ESB eCars

MJohnston

ECars high power pricing:

ESB wrote:

ESB is investing in and upgrading its public charging network across Ireland. As part of this, over 50 high power charging hubs will be rolled out on motorway and national road sites.

The first four ESB high power chargers have been installed in Kilcullen (M9), Portlaoise Plaza** (M7/M8), Galway Plaza (M6) and Kells (M3). To give customers a chance to try out the new technology, these chargers have been free to use since their installation. Today ESB is announcing the pay for use details for high power (150kW) chargers which will be introduced from 1st December 2020.

The original pricing scheme has been maintained; there are two price plans available for EV drivers - Pay As You Go or Membership:

Membership is €4.60 per month and provides a reduced rate of 33c per kWh for use of high power (150kW) chargers.
Pay As You Go customers will avail of a three month introductory rate of 34.5c per kWh for use of the high power (150kW) chargers. From March 1st the PAYG rate will be 37c per kWh.

https://www.esb.ie/ecars/news/2020/2020/11/17/pay-per-use-to-be-introduced-on-high-power-chargers-from-december-1st

Kramer

ESB is investing in and upgrading its public charging network across Ireland. As part of this, over 50 high power charging hubs will be rolled out on motorway and national road sites.



The first four ESB high power chargers have been installed in Kilcullen (M9), Portlaoise Plaza** (M7/M8), Galway Plaza (M6) and Kells (M3). To give customers a chance to try out the new technology, these chargers have been free to use since their installation. Today ESB is announcing the pay for use details for high power (150kW) chargers which will be introduced from 1st December 2020.



The original pricing scheme has been maintained; there are two price plans available for EV drivers - Pay As You Go or Membership:



Membership is €4.60 per month and provides a reduced rate of 33c per kWh for use of high power (150kW) chargers.
Pay As You Go customers will avail of a three month introductory rate of 34.5c per kWh for use of the high power (150kW) chargers. From March 1st the PAYG rate will be 37c per kWh.

37c/kWh basically.

Kramer

Kramer wrote: »

As part of this, over 50 high power charging hubs will be rolled out on motorway and national road sites

That's brilliant news - over 50 HPC HUBS - we'll be tripping over them .

KCross

They also gave some specifics about the 8 bay hubs....

The first eight bay high power hub will be located at Mayfield, on the M7 at Monasterevin. Construction of the hub is due to commence in Q4/20. The roll out of all high power sites will continue over the next two years.

At least its still on their plan and imminent and that they dont consider the current 2-3 bay "hubs" as adequate.

Kramer wrote: »

37c/kWh basically.

Cant complain about that price really if it delivers 150kW?

Cyrus

Kramer wrote: »

37c/kWh basically.

have to say thats not bad at all, for comparison with an audi you can get ionity for 31c a kw for a year then after that you have to pay a monthly membership of 17.50 to get that rate :rolleyes:

McGiver

Kramer wrote:

That's brilliant news - over 50 HPC HUBS - we'll be tripping over them .

Ecars hub - 2 cars charging at once.

That's done! All triple head sites can charge 1x CCS/Chademo + 1x AC43.

This company has no credibility. Awful.

Black_Knight

McGiver wrote: »

Ecars hub - 2 cars charging at once.

That's done! All triple head sites can charge 1x CCS/Chademo + 1x AC43.

This company has no credibility. Awful.

They have expanded on what hub is in the email:

There are three tiers of high power charging hubs – tier one consisting of four high power chargers allowing up to eight electric vehicles at any one time; tier two consisting of two high power chargers allowing up to four electric vehicles at any one time; and tier three consisting of one high power charger and one fast charger allowing up to three electric vehicles charge at any one time. The high-power charging hubs, which can charge between three and eight vehicles simultaneously, are dramatically faster than current charging infrastructure and are capable of providing a 100km range to electric vehicles drivers in as little as six minutes.

So there's 3 tiers of hub:
1. 4 HPC which can charge up to 8 cars at once
2. 2 HPC which can charge up to 4 cars at once
3. 1 HPC and 1 FCP which can charge up to 3 cars at once.

We've only so far seen #3. They don't include Dublin port as a hub, though it does have 2 FCP at it. Seems hub needs to include at least 1 HPC.

A Hub isn't a hub unless there are 8 physical 150+ Kw chargers than can charge 8 cars at full power without load splitting.

150 Kw but upgradable to higher power.

Black_Knight

Love how they use a 40kWh leaf as a sample of cost savings over diesel on the SCP, FPC and HCP table. Leaf on a HCP is saving nothing.

markpb

That was probably the most confusing email I’ve ever read. So much rubbish before and after the a convoluted pricing table wedged into the middle.

AndyBoBandy

Black_Knight wrote: »

3. 1 HPC and 1 FCP which can charge up to 3 cars at once.

so this confirms that at a site like the above, the AC43 will now be disabled if the CCS or Chademo is being used on the triple head unit!!

backwards step, and a big Fcuk You to Zoe drivers....

Black_Knight

Deleted User wrote: »

A Hub isn't a hub unless there are 8 physical 150+ Kw chargers than can charge 8 cars at full power without load splitting.

150 Kw but upgradable to higher power.

By your definition, not Ecars.

I'd be happier with twice as many hubs, but with only 4 units at each for now. We can see in the stats (ok, pandemic lessens the usage) that the 2 bay hubs are rarely occupied. Based on usage and growing adoption of EVs it'd be great to see these expanded, but in the meantime there's no fact based demand for 8 bay hubs. In fact i'd really hope ESB will monitor the socket usage at these hubs and switch our the CHAdeMO heads as they get less popular.

Black_Knight

AndyBoBandy wrote: »

so this confirms that at a site like the above, the AC43 will now be disabled if the CCS or Chademo is being used on the triple head unit!!

backwards step, and a big Fcuk You to Zoe drivers....

Did ECars confirm that, or are you inferring it? It's pretty ****ty for Zoe drivers alright, though at least they've started software upgrading those new DC units from 6kW 3 phase to 22kW 3 phase.

AndyBoBandy

Black_Knight wrote: »

Did ECars confirm that, or are you inferring it? It's pretty ****ty for Zoe drivers alright, though at least they've started software upgrading those new DC units from 6kW 3 phase to 22kW 3 phase.

Well, they just explained it there didn't they??? 2 cars using the Hyperspeed, and only 1 using the triple head.....

1 HPC and 1 FCP which can charge up to 3 cars at once.

We know 2 cars can use the HPC, so that leaves only 1 able to use the FCP (and all the FCP's beside the HPC's are Triple Heads..)


and then they also explained here on Facebook a few weeks ago..

KCross

Deleted User wrote: »

A Hub isn't a hub unless there are 8 physical 150+ Kw chargers than can charge 8 cars at full power without load splitting.

150 Kw but upgradable to higher power.

In that case the Ionity hubs arent hubs either.

Black_Knight

markpb wrote: »

That was probably the most confusing email I’ve ever read. So much rubbish before and after the a convoluted pricing table wedged into the middle.

150kW fees start on 1st Dec.
33c/kWh if you're on the membership plan
34.5c/kWh if you're on PAYG

Here are the configurations of Hub we plan to roll out:

Black_Knight wrote: »

So there's 3 tiers of hub:
1. 4 HPC which can charge up to 8 cars at once
2. 2 HPC which can charge up to 4 cars at once
3. 1 HPC and 1 FCP which can charge up to 3 cars at once.

Monasterevin will be the first tier 1 hub. Work is starting soon, and all HPC sites will be rolled out over the next 2 years (but we're not gonna say how many there will be so nwah nah)

PS. Portlaoise Plaza hub power supply sucks at the moment, the HPC will only cost as much as SCP until we fix that. ETA "the coming weeks" ie. Dec 2052.

AndyBoBandy

Black_Knight wrote: »

150kW fees start on 1st Dec.
33c/kWh if you're on the membership plan
34.5c/kWh if you're on PAYG

Rising to €0.37 on March 1st

AndyBoBandy

You'd also hope that one of the HPC's at sites where there are 4 of them would be at least twin CCS, giving 5 CCS & 3 Chademo plugs..

Otherwise it's 8 cars charging simultaneously..... (as long as 4 of them are Leaf's..)

Kramer

Black_Knight wrote: »

ETA "the coming weeks" ie. Dec 2052.

It'll be worth the wait though, as can be seen from the following artist's impression.......



.

Haha yeah a dream but who's going to pay for the land ? this would cost many millions and who's going to pay for it ? the payback at 30 odd C/Kwh would not make it profitable. I suppose the same could be said for any EV hub ?

This is what we need at Petrol stations, at least 2 pumps at each Petrol station should be replaced with 150 KW charger funded by the oil companies.

Kramer

Deleted User wrote: »

Haha yeah a dream but who's going to pay for the land ?

EV owners.

This is what we need at Petrol stations, at least 2 pumps at each Petrol station should be replaced with 150 KW charger funded by the oil companies.

2/3rds of the price we pay for petrol/diesel is tax.
Surely the gubbermint should fund 2/3rds of the chargers then?

In other words, taxpayers :pac:.

Kramer

KCross wrote: »

Cant complain about that price really (37c/kWh) if it delivers 150kW?

Nope, fair price. I've no real issue with ECars pricing TBH. Sure, they could incentivise off peak charging more, maybe reduce rates after midnight to encourage the insomniacs to take advantage of surplus night time generation.
Introduce a 3 hour overstay fee on 22kW AC points to stop people gaming the system to avail of free/cheap/prime parking. Rejig the monthly subscription model as it's useless to all but a few the way it is now.
All minor stuff.

My gripe is the lack of interurban/motorway hubs & how they prioritised AC installs, especially in Tescos.

Even 20 odd hubs, with even 2x 150kW units & a 50kW fast charger each, strategically located, would be a massive step forward.
Carry on then with more AC units & expand, as demand requires.

Black_Knight

AndyBoBandy wrote: »

You'd also hope that one of the HPC's at sites where there are 4 of them would be at least twin CCS, giving 5 CCS & 3 Chademo plugs..

Otherwise it's 8 cars charging simultaneously..... (as long as 4 of them are Leaf's..)

When they install the units where you have to drive straight up to them, rather than like a traditional petrol station, it could be highly unlikely to ever get 8 cars at once. Once all the left hand bays are taken, no Ioniq or Audi eTron can charge there. Once all the right hand bays are taken no ID3 (and I guess id4, enyaq, cupra born etc) can charge there.

AndyBoBandy

Black_Knight wrote: »

When they install the units where you have to drive straight up to them, rather than like a traditional petrol station, it could be highly unlikely to ever get 8 cars at once. Once all the left hand bays are taken, no Ioniq or Audi eTron can charge there. Once all the right hand bays are taken no ID3 (and I guess id4, enyaq, cupra born etc) can charge there.

Longer cables then, that swing out over the car so they can easily support cars with the socket mounted front/rear/left/right....

But I know, this is starship enterprise levels of forward thinking on eCars behalf...

Kramer

Black_Knight wrote: »

.....Ioniq or Audi eTron ....ID3 (and I guess id4, enyaq, cupra born etc)

Teslas too with their rear quarter located ports......all the same, all badly designed.

Now Nissan have it right, with that ideally placed, front centre mounted charge port. The Koreans too............smart feckers . Drive in, back out.

No, we have to give credit to ECars here for their logical layout...........

Black_Knight

AndyBoBandy wrote: »

Longer cables then, that swing out over the car so they can easily support cars with the socket mounted front/rear/left/right....

But I know, this is starship enterprise levels of forward thinking on eCars behalf...

If only it was. Sadly it just seems like they don't care enough to think these issues through. Kids could see these practical issues and come up with solutions, but I don't know how much hands on experience the ECars planners have. They blindly rinse and repeat the same setup. How IEVOA haven't lambastem them for these oversights I don't know. I can only imagine it's cost savings. Less land needed for parking bays compared to a proper forecourt. Don't let practicality get in the way of cost savings.

Silent Running

AndyBoBandy wrote: »

Rising to €0.37 on March 1st

Anyone notice that they stopped short of using the €0.37 rate when comparing a Leaf to a Focus on the charts? The comparison was getting a bit close to break even.

Black_Knight

Silent Running wrote: »

Anyone notice that they stopped short of using the €0.37 rate when comparing a Leaf to a Focus on the charts? The comparison was getting a bit close to break even.

€5.48 for 100km on EV vs €5.81 on diesel. The emphasis should be on the second chart though. No one is exclusively charging on FCP.

That 14.81kWh/100km metric they're using from the Leaf is ambitious. I know it's WLTP, but WLTP range when talking about motorway charging hubs is a misnomer

Silent Running

Black_Knight wrote: »

€5.48 for 100km on EV vs €5.81 on diesel. The emphasis should be on the second chart though. No one is exclusively charging on FCP.

That 14.81kWh/100km metric they're using from the Leaf is ambitious. I know it's WLTP, but WLTP range when talking about motorway charging hubs is a misnomer

Yeah I agree, but for those having to rely on the public charging network, there would be no incentive to spend money on an expensive electric car. Their next car will probably be fossil fuelled too.

Kramer

Kramer wrote: »

EV owners.

How are ev owners going to pay for these hubs at 37 C/Kwh ?

Kramer wrote: »

2/3rds of the price we pay for petrol/diesel is tax.
Surely the gubbermint should fund 2/3rds of the chargers then?

In other words, taxpayers :pac:.

I'm sure the taxpayer will fund a substantial about of these hubs, the lad alone will cost a fortune.