Justin's finally up for sale.

Caranica

beauf wrote: »

Not entirely sure you'd need a Garda station and refuge nearby to a nursing home.

My point in relation to those was building height

beauf

Caranica wrote: »

My point in relation to those was building height

I know I was just pulling your chain. I don't really get the issues with height unless you are overlooked or in the shadow of it. Which can be an issue if they build 4 and 5 storey apartments beside your house. Which the planners allow frequently.

But a taller building with a sympathetic even homage treatment of the ground and first floor facia can work well. Not that there is any coherent design cultural or otherwise in Blanch Village to blend in with.

Hurrache

There's no need to go high rise in suburbs, the place for that is in the cities

liamog

Pat Dunne wrote: »

I agree, however it simply can’t be more of this bland architecture.
Have the architects taken any environmental approach to this building?
Is it carbon neutral?
Does it have rain water harvesting facilities?
Does it have on site secure Bicycle parking?
Are there EV charging points?

Did you read the linked document in your own post, there is a whole section on sustainable measures on page 18.

Phil.x

€20 to submit an observation that won't see the light of day. Nothing but a Money racket by dodgy fingal and its crony councillors.

Caranica

Hurrache wrote: »

There's no need to go high rise in suburbs, the place for that is in the cities

That's not high rise in planning terms.

Phil.x wrote: »

€20 to submit an observation that won't see the light of day. Nothing but a Money racket by dodgy fingal and its crony councillors.

All observations are published on the Council website and on the planning file.

liamog

It scares me when people think that 4 stories (3 with a setback) is high rise development.

Pat Dunne

Phil.x wrote: »

€20 to submit an observation that won't see the light of day. Nothing but a Money racket by dodgy fingal and its crony councillors.

Your ire should be directed at the unaccountable Public Servants who are the Planning Officials in Fingal County Council. Publicly elected Councillors were removed from the Planning process over 20 years ago

jack presley

Pat Dunne wrote: »

Your ire should be directed at the unaccountable Public Servants who are the Planning Officials in Fingal County Council. Publicly elected Councillors were removed from the Planning process over 20 years ago

Qualified and experienced planners you mean?

Thank God councillors have no input in planning decisions.

Larbre34

They are accountable, to An Bord Pleanála, the Courts and if it ever came to it, SIPO.

Now I happen to be a chartered planner, albeit in private practice, but I did once work as a graduate and junior level planner in Local Authorities and I deal with them on commercial applications day in and out. Ask me anything.

Pat Dunne

jack presley wrote: »

Qualified and experienced planners you mean?

Thank God councillors have no input in planning decisions.

Qualifications and Experience has failed to delivered any worth while Architecture to Dublin 15 in the last 30 years it’s simply a replication of dull and bland buildings.
Yes, I agree having Politicians out of the planning process is good. However it is very well know and documented fact that many a former Planning Official and or Senior Council Manager whom upon retirement, lands a nice cushy job with a Developer or becomes their go to Planning Consultant.

liamog

Pat Dunne wrote: »

Qualifications and Experience has failed to delivered any worth while Architecture to Dublin 15 in the last 30 years it’s simply a replication of dull and bland buildings.
Yes, I agree having Politicians out of the planning process is good. However it is very well know and documented fact that many a former Planning Official and or Senior Council Manager whom upon retirement, lands a nice cushy job with a Developer or becomes their go to Planning Consultant.

That can be said of most public servants, those years of knowledge may as well be used for something.

I don't blame the council for the lack interesting architecture, we're a dormitory suburb of a small European capital. What are you expecting other than functional buildings.

Pat Dunne

liamog wrote: »

I don't blame the council for the lack interesting architecture, we're a dormitory suburb of a small European capital. What are you expecting other than functional buildings.

Your lack of ambition for your local area and environment is very disappointing.

jack presley

Pat Dunne wrote: »

However it is very well know and documented fact that many a former Planning Official and or Senior Council Manager whom upon retirement, lands a nice cushy job with a Developer or becomes their go to Planning Consultant.

I don't get the point you're trying to make here. That's the same for tonnes of professions. People do the required years or reach retirement age where they have to leave or whatever and move on to a job in private practice. There's nothing wrong with that.

Hurrache

Caranica wrote: »

That's not high rise in planning terms.

I understand that, I was talking in general terms.

Pat Dunne wrote: »

Your ire should be directed at the unaccountable Public Servants who are the Planning Officials in Fingal County Council. Publicly elected Councillors were removed from the Planning process over 20 years ago

With the fast tracking planing process, which could be disastrous, the local councils are bypassed and it goes straight to An Bord Pleanna.

hardybuck

I think it's fantastic that local councils, and Councillors in particular, are bypassed for these important strategic developments.

I notice that people have complained about Blanch 'village' and it's design - well you have local planners and Councillors to thank for that.

While ABP aren't perfect, at least they might introduce some consistency and expertise to the process.

A classic case in point was a group of Cork County Councillors voting this year to alter the County Development Plan to facilitate the development of a Kildare Village type retail development.

The newly appointed Planning Regulator had to step in and ask the relevant Minister to intervene as the Council didn't give sufficient consideration to spacial strategies, roads and transport strategies, etc.

Hurrache

Nothing good comes out of fast tracking planing.

hardybuck

Hurrache wrote: »

Nothing good comes out of fast tracking planing.

Could you expand upon that assertion?

liamog

Pat Dunne wrote: »

Your lack of ambition for your local area and environment is very disappointing.

I'm not a property developer so wasn't really going to make a difference anyway. I tend to save my ambition for people developing to the best of their abilty and having the local amenieties to do so, instead of having not very many amenities but the ones they do look nice.
In community nursing homes like this are a great way to ensure older members of the community stay connected to their local support groups, I don't need them to look amazing at the same time.

Hurrache

hardybuck wrote: »

Could you expand upon that assertion?

We've a decade or two of it, and inappropriate planing, stemming from the 80s into the 90s, problems of which we're still dealing with now.

hardybuck

Hurrache wrote: »

We've a decade or two of it, and inappropriate planing, stemming from the 80s into the 90s, problems of which we're still dealing with now.

You could go straight to ABP in the 80s and 90s if you wanted to build 100 homes or more?

From my perspective it's an excellent initiative. Too many developments were held up locally by Council's before they could even get to ABP.

You also lack expertise in some Councils on this type of planning, especially if they don't have much throughput, so this takes the pressure off them.

Now ABP can get in early and listen to submissions from both sides before making a decision. Exactly the type of innovation and efficiencies we needed years ago.

Larbre34

Hurrache wrote: »

Nothing good comes out of fast tracking planing.

It does if you establish a robust planning framework, strategic planning, local development planning etc.

We aren't there yet, but we've come light years in 20 years.

By the way, I can tell you the architecture is quite far down the hierarchy of suitability.

Former Former

I don't love the proposal but I'm all for knocking down Justin's

LorelaiG

My only qualm about this is that it is a private nursing home...

Phil.x

Larbre34 wrote: »

They are accountable, to An Bord Pleanála, the Courts and if it ever came to it, SIPO.

Now I happen to be a chartered planner, albeit in private practice, but I did once work as a graduate and junior level planner in Local Authorities and I deal with them on commercial applications day in and out. Ask me anything.

Who gets the most money from bad planning?

beauf

Larbre34 wrote: »

...By the way, I can tell you the architecture is quite far down the hierarchy of suitability.

...we hadn't noticed...

Usually planning goes something like...

Propose...stupid idea...
....ignore all the complaints....
...when all the problems come true...
...say there was no way of predicting it...


No problem with it being a nursing home, and I've not looked at the plans for this. But we keep creating ugly and dysfunctional, and soulless public spaces and buildings. Then wonder why there's no sense of identity or community in these places.

hardybuck

beauf wrote: »

...we hadn't noticed...

Usually planning goes something like...

Propose...stupid idea...
....ignore all the complaints....
...when all the problems come true...
...say there was no way of predicting it...


No problem with it being a nursing home, and I've not looked at the plans for this. But we keep creating ugly and dysfunctional, and soulless public spaces and buildings. Then wonder why there's no sense of identity or community in these places.

What would you go with if you owned it?

Gaspode

They if I had the site, I'd go with a 6-8 story unit with a central courtyard. Id have the first 2 floors for seniors in a nursing home and semi-independent type setting, a creche or playshcool on the next floor, a couple of floors of apartments, top floor offices and gym. Something for everyone but no shops, the world does not need any more shops! Maybe a small coffee dock in the courtyard where peopke of all ages could mingle (in a future covid-free world)

beauf

hardybuck wrote: »

What would you go with if you owned it?

Like I said earlier I have no problem with a nursing home.

If you are asking me what the area needs I would say assisted living retirement village or apartments. For those not quite ready for a nursing home but need some help and assistance. Nice communal garden to the front.

hardybuck

beauf wrote: »

Like I said earlier I have no problem with a nursing home.

If you are asking me what the area needs I would say assisted living retirement village or apartments. For those not quite ready for a nursing home but need some help and assistance. Nice communal garden to the front.

I asked you what you'd put in there if you owned it, i.e. what you'd do if you were in their shoes.

Apparently very little money in apartments unless you have significant scale. You'd be hoping a fund would come in and buy the block off you to rent them, as selling them to individuals wouldn't be worthwhile.

What you've mentioned there sounds fairly good, but I don't think it would work on the main street of a town.