VW e-Golf

unkel

Even though the El Born will be cheaper to buy in 2 years time than the eGolf is now, that doesn't mean the eGolf will depreciate like mad. I only do average mileage myself (16k km per year) so my fuel saving wasn't huge. But looking back I made the right decision buying new and my EV has depreciated very little. There will be strong demand for second hand EVs for a very long time as people will transition to EVs and of course not everyone will be able to afford brand new cars. Look what happened at the value of an early Leaf with serious battery degradation. You could buy one 2 years ago for €4k, now the same car, two years older can fetch €6k

kris_2021

Are they giving scrappage or trade in offers on egolf also?

charlieIRL

kris_2021 wrote: »

Are they giving scrappage or trade in offers on egolf also?

Not that I know of.

KCross

unkel wrote: »

Even though the El Born will be cheaper to buy in 2 years time than the eGolf is now, that doesn't mean the eGolf will depreciate like mad. I only do average mileage myself (16k km per year) so my fuel saving wasn't huge. But looking back I made the right decision buying new and my EV has depreciated very little. There will be strong demand for second hand EVs for a very long time as people will transition to EVs and of course not everyone will be able to afford brand new cars. Look what happened at the value of an early Leaf with serious battery degradation. You could buy one 2 years ago for €4k, now the same car, two years older can fetch €6k

My depreciation concerns on the eGolf are twofold.... the ID.3 should be on our roads for Jan 2021 (excluding 1st edition models which are Summer 2020). Thats really only 12 months away for nkay1985 as presumably they are looking at a Jan 2020 eGolf? Thats not long at all.

Secondly, there is a new mk Golf due out (Mk8, i think?). Thats going to make the eGolf look very dated in 2020, not to mind 2021.

I'm not putting the eGolf down. Great car by all accounts, I just dont think its worth the money even with the extra €5k off.


Lets say in 2021 I am in the market for an EV..... Do I buy a <€30k ID.3 or a secondhand eGolf. If I am buying a secondhand eGolf then it HAS to be priced several thousand below the price of a new similar spec ID.3... I cant see how it could come in at anything else.... it will be the old style Golf with lower range!

Would you pay, lets say, €25k for a Jan 2020 eGolf in Jan 2021 or would you buy the new ID.3 for <€30k? I'd buy the ID.3 all day long. The eGolf would need to be <€20k to tempt me away from a new ID.3.

We all know EV depreciation is holdng up very well but thats a temporary thing right now, in the context of 2021 and a raft of new EV's and in particular VW selling the ID.3 in volume it can only have a negative effect on eGolf residuals. Its still about €3k too expensive, imo.

unkel

I don't disagree with any of that, but will we really have readily available RHD ID.3 for under €30k on the road by January 2021? Seems optimistic and we have all been too optimistic for nearly all EV launches over the past few years. Optimistic about time and about money.

And EV depreciation is of course temporary but might last for another good few years, but I agree in your above scenario the 2020 eGolf will suffer a good bout of depreciation in its first year. But very little after that. And I'm sure no one wants to buy an eGolf now and change again next year. It matters little if you plan to keep the car for several yaers. And as mass production of EVs is only starting and we already know that the majority of people want EVs, the values should stay solid:

"Majority of motorists thinking about switching to electric vehicle in next five years"

Linky

KCross

unkel wrote: »

I don't disagree with any of that, but will we really have readily available RHD ID.3 for under €30k on the road by January 2021? Seems optimistic and we have all been too optimistic for nearly all EV launches over the past few years. Optimistic about time and about money.

Isnt production of the ID.3 1st edition starting in Nov 2019 with Summer 2020 deliveries with the reservation holders having until Apr 2020 to confirm their orders. That seems fairly well stated by VW at this stage. I dont think they'll renege on that commitment at this stage... thats only months away.

They also said that once those 1st editions are sold you can then buy any model you like (i.e their configurator will be open to everyone) and 2021 is supposed to be the year they make 100k ID.3's so unless VW are lying about the whole thing I'd say early 2021 is a reasonable bet.

KCross

unkel wrote: »

And EV depreciation is of course temporary but might last for another good few years, but I agree in your above scenario the 2020 eGolf will suffer a good bout of depreciation in its first year. But very little after that. And I'm sure no one wants to buy an eGolf now and change again next year. It matters little if you plan to keep the car for several yaers. And as mass production of EVs is only starting and we already know that the majority of people want EVs, the values should stay solid:

True that you are unlikely to sell it after 1 year unless you are a sucker for punishment but I do think it matters as it will effect resale in year 2 or 3 or 4... its all connected and the ID.3 price is going to set the bar for eGolf resale values.... in a similar way to how you expected Model S values to drop once Model 3 started being delivered to the UK... not much different except in VW's case its a direct like for like car, so even more likely/relevant.

unkel

From what I have seen from Frankfurt, the ID.3 seems a lower quality product than the eGolf. It's roomier inside and it has more range, but that's all the positives out of the way. The design of the ID.3 is quite conservative, just like the Golfs have been for decades. A €32k eGolf will take a depreciation hit when the ID.3 becomes available in 2021, but after that I expect the absolute depreciation figures in year 2, 3, etc to be lower than those of an ID.3

KCross

unkel wrote: »

From what I have seen from Frankfurt, the ID.3 seems a lower quality product than the eGolf. It's roomier inside and it has more range, but that's all the positives out of the way.....

faster charging, more powerful motor, better connectivity.....


Anyone looking at an ID.3 and an eGolf side by side in 2021 is not going to say "It's roomier inside and it has more range, but that's all the positives out of the way..."


Depreciation is impossible to predict so nkay1985 will have to make up his own mind. Certainly €32k is more palatable than €37k and if he keeps it for, say, 5yrs the depreciation hit should be easier to absorb.

celtic_oz

Kia Niro Electric Compact SUV Suggests Big Volkswagen Error

As the rapturous reviews for Volkswagen’s new electric sedan, the ID.3, died down at the Frankfurt Auto Show where it made its debut earlier this month, the question was raised; why wasn’t it an SUV? The ID.3, designed from the ground up to be all-electric, is on the small side, and roughly equivalent to the Golf family sedan.

The Kia e-Niro is a small SUV, and although it is built on an already existing gasoline/diesel model, it has the extra room and height which Europeans now crave. It has a big 64 kWh battery and develops 200 hp, thrusting it from rest to 60 mph in an impressive 7.5 seconds. The range claimed is about 280 miles. On a recent test drive, I can confirm that was obtainable. The e-Niro is priced at about 36,000 pounds ($45,000) after tax and before a government grant of 3,500 pounds ($4,400). The closest competitors in this SUV sector are the Audi e-Tron, which costs more than twice as much, and the Jaguar I-Pace, which is almost as expensive.

youreadthat

Don’t really get that article, missed its mark a tad....

unkel

KCross wrote: »

faster charging

Nope. Just 50kW charging as standard. More power and RWD are nice to me, but most people wouldn't care as they would be more than happy with the performance of the eGolf

KCross

unkel wrote: »

Nope. Just 50kW charging as standard. More power and RWD are nice to me, but most people wouldn't care as they would be more than happy with the performance of the eGolf

Just saying there is more to the ID.3 than range and interior space like you said.
You're really talking down the ID.3. I sense you're disapointed with it?!

I'd hold your fire until you see a production model in the flesh yourself. I think Bjorn said some of the panels on the demo cars were not production level yet.


I'd bet an ID.3 spec'd up to the price of an eGolf will be significantly better in most metrics you care to pick. Before parting with €32k on an eGolf I'd at least wait for pricing and spec details of the ID.3 from VW Ireland.


If nkay1985 cant wait until 2021 then fair enough, at least he is going in with his eyes open.

KCross

nkay1985 wrote: »

Yeah the website hasn't been updated yet but the reduction is definitely there. I just got the attached from Laharts in Kilkenny.

nkay.... i just see your attachment now... your OTR price is actually €34k, not €32k??

Dempsey

nkay1985 wrote: »

Hi guys.

I'm close to the point of deciding whether or not to pull the trigger on a e-Golf and was just interested in people's thoughts. From experience, what's it like as a car to own? What kind of real range would a full battery get (assuming mixed driving, typically no motorway though)? What are the positives/negatives of the car?

I would be going for a Comfortline as I wouldn't be able to stretch to the Executive.

I've seen "car connect" in the brochure. Is this basically Android Auto/Apple Car Play? Is there an app for the e-Golf to remotely monitor charging etc?

Anything any body thinks is relevant when thinking about buying one of these would be great really as I always felt they were overpriced so, as a result, don't know nearly as much about them as the Leaf/Ionic, but the €5k price reduction and 0% PCP suddenly makes it a possibility.

Thanks.

I pulled the trigger on an 2nd hand eGolf a few weeks ago and I have/had a reservation on the ID3. No regrets so far

My commute is 180km round trip each day. 40% Motorway/60% National Roads and I get to work with about 50-60% battery. So light charge at home and full charge at work. The maths for the ID3 just didnt work out for me. My running costs have stayed the same despite buying a car 13 years newer than what I had.

There is an App & Online Site for monitoring the charge, adjusting the charge schedule, driving statistics etc and it has android auto/apple car play aswell

If you are getting the comfortline, I'd still look for the active display & keyless entry.

Any other questions, let me know

Dempsey

Dempsey wrote: »

I pulled the trigger on an 2nd hand eGolf a few weeks ago and I have/had a reservation on the ID3. No regrets so far

Well done, best of luck !

unkel

KCross wrote: »

Just saying there is more to the ID.3 than range and interior space like you said.
You're really talking down the ID.3. I sense you're disapointed with it?!

Nah, it could well be my next car, I've the deposit down

Normally when a car is introduced at as big a show as Frankfurt with as much scrutiny the ID.3 is getting, I'd say that car is as close to 100% as the production cars as possible, but yeah, I should reserve some judgement until I've actually test driven it myself.

Third_Echelon

With the information we've seen from Frankfurt in terms of look, spec, some better info on prices, I think the depreciation of an eGolf that people were talking about pre-Frankfurt won't be as much as expected. The eGolf is first and foremost, a Golf! The interior product, even on the cheaper model is excellent. It's a well finished product that is great to drive in the EV version. Irish market new price for an eGolf is a tad high as most cars are, but it's still a great EV option and fits most people's daily commute type usage.

Realistically it will be probably mid-2021 before you can walk in off the street to an Irish VW dealer, order the RHD ID.3 that you want and have it delivered in a few weeks (or from existing forecourt stock). That's still just under 2 years away. That's plenty of great driving in an eGolf, which will then be a perfect trade-in for an ID.3 if it floats your boat then.

I like the exterior of the ID.3. It's a good looking car. The interior lets it down a bit in certain places. Would definitely need to see one in the flesh and get a good test drive.

One of the nicest 'features' of the eGolf for me is getting a good distance of coasting in D mode, then dropping into B to come to a red light to get some of that regen braking. It's very easy with the traditional auto gear shifter placement. Won't be so much in the ID.3 with the gear selector being that stalk thing on the dash :-(

unkel

I reckon the fact that the eGolf looks and feels like a normal car (not an EV) is what will appeal to its target market in a few years time when it comes onto the second hand market. Indeed the conventional automatic gear lever is one of those features.

Third_Echelon

unkel wrote: »

I reckon the fact that the eGolf looks and feels like a normal car (not an EV) is what will appeal to its target market in a few years time when it comes onto the second hand market. Indeed the conventional automatic gear lever is one of those features.

Yeah definitely! It's what attracted me to it (personally don't like the look of the Leaf) and other options were a bit too 'space age'. The mass appeal of the Golf platform means that it has a lot going for it on the future second hand market!

charlieIRL

Third_Echelon wrote: »

Yeah definitely! It's what attracted me to it (personally don't like the look of the Leaf) and other options were a bit too 'space age'. The mass appeal of the Golf platform means that it has a lot going for it on the future second hand market!

Same here.

KCross

- Is there a way to tell externally/internally from dealer pics whether an eGolf from 2017 has the 24kWh or 35kWh battery?
- Are all 2018 eGolfs the 35kWh version or did that changeover happen at some other time?
- When the new 35kWh model came out did the price remain the same and they just stopped making the 24kWh version?


2017 models on DoneDeal right now are asking about €22k from dealers so thats high enough depreciation in 2 years. Just saying!

charlieIRL

KCross wrote: »

- Is there a way to tell externally/internally from dealer pics whether an eGolf from 2017 has the 24kWh or 35kWh battery?
- Are all 2018 eGolfs the 35kWh version or did that changeover happen at some other time?
- When the new 35kWh model came out did the price remain the same and they just stopped making the 24kWh version?


2017 models on DoneDeal right now are asking about €22k from dealers so thats high enough depreciation in 2 years. Just saying!

The blue strip under the headlights on the 2017 24kWh model is different to the 36kWh 2018 model. I’ll see can I find pics.

AFAIK all 2018’s are 36kWh but be careful of late reg 24’s. Some old stock might have been registered in 2018.

2017 is 114bhp and 2018 on is 136bhp too

KCross

charlieIRL wrote: »

The blue strip under the headlights on the 2017 24kWh model is different to the 36kWh 2018 model. I’ll see can I find pics.

AFAIK all 2018’s are 36kWh but be careful of late reg 24’s. Some old stock might have been registered in 2018.

2017 is 114bhp and 2018 on is 136bhp too

Is it fair to say that ALL 2017's are the 24kWh model?

charlieIRL

KCross wrote: »

Is it fair to say that ALL 2017's are the 24kWh model?

Yes I would say so.

Shefwedfan

KCross wrote: »

Is it fair to say that ALL 2017's are the 24kWh model?

No :P


If originally Irish then they are only the 26kWh


If UK then some of the later 2017 models are 36kWh versions


Electric autos had a 2017 36kWh model for sale earlier this year, even Phil rang me as he wasnt sure which battery was in it :-)

Third_Echelon

KCross wrote: »

2017 models on DoneDeal right now are asking about €22k from dealers so thats high enough depreciation in 2 years. Just saying!

Probably the older/smaller battery model.

KCross

Shefwedfan wrote: »

No :P


If originally Irish then they are only the 26kWh


If UK then some of the later 2017 models are 36kWh versions


Electric autos had a 2017 36kWh model for sale earlier this year, even Phil rang me as he wasnt sure which battery was in it :-)

ok, so the longer range model came out in 172 but vast majority are 181+?

Is there a visual way to see what battery is in it. charlieIRL mentioned a blue strip or something.... does that show you its the longer range model? Any pics of the difference?

Third_Echelon wrote: »

Probably the older/smaller battery model.

One of them was definitely a 171 so the shorter range battery but still heavy depreciation either way as that was still a €37k car when new?

2018 models just took a €5k hit with the recent price reductions and I think the release of ID.3 will further reduce it again in Jan 2021.

Shefwedfan

KCross wrote: »

ok, so the longer range model came out in 172 but vast majority are 181+?

Is there a visual way to see what battery is in it. charlieIRL mentioned a blue strip or something.... does that show you its the longer range model? Any pics of the difference?




One of them was definitely a 171 so the shorter range battery but still heavy depreciation either way as that was still a €37k car when new?

2018 models just took a €5k hit with the recent price reductions and I think the release of ID.3 will further reduce it again in Jan 2021.

Ireland didnt get it till 181 but in the UK they had some at end of 17 so would be 172 plate


How to work it out. :P not too simple. They look the exact same apart from the console inside is the new model which supports apple car play and has less buttons. Also the range of course.



The blue strip is on both. From the outside of my 192 you would not be able to tell any difference from the 151 I had.....well apart from the colour of course.

The 5k is to sell off the stock, I doubt they will be manufacturing many eGolf from now till the ID....just fill out any orders. Especially for right hand models. The US will continue to have the eGolf as the ID is not released with them......

KCross

Shefwedfan wrote: »

How to work it out. :P not too simple. They look the exact same apart from the console inside is the new model which supports apple car play and has less buttons. Also the range of course.

Thanks, I see it now. The buttons on the right of the console are not there in the newer model and the speedo/dash looks different too.