L drivers, cars taken

Roycropper63

Heard in rte news yesterday that nearly 400 l drivers have had their cars seized for driving on their own?
Can any one verify that or is it just hype?

doolox

400 is a tiny number in comparison.

The only guess I can arrive at is that there are approx 50,000 people learning to drive each year on Irish roads, given that 50,000 people sit the leaving cert each year.

At a 50% failure rate you could guess that 100,000 tests are carried out each year. So that 400 apprehensions for lone driving without a full licence is 1/2 of 1 per cent of the total number of drivers learning on our roads.

When a car is seized it does not necessarily mean it is totally lost. A fine and recovery fee may restore the car to its owner. If the owner does not have a driver to accompany him this could be a problem but a recover truck could take the car to the owners house until he gets a driver.

The real problem starts with people having no private yard or driveway to keep a car on when it is not in use.

It seems that in the future, people with no access to a fully qualified driver or access to parking will have to hire cars and drivers from a school of motoring for all their learning activities including gaining experience and practice.

The country will have to look into how other countries manage to finance driver education and training in order to overcome the difficulty of young people being able to conform legally and practically to the new rules.

biko

This tweet puts the number at 337

Don't be next OP


https://twitter.com/GardaTraffic/status/1096488445059518465

Anthonylfc

Nice to see them going after the hardcore criminals here

OldMrBrennan83

Anthonylfc wrote: »

Nice to see them going after the hardcore criminals here

I like to see them going after everyone. Get them off the roads.

Anthonylfc

OldMrBrennan83 wrote: »

I like to see them going after everyone. Get them off the roads.

Wouldnt see them do this to travellers or known drug dealers

Just new drivers

Naos

Anthonylfc wrote: »

Nice to see them going after the hardcore criminals here

Anthonylfc wrote: »

Wouldnt see them do this to travellers or known drug dealers

Just new drivers

While driving unaccompanied may be deemed low in terms of level of criminality, the potential outcome of such an action would be deemed of high risk as an accident owing to lack of experience could lead to multiple fatalities.

New drivers / learners should not be driving unaccompanied.

Plumbthedepths

Anthonylfc wrote:

Nice to see them going after the hardcore criminals here

So just the laws you agree with should be enforced?

ayux4rj6zql2ph

Anthonylfc wrote: »

Nice to see them going after the hardcore criminals here

Usually hardcore criminals drive without tax,insurance,nct,licence etc, so it is relevant.

Hence the term 'drive by shooting'

ayux4rj6zql2ph

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

So just the laws you agree with should be enforced?

In cases like that people want their cake and to also eat it.

If it's an illegal act enforce the law.

punisher5112

Drug dealing and running is being carried out by kids of 8 years of age.

Drug dealers in cars usually use rentals or have cars that have everything legal and constantly changing their vehicles.

Plumbthedepths

Marina Young Lodging wrote:

In cases like that people want their cake and to also eat it.

Or until it effects them.

ayux4rj6zql2ph

biko wrote: »

This tweet puts the number at 337

Don't be next OP


https://twitter.com/GardaTraffic/status/1096488445059518465

That's only what they have caught, imagine those who have successfully evaded checkpoints by seeing them or even tip offs via social media.

This is only the tip of the iceberg.

ayux4rj6zql2ph

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Or until it effects them.

Aye

corks finest

Anthonylfc wrote: »

Nice to see them going after the hardcore criminals here

No tax or no insurance or unaccompanied L driving is a no no

Isambard

doolox wrote: »

400 is a tiny number in comparison.

The only guess I can arrive at is that there are approx 50,000 people learning to drive each year on Irish roads, given that 50,000 people sit the leaving cert each year.

At a 50% failure rate you could guess that 100,000 tests are carried out each year. So that 400 apprehensions for lone driving without a full licence is 1/2 of 1 per cent of the total number of drivers learning on our roads.

When a car is seized it does not necessarily mean it is totally lost. A fine and recovery fee may restore the car to its owner. If the owner does not have a driver to accompany him this could be a problem but a recover truck could take the car to the owners house until he gets a driver.

The real problem starts with people having no private yard or driveway to keep a car on when it is not in use.

It seems that in the future, people with no access to a fully qualified driver or access to parking will have to hire cars and drivers from a school of motoring for all their learning activities including gaining experience and practice.

The country will have to look into how other countries manage to finance driver education and training in order to overcome the difficulty of young people being able to conform legally and practically to the new rules.

Leaving the car parked in the road isn't a problem if you haven't passed the test,and it's taxed/insured and NCTd, it's driving unaccompanied is the problem.

amcalester

Anthonylfc wrote: »

Nice to see them going after the hardcore criminals here

What’s a Garda to do if an unaccompanied learner pulls up to a checkpoint?

Let them off because there are worse criminals currently free, that’s fairly stupid.

SCOOP 64

i think the long wait times for test and retest need to be looked at, a lot of drivers are just to impatience to wait, still surprised at the response of Garda to this new law and the rate of prosecution, but i suppose because with L plates on the car, big red flag. (not advising to take off L plates before going out unaccompanied).but at the end of of the day its a piece of paper and one tester saying your ok to drive, the day before you were not,you were just a Criminal breaking the law.
but it must be keeping the Guards busy.

Anthonylfc

amcalester wrote: »

What’s a Garda to do if an unaccompanied learner pulls up to a checkpoint?

Let them off because there are worse criminals currently free, that’s fairly stupid.

Yes

At the moment they take the car till a fully insured driver comes to collect the car and unaccompanied driver gets a slap on wrist or few points

More paperwork for gards

Far far worse going on in the streets than this but they do nothing

Hedgelayer

Anthonylfc wrote: »

Nice to see them going after the hardcore criminals here

I know those kid's think they can drive without a proper license.
Feckers are a law onto themselves, a danger to other drivers.

Sitting in a mechanical propelled vehicle liable to kill someone else and themselves.

The amount who use the wrong lane in a roundabout is frightening, overtake in the slow lane with N plates too...

amcalester

Anthonylfc wrote: »

Yes

At the moment they take the car till a fully insured driver comes to collect the car and unaccompanied driver gets a slap on wrist or few points

More paperwork for gards

Far far worse going on in the streets than this but they do nothing

So a Garda assigned to a checkpoint should ignore the very thing he has been told to check because it’s not serious enough.

What’s the hierarchy of offenses, in your opinion, that should be prosecuted?

drunkmonkey

This is causing a knock on problem. L drivers aren't putting on their plates.
It's a horrendous law on anyone not served by regular public transport, basically anyone outside a city.

Hedgelayer

Anthonylfc wrote: »

Yes

At the moment they take the car till a fully insured driver comes to collect the car and unaccompanied driver gets a slap on wrist or few points

More paperwork for gards

Far far worse going on in the streets than this but they do nothing

Try saying that to someone who ended up in a wheelchair due to an inexperienced driver.

A kick to the spine could cause the same outcome as a collision with stupidity.

SCOOP 64

Hedgelayer wrote: »

I know those kid's think they can drive without a proper license.
Feckers are a law onto themselves, a danger to other drivers.

Sitting in a mechanical propelled vehicle liable to kill someone else and themselves.

The amount who use the wrong lane in a roundabout is frightening, overtake in the slow lane with N plates too...

Plenty of full license drivers doing this i say more then learner drivers.

dudara

I read in the Irish Times (IIRC) that they’re seized an average of 8 cars per day. That’s actually fairly high, but it’s about time that the law was enforced.

I have a certain level of sympathy, but there is a clear breaking of the law happening and it needs to be fixed.

Hedgelayer

SCOOP 64 wrote: »

Plenty of full license drivers doing this i say more then learner drivers.

I know but the full license driver's are properly insured, there lies the problem.

ayux4rj6zql2ph

A number of things need to be done in this country but alas they won't

No issuing of a 3rd or subsequent learner permit without evidence of having sat a driving test.

Test those who were issued with licences in the amnesty.

Bring in Applus or SGS testers to get the backlog down, i did my own test in a car with SGS at a Dublin NCT centre.

It will probably become necessary to check every driver's licence/permit at checkpoints, the technology is now there to check if a driver has a full driving licence/learner permit/disqualified via the hand held devices linked to the RSA's database.

ayux4rj6zql2ph

What does one do with this guy and those similar? failed the test on 17 occasions.

Only credit he can get is he is trying unlike the 2000 people on 10 or more learner permits, i read that online recently.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/radio-station-stupid-to-fuel-driver-ire-461326.html

If what he says about driving in the UK on the then provisional licence i will eat my hat.

ayux4rj6zql2ph

13 driver testers between test centres in Cork & Kerry


https://www.echolive.ie/corknews/Demands-for-more-driving-testers-as-6500-wait-for-a-test-in-Cork-city-3734bca9-752c-48a8-a432-cc51eba5e577-ds?fbclid=IwAR1zkyUM8eDaMWbX4l5r_hnpKRLcZ3Aef0zsgEBZ3ps7SDEzoKEOBThDKmI

DaveyDave

Of course one of the first posts is "why aren't they getting real criminals"

How dare the Road Policing Unit do traffic duties. Should be out catching murderers and rapists. It's a disgrace, Joe!

Just because someone isn't a drug lord doesn't mean they aren't breaking the law and shouldn't be taken off the road.

ayux4rj6zql2ph

A few articles relevant to the topic

https://www.thejournal.ie/readme/opinion-why-is-the-irish-driving-test-so-hard-and-so-expensive-3756202-Dec2017/


https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/garda-who-never-sat-a-driving-test-loses-appeal-against-conviction-for-using-fake-license-829610.html


https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/motors/some-65-000-irish-drivers-on-their-third-or-higher-learners-permits-1.3471340

Attendance is also, according to the RSA, a serious part of the problem. “Almost 19,000 candidates did not show up for their driving test in 2017, equating to 15 per cent of driving tests and six weeks of lost productivity,” said the spokesperson. “Many of these candidates failed to turn up because they are simply booking a driving test in order to apply for the renewal of their learner permit.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/rsa-planning-crackdown-as-thousands-use-loophole-to-avoid-full-driving-test-863115.html

Hedgelayer

DaveyDave wrote: »

Of course one of the first posts is "why aren't they getting real criminals"

How dare the Road Policing Unit do traffic duties. Should be out catching murderers and rapists. It's a disgrace, Joe!

Just because someone isn't a drug lord doesn't mean they aren't breaking the law and shouldn't be taken off the road.

When ever I read people moaning about the guard's should be doing this that or the other, the first thing that comes to mind is "petty criminals" or middle classes with spoiled kid's who should be allowed to break the law, well because they're my kid's.
And I'm important.
My brother's a gawrd you know....
Thant kind of mindset..

iwillhtfu

Naos wrote: »

While driving unaccompanied may be deemed low in terms of level of criminality, the potential outcome of such an action would be deemed of high risk as an accident owing to lack of experience could lead to multiple fatalities.

New drivers / learners should not be driving unaccompanied.

I hate this argument purely for the fact we all did just what you're saying new drivers shouldn't. I'd rather the time and effort was put into catching drivers on their phones they should seize cars from them and the message wont be long hitting home.

Acosta

Marina Young Lodging wrote: »

Test those who were issued with licences in the amnesty.

Sure why do something sensible when the powers that be can just blame all the problems on the roads on young people.

No issue really with the law being enforced and I'm no expert driver. I can only comment on what i see myself on the roads. And 9 times out of 10 when i see someone doing something really stupid or dangerous it's someone that looks like they've been driving 20 or 30 years and not a learner driver.

It's long over due that the RSA produce an ad featuring someone behind the wheel that looks over 40.

ayux4rj6zql2ph

Acosta wrote: »

Sure why do something sensible when the powers that be can just blame all the problems on the roads on young people.

No issue really with the law being enforced and I'm no expert driver. I can only comment on what i see myself on the roads. And 9 times out of 10 when i see someone doing something really stupid or dangerous it's someone that looks like they've been driving 20 or 30 years and not a learner driver.

It's long over due that the RSA produce an ad featuring someone behind the wheel that looks over 40.

It’ll have to come down to the over 40’s featuring.

The whole ‘he drives she dies’ ad blew up in their faces with women at the wheel and people or males dying.

Blaming the government is the easy way out, surprised that the EU never brought in a directive to cover learner drivers.

LazerShark

iwillhtfu wrote: »

I hate this argument purely for the fact we all did just what you're saying new drivers shouldn't. I'd rather the time and effort was put into catching drivers on their phones they should seize cars from them and the message wont be long hitting home.

I would say both. The lower-level road traffic laws in this country are just not enforced and it is human nature to break rules that are inconvenient if they know they get away with it. It seems the only offence on Irish roads is speeding.

Anthonylfc

Hedgelayer wrote: »

I know those kid's think they can drive without a proper license.
Feckers are a law onto themselves, a danger to other drivers.

Sitting in a mechanical propelled vehicle liable to kill someone else and themselves.

The amount who use the wrong lane in a roundabout is frightening, overtake in the slow lane with N plates too...

Same can be said about old age peoples vision and reaction times etc

Or women plastering make up on while driving and on phones too

ayux4rj6zql2ph

Anthonylfc wrote: »

Same can be said about old age peoples vision and reaction times etc

Or women plastering make up on while driving and on phones too

Doctors must sign off on the over 70's for a driving licence/learner permit, i would presume (or at least hope) they do check their eye sight.

When i renewed my own licence recently i had to get an eye test done by an official optician before the GP would sign off on my medical.

Boxcar_Willie

Id say in fairness that there's very few on here who haven't done it.

Real issue is the total failure of the testing system.

Wishbone Ash

Acosta wrote: »

... And 9 times out of 10 when i see someone doing something really stupid or dangerous it's someone that looks like they've been driving 20 or 30 years and not a learner driver.

It's long over due that the RSA produce an ad featuring someone behind the wheel that looks over 40.

While that type of comment is trotted out here regularly, statistically young drivers are a much greater risk on our roads and that is reflected in their insurance costs and payouts.

They are probably even more of a risk than insurance statistics present as most older drivers think nothing of making a claim for something fairly routine while many younger drivers will avoid going through their insurance if possible.

UrbanFret

How is a young lad or lass in rural Ireland supposed to get to and from work ? There is no public transport system,no taxi service most of the time, and no one available to accompany them . But hey ho shane ross thinks he's doing the country a great service, Wait until the c##ts come canvassing again. Between this and the drink driving zero tolerance rural Ireland is on lockdown. An old man who leaves close to me whom I often call to for a chat told me with a tear in his and I quote " I am not a criminal yet do you see those 4 walls? (in his living room) I am a prisoner here . He used to go in to town for his dinner and have a pint of stout and a chat with a few friends before it. If Ross wants these laws then he needs a revamp of public transport or better still reopen the railway lines that were scandalously confined to history.

amcalester

UrbanFret wrote: »

How is a young lad or lass in rural Ireland supposed to get to and from work ? There is no public transport system,no taxi service most of the time, and no one available to accompany them . But hey ho shane ross thinks he's doing the country a great service, Wait until the c##ts come canvassing again. Between this and the drink driving zero tolerance rural Ireland is on lockdown. An old man who leaves close to me whom I often call to for a chat told me with a tear in his and I quote " I am not a criminal yet do you see those 4 walls? (in his living room) I am a prisoner here . He used to go in to town for his dinner and have a pint of stout and a chat with a few friends before it. If Ross wants these laws then he needs a revamp of public transport or better still reopen the railway lines that were scandalously confined to history.

Does he know he can still drive after a big feed?

It’s not illegal at all.

Eggs For Dinner

Having inconvenience getting to work is no excuse for any novice driver putting my life in jeopardy by being on the same road as me in illegal circumstances

Dravokivich

Eggs For Dinner wrote: »

Having inconvenience getting to work is no excuse for any novice driver putting my life in jeopardy by being on the same road as me in illegal circumstances

Easy now. Novice means passing the test within the last 2 years.

ayux4rj6zql2ph

Eggs For Dinner wrote: »

Having inconvenience getting to work is no excuse for any novice driver putting my life in jeopardy by being on the same road as me in illegal circumstances

As mentioned, novice is someone with a full licence under 2 years that displays N plates, you mean a learner drivers (who is supposed to display L plates)

iamwhoiam

UrbanFret wrote: »

How is a young lad or lass in rural Ireland supposed to get to and from work ? There is no public transport system,no taxi service most of the time, and no one available to accompany them . But hey ho shane ross thinks he's doing the country a great service, Wait until the c##ts come canvassing again. Between this and the drink driving zero tolerance rural Ireland is on lockdown. An old man who leaves close to me whom I often call to for a chat told me with a tear in his and I quote " I am not a criminal yet do you see those 4 walls? (in his living room) I am a prisoner here . He used to go in to town for his dinner and have a pint of stout and a chat with a few friends before it. If Ross wants these laws then he needs a revamp of public transport or better still reopen the railway lines that were scandalously confined to history.

How about the young lad or lasses do lessons, do their test and get a licence . The rest of Europe manage like that its not rocket science
And why on earth can the old man not still go for dinner and chat without the pint ?

jochenstacker

doolox wrote: »

It seems that in the future, people with no access to a fully qualified driver or access to parking will have to hire cars and drivers from a school of motoring for all their learning activities including gaining experience and practice.

The country will have to look into how other countries manage to finance driver education and training in order to overcome the difficulty of young people being able to conform legally and practically to the new rules.

It's very simple. In other countries you enroll in a school of motoring, take theory and driving lessons, take a theory and driving test and once you pass that, you can drive. As for finance, well, you want it, you pay for it.
Works for hundreds of millions of people all over Europe.
The idea is, either you have a license and you can drive, or you don't and you can't.
Absolutely nothing difficult about it.

EPAndlee

It's the law now and people need to just get over it

JP Liz V1

I think seizing the car is a tad too much

UrbanFret

iamwhoiam wrote: »

How about the young lad or lasses do lessons, do their test and get a licence . The rest of Europe manage like that its not rocket science
And why on earth can the old man not still go for dinner and chat without the pint ?

Don't think you realise what rural Ireland is all about. The process you describe above will take at least 6 months ,what are the supposed to do in the meantime. The driving test is a ****ing joke. Tells you nothing about how capable or not the driver is. You just drive for 40 minutes in a manner you will never practice again in your lifetime. As for my elderly friend he looked forward to that pint every day. I'll mention your pearls of wisdom to him, who would have though you could have your dinner without an aperitif.:rolleyes:

dudara

UrbanFret wrote: »

Don't think you realise what rural Ireland is all about. The process you describe above will take at least 6 months ,what are the supposed to do in the meantime. The driving test is a ****ing joke. Tells you nothing about how capable or not the driver is. You just drive for 40 minutes in a manner you will never practice again in your lifetime. As for my elderly friend he looked forward to that pint every day. I'll mention your pearls of wisdom to him, who would have though you could have your dinner without an aperitif.:rolleyes:

I am from rural Ireland, from the deepest boondocks in fact. And these heart-pulling stories don’t work on me. You don’t get to drive unaccompanied, unqualified because you have a sob story. There are millions of young people living in rural areas all across Europe and they manage it. We’re not that special.