6n 2019 Scotland Vs Ireland build up thread

sydthebeat

tmc1963 wrote: »

Can I ask if these are widely held views - it's just that they seem a bit dismissive.

Of the list of injuries, it's difficult to point to any player that would make a first choice 23 other than the two players mentioned. ZF and FB in the front row probably would as well.
After that they are mostly fringe squad players, or break glass players. (though I do like mcguigan myself as a player)

I don't agree that from 1-10 we are stronger in every position, I think that's too simplistic. For example I would take the Scottish second row over ours tomorrow, even with James Ryan in there.

The game plan for Ireland tomorrow should be quite simple.... Cut out their tempo in defense by hitting up hard and fast... Put Russell under pressure in distribution.... Disrupt their breakdown ball by being bastards (POM, Best and SOB here)

In attack then we absolutely stick with what we are good at. Retain the ball. Power up into them. Rain down kicks onto their back three with hard presses. Their defensive line doesn't have the hard hitters that England do, so aki, farrell, conan, SOB etc sprigs be trying to power break the gain line with faster ball outside while they are on the back foot...

BAM! uhavechlamydia

I'm really looking forward to the game now... Delighted for Farrell and hoping he rips up trees and gives Joe another headache going forward with his WC squad

bilston

ClanofLams wrote: »

Wouldn't be overly confident, the number of changes make it hard to have much cohesion. Big chance for Conan and Roux, the former to potentially make a case for a starting position, although he will need to be excellent for the remainder of the 6N given how consistent Stander has been and the latter to solidify his place in the squad.

Roux has improved a lot over the last couple of years, think he will go well, the only fault I would have with him is he can give away silly penalties but hopefully that won't happen. The criticism of him last week on here was bizarre, someone suggested he should never see a squad again or something daft like that, how they reached that conclusion was beyond my understanding.

The game probably hinges on Murray and Sexton, if they are back to somewhere approaching their best, Ireland should be fine. But if they're anything like last week it could be a long afternoon.

The game, as always, hinges on our pack. They lay the platform. For all the criticism Murray and Sexton got after last week, it should be remembered that they were playing behind a pack that lost just about every area of the game to their English counterparts. Amy half back will struggle in that scenario.

bilston

wittycynic wrote: »

Selection for this match is a big of a missed opportunity to bring in some younger players with a view towards the autumn.

At the next World Cup the age profile of (arguably) our first fifteen will be:

Cian Healy (32)
Rory Best (37)
Tadgh Furlong (26)
James Ryan (23)
Devin Toner (33)
Peter O'Mahony (30)
Sean O'Brien (32)
CJ Stander (29)

Conor Murray (30)
Johnny Sexton (34)
Keith Earls (32)
Bundee Aki (29)
Garry Ringrose (24)
Jacob Stockdale (23)
Rob Kearney (33)

That's nine players in their 30s, with four 33 or over, and an average team age of 30. The cumulative effect of all this is a team that won't have the same ability to get through work, or recover, as one even two or three years younger on average.

While Schmidt's hands are tied around experimentation at second row in a sense, abandoning the Henshaw at full back idea after one game (dropped players under Schmidt routinely appear to have picked up a face-saving knock) and failing to give time to Larmour at full back are errors. As is not looking to Scannel at hooker at this stage.

Last year was an incredible one for Irish rugby, but looking at the profile of the team, you increasingly get the view it was a last hurrah for a lot of players who are now moving past their prime.

Experienced teams win world cups. Our age profile is grand.

bilston

molloyjh wrote: »

My biggest concern isn’t in selection, it’s the attitude. If they show up looking as lethargic as they did last week we’ll lose. Get our heads right and we should win.

This.

At the moment I'm of the opinion that last week could be the best thing that ever happened to us. It showed the players can never be complacent and always have to be at the top of their game, as everyone will be gunning for them.

If they have learnt that lesson then I don't expect a repeat again.

Of course if we lose again tomorrow then I will start considering hitting the panic button!

Buer

wittycynic wrote: »

Selection for this match is a big of a missed opportunity to bring in some younger players with a view towards the autumn.

At the next World Cup the age profile of (arguably) our first fifteen will be:

Cian Healy (32)
Rory Best (37)
Tadgh Furlong (26)
James Ryan (23)
Devin Toner (33)
Peter O'Mahony (30)
Sean O'Brien (32)
CJ Stander (29)

Conor Murray (30)
Johnny Sexton (34)
Keith Earls (32)
Bundee Aki (29)
Garry Ringrose (24)
Jacob Stockdale (23)
Rob Kearney (33)

That's nine players in their 30s, with four 33 or over, and an average team age of 30. The cumulative effect of all this is a team that won't have the same ability to get through work, or recover, as one even two or three years younger on average.

Did one of the rugby podcasts not do an analysis of the RWC winning teams in recent months and come to the "revelation" that they all had quite a high average age? Teams that win tournaments are teams that have been together for a long time, have lots of experience in their key players and have very, very few bolters who are just into the first team that year.

Squidgy Black

Considering this was the last RWC winning starting 15, I don't think there's a massive difference age wise.

Joe Moody (26)
Dane Coles (28)
Owen Frank's (27)
Brodie Retallick (23)
Sam Whitelock (26)
Jerome Kaino (31)
Richie McCaw (34)
Kieran Read (29)
Aaron Smith (26)
Dan Carter (33)
Julian Savea (25)
Ma'a Nonu (33)
Conrad Smith (33)
Milner-Skudder (24)
Ben Smith (29)

aloooof

Squidgy Black wrote: »

Considering this was the last RWC winning starting 15, I don't think there's a massive difference age wise.

Joe Moody (26)
Dane Coles (28)
Owen Frank's (27)
Brodie Retallick (23)
Sam Whitelock (26)
Jerome Kaino (31)
Richie McCaw (34)
Kieran Read (29)
Aaron Smith (26)
Dan Carter (33)
Julian Savea (25)
Ma'a Nonu (33)
Conrad Smith (33)
Milner-Skudder (24)
Ben Smith (29)

I actually think our age distribution looks pretty good, when you factor in key positions.

Compares reasonably well to above, but the big difference there is in the front 5.

Buer

aloooof wrote: »

I actually think our age distribution looks pretty good, when you factor in key positions.

Compares reasonably well to above, but the big difference there is in the front 5.

It does but keep in mind Tony Woodcock who was almost 35 was their first choice prop and got injured earlier in the tournament. They also had the 36 year old Kevin Mealamu and 31 year old Ben Franks on the bench.

It's all much of a muchness.

ClanofLams

bilston wrote: »

The game, as always, hinges on our pack. They lay the platform. For all the criticism Murray and Sexton got after last week, it should be remembered that they were playing behind a pack that lost just about every area of the game to their English counterparts. Amy half back will struggle in that scenario.

As I clarified in a later post, I expect Irelands pack to have parity at worst. Agree that it was a difficult situation behind a beaten pack last week but they were still a long way off form, Murray hasn't been back to his best since his return from what I have seen and Sexton has only played two games in six weeks or so, both of which he struggled in.

If they deliver performances of a similar standard this week as last, Ireland will struggle unless it's completely a one sided affair up front.

Buer

Worth noting that, in 5 of their last 6 games in Murrayfield, Scotland have a try on the board in the opening quarter. The longest they had to wait in those matches was until the 18th minute. Those include games against England, France and South Africa so not pushovers. They start at 100mph and if Ireland start the match the same way we did last week (or how we did 2 years ago in Murrayfield) we're going to be chasing the game from very early on and our bench is not as strong as it has been in the past in terms of impact.

evil_seed

To the people saying losing last week should wake them up - agreed
To the people saying they'l panic if we lose - WTF? What's our record in Murryfield like?

Zzippy

leakyboots wrote: »

Chris Farrell is most definitely a distributor when he wants to, well able to throw skip passes out to the wing. He's got great hands.

How many times have CF and TF faced each other?

I think people are forgetting how impressive CF was in his last outing for us, MOTM if I remember?

Edit: I think he's the right call for 13 behind Ringrose.

Not forgetting, just think he is more suited to 12. I hope he has a great game tomorrow. If Henshaw was fit he would be at 13 and Farrell wouldn't make the squad.

(The two Farrells have played each other twice if I'm right. First time Tom made line breaks for fun. He also scored the wining try from one of his line breaks. Second time Tom made line breaks for fun and was MOTM despite being on the losing team. He also scored a try after ripping the ball from a No. 8.)

Buer

evil_seed wrote: »

To the people saying losing last week should wake them up - agreed
To the people saying they'l panic if we lose - WTF? What's our record in Murryfield like?

We've lost 3 of our last 4 there.

razorblunt

I had to laugh when I saw a picture of the Ireland bus at Haymarket on Twitter yesterday. That Scottish superfan GLove jokingly suggested he's off to find a clamp and some lad replied with "here's the other side of the bus" showing an MSPaint job of the Springboks logo on there next to #teamofus.

Incredible lack of self awareness it has to be said.

sydthebeat

razorblunt wrote: »

I had to laugh when I saw a picture of the Ireland bus at Haymarket yesterday. Yer man GLove jokingly suggested he's off to find a clamp and some lad replies here "here's the other side of the bus" and an MsPaint job of the Springboks logo on there next to #teamofus.

Incredible lack of self awareness it has to be said, WP doesn't stand for Wee Pal Nel!

I don't understand any of this post???

Is it an Instagram "had to be there" type??

Zzippy

sydthebeat wrote: »

I don't understand any of this post???

Is it an Instagram "had to be there" type??

I too am confused...

Perifect

It's confusing but I think a Scotland fan was having a go because we have a few South Africans, then the poster was saying that's ironic.

Riskymove

sydthebeat wrote: »

I don't understand any of this post???

some Scots suggested the Irish team bus be sprayed with the South African logo

Poster thinks this ironic given WP is also South African and now plays for Scotland

molloyjh

bilston wrote: »

This.

At the moment I'm of the opinion that last week could be the best thing that ever happened to us. It showed the players can never be complacent and always have to be at the top of their game, as everyone will be gunning for them.

If they have learnt that lesson then I don't expect a repeat again.

Of course if we lose again tomorrow then I will start considering hitting the panic button!

Every team has off days. It’s been a while since we had one and we were probably due it. The (short term) problem is that it’s probably cost us the Championship. Going down 0-5 at home like that most certainly leaves us too much to do and does make us completely dependent on other results.

No matter what way we cut it though, it has to be a worry that we couldn’t get ourselves pumped for a home game against one of the best teams in the world whonwere coming here to make a point, nevermind the fact that it was England. It’d probably have been easier to take if it was anyone else, but we expect the lads to be up for that one.

sydthebeat

Riskymove wrote: »

some Scots suggested the Irish team bus be sprayed with the South African logo

Poster thinks this ironic given WP is also South African and now plays for Scotland

WP Nel
Cornell Du Preez
Josh Strauss
Allen Dell

whoever made that joke is really a bit of an idiot.

evil_seed

Buer wrote: »

We've lost 3 of our last 4 there.

Exactly. So it's no need to panic when historically we've been bad over there. And that's just recent history too

razorblunt

sydthebeat wrote: »

WP Nel
Cornell Du Preez
Josh Strauss
Allen Dell

whoever made that joke is really a bit of an idiot.

That's the long and short of it.
Apologies for the confusion, I had a boring conference call in one ear whilst I was posting that.

The 4 lads above plus, the Edinburgh winger and prop waiting for residency.

Perifect

My gut before the England game told me that our complacency was a huge worry, that combined with a fired up England, I was scared. Unfortunately, my gut was right. This week, I have a feeling that we are going to be the team fired up and rattling into tackles. I'm worried about a few positions but I think we're going to win! Very close match though.

Had a dream that we lost 38-8. No biggie

kilns

This is going to be a very tight game, we never have it easy in Murrayfield. Ringrose is a huge huge loss and the step down to Farrell is enormous, hopefully he rises to the occassion.

if we kick lose to Hogg we could be in trouble of conceding some easy tries but I am sure Joe has a plan for that.

We really need to strangle them up front and at the breakdown and not give them anything to live but scraps

Its going to be tight and PP have it -6 ireland which could be just about right

BAM! uhavechlamydia

I'd ask just one thing... venjur ain't allowed to do the match thread #jinx

Zzippy

BAM! uhavechlamydia wrote: »

I'd ask just one thing... venjur ain't allowed to do the match thread #jinx

Is that an offer? Good man. You can do it so

Dickie10

if we lose how much of a disaster would it be? would joe give marginal players game time for the last three games?

Henry Ford III

Dickie10 wrote: »

if we lose how much of a disaster would it be? would joe give marginal players game time for the last three games?

It wouldn't be great - the RWC isn't that far off.

Dickie10

i wonder would the media go the opposite way of dancing on there grave ala the english media with their football team? they are partly responsible for so much pressure on the players anyway bigging them up as if they are going to win a world cup. the same gutter press will probably be tearing joe down after building him up

Duggie2012

i think we will lose 30-15 or something like that. i can see the scots scoring tries, they have a very decent backline. hope i'm wrong but i think we will lose.

Zzippy

Duggie2012 wrote: »

i think we will lose 30-15 or something like that. i can see the scots scoring tries, they have a very decent backline. hope i'm wrong but i think we will lose.

The Scots also concede tries - 3 to Italy in 8 minutes last week.

BAM! uhavechlamydia

Zzippy wrote: »

Is that an offer? Good man. You can do it so

Could you imagine the carnage!

sydthebeat

BAM! uhavechlamydia wrote: »

Could you imagine the carnage!

no.

make it real !

Cosmo Kramer

Riskymove wrote: »

some Scots suggested the Irish team bus be sprayed with the South African logo

Poster thinks this ironic given WP is also South African and now plays for Scotland

That's actually incredible given that only 7 of the Scottish starting 15 are homegrown players.

BAM! uhavechlamydia

sydthebeat wrote: »

no.

make it real !

I have enough trouble at the moment with a bank thinking I'm a terrorist ffs

evil_seed

Zzippy wrote: »

The Scots also concede tries - 3 to Italy in 8 minutes last week.

they had the game all wrapped up at that stage though. Never in doubt

awec

SOB sitting out today's captains run...

BoardAtWork

awec wrote: »

SOB sitting out today's captains run...

That's not good news. A backrow of POM/VdF/Conan is extremely lightweight.

Squidgy Black

If it's not injury related, then that's comical from the IRFU/SOB's agent, I can't imagine the deal was agreed in the last 24 hours from when he was named as a starter

Zzippy

awec wrote: »

SOB sitting out today's captains run...

Ah sh1te!

BAM! uhavechlamydia wrote: »

I have enough trouble at the moment with a bank thinking I'm a terrorist ffs

You can't just say that and leave us hanging...!

Eod100

Squidgy Black wrote: »

If it's not injury related, then that's comical from the IRFU/SOB's agent, I can't imagine the deal was agreed in the last 24 hours from when he was named as a starter

"Being managed" whatever that means. https://twitter.com/Cumoski/status/1093888536682602497?s=19

Cosmo Kramer

What are the chances SOB is pulled before kick off? JVDF starting and Murphy on the bench a possibility.

Murphy to the bench I guess. Would you start him over VDF?

arsebiscuits1

Deleted User wrote: »

Murphy to the bench I guess. Would you start him over VDF?

If you're sticking to the same plan of why SOB was brought in then yes I would start Murphy.

He's a bit more aggressive and a better carrier than Josh. In fact I think Jordi is a very underrated ball carrier.

Obviously you will lose a lot of Go Forward without SOB

troyzer

ROC is saying he'll be fine to play.

Could just be precautionary. Henshaw missed the captain's run last week as well.

Dubinusa

Jesus wept!! And that's one reason why SOB is not foremost in my team selection.
Captain's run?
If he misses out, Joe has got to be thinking of looking elsewhere!
As good a player as he is, he's going to give some of us heart attacks with his instability!
If he doesn't start, it's a different match. I am not very confident if it's true.
SOB would most likely not survive the rwc.

BAM! uhavechlamydia

Zzippy wrote: »

Ah sh1te!





You can't just say that and leave us hanging...!

Ah...I'm part of Pat Casey's fragrance buying group in the Gentlemans Club..we all chip in and get niche smells at great prices.
We pay by bank transfer...and like ye...he gets to keep up with my usernames, so we always include our boards name too so there's no errors...... but I had a call from my bank this morning, saying Citybank had questioned my payment...I had to provide my name....dob...and what the payment was for... unusual...so gave them the info...an hour later they rang back... Citybank want to know my nationality and how long I've been in the country....
At this point the girl is cracking up...and says they've seen "BAM" in your username and think you're a terrorist bomber....words failed me....but tis all sorted now....

I'm waiting for the WHO to get onto me now about any Chlamydia outbreaks

kingofthekong

arsebiscuits1 wrote: »

If you're sticking to the same plan of why SOB was brought in then yes I would start Murphy.

He's a bit more aggressive and a better carrier than Josh. In fact I think Jordi is a very underrated ball carrier.

Obviously you will lose a lot of Go Forward without SOB

Thats simply not true VDF is better in every single department then Murphy and thats why he's up in Ulster