Is the Dublin accent dying?

branie2

A famous "person" with a Dublin accent that we haven't heard from in a while is Dustin the Turkey

Sky King

If i lived in Dublin I would INSIST that all my children speak like Lloyd Grossman.

DS86DS

Some of these culchie posters are hilarious.

You'd swear they were Eton and Oxford educated Upper Class toffs......when in reality they live in a 2 bedroom cottage down some boreen cul-de-sac and have the smell of cow sh!te wafting through the house every time they open the window.

Snickers Man

Franz Von Peppercorn wrote: »

Interesting. As children do pick up accents from peers not parents that makes sense. The U.K. posh accent depends to a large extent on schools as well.

It's why many Irish jews sound like Protestants; they tend to go to Protestant schools. One of the finest examples of a mid-20th century Dublin Protestant accent in the public sphere was future Israeli president Chaim Herzog delivering his famous speech at the United Nations on the "Zionism is racism debate" in the 1970s. (He was of course opposing the motion). Listen to how he pronounces "Germany", "World" and "troopers" among others.

Wesley College boy

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FuJXdAvPCrU

Snickers Man

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Snickers you seem to be a bit interested in the various ‘Dublin ‘ accents wonder have you noticed a ‘Sithe Dublin’ accent springing up on the airwaves?

It’s not a ‘Dort’ accent but the letter ‘e’ and ‘o’ are the giveaways.

“I am not going’ becomes “I am not gawing “
“I was desperate’ becomes “I was dasparate “

Miriam Au Callaghan with her ‘gasts ‘ (guests) and ‘raude’(road) is a good model
But the great Sally Hayden is the supreme commander of this accent.

I’ll try to dig up an example but would be interested to hear your views.

I'm not an expert on linguistics or any other speech science. I just notice a few sounds that are distinctive and notice too that they don't seem to be peculiar to any particular district of the city. For what it's worth I see the spread of accents as being a spectrum, with a fairly linear progression from the "League of Ireland" accent, common to many denizens of that League (and please don't think I'm being judgemental, it's just that most public commentators with that accent tend to be LoI-related), through to that God-awful accent that many people here are wrongly calling "D4".

Joe Duffy, for example, has an accent that's closer to the first end of the spectrum but his isn't quite so harsh. And the Miriam O'Callaghan example that you quote is closer to the other end but is not quite so annoying as the truly heinous examples you can sometimes hear outside "Wes" on a weekend night, if you ever have the misfortune to be passing.

Sardonicat

^^^^^
He just sounds like a well spoken Irish man (which he was) . Don't know how you can ascertain someone's religion from that accent. I know plenty of Irish people who sound like that. Most of them from Catholic backgrounds and didn't attend Wes.

Snickers Man

Sardonicat wrote: »

^^^^^
He just sounds like a well spoken Irish man (which he was) . Don't know how you can ascertain someone's religion from that accent. I know plenty of Irish people who sound like that. Most of them from Catholic backgrounds and didn't attend Wes.

Like any social intuition, it's a generalisation. His accent is not especially common nowadays but it was one typically, not exclusively, found among middle class Protestant schools in the early to mid 20th century, which was Mr Herzog's era.

Again, it was a class thing. People from those schools tended to be middle class (there were plenty of working class Dublin Protestants at the time but the Ne Temere decree largely did for them) and so it was disproportionately found among Protestant Irish people.
And jews

It's a very pleasant accent, unlike the one used by many of today's affluent class.

Sardonicat

It is indeed a lovely accent. Pity it's dying out. Reminds me of an old friend. Would be in his late 60s early 70s now. It doesn't sound "posh" or forced and is still audibly Irish. Very easy on the ear.

Galwayguy35

DS86DS wrote: »

Some of these culchie posters are hilarious.

You'd swear they were Eton and Oxford educated Upper Class toffs......when in reality they live in a 2 bedroom cottage down some boreen cul-de-sac and have the smell of cow sh!te wafting through the house every time they open the window.

You clearly don't know a lot about life outside Dublin.

Brendan Bendar

Snickers Man wrote: »

I'm not an expert on linguistics or any other speech science. I just notice a few sounds that are distinctive and notice too that they don't seem to be peculiar to any particular district of the city. For what it's worth I see the spread of accents as being a spectrum, with a fairly linear progression from the "League of Ireland" accent, common to many denizens of that League (and please don't think I'm being judgemental, it's just that most public commentators with that accent tend to be LoI-related), through to that God-awful accent that many people here are wrongly calling "D4".

Joe Duffy, for example, has an accent that's closer to the first end of the spectrum but his isn't quite so harsh. And the Miriam O'Callaghan example that you quote is closer to the other end but is not quite so annoying as the truly heinous examples you can sometimes hear outside "Wes" on a weekend night, if you ever have the misfortune to be passing.

I love the ‘League of Ireland’ accent description... I know exactly where you are coming from..... on the airwaves you have Johnny McDonald and Pat Fenlon,both being solid citizens but would be fine examplers of this accent.

Brian Kerr would be out on his own in this respect.

While I am at it , have you any view on what I call the ‘Dublin Fire Brigade Accent’ which I think is distinctive and predictable.

A wee bit more refined than the ‘League of Ireland Accent’ in most cases but definitely deserves a niche of its own.

You then have the ‘Dublin GAA accent’ which again is slightly different before you move on to the ‘IRFU Dublin accent’ which reflects the schooling of most of the denizens of that sport.

And all that’s before you delve into the ‘South Dublin GAH man ‘ accent beloved by Dezzie Cahill..... the clue in this one is how the ‘y’ is used.

‘Kerry’ becomes ‘Kerree ‘ it’s subtle and only anoraks like myself, perhaps ,would notice and understand the location accent.


Now the ‘Ken Doherty Accent’ South Dublin Ranelagh(Renalagh) there’s another one.


Fascinating subject.

DEFTLEFTHAND

You should write a book on Dublin accents Brendan.

You seem to have an amazing passion for the subject.

I love your 'Dublin Fire Brigade Accent' description.

It's amazing how every level of Dub society have their own unique sound.

Brendan Bendar

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

You should write a book on Dublin accents Brendan.

You seem to have an amazing passion for the subject.

I love your 'Dublin Fire Brigade Accent' description.

It's amazing how every level of Dub society have their own unique sound.

Thank you, I most certainly do find accents very interesting and do listen with interest to the little subtle nuances of an accent which can either give clues of a persons occupation, a persons local area or a persons educational background

He heh just listening to a dude Andrew Balbirnie of Irish Cricket speaking.

“Bowling” “Bauling”. “Overs”. “Auvers”

Has to be from the Clonskeagh, Gautstown areas.

Anyone?

iamwhoiam

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Thank you, I most certainly do find accents very interesting and do listen with interest to the little subtle nuances of an accent which can either give clues of a persons occupation, a persons local area or a persons educational background

He heh just listening to a dude Andrew Balbirnie of Irish Cricket speaking.

“Bowling” “Bauling”. “Overs”. “Auvers”

Has to be from the Clonskeagh, Gautstown areas.

Anyone?

The Dublin Zoo keepers accent ! They all sound the same

Brendan Bendar

iamwhoiam wrote: »

The Dublin Zoo keepers accent ! They all sound the same

Very good...... you got that from the excellent programmes they had on I think RTE.... didn’t you.


Very good observation.... you are quite correct.

iamwhoiam

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Very good...... you got that from the excellent programmes they had on I think RTE.... didn’t you.


Very good observation.... you are quite correct.

I am sure even the Australian guy will sound like them in a few years !

Brendan Bendar

iamwhoiam wrote: »

I am sure even the Australian guy will sound like them in a few years !

Yes, like Ole Gunnar Soljskaer (sp) has the Manc accent (club) (cloob) and

Didi Hamman on RTE has the twinges of scouse from his time in Liverpool.


There are several other accents going around airwaves ,not all Dublin.

Honourable mention would be the ‘Jockeys Accent’ usually a broad ‘culchie’ accent from the Kildare/Meath/ Tipperary area which unusually seeps into trainers and owners.

Very interesting indeed.

JohnnyFlash

Who do you sound like, Brendan?

A cross between Cyril Farrell and PJ Baldwin is my guess.

Brendan Bendar

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

Who do you sound like, Brendan?

A cross between Cyril Farrell and PJ Baldwin is my guess.

Nah... probably like some chancer who got a bit uppity in a semi state like the ESB maybe rimmed my way into the international end of things, ended up in Japan,blew up to a 42’/28’ size drinking Pocari Sweat from machines and riding the Ginza Line late at night.

You know yourself John, hint of the muck savage there if I am honest.

Dickie10

the jockey accent is because about 75% of jockeys are from meath and kildare and even at that its the region of meath south of navan and the area of kildare north of athy. these accents are very similar simply because they encompass a certain region with the border between counties stradddling the middle of the region. towns such as trim,kilcock,maynooth,clane and naas would be the main centres, the traditional accent is very similar in all these towns. even though they are all only 15-25 miles from oconnell st, they have very little trace of a dublin accent.

Dickie10

i think dublin GAA have there own distinct accent because of the culchie accent in 80% of the houses in dublin GAA. imagine the brogans a mother from listowel and father from mayo. micheal darragh mcauley father from donegal and cian osullivans parents both from kerry.

completedit

South Dublin accent doesn’t sound American at all. The only people in Ireland who sound American are those weird sort of rocker kids

Ush1

Dickie10 wrote: »

i think dublin GAA have there own distinct accent because of the culchie accent in 80% of the houses in dublin GAA. imagine the brogans a mother from listowel and father from mayo. micheal darragh mcauley father from donegal and cian osullivans parents both from kerry.

Huge swathes of the outskirts of Dublin are like that. First generation Dubs with country parents who have a softer Dublin accent.

Edgware

Dickie10 wrote: »

i think dublin GAA have there own distinct accent because of the culchie accent in 80% of the houses in dublin GAA. imagine the brogans a mother from listowel and father from mayo. micheal darragh mcauley father from donegal and cian osullivans parents both from kerry.

Unlike the inner city accent where the granny "worked" in Monto and the Grandad was a British squaddie

Deebles McBeebles

completedit wrote: »

South Dublin accent doesn’t sound American at all. The only people in Ireland who sound American are those weird sort of rocker kids

What about all the well-heeled ladies who think they are in Fade Street?

Brendan Bendar

It’s not so much the accent but the expressions that give the ‘American twinge’ to their accents.

The ‘r ‘ letter has changed radically in the last ten years.

Today’s youth don’t go to ‘Cork’ they go to ‘Coe erk’.

Nobody called it ‘Coe erk’ years ago except Americans.

Another segment of the Dublin accent which intrigues me is the ‘Supermarket Accent’

This one is beloved by usually fairly young mainly male college students doing casual work in the big Supermarkets.

It’s usually spoken out of the back of the throat, loudly, and with great ‘authority’ in short staccato bursts

Such as maybe “ Did ya see Liverpool last night man”……………………Salah like……. Should a scaaured man…………………the formation man…………… what was he doin …………keepin Milner on de bench like........should a gone fahrr in mid field man.

And so on....ð. no doubt they will all be Premier League managers later, given their confidence in their critique of the game......

OleRodrigo

Would be sad to see the Dublin accent replaced by something mid atlantic that sounds like a caricature of itself, whilst drowning in smugness.

However, the inner city version will not be missed.

Edgware

OleRodrigo wrote: »

Would be sad to see the Dublin accent replaced by something mid atlantic that sounds like a caricature of itself, whilst drowning in smugness.

However, the inner city version will not be missed.

With the latest taxi plate scam you will see the end of the " no wat I mean Bud" drivers soon

JupiterKid

The Dublin accent is alive and well. Not going anywhere soon.

A mild Dublin brogue is fine but full nasal scanger accent is vile.

If anything, the "Dulchies" living in Commuterland in Kildare, Meath and Wicklow are changing the local accents to a more Dublin one. Ive seen black and oriental kids with a full on Dublin accent.

The creeping Americanisation does annoy me. I cant stand the term "mom" for mam or mum.

OleRodrigo

Edgware wrote: »

With the latest taxi plate scam you will see the end of the " no wat I mean Bud" drivers soon

Well I wouldn't want to see someone out of work, but FFS they should sort that accent out.

Me ears feel like jumping off a cliff.

DEFTLEFTHAND

Dickie10 wrote: »

i think dublin GAA have there own distinct accent because of the culchie accent in 80% of the houses in dublin GAA. imagine the brogans a mother from listowel and father from mayo. micheal darragh mcauley father from donegal and cian osullivans parents both from kerry.

Very true.

Like how first gen Irish Poles who've never lived a day in the motherland still have a hint of a Polish accent. Our parents influence how we speak. They're the first people we mimmick.

completedit

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

It’s not so much the accent but the expressions that give the ‘American twinge’ to their accents.

The ‘r ‘ letter has changed radically in the last ten years.

Today’s youth don’t go to ‘Cork’ they go to ‘Coe erk’.

Nobody called it ‘Coe erk’ years ago except Americans.

Another segment of the Dublin accent which intrigues me is the ‘Supermarket Accent’

This one is beloved by usually fairly young mainly male college students doing casual work in the big Supermarkets.

It’s usually spoken out of the back of the throat, loudly, and with great ‘authority’ in short staccato bursts

Such as maybe “ Did ya see Liverpool last night man”……………………Salah like……. Should a scaaured man…………………the formation man…………… what was he doin …………keepin Milner on de bench like........should a gone fahrr in mid field man.

And so on....ð. no doubt they will all be Premier League managers later, given their confidence in their critique of the game......

Hahahah that’s so funny man that’s my accent, the supermarket one. Sometimes I sound posh and other times I sound like I’m from darndale.

Anyway the posh south Dublin accent, think rob lipsett probably sounds slightly English to foreigners not Americans.

South Dublin girls tend to pronounce t like sch so what sounds like whatsch...no American girls sound like that.

Brendan Bendar

completedit wrote: »

Hahahah that’s so funny man that’s my accent, the supermarket one. Sometimes I sound posh and other times I sound like I’m from darndale.

Anyway the posh south Dublin accent, think rob lipsett probably sounds slightly English to foreigners not Americans.

South Dublin girls tend to pronounce t like sch so what sounds like whatsch...no American girls sound like that.

Good man, the SOGs do indeed do sound as you say... thats right.... roitsht

American girls don’t speak like that guys.

The Tetrarch

No.
My car dashcam records sound.
I listened to myself talking to my sister.
Her accent was fine, mine was Dub x 10.
I was morto.

Edgware

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

Very true.

Like how first gen Irish Poles who've never lived a day in the motherland still have a hint of a Polish accent. Our parents influence how we speak. They're the first people we mimmick.

Even "mimic"

feargale

Dickie10 wrote: »

the jockey accent is because about 75% of jockeys are from meath and kildare and even at that its the region of meath south of navan and the area of kildare north of athy. these accents are very similar simply because they encompass a certain region with the border between counties stradddling the middle of the region. towns such as trim,kilcock,maynooth,clane and naas would be the main centres, the traditional accent is very similar in all these towns. even though they are all only 15-25 miles from oconnell st, they have very little trace of a dublin accent.

Many years ago I spent an evening in Garristown, County Dublin. Listening to the accents, you could have convinced me that I was in Cavan.

padd b1975

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Thank you, I most certainly do find accents very interesting and do listen with interest to the little subtle nuances of an accent which can either give clues of a persons occupation, a persons local area or a persons educational background

He heh just listening to a dude Andrew Balbirnie of Irish Cricket speaking.

“Bowling” “Bauling”. “Overs”. “Auvers”

Has to be from the Clonskeagh, Gautstown areas.

Anyone?

Lad most likely cut his teeth in Merrion CC Bren.

The type of character who'd be ferried to and from in an ancient Land Rover.

Old money-could be from anywhere really.

mariaalice

The Tetrarch wrote: »

No.
My car dashcam records sound.
I listened to myself talking to my sister.
Her accent was fine, mine was Dub x 10.
I was morto.

That is an interesting one I have come across with two siblings I am related to, one has the modern posh south Dublin accent and one has a very Wicklow GAA type accent yet they both live in the same house.

EmmetSpiceland

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Thank you, I most certainly do find accents very interesting and do listen with interest to the little subtle nuances of an accent which can either give clues of a persons occupation, a persons local area or a persons educational background

He heh just listening to a dude Andrew Balbirnie of Irish Cricket speaking.

“Bowling” “Bauling”. “Overs”. “Auvers”

Has to be from the Clonskeagh, Gautstown areas.

Anyone?

Jesus Brendan, I didn’t want to agree with you but I’m suffering here in my own living room having to listen to this John Forrest commentating for the rugby on TV3.

“Baul” “Sloe” “Stowlyn” are just a few examples of the linguistic butchery. Even as a Dub this is nails on the chalkboard stuff.

I’m telling you, it’s souring my can of Prazsky and tempting me to turn on the BBC!

Brendan Bendar

EmmetSpiceland wrote: »

Jesus Brendan, I didn’t want to agree with you but I’m suffering here in my own living room having to listen to this John Forrest commentating for the rugby on TV3.

“Baul” “Sloe” “Stowlyn” are just a few examples of the linguistic butchery. Even as a Dub this is nails on the chalkboard stuff.

I’m telling you, it’s souring my can of Prazsky and tempting me to turn on the BBC!

Never heard of that gent Emmett, must keep a ear out for him

Have to say never, never,ever, heard anything as bad as Kerr on the commentating on the Mu PSG game. Anyway I won’t go there.

What’s that Prazsky with the big frikken bubbles 4.3 abv doin in your living room.Goes flat after two minutes no wonder you are suffering.

Bring an empty two liter flagon to bed with you is this posters advice.

Leave her at the head of the bed E.

EmmetSpiceland

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Never heard of that gent Emmett, must keep a ear out for him

Have to say never, never,ever, heard anything as bad as Kerr on the commentating on the Mu PSG game. Anyway I won’t go there.

What’s that Prazsky with the big frikken bubbles 4.3 abv doin in your living room.Goes flat after two minutes no wonder you are suffering.

Bring an empty two liter flagon to bed with you is this posters advice.

Leave her at the head of the bed E.

Sound advice, I’m keeping a roll of triple ply luxury on ice for the morning. Just in case.

Regarding Mr Kerr, does it not warm the cockles of yer heart when he does curdle up his auld shoulders, squints his peepers and then issues forth pearls of footballing wisdom seemingly out of his wrinkled up srón?

No? Sure isn’t there always the mute button on the remote.

Brendan Bendar

EmmetSpiceland wrote: »

Sound advice, I’m keeping a roll of triple ply luxury on ice for the morning. Just in case.

Regarding Mr Kerr, does it not warm the cockles of yer heart when he does curdle up his auld shoulders, squints his peepers and then issues forth pearls of footballing wisdom seemingly out of his wrinkled up srón?

No? Sure isn’t there always the mute button on the remote.

Now there’s a good idea