The Legend of Zelda: Link’s Awakening - Nintendo Switch

sligeach

Nintendo don't do great stories really, it's more about the gameplay. The "plots" for Mario games are especially awful. And I didn't think Okami outstayed its welcome. That was another brilliant game.

Star Lord

PostWoke wrote: »

Except at the raccoon.

Except at the platform with the face.

Except with the crow.

Except getting into Yarna Desert, which I'm now having to look up a guide for. I have to say I LOVE all the obstacles in the world, the holes and the immovable rocks in the way. Yup, none of my time being wasted!

If you can't get past something, you're either not equipped for it yet, or are going the wrong way. If you're resorting to guides, then the problem is you're not being spoon fed enough for your liking.

PostWoke wrote: »

You JUST said the game has a great narrative a few days ago, which it doesn't. Which is it?

These things are not mutually exclusive. Games can have great narrative and no pointless exposition.

PostWoke

sligeach wrote: »

Nintendo don't do great stories really, it's more about the gameplay.

OoT, Wind Waker, Majora's Mask, even Skyward Sword disagree with you. No they're not dense like a Final Fantasy or Metal Gear game, but those stories are very memorable. Metroid and Mario, yes, there's certainly less of that, maybe with the exception of Sunshine and the Metroid game that shall not be named.

Then of course you have the Mario RPG games, but I believe most if not all of those are not in-house productions? Not sure, never played them, keep meaning to.

Retr0gamer

PostWoke wrote: »

Except at the raccoon.

Except at the platform with the face.

Except with the crow.

Except getting into Yarna Desert, which I'm now having to look up a guide for. I have to say I LOVE all the obstacles in the world, the holes and the immovable rocks in the way. Yup, none of my time being wasted! .

I meant with annoying exposition which takes control away from the player. Not minor gameplay sequences that might have annoyed you. I think I made that very obvious so don't twist my words.

PostWoke wrote: »

You JUST said the game has a great narrative a few days ago, which it doesn't. Which is it?;

What are you talking about? Games can have great narrative without resorting to mountains of exposition. Super Metroid, ICO, Braid, Dark Souls and Shadow of The Colossus are other examples. Simple but effective is far more preferable than never ending cutscenes and lore codex.

PostWoke wrote: »

There is practically no narrative here. 'Wake the Wind Fish' is it.

I'm not wrong, just my definition of good narrative isn't as narrow as yours. Good narrative doesn't need mountains of text and exposition. Tell your story through gameplay and the environment. If you need too much exposition then you've either failed as a game designer or you're treating your audience as stupid.

sligeach wrote: »

Nintendo don't do great stories really, it's more about the gameplay.

The same company brought us Fire Emblem Genealogy of War, Earthbound, Mother 3 and Super Metroid to name a few. All narrative masterpeices.

PostWoke

Retr0gamer wrote: »

I'm not wrong

You are, and you're just confusing yourself now too.

~~

I think the thing I hate most about the game is how constricting the overworld is. Trees, blocks and holes everywhere, too many to jump over, can't use the pegasus boots to run over them either. Picked up Marin to take her to the walrus, there was a transport platform just to the right, but no, ten holes between us and that, had to circle around to the village. So annoying. Far more constricting overworld than ALttP, and slightly more than Minish; there really is no excuse. Going for the fourth dungeon now, doing the rest with a guide so I can get rid of this disappointment asap. Really haven't disliked a Zelda apart from Twilight Princess, and maybe Phantom Hourglass because of the annoying tower.

Mr.Saturn

PostWoke wrote: »

Really haven't disliked a Zelda apart from Twilight Princess, and maybe Phantom Hourglass because of the annoying tower.

Actually been playing Twilight Princess and think I'm roughly halfway, not been super digging it. I'm guessing it doesn't get much better?

PostWoke

Nope. Not even a good game never mind a good Zelda. But I still recommend pushing through regardless, some worthwhile moments and dungeons.

sligeach

Stop, please! There's no bad Zelda games, except one. Skyward Sword.

"Not even a good game never mind a good Zelda."

That's what you must have meant to say. It is simply...Awful! Awful! Awful!

Twilight Princess was and is a good game. The thing is, people were expecting the Second Coming, after OOT. Majora's Mask was great too, but that was different.

PostWoke

sligeach wrote: »

Stop, please! There's no bad Zelda games, except one. Skyward Sword.



That's what you must have meant to say. It is simply...Awful! Awful! Awful!

Twilight Princess was and is a good game. The thing is, people were expecting the Second Coming, after OOT. Majora's Mask was great too, but that was different.

Skyward Sword is a beautiful game with great characters and Retro's favourite, narrative. It does have serious flaws, namely the late game backtracking the game absolutely didn't need (a WW length game would've been fine here) and the horrendously frustrating swordfighting boss fights. Also having to endure an item description for everything upon reset, I believe it was? Some people complain about the overworld, I don't see the difference between rolling around Termina Field and flying to points of interest myself.

Gorgeous gouache/ watercolour aesthetic, the second prettiest Zelda after WW, neither will ever age, great dungeons, including one that is pretty essential to understanding overarching Zelda lore, far superior collectathon sections compared to the awful bug hunting in TP, nice sidequests, fantastic music that is also contextual, and even a hint at the Zelda universe we know being a massive reset from another one that was completely destroyed, which I hope we see one day (Fi being much older than Skyward Sword but talking in percentages suggests an advanced, possibly Sci-Fi civilization).

Very much hope we see a straight remaster for Switch soon. I'm jonezing for SS, Metroid Trilogy, Mario Sunshine and Wind Waker HD on Switch.

sligeach

Skyward Sword, being more honest is nearly trash in my view. If I was to list it's criticisms, it would take a long, long time. I was so hyped for it and loved every Zelda game, bought the Gold Wii remote Collectors Edition with soundtrack and, words, fail to describe the awfulness of it.

Fi, empty sky, poor mini-games, repeated boss battles, disjointed world, P1$$ poor instrument playing, muted nonexistent soundtrack, brutal final boss, areas of the game rehashed for several purposes, dowsing, sidequests were muck. I'm not exaggerating, I was glad and looking forward to the game ending, long before it happened, I was that disappointed.

I love Zelda to bits, but I have no idea how people and sites gave it a free pass. There were sites that gave it perfect scores, seriously, WTF? I would gladly see it removed from the timeline. BOTW was a monumental return to form.

PostWoke

sligeach wrote: »

empty sky

Lots of islands in the sky. Less so than WW for sure.

sligeach wrote: »

repeated boss battles

Let's not pretend SS is Halo 5 here eh, there's plenty of unique bosses.

sligeach wrote: »

muted nonexistent soundtrack

Skyward Sword is by far the largest Zelda soundtrack, at well over a hundred tracks. This argument is also unfair in BoTW.

sligeach wrote: »

I love Zelda to bits, but I have no idea how people and sites gave it a free pass. There were sites that gave it perfect scores, seriously, WTF? I would gladly see it removed from the timeline. BOTW was a monumental return to form.

I feel this way about LA. BoTW is near flawless but also has its' flaws, namely very samey shrines, dungeons, dungeon bosses and the final boss having no character. Of course, we know why now, it wasn't so much Ganondorf as a pure manifestation of his malice. Very much hoping they get BoTW2 out for Christmas next year with a Switch Pro of some description, special Zelda edition wouldn't go amiss either.

CiDeRmAn

I get that there appear to be strong opinions but can we remember that they are all just that, opinions?
Everyone has their favourite and least favourite LoZ title, and they often differ, from person to person.
Everyone is convinced too at the truth of their claim.

But, let's not let things get heated, please.

Rhyme

Well excuuuuuuuuuuuuuse me, Princess.



#squadala

PostWoke

CiDeRmAn wrote: »

But, let's not let things get heated, please.

? I see no heat whatsoever tbh. Just ideas being clearly communicated and shared, the whole point of message boards.

manual_man

Has this been patched yet?

sligeach

PostWoke wrote: »

? I see no heat whatsoever tbh. Just ideas being clearly communicated and shared, the whole point of message boards.

I don't think he's saying things are heated, just to be careful not to let it happen. I too didn't have a problem with anyone's opinion, no matter how clearly wrong they are.

Corholio

PostWoke wrote: »

? I see no heat whatsoever tbh. Just ideas being clearly communicated and shared, the whole point of message boards.

I think it's just that opinions about Skyward Sword seem to pop up quite often, often in unrelated threads, and it ends up being the same tired things dragged back and forth.

PostWoke

manual_man wrote: »

Has this been patched yet?

Also it's a disgrace how long it took for even one patch, and it didn't help performance at all from what I can see, no idea what it did, but yes, there was a small one.

sligeach wrote: »

I don't think he's saying things are heated, just to be careful not to let it happen. I too didn't have a problem with anyone's opinion, no matter how clearly wrong they are.

I know, imagine someone saying SS has no soundtrack when the soundtrack has 243 separate tracks! ;P

chrislad

PostWoke wrote: »

Also it's a disgrace how long it took for even one patch, and it didn't help performance at all from what I can see, no idea what it did, but yes, there was a small one.



I know, imagine someone saying SS has no soundtrack when the soundtrack has 243 separate tracks! ;P

I've actually never played Skyward Sword, bar the opening area, just couldn't get into it, and at the time, other things took precedence. That said, Breath of the Wild has a massive soundtrack too, and for the life of me, I can't recall one of the tunes, whereas the Great Sea theme from Wind Waker, as well as its opening theme, has lingered far longer.

PostWoke

chrislad wrote: »

I've actually never played Skyward Sword, bar the opening area, just couldn't get into it, and at the time, other things took precedence. That said, Breath of the Wild has a massive soundtrack too, and for the life of me, I can't recall one of the tunes, whereas the Great Sea theme from Wind Waker, as well as its opening theme, has lingered far longer.

Yeah I also didn't finish SS at the time, not until years later. Life got in the way, had to start again too, but ran a rip through Dolphin for it the second time, with a Mayflash remote sensor. Looked incredible at 1080p.

BoTW does indeed get the same criticism soundtrack wise. The two that stick out to me is the grassland region and especially the snowy region and theme, as well as the one that plays when you're following the torches to get to the master sword, that one is very memorable and atmospheric, made the whole scene. Love me some bamboo windchimes :P

RobbingBandit

Aside from BOTW 2 I'm not buying any Zelda on switch at launch again unless it's a remastered budget price disgusted with myself for how much I paid for Link's awakening and the Amiibo.

CiDeRmAn

RobbingBandit wrote: »

Aside from BOTW 2 I'm not buying any Zelda on switch at launch again unless it's a remastered budget price disgusted with myself for how much I paid for Link's awakening and the Amiibo.

Yes you will.
First in line and hating yourself.

RobbingBandit

CiDeRmAn wrote: »

Yes you will.
First in line and hating yourself.

Come now no one will ever hate me as much as you did hahaha

Gulp I'm in trouble now.

I'd pay €to infinity and beyond for Ocarina and or Majora on switch in all fairness.

Mr.Saturn

I'd pay over-the-odds for a big-screen Majora that doesn't look like dog sick. Played it for the first time a couple months back, it's a phenomenal game.

PostWoke

CiDeRmAn wrote: »

Yes you will.
First in line and hating yourself.

Sounds like me for Rise of Skywalker.


TBH who could have really anticipated this? People were complaining about the price sure, but people swore up and down LA was one of the best, not a highly constricted game with Grim Fandango logic. I'd never played it so I didn't know, I must be a filthy casual because my Zelda first experience was Wind Waker with the Ocarina pack in, then the Mario Kart gamecube with the Ocarina and Majora's Mask pack-in (sold my og GC for it :P). Man I miss Sakaguchi's Nintendo.

sligeach

PostWoke wrote: »

I know, imagine someone saying SS has no soundtrack when the soundtrack has 243 separate tracks! ;P

No good if it's muted and you can't hear it. BOTW's soundtrack was muted too and more in the background. I honestly can't remember any music from SS, I can from BOTW. Twilight Princess and the Wind Waker had great and memorable music. I must go back and listen to SS, maybe it was there and I just couldn't hear it.

CiDeRmAn

RobbingBandit wrote: »

Come now no one will ever hate me as much as you did hahaha

Gulp I'm in trouble now.

I'd pay €to infinity and beyond for Ocarina and or Majora on switch in all fairness.

I don't really hate anyone.
While there were certainly some cruel people around, once upon a time, I always tried not to be.
Perhaps a lack of a willingness to understand...

But we are all friends now, that is the important thing!

And you'll queue, whenever the inevitable LttP remaster comes out on the Switch... with some pre-order Tri-force shaped glow-in-the-dark stress toy...

You want to start queuing already, don't you?

RobbingBandit

Lttp turning into the rabbit would look like Frank the Bunny on the switch, damn sign me up for that.

PostWoke

RobbingBandit wrote: »

Lttp turning into the rabbit would look like Frank the Bunny on the switch, damn sign me up for that.

Still think TP would've been much better if you'd been able to change into numerous animals Majora's Mask style, including a bunny.

Just got to Catfish temple, Angler's was one of the worst laid out temples in Zelda history, and spotting the cracked pillars to explode... yeesh. I assume they were far more visible on the gameboy. As was the fact you needed to dive to get into Catfish. I do wonder how much more visible clues were in the gb version.

Then being forced to do that stupid ghost side quest before entering catfish, just really, really bad game design. Can't believe I have four more instruments to get Seriously dunno how people moan about the triforce quest in WW. This is probably one of the worse games I've played all year

pasta-solo

PostWoke wrote: »

being forced to do that stupid ghost side quest before entering catfish, just really, really bad game design. Can't believe I have four more instruments to get Seriously dunno how people moan about the triforce quest in WW. This is probably one of the worse games I've played all year

You know you can stop playing anytime, right? Why force yourself to finish if you're not enjoying it?

PostWoke

sligeach wrote: »

No good if it's muted and you can't hear it.

Unmute your telly. I was going to post a few examples, but literally the first ten examples of the OST on Youtube are so melodic and energetic I'm just going to post the entire playlist, it's not all running through the embedded window, you'll have to follow it to youtube.

Ballad of the Goddess (#3) has to be one of the best Zelda tracks ever, goddamn.

RobbingBandit

Sarah's Song extended ending of Ocarina is still my favourite Zelda track

PostWoke

pasta-solo wrote: »

You know you can stop playing anytime, right? Why force yourself to finish if you're not enjoying it?

Yeah I know, but might as well. Finishing it with a guide to see the main story anyway, getting rid of it when I go into town at the end of the week.

Not sure how anyone ever got the bird key back in the day without a guide. How you gonna know to move the statue after getting the extra powerful bracelets? And that signpost maze was so annoying, just plays really badly.

PostWoke

"Finally have all the instruments, let's go for the ending!"

"...what? ANOTHER DUNGEON! AND NO MAGNIFYING GLASS SO I AM FORCED TO DO THIS IDIOTIC FETCH QUEST????"

Just finished it for real, unbelievable game for all the wrong reasons. Flabberghasted people thought this was good, I wonder if they were any first timers or it was all people with experience with the GB game. Incredibly constricting world design preventing you from exploring with trees, rocks, holes, and just impassable borders, Grim Fandango logic best left in the 90's, so much mandatory progression hidden behind choices I don't know how anyone ever made on their own, and not a single enemy who was fun to fight, and very easy boss fights. There's a reason Ocarina changed up the formula and never looked back; hell, not even A Link to the Past 1, or A Link Between Worlds felt so constricted and random. And the performance is just very bad, they should have locked it to 30.
Twilight Princess is now only my second least favourite Zelda. Did not anticipate that when looking forward to this game for months.

It looks decent, enemy bosses in particular are well modelled and shaded. I liked the story, even though I had it spoiled on me in a thread about this remake's reveal. Would've liked a choice at the end, live the lie or not. I think it would be cool if BoTW2 could have DLC revolving around restoring Koholint.

Back to Luigi's Mansion 3, a far superior experience, and bring on Pokemon. My copy of LA will be joining the many, many others already populating CeX shelves asap.

Retr0gamer

Retr0gamer wrote: »

And narratively, it's simple but effective.

PostWoke wrote: »

There is practically no narrative here. 'Wake the Wind Fish' is it.

Retr0gamer wrote: »

I'm not wrong

PostWoke wrote: »

You are, and you're just confusing yourself now too.

PostWoke wrote:

I liked the story

PostWoke

Retr0gamer wrote: »

Six or seven lines towards the very very end does not a narrative make...

... tbh I was trying to find something nice to say about the game XD

It's melancholy which is good but does not thread itself throughout the whole game. Until you come across the mural there's basically nothing aside from 'Wake the Wind Fish'. That's 90% into the game.

Still wish we were given an option. It's Mass Effect 3 all over again!!

LA's Link is his own incarnation right, or is he a Link from another Zelda game?

Retr0gamer

I think he is apparently the same Link from after LTTP.

However sane people like myself like to believe that the whole Zelda timeline is a load of old ballbags that Nintendo pulled out of their asses.

PostWoke

It's fun to think about, but definitely didn't exist pre-Wind Waker or OoT.

chrislad

Retr0gamer wrote: »

I think he is apparently the same Link from after LTTP.

However sane people like myself like to believe that the whole Zelda timeline is a load of old ballbags that Nintendo pulled out of their asses.

Apparently it's Ocarina of Time, LttP, then this. But as you said, it's like trying to make random shapes fit together, and say this is the design you intended all along.

PostWoke

chrislad wrote: »

Apparently it's Ocarina of Time, LttP, then this.

The timeline splits into three after Ocarina though. At least it does now. And possibly reconverges before BoTW somehow...

Retr0gamer

It's a load of nonsense. I remember hearing about it in fan theory episodes before Nintendo made it official and thinking it was really dumb.