ESB eCars

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120767647#Comment_120767647

Probably not, AFAIK the announced chargers are being installed by the county council and they tend to go with an Irish provider (I believe they're actually legally obliged to do so unless there's no company in Ireland that can fulfill the requirement)

The issue with the Ionity expansion is that it's been about a year and nothing has happened. I know it takes a long while to acquire sites and get planning permission and grid connections, so I still feel the 2025 completion date is very much at risk

I'm also pretty convinced that Ireland is way down the priority list for Ionity

ted1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120758357#Comment_120758357

Pass it under the car, or trial it around behind the wheels. Not really an issue

zg3409

O Bama plaza, 4 cars queuing to use the one charger today but soon...

innrain

Barack Obama Plaza hub appears online 9 CCS plugs 👍

wassie

Finally an actual ESB hub.

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120816861#Comment_120816861

Don't get your hopes up, I'm sure there's going to be some major flaw waiting to be discovered

the_amazing_raisin

This thread has really died off recently, have Ecars started doing their job or something?

Or have the competition rolled out enough chargers that we can ignore Ecars now?

Or are we just so jaded that we've stopped complaining? 😅

liamog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120817630#Comment_120817630

I think a bit of both, the only controversial thing that eCars have done in the last 12 months is the removal of the CHAdeMO charger in Clifden, other than that they've been doing a decent job of rolling out small charging stations with Supervalu and charging hubs with the Plaza group.

ELM327

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120815179#Comment_120815179

and incredulously 9 chademo plugs too!

eagerv

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120817630#Comment_120817630

I must admit that I have lost almost all interest in ESB, EasyGo etc charging, now that I have the car brand that must not be named..😋

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120817656#Comment_120817656

You can take your Leaf on a spin to Galway now 😉

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120817659#Comment_120817659

You're allowed to name them 😉

I think you've hit the nail on the head, Ecars are effectively the provider of last resort so when there's an alternative available they get used instead

And the car company that shall not be named has done a decent job of expanding over the last year or two so you can generally get around a lot of Ireland without using Ecars

liamog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120817690#Comment_120817690

My Mini charging card still seems to be active, so I'm still in the envious position of eCars being the cheapest per kWh. (35c on all DC)

Black_Knight

Just occurred to me that while I do post number of "sites" Ecars have, I don't post a chart of the number of units/chargers they have.

Finally more CCS units that CHAdeMO. Next Mondays graph will include BOb plaza.

Black_Knight

^^ I've added that to the site now:

https://ecars-stats.com/graphs.html

Could probably do with tidying up that page. Lots of graphs... too much scrolling

McGiver

So the IEVA has sent a letter of complaint to EBS eCars and asking them to reduce the prices with respect to the quality of service provided (not reflected in the price). Nice one!

https://www.irishevassociation.ie/letter-to-ecars-re-cost-of-charging/?utm_campaign=IEVA%20Newsletter&utm_medium=email&_hsmi=265431806&_hsenc=p2ANqtz-9-wLh5NsJiWAmSIlsyrWNcxYWtBHM8DAZGvXzV9A16SRsVt1lF8BAc450BEk5FUFhZpCm3RxuGUPhv4QEr-nraBEtDPA&utm_content=265431806&utm_source=hs_email

What do we think?

ELM327

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120817666#Comment_120817666

Limerick, no?

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120817900#Comment_120817900

Stupid and misguided bunkum IMO. Prices are perfectly valid in current market

AndyBoBandy

eCars are a corporate partner of IEVA though aren't they?

Anyway it was sent on May 25th.... so the fact that it's July and nothing has changed says it all really...

liamog

Their first point seems like pandering to those who don't understand how electricity markets work in the EU, I'm surprised that a person who would be on a EV owners committee wouldn't be aware of the concept of last/kWh pricing and the separation between a state owned operators generation and commercial arms.

Points 2&3 I'd agree with, I'd prefer eCars to have flexible market pricing instead of the long term fix. In transport we're used to fuel prices changing regularly, I'd be in favour of charging prices being similarly flexible (ideally including time of use pricing).

Point 4 is a subtle one, I wouldn't be looking for reduced pricing due to a site limit, but something does need to be reviewed re overstay fee's. Where a charger is operating at full capacity the overstay is down to bad planning by the vehicle owner. If the time to charge is extended due to load sharing or reduced site capacity then I feel its a bit unfair to penalise them. Closest I got to an overstay fee was at a 50kW charger that was reduced to 25kW because of another car using the AC cable. Turned my required 25 minute charge into a 50 minute one.

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120817965#Comment_120817965

Yes, you're right. I had Galway stuck in my head because I was searching planning applications to try and find the new Ionity site around Athenry 😅

I don't think the IEVA letter was misguided. It's pretty obvious that the only thing keeping prices high at this point is suppliers. Gas market is down substantially, even on the futures contracts

There's always been a quality factor to the price of EV charging. Ionity got away with charging 73c/kWh because they could argue they provided a much better service than others

Ecars can't really make the same argument since they're effectively the worst provider

It bites particularly deep considering that Ecars have historically gotten a lot more funding than any other providers

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120817849#Comment_120817849

Interesting observation, DC usage at the moment is around the same level as this time last year, despite there being thousands more EVs on the road (it's possible I read the graph wrong though)

Kinda puts the screws on Ecars pricing, they'll obviously make more money from the same usage, but you want to be growing users at around the same pace as EV sales otherwise your network will stagnate

I think the competition is starting to bite

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120817652#Comment_120817652

Looks like I got some life back into the old Ecars debate after all 😂

ELM327

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120818550#Comment_120818550

Most competitors except Tesla charge similar rates. Most new EVs dont need fast charging in their day to day use. Fast charging will become less and less common with newer EVs as range gets longer.

liamog

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120818550#Comment_120818550

It would be interesting to see if we're seeing a move charging time, the en-route DC charge usage may drop with longer range cars, I'd expect chargers in Supermarkets to increase in popularity for us driveway deficient people

ELM327

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120818785#Comment_120818785

That's kind of the point I made above. If current usage patterns of DC charging are based on X number of EVs requiring Y amount of DC kWh where Y is equivalent to 20% of the total number of kWh spent driving EVs as a whole, I expect the ratio of X to Y to move further lower over time, where more EVs are needed to require the same number of kWh. Compare 2023 to 2013 for instance, every EV back then was under 150km range. Now everything is pretty much in the 300's or close to it.

McGiver

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120818785#Comment_120818785

I disagreed with you on ubiquity of DC charging in the past. I'm readjusting my position on this a bit.

I still think AC will totally dominate, as evidenced from NO/SV/NL. But I think legacy DC (50 kW) will be redeployed to cities and towns to places you mentioned.

Once 350 kW charging becomes the norm, which will be the case very soon, the 50 kW chargers on motorways and in some other settings will need to be upgraded and reallocated. This is already ongoing with 150 kW chargers even with eCars.

the_amazing_raisin

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120818799#Comment_120818799

True, but we're a long way from full EV adoption so even if the rate of usage per car drops off, there'll still be an overall increase in usage

If you look at the up and coming EVs, there's a big push for the cheaper and smaller segment EVs. I don't think they'll be sold with 100kWh batteries, and I still think they'll be used for regular long trips as well

So I don't think we've hit "peak midpoint charging" just yet

markpb

What’s up with the 22kW AC usage, those charts are not what I would have expected at all. That massive drop in usage around July last year seems odd, is that when they increased the charges? It’s happening again in the last few months, maybe it’s cyclical?

ELM327

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120818994#Comment_120818994

I see your point and agree to an extent, but, still I think the vast majority of new cars will rarely need to dc charge whereas folks driving ev even 5 years ago would be more likely than not to have a fast charging session in a couple of weeks say.

mfceiling

Just got an email to say the minimum balance is reverting back to €5!!

They have been listening to customer feedback.