybrid – Petrol/Electric Plug-in&onesearchad=New&onesearchad=Nearly New&onesearchad=Used

User1998

I have a Golf GTE with the same setup. Gets about 25km electric range, probably more in the summer. 1.4 tsi is a fairly reliable engine too

Third_Echelon

User1998 wrote: »

I have a Golf GTE with the same setup. Gets about 25km electric range, probably more in the summer. 1.4 tsi is a fairly reliable engine too

With the size of the car, i.e. small for a plug-in hybrid, do you find lugging around the batteries and the petrol engine makes it unnecessarily heavy or affects handling or performance?

One of the main reasons that I love the eGolf is that it’s light and handles like a little go kart. Sticks in the corners, acceleration out it is sweet! It’s just a beautiful drive.

I like the idea of the Golf GTE but seems like a compromise to me? If I was going p-hybrid, the Passat GTE might make more sense (to me) as it’s more of a family car that you’d be doing bigger mileage in?!

User1998

I did consider an E Golf but decided to go with the GTE instead. Before buying the car I watched/read every review that was out there. They were all comparing it with a GTI and said you could really feel the weight of the batteries in the corners and that it wasn’t as nimble as a GTI. In my experience it has never felt too heavy or anything like that. Steering is really light and it has really good acceleration. (Especially the initial 0-50 thanks to the electric motor) I’d rarely fling it into a corner but when I have it never felt too heavy. Coming from a diesel golf it feels a lot more agile than the tdi. And having owned a passat its definitely nicer on the motorway and obviously alot more spacious for families and carrying stuff but I don’t need a big car so the Golf suits me better (No kids)

Third_Echelon

User1998 wrote: »

I did consider an E Golf but decided to go with the GTE instead. Before buying the car I watched/read every review that was out there. They were all comparing it with a GTI and said you could really feel the weight of the batteries in the corners and that it wasn’t as nimble as a GTI. In my experience it has never felt too heavy or anything like that. Steering is really light and it has really good acceleration. (Especially the initial 0-50 thanks to the electric motor) I’d rarely fling it into a corner but when I have it never felt too heavy. Coming from a diesel golf it feels a lot more agile than the tdi. And having owned a passat its definitely nicer on the motorway and obviously alot more spacious for families and carrying stuff but I don’t need a big car so the Golf suits me better (No kids)

Yeah it’s all perspective really and what suits you for your own situation. I think I remember you asking about the GTE vs E on here a while ago? Was that you? Glad to hear it was a good buy for you.

With your previous being a TDI, I can see why they GTE feels a bit more agile. Again that’s one of the lovely things about the golf range. There really is an option for all tastes and use cases, GTI, TDI, GTE, E and regular petrol and diesel variants.

User1998

Yeah that was me alright, wasn’t so much of a comparison post, it was more me asking would a GTE suit me and everyone suggesting the E golf

Great car tho all the same. I’m sure the E Golf is great as well. If you read my original thread you’ll see me talk about using GTE mode but I actually drive it in E Mode 95% of the time, electric is so much nicer to drive. I’ve spent about €35 in fuel since I bought it early September. (€25 being a trip to Wexford)

Once I see a few ex lease cars coming out of their 3 year lease in the UK I’m going to replace it with a 171 GTE. Maybe after that I’d go fully electric.. just depends on the prices of used teslas at the time

Third_Echelon

User1998 wrote: »

Yeah that was me alright, wasn’t so much of a comparison post, it was more me asking would a GTE suit me and everyone suggesting the E golf

Great car tho all the same. I’m sure the E Golf is great as well. If you read my original thread you’ll see me talk about using GTE mode but I actually drive it in E Mode 95% of the time, electric is so much nicer to drive. I’ve spent about €35 in fuel since I bought it early September. (€25 being a trip to Wexford)

Once I see a few ex lease cars coming out of their 3 year lease in the UK I’m going to replace it with a 171 GTE. Maybe after that I’d go fully electric.. just depends on the prices of used teslas at the time

That’s good fuel economy alright! Will be interesting to see how car prices importing from the UK will be affected by Brexit in the coming years with exchange rates and all that.

Soarer

User1998 wrote: »

I have a Golf GTE with the same setup. Gets about 25km electric range, probably more in the summer. 1.4 tsi is a fairly reliable engine too

Is it really only 25km range in the winter??

Woulda been hoping for 30+ in winter and 40+ in summer.

User1998

Soarer wrote: »

Is it really only 25km range in the winter??

Woulda been hoping for 30+ in winter and 40+ in summer.

On the colder days with heating on, heated seats and a slightly heavy right foot yes. If you were to pre heat the car it would bring you up to 30km easy I’d say, the heating really kills range. I can’t pre heat the car from my phone, only through the infotainment screen, and I don’t have set departure times (eg 7am mon-fri).. so I rarely preheat. I’m sure 40 is achievable in summer but I’ve only had the car since September so never tried it

BKtje

I'm quite looking forward to seeing what the MK 8 GTE brings. I have been humming and hawing over getting a Tesla for over a year now but since I only have on street parking with no super chargers between home and work I've been holding off. A hybrid never seemed like a good idea since my commute is 110km as well but I've been reconsidering with the research I've done on the current and upcoming GTE's.

I currently have a Golf 1.4 Highline TSI DSG which is so easy to drive on the motorway and I can only see myself changing it for a car with a bit more oomph/fun which can still be driven economically when wanted.

Mike9832

BKtje wrote: »

I'm quite looking forward to seeing what the MK 8 GTE brings. I have been humming and hawing over getting a Tesla for over a year now but since I only have on street parking with no super chargers between home and work I've been holding off. A hybrid never seemed like a good idea since my commute is 110km as well but I've been reconsidering with the research I've done on the current and upcoming GTE's.

I currently have a Golf 1.4 Highline TSI DSG which is so easy to drive on the motorway and I can only see myself changing it for a car with a bit more oomph/fun which can still be driven economically when wanted.

How you gonna charger the GTE?

BKtje

In work and the odd time at home when i get the space in front of my house. Still not ideal I guess but would still have the 1.4l.motor which is why a hybrid is attractive. There is also a 4km 200m drop on motorway on the way to work which would recuperate some power I guess. It would never pay for itself but i get decent discounts through work (10% with VW on top of any others or 20% with Mercedes) so wouldn't break the bank either and would get more performance without losing on the "fuel economy " side. At least in theory, will need to wait for people to get their hands on the car to see.

Shefwedfan

Even if you don't get to charge all the time it will still run in hybrid mode all the time.

So will be better to the straight petrol. You will start to see more points become available over time and will make it easier to top up

BKtje

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Even if you don't get to charge all the time it will still run in hybrid mode all the time.

So will be better to the straight petrol. You will start to see more points become available over time and will make it easier to top up

I hope so but the city where I live in Switzerland is quite anti car at the moment. There are a couple of charge points near where I live but would be a 10 minute walk and it would annoy me to do that twice a day. That said I have a main VW dealer a little closer so I can hope that once they get more electric and hybrid cars that they install a few charge points for their customers.

Maybe we should use the other thread for the hybrid and light hybrids Golf's as this is going off topic for the E-Golf.

Shefwedfan

BKtje wrote: »

I hope so but the city where I live in Switzerland is quite anti car at the moment. There are a couple of charge points near where I live but would be a 10 minute walk and it would annoy me to do that twice a day. That said I have a main VW dealer a little closer so I can hope that once they get more electric and hybrid cars that they install a few charge points for their customers.

Maybe we should use the other thread for the hybrid and light hybrids Golf's as this is going off topic for the E-Golf.

Nah your grand here. Look a few posts back up and you had someone going on about Peugeots and all sorts of rubbish :P

BKtje

BKtje wrote: »

........ There is also a 4km 200m drop on motorway on the way to work which would recuperate some power I guess.......

You presumably need to climb that on the way back?

BKtje

yes but I will have charged in work so probably on elec though it would eat into the range available on the way back.

User1998

https://www.donedeal.ie/view/23890659

Is this the price drop people were talking about?

unkel

€36k is far too much money for an electric Golf if you asked me.

Before this "price drop" you could get a more basic version for €29k. That's more like it. I don't know if that price has gone down any further.

charlieIRL

User1998 wrote: »

https://www.donedeal.ie/view/23890659

Is this the price drop people were talking about?

No, that should drop another €4300 at the end of the month. Means an Executive is now circa €32,000. Fantastic car for that money.

Rusky rusky

If someone interested in design and mechanics of e-golf google “vw ssp 530” . There’s a whole series of VW self study programs, although I can’t find a list of the ssps from number 500 or so. Golf 2013 is 513 to 519. E golf heat pump is 532, golf gte is 537, golf gte dsg is 538.