Go arounds Ryanair/Aer Linguus

Wrex

Now i have to say a few things at the start, i am neither an expert, have any stats, and not making a statement of fact, or infuring any conclusions.

During the last few very windy days in Dublin, I check the flightradar 24 app, to see how flights are doing. From my observations, with no proof, it seems Ryanair planes seem to have to complete go arounds more often than the Aer Lingus ones. Yesterday for example, i observed two Ryanair go arounds in between Aer Lingus planes landing successfully. Does anyone with more knowledge of me have a reason for this?


It is just something i have noticed last few years when i check the app in bad weather conditions.

Dardania

pure guess, but from looking on google, it seems the 737NG with winglets has a crosswind limit of 33kts, whwereas the A320 without sharklets is 38kts - might be in the area?

Mebuntu

There is another important factor to consider.

If a landing aircraft receives a windshear warning it is usually mandatory to go around. In a line of 10 landing aircraft you could have a situation where 9 of them go around due to windshear warning with just the one going ahead with the landing because it didn't get one.

ozzy jr

How many Ryanair planes land at Dublin compared to Aer Lingus in a day?

View Profile

Wrex wrote:

it seems Ryanair planes seem to have to complete go arounds more often than the Aer Lingus ones. Yesterday for example, i observed two Ryanair go arounds in between Aer Lingus planes landing successfully.

And if you came back an hour later you could have witnessed two Ryanair landing and an Aer Lingus going around.

Nothing to do with the pilots, airline procedures or aircraft types. All operate with very similar parameters.

davetherave

ozzy jr wrote: »

How many Ryanair planes land at Dublin compared to Aer Lingus in a day?

I'm not saying this is 100% but just working off of https://www.dublinairport.com/flight-information/live-arrivals and doing a search for both then counting the number of occurrences each I'm getting 108 for EI and 109 for FR. I'm including corresponding flights scheduled for tomorrow up to the first row I'm seeing for them today

You could tot them up manually using the timetable below if you feel the need.

https://www.dublinairport.com/docs/default-source/winter-timetable-2018-19/daa-winter-timetable-2018-hr.pdf?sfvrsn=2

duskyjoe

View Profile wrote: »

Nothing to do with the pilots, airline procedures or aircraft types. All operate with very similar parameters.

pilot procedures and parameter agreed but aircraft type No. If a 320 has a higher cross wind limit than a 737, well it’s common sense whose going to get in or not if the cross wind gust is exceeding the manufactures cross wind limiting component.

goingnowhere

As has been posted the crosswind limits on the A320 are higher and also the A320 has a lower approach speed

So you will see times when Aer Lingus land but Ryanair diverts as a result of the wind.

If its out of limits you go around and try again or go somewhere else, land 1 knot over the limit and you will find yourself in trouble

L1011

davetherave wrote: »

I'm not saying this is 100% but just working off of https://www.dublinairport.com/flight-information/live-arrivals and doing a search for both then counting the number of occurrences each I'm getting 108 for EI and 109 for FR. I'm including corresponding flights scheduled for tomorrow up to the first row I'm seeing for them today

You could tot them up manually using the timetable below if you feel the need.

https://www.dublinairport.com/docs/default-source/winter-timetable-2018-19/daa-winter-timetable-2018-hr.pdf?sfvrsn=2

The EI figure will include ATRs, RJ85s, 757s and 330s all of which have different crosswind limits again.

View Profile

duskyjoe wrote:

pilot procedures and parameter agreed but aircraft type No. If a 320 has a higher cross wind limit than a 737, well it’s common sense whose going to get in or not if the cross wind gust is exceeding the manufactures cross wind limiting component.

Fairly rare for exceedance of a crosswind limit to lead to a go around, especially on short final. Much more common for a windshear warning or unstable approach being the reason an approach is thrown away.

If winds were out of limits the pilots generally wouldn't even begin an approach but instead hold or divert.

Chris_5339762

Anything to do with the landing characteristics of a B737 vs an A320/321?

coastwatch

Dont want to derail thread, but during high cross winds, at what point does the crew have to commit to landing? I saw a video of a FR flight landing attempt at Leeds at the weekend, seemed to be about 10-15 degrees off centreline, rear wheels touched and then took off again, maybe for another go or to divert somewhere else.

ProfessorPlum

coastwatch wrote: »

Dont want to derail thread, but during high cross winds, at what point does the crew have to commit to landing? I saw a video of a FR flight landing attempt at Leeds at the weekend, seemed to be about 10-15 degrees off centreline, rear wheels touched and then took off again, maybe for another go or to divert somewhere else.

Once spoilers/reversers haven’t deployed you can technically go around at any stage.

View Profile

Selecting takeoff power on the 737 automatically stows the spoilers.

Brennus335

coastwatch wrote: »

Dont want to derail thread, but during high cross winds, at what point does the crew have to commit to landing? I saw a video of a FR flight landing attempt at Leeds at the weekend, seemed to be about 10-15 degrees off centreline, rear wheels touched and then took off again, maybe for another go or to divert somewhere else.

A go around can be conducted at any point up until the selection of thrust reverse.

Tenger

Brennus335 wrote: »

A go around can be conducted at any point up until the selection of thrust reverse.

A captain I used to know in EI stated that "every landing is a failed go-around", his point being that a 'go-around' is always a possibility and can happen very far out if the situation happens.
Enthusiasts (and the media) focus on the late go-arounds or touch and go's as they are the most dramatic.

Stovepipe

Correct. Every pilot is alive to the notion that he may have to go around, early or late and he and his fellow cockpit crew will have planned accordingly, by reading the Missed Approach procedure on the approach plate and knowing what the Company requires of them.