Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Please note that it is not permitted to have referral links posted in your signature. Keep these links contained in the appropriate forum. Thank you.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2055940817/signature-rules

VAT on UK import

2»

Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,278 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    This was discussed in the previous thread, revenue will never come looking in the scenario where you buy vat free in the UK and then rack up the miles before registering here. So they can’t really come down on you like a tonne of bricks.

    At least one if not two people on that thread had successfully avoided paying vat in this way, look up the other thread if you don’t believe it here.

    I was in it, I called the revenue more or less threatened to cut my nuts off if I didn't pay the vat. Couple of guys got lucky. You want to play games with the revenue that's your choice but it's not legal.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,615 ✭✭✭grogi


    This was discussed in the previous thread, revenue will never come looking in the scenario where you buy vat free in the UK and then rack up the miles before registering here. So they can’t really come down on you like a tonne of bricks.

    At least one if not two people on that thread had successfully avoided paying vat in this way, look up the other thread if you don’t believe it here.

    They sometimes are, especially when some flags are raised. Never underestimate the taxman...


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,085 ✭✭✭BnB


    You can't buy a car in the UK vat free and import it without paying Vat here.

    100%

    It is very black & white with Revenue.

    As everyone has said, if it is over the 6 months & 6kms, then you don't pay VAT here - That's fine. But you will obviously have to pay it when you buy it in the UK.

    If it is under the 6 months or 6kms, then you will pay VAT here - No matter what you have done in the UK. However, in that case, in order to avoid double paying the VAT, you can fill out a form with the dealer you are buying the car from in the UK to say that you are exporting the Vehicle (within the EU) and therefore you do not need to pay VAT in the UK when you are buying it. Alternatively, if you do pay the VAT in the UK and then end up paying the VAT again in Ireland, you can reclaim your VAT from the UK but that is meant to be a real pain in the butt of a process.

    The above was all explained to me by a very helpful girl in the Revenue when I rang them last year with a similar VAT query. The car I was buying was about 3 weeks short of the 6 months and about 400 km short of the 6k. In the end, for an easy life, I just waited 3 weeks and bought the car then. The drive home sorted out the extra kms.

    You could of course chance your arm and try and manipulate that window of opportunity around the 6 month mark but you are playing a very very dodgy game and of course, straight up breaking the law.

    To go back to the OP's query - I wouldn't worry about it being referred to the revenue. When I registered mine last year I got the same and got a case of the willies worrying that they were going to try and screw me. But yer man (in the NCT centre in Limerick) said not to worry about it at all and it is standard practice for anything under 1 year old and/or anything high value at the minute. Revenue are looking at them from a lot of different angles including money laundering etc. My valuation came back from revenue exactly the same as the standard valuation from the online VRT calculator.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,278 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    Don't forget when you try to get one over on the revenue interest starts been added from the time you commited the fraud not the day your caught...it's added daily and compounded, they'll also load on penalties and charges.


  • Registered Users Posts: 104 ✭✭iognaid


    Many thanks for that reply. Yes I understand the 6 months.under 6 months vat charged. But if it is just 6 months, what then. Also some months are longer than others. Are the days counted? 183! Thanks again.


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 28,278 ✭✭✭✭drunkmonkey


    iognaid wrote: »
    Many thanks for that reply. Yes I understand the 6 months.under 6 months vat charged. But if it is just 6 months, what then. Also some months are longer than others. Are the days counted? 183! Thanks again.

    Under 6mts you claim back the UK vat 20% and pay the Irish Vat 23%


    6mts and 1 day you just pay what ever price is on the car as the vat is included.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,041 ✭✭✭Casati


    Under 6mts you claim back the UK vat 20% and pay the Irish Vat 23%


    6mts and 1 day you just pay what ever price is on the car as the vat is included.

    How do you claim the vat back in the UK? Can the dealer just sell it to a private individual exporting to the ROI vat free? If you buy privately a 3 month old car with 2000km can you claim the vat back from UK revenue?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,615 ✭✭✭grogi


    Casati wrote: »
    How do you claim the vat back in the UK? Can the dealer just sell it to a private individual exporting to the ROI vat free?

    They potentially could, if the vehicle was bought by them with full VAT - exp. unregistered car or a demo car. If it was registered by a private buyer, not that easy.

    Nevertheless it is risky for them if it is discovered that the car is not registered outside of UK, as they will have to pay the VAT themselves.
    If you buy privately a 3 month old car with 2000km can you claim the vat back from UK revenue?

    Yes - you can. There are some forms you'd need to fill in. You'll get back the whole VAT paid initially for it. In principle you only need to pay VAT only once.


  • Registered Users Posts: 17 Stovie


    Quote
    If you buy privately a 3 month old car with 2000km can you claim the vat back from UK revenue?


    If you buy privately the seller will not be registered for VAT and so will not be able to charge you VAT. And if you have not been charged VAT you cannot reclaim it. So the answer is no.

    The same applies to cars sold under the margin scheme. Most cars in the UK & NI are sold under the margin scheme and so no VAT is charged and cannot be reclaimed from UK revenue


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,041 ✭✭✭Casati


    Stovie wrote: »
    Quote
    If you buy privately a 3 month old car with 2000km can you claim the vat back from UK revenue?


    If you buy privately the seller will not be registered for VAT and so will not be able to charge you VAT. And if you have not been charged VAT you cannot reclaim it. So the answer is no.

    The same applies to cars sold under the margin scheme. Most cars in the UK & NI are sold under the margin scheme and so no VAT is charged and cannot be reclaimed from UK revenue

    So buying one privately would see you getting stung paying vat here on top of the original vat paid in the UK? (assuming <6 mnth and <6km)


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 17 Stovie


    Casati wrote: »
    So buying one privately would see you getting stung paying vat here on top of the original vat paid in the UK? (assuming <6 mnth and <6km)

    Exactly. But not just buying privately. Also buy from a dealer who operated the margin scheme. Know all about it. Happened my wife in November 2018. She bought a 6 month old car with 800 miles from a dealer in NI. He sold it under the margin scheme and so charged no VAT. As she was not charged VAT the UK revenue could not give her a refund. The Irish revenue then charged her 5,000 VAT. So in effect VAT was paid in two countries on this car.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,615 ✭✭✭grogi


    Stovie wrote: »
    Quote
    If you buy privately a 3 month old car with 2000km can you claim the vat back from UK revenue?


    If you buy privately the seller will not be registered for VAT and so will not be able to charge you VAT. And if you have not been charged VAT you cannot reclaim it. So the answer is no.

    Nonsense. If you export new vehicle (6months, 6000km), you are entitled for VAT refund. Of course it is massively easier not to go through such ordeal


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,377 ✭✭✭✭Marcusm


    grogi wrote: »
    Nonsense. If you export new vehicle (6months, 6000km), you are entitled for VAT refund. Of course it is massively easier not to go through such ordeal

    Not in all circumstances because the seller may not account for VAT or it may not be a VAT qualifying car. Where this occurs, although U.K. VAT has initially been paid, it is not available to be refunded to a foreign seller. It is simply incorrect to assume that it will always be refundable as the mechanics of the VAT system only permits regards to be had to the immediate transaction not prior ones.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,615 ✭✭✭grogi


    Marcusm wrote: »
    Not in all circumstances because the seller may not account for VAT or it may not be a VAT qualifying car. Where this occurs, although U.K. VAT has initially been paid, it is not available to be refunded to a foreign seller. It is simply incorrect to assume that it will always be refundable as the mechanics of the VAT system only permits regards to be had to the immediate transaction not prior ones.

    In regular exchange of goods, you're right. But export of new vehicles does not follow those guidance.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,377 ✭✭✭✭Marcusm


    grogi wrote: »
    In regular exchange of goods, you're right. But export of new vehicles does not follow those guidance.

    The New Means of transport rules are indeeed applicable but the area where there is a problem is where the supplier in the U.K. is not VAT registered (such as a private individual) or where it is a margin scheme car (generally bought by dealer from private individual), this will mean that Urish VAT is chargeable but there is not a guaranteed entitlement to any U.K. refund or credit. This latter part is subject to the domestic rule regarding such. It won’t happen often but when it does it’s a pain.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 990 ✭✭✭bf


    Stovie wrote: »
    Exactly. But not just buying privately. Also buy from a dealer who operated the margin scheme. Know all about it. Happened my wife in November 2018. She bought a 6 month old car with 800 miles from a dealer in NI. He sold it under the margin scheme and so charged no VAT. As she was not charged VAT the UK revenue could not give her a refund. The Irish revenue then charged her 5,000 VAT. So in effect VAT was paid in two countries on this car.

    Interested as to how Revenue became aware of the VAT liability, are they informed directly by Applus as part of the VRT procedure?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 3,881 ✭✭✭terrydel


    bazz26 wrote: »
    If the car is at least 6 months old (they go off the date of original registration) and/or has at least 6000 km on the clock then VAT shouldn't be chargeable.

    Wrong, both conditions must be true (over 6 mnoths old, over 6000km) for vat not to be chargeable.


  • Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 19,119 Mod ✭✭✭✭slave1


    Stovie wrote: »
    Exactly. But not just buying privately. Also buy from a dealer who operated the margin scheme. Know all about it. Happened my wife in November 2018. She bought a 6 month old car with 800 miles from a dealer in NI. He sold it under the margin scheme and so charged no VAT. As she was not charged VAT the UK revenue could not give her a refund. The Irish revenue then charged her 5,000 VAT. So in effect VAT was paid in two countries on this car.
    bf wrote: »
    Interested as to how Revenue became aware of the VAT liability, are they informed directly by Applus as part of the VRT procedure?

    At VRT check the clock was (I assume) under the 6,000kms so that would kick VAT in, perhaps it was a day or so under 6 months old either?


  • Registered Users Posts: 10 gavmancars


    grogi wrote: »
    They potentially could, if the vehicle was bought by them with full VAT - exp. unregistered car or a demo car. If it was registered by a private buyer, not that easy.

    Nevertheless it is risky for them if it is discovered that the car is not registered outside of UK, as they will have to pay the VAT themselves.



    Yes - you can. There are some forms you'd need to fill in. You'll get back the whole VAT paid initially for it. In principle you only need to pay VAT only once.

    Hi - do you know how to claim the VAT back from the UK i.e. which forms do you use?
    thanks


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,615 ✭✭✭grogi


    gavmancars wrote: »
    Hi - do you know how to claim the VAT back from the UK i.e. which forms do you use?
    thanks

    There is VAT411 - but that's only to when you buy from a dealer.... :(


  • Advertisement
  • Registered Users Posts: 10 gavmancars


    grogi wrote: »
    There is VAT411 - but that's only to when you buy from a dealer.... :(

    Thanks grogi,

    I had seen that one but this is as you are buying, its more when you have purchased and have also paid the VAT in Ireland. Is there another form which you can claim the VAt back form the UK revenue.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,377 ✭✭✭✭Marcusm


    gavmancars wrote: »
    Thanks grogi,

    I had seen that one but this is as you are buying, its more when you have purchased and have also paid the VAT in Ireland. Is there another form which you can claim the VAt back form the UK revenue.

    When did you but the car? If the U.K. supplier has not yet completed and submitted his VAT return for that quarter, he should be able to cancel the original invoice (provided VAT qualifying) and then you jointly complete VAT411. He would then repay the VAT for you. Absent this, I do not think there is a defined process as it’s usually sorted in advance.


  • Registered Users Posts: 10 gavmancars


    Marcusm wrote: »
    When did you but the car? If the U.K. supplier has not yet completed and submitted his VAT return for that quarter, he should be able to cancel the original invoice (provided VAT qualifying) and then you jointly complete VAT411. He would then repay the VAT for you. Absent this, I do not think there is a defined process as it’s usually sorted in advance.

    Thanks Marcus - its a moped and i got it about 1 month ago. thanks for the advice i will go back to vendor.


  • Registered Users Posts: 4 Rocky2525


    Can anyone confirm where the 6mth cutoff is? I've been on to revenue and they've told me if I recieve the car within 6 months of first registeration in UK, it doesnt matter how long I wait to bring it in to the state, it will be liable for VAT. (not vat qualifing, and over 6,000km).


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,380 ✭✭✭✭Esel


    Rocky2525 wrote: »
    Can anyone confirm where the 6mth cutoff is? I've been on to revenue and they've told me if I recieve the car within 6 months of first registeration in UK, it doesnt matter how long I wait to bring it in to the state, it will be liable for VAT. (not vat qualifing, and over 6,000km).
    You should ask on the main thread. One of the posters there works on VRT in an NCT centre, and I *think* she said if it is over 6 months at presentation, it's OK. May have referred to an import from NI, not sure.

    Not your ornery onager



Advertisement