Paris Saint-Germain v Manchester United , Round of 16 2nd Leg, BT Sport 2, 8pm

~Rebel~

martingriff wrote: »

Can teams from the same country not play each other in the next round

They can. Wouldn't mind one all england clash in the next round, just to thin out the English field and keep it feeling european. Already it looks like 3 of the last 8 will be English - 4 if Liverpool can upset the odds a bit in Munich.

Drumpot

Necro wrote: »

If Pool make it through and draw United this place might spontaneously combust though...:pac:

Only if Liverpool lose ....

Strumms

Necro wrote: »

That's all over now, could be United Spurs for example (of teams currently qualified).

If Pool make it through and draw United this place might spontaneously combust though...:pac:

It’s a MODEL :D:D:pac:

ShooterSF

PaulieC wrote: »

Lovely that it was Kimpembe that have away the pen seeing as he scored when should not have been in the pitch in the first leg

And would have been suspended. Don't believe in Karma but...

Necro

Strumms wrote: »

It’s a MODEL :D:D:pac:

Mods if that happens....



Followed by...

martingriff

Necro wrote: »

That's all over now, could be United Spurs for example (of teams currently qualified).

If Pool make it through and draw United this place might spontaneously combust though...:pac:

Not sure the Mods would be happy 2 weeks of that thread

patmac

I wasn’t a fan of VAR but definitely think it’s the best thing in the world ever now.

Mr.Nice Guy

KERSPLAT! wrote: »

Not at all, I just see no reason to be pulling up 3 week old posts when your team has just secured a massive result. I'd prefer to celebrate the win myself than pulling out a post to "get one up" on a rival fan.

I'm by no means a United fan but I had no issue with them going through. A quote from earlier after Greenwood came on.

Anyway, whatever floats your boat.

As I'm the one who pulled it up I should probably explain. I referenced a post from the first leg - you know, from the same tie - where posters like yourself were, as you might put it, "getting one up" on rival fans by insinuating that United were already out. I thought it was fair to highlight it given the most amusing events of this evening.

I'd no problem with the initial post btw. I like a bit of joshing and I figured the smiley would have indicated that. I'm surprised you reacted so angrily to it since in the same thread you were reproaching another United poster for not appreciating the bantz.

It's almost as if you're unhappy with the result tonight or something. In any event, best wishes to you sir on this historic evening.

Harry Palmr

Predictably Blue Moon sees this VAR incident as a UEFA conspiracy to do down the Oil Clubs. Brilliant!

super_furry

Liam O wrote: »

If they go through tonight I'm getting one framed on the wall tbh!

Right Liam O. You have until next week to get your foreskin-pink coloured jersey framed and hung.

yabadabado

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

As I'm the one who pulled it up I should probably explain. I referenced a post from the first leg - you know, from the same tie - where posters like yourself were, as you might put it, "getting one up" on rival fans by insinuating that United were already out. I thought it was fair to highlight it given the most amusing events of this evening.

I'd no problem with the initial post btw. I like a bit of joshing and I figured the smiley would have indicated that. I'm surprised you reacted so angrily to it since in the same thread you were reproaching another United poster for not appreciating the bantz.

It's almost as if you're unhappy with the result tonight or something. In any event, best wishes to you sir on this historic evening.

Some lads get emotional even when their team isnt losing.

Strumms

super_furry wrote: »

Right Liam O. You have until next week to get your foreskin-pink coloured jersey framed and hung.

I read that wrong and now I’m unlikely to sleep :eek:

Headshot

Yup we have to see that jersey framed now

what you say on the internet is gospel

Unearthly

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Predictably Blue Moon sees this VAR incident as a UEFA conspiracy to do down the Oil Clubs. Brilliant!

Christ I can only imagine the type of venom they are spitting tonight

Strumms

Unearthly wrote: »

Christ I can only imagine the type of venom they are spitting tonight

We can request that they monitor their prodsidity, tone and inflection when they say... “ yes, the defenders arm WAS in a VERY unnatural position as he made what was likely deliberate contact with the football”.

Paully D

That’s one of the worst decisions I’ve seen in a long, long time.

I was in favour of VAR but it seems to be leading to far more poor decisions than I anticipated and I can’t say I’m looking forward to it being implemented increasingly if we’re going to see more rubbish similar to what happened tonight.

Imagine the reaction if an English club had gone out to a decision like that!

Just awful.

Loafing Oaf

Paully D wrote: »

That’s one of the worst decisions I’ve seen in a long, long time.

Has the handball law, or the implementation of it, changed though? According to the BT commentator (IIRC), if your arm is any way out from your body and it hits the ball, that's now a foul.

osarusan

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

Has the handball law, or the implementation of it, changed though? According to the BT commentator (IIRC), if your arm is any way out from your body and it hits the ball, that's now a foul.

Yeah the commentator said something about 'making your body bigger' by having the arms away from the body.

Ferdinand, Owen and Hargeaves in the BT studio, and none thought it was a penalty, although there was some ex-ref or something who tried to explain it.

I think that for the three of them, and for most football fans, it doesn't fit with their idea of what 'should be' a penalty, but we're not up to date with the latest instructions on how to interpret things.

Owen said that if that's a penalty according to the laws of the game, then maybe the laws of the game, or interpretation guidelines, need to be looked at. I'd agree with that.

PhlegmyMoses

osarusan wrote: »

Yeah the commentator said something about 'making your body bigger' by having the arms away from the body.

Ferdinand, Owen and Hargeaves in the BT studio, and none thought it was a penalty, although there was some ex-ref or something who tried to explain it.

I think that for the three of them, and for most football fans, it doesn't fit with their idea of what 'should be' a penalty, but we're not up to date with the latest instructions on how to interpret things.

Owen said that if that's a penalty according to the laws of the game, then maybe the laws of the game, or interpretation guidelines, need to be looked at. I'd agree with that.

This is it. Been saying it for years. Handball law is a mess. Go and read it and now apply it to any handball that you see. Saying that this is down to VAR, or that it is a bad call from the ref when he is simply applying the law, is missing the point spectacularly

AdamD

All the people blaming VAR...

The problem is the rules are vague as **** and seriously need clarification.

josip

Strumms

The guys arm was in the most unnatural position that it physically could have been. We might not be professional footballers but seeing the replay there is no fair advantage that the player can gain be it balance or otherwise by raising his one arm up above his head like that. In my view the ONLY advantage was to make himself a larger target for preventing a shot hitting the target....

josip

Rashford's penalty was the first he has ever taken in a competitive match for Manchester United.
Some stones on the lad as Rob Kearney would say.

osarusan

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

This is it. Been saying it for years. Handball law is a mess. Go and read it and now apply it to any handball that you see. Saying that this is down to VAR, or that it is a bad call from the ref when he is simply applying the law, is missing the point spectacularly

I wonder, when the FIFA referee advisory panel that released the latest guidelines on 'arms away from the body to make the body bigger' next meet, will they be saying "well that wasn't what we had in mind when we wrote those guidelines" or is that the kind of thing they want to see penalised.

For me, and I think, most fans of the game, that 'shouldn't' be a penalty.

Strumms

Well should we want to see whenever a shot is taken be it a free kick or open play, player(s) jumping up with arms raised either facing play or away from play, thus *delibritly* making themselves a bigger target therefore deliberately engineering a handball that peanalises the attacking team yet getting away with it ? I’m all for rewarding ingenuity but it is neither within the spirit of the game or in my view the rules that this situation can be allowed.

NIMAN

I thought VAR was meant to put an end to crap decisions and teams getting dumped out of competitions unfairly?
So you aren't allowed to jump in front of shots now?

jayo26

NIMAN wrote: »

I thought VAR was meant to put an end to crap decisions and teams getting dumped out of competitions unfairly?
So you aren't allowed to jump in front of shots now?

It did

Strumms

NIMAN wrote: »

I thought VAR was meant to put an end to crap decisions and teams getting dumped out of competitions unfairly?
So you aren't allowed to jump in front of shots now?

Not with your arm in the most unnatural position that it could have been in, a deliberate act and when the arm contacts the ball...that a penalty

NIMAN

Funnily, the Utd man that took the shot appealed for a corner and was happy that it was awarded.

Funny old game, eh.

NIMAN

Strumms wrote: »

Not with your arm in the most unnatural position that it could have been in, a deliberate act and when the arm contacts the ball...that a penalty

Try taking a run and jump up, to see where your arms go.

I have been watching football for 45 years now, and always thought that it had to be a deliberate handball? Since they introduced all this nonsense like "making your body bigger" it just muddies the water.

Strumms

NIMAN wrote: »

Try taking a run and jump up, to see where your arms go.

I have been watching football for 45 years now, and always thought that it had to be a deliberate handball? Since they introduced all this nonsense like "making your body bigger" it just muddies the water.

Next game you watch, see how many times you see a player jump with one arm, raised, fully extended over their head in a similar situation. The principles of balance, center of gravity etc suggest that a player trying to execute a jump in such a manner will not gain a natural advantage by placing one arm fully extended over their head with the other by their side..

kona

d22ontour wrote: »

Can't see anything bar a psg win, psg -2 @ 3/1 looks decent.

Good call pal . Hahaha

FourFourRED

Agent Coulson wrote: »

I think if Man U can get an earlier goal PSG will crumble.

Hotblack Desiato

martingriff wrote: »

Can teams from the same country not play each other in the next round

If they qualify

NIMAN

Please let it be Liverpool v Utd
Please let it be Liverpool v Utd
Please let it be Liverpool v Utd
Please let it be Liverpool v Utd

Rossi IRL

NIMAN wrote: »

Funnily, the Utd man that took the shot appealed for a corner and was happy that it was awarded.

Funny old game, eh.

Not sure what eyes your looking through but Dalot appealed straight away for a handball.

lab man

flazio wrote:

What were Uniteds odds before the game?

40/1to win 3 1

~Rebel~

Strumms wrote: »

The guys arm was in the most unnatural position that it physically could have been. We might not be professional footballers but seeing the replay there is no fair advantage that the player can gain be it balance or otherwise by raising his one arm up above his head like that. In my view the ONLY advantage was to make himself a larger target for preventing a shot hitting the target....

I'm a bit confused by your posts... the ball hit his elbow, with his arm by his side... here's a screenshot of the moment of contact.

machiavellianme

Strumms wrote: »

The guys arm was in the most unnatural position that it physically could have been. We might not be professional footballers but seeing the replay there is no fair advantage that the player can gain be it balance or otherwise by raising his one arm up above his head like that. In my view the ONLY advantage was to make himself a larger target for preventing a shot hitting the target....

What are you talking about? The arm it hit was down by his side. Slightly out from his body with his hand facing inwards, but it would defy human dynamics for his arm to be anywhere else once he left the ground. Possibly the most natural position it could have been in. Unless he was to physically remove his arm, hide it under his shirt or stretch it upright above his head (all of which are unnatural), there was no way of avoiding contact. But as we know, not all contact is deliberate. It certainly didn't look like he was gaining any advantage from his body position. If it hit his other arm which was raised, you might have some point.

gimli2112

It would have been a great result without their injuries /suspensions. The penalty was harsh but enough to put them through and deservedly so. Nothing should take away from the outcome.


Is the PSG experiment a failed one? You'd have to expect they'll eventually win it but playing week in week out in a non league can't be helping. I see they've accumulated a record number of points this year. They're like a really good Celtic.

facehugger99

If this is the way the handball rule is heading, there will be a new breed of strikers, whose may attribute will be being able to hit an opposition players' arm inside the box

Liam O

facehugger99 wrote: »

If this is the way the handball rule is heading, there will be a new breed of strikers, whose may attribute will be being able to hit an opposition players' arm inside the box

The defender sees the ball coming towards them, turns away from it while 'unaware' that the ball is heading for their arms, both of which happen to be spread wide of their bodies on the same side. The ball then hits one of said arms that the player has made no effort to move and instead has moved it slightly wider to make him even bigger while again NOT LOOKING AT THE BALL.

How is that not a deliberate attempt to use your arm to affect the play?

~Rebel~

Liam O wrote: »

The defender sees the ball coming towards them, turns away from it while 'unaware' that the ball is heading for their arms, both of which happen to be spread wide of their bodies on the same side. The ball then hits one of said arms that the player has made no effort to move and instead has moved it slightly wider to make him even bigger while again NOT LOOKING AT THE BALL.

How is that not a deliberate attempt to use your arm to affect the play?

I see... so while facing the other direction, he knows exactly when the move his elbow to connect with the ball, whilst in midair?

His arm is also not spread wide, it's about as by-your-side as you can possibly have it while jumping.

Look, I really don't understand anyone trying to claim that's a legitimate penalty claim. Surely it's just as satisfying (if not moreso) to steal a march on PSG with a dodgy call?

facehugger99

Liam O wrote: »

The defender sees the ball coming towards them, turns away from it while 'unaware' that the ball is heading for their arms, both of which happen to be spread wide of their bodies on the same side. The ball then hits one of said arms that the player has made no effort to move and instead has moved it slightly wider to make him even bigger while again NOT LOOKING AT THE BALL.

How is that not a deliberate attempt to use your arm to affect the play?

That's nothing but a slow-mo analysis - and a poor one at that.

Everything can be made to look deliberate or have a narrative grafted onto it in slow-motion.

It was a really shocking decision. I haven't seen any evidence that VAR is adding anything but delays and confusion to the game.

Liam O

facehugger99 wrote: »

That's nothing but a slow-mo analysis - and a poor one at that.

Everything can be made to look deliberate or have a narrative grafted onto it in slow-motion.

It was a really shocking decision. I haven't seen any evidence that VAR is adding anything but delays and confusion to the game.

He had time to turn around. No attempt was made to move his arm but he had time to make himself bigger with his arms in order to block the shot. So players should gain an unfair advantage with their arms according to you?

VAR worked perfectly on this occasion.

There's a good bit about this exact thing in this article. Referees have copped on since it happened.

https://www.football365.com/news/it-is-time-for-peter-g-to-vent-about-handball.

Liam O

~Rebel~ wrote: »

I see... so while facing the other direction, he knows exactly when the move his elbow to connect with the ball, whilst in midair?

His arm is also not spread wide, it's about as by-your-side as you can possibly have it while jumping.

Look, I really don't understand anyone trying to claim that's a legitimate penalty claim. Surely it's just as satisfying (if not moreso) to steal a march on PSG with a dodgy call?

The referee, the VAR technician and whoever the ex ref was on BT all agreed it was a penalty. So the people interpreting the laws all being aligned on something and agreeing on a decision makes it a terrible call? Kimpembe had time to turn away but not to move his arms? It was a cowardly play and he's been punished for it.

facehugger99

Liam O wrote: »

The referee, the VAR technician and whoever the ex ref was on BT all agreed it was a penalty. So the people interpreting the laws all being aligned on something and agreeing on a decision makes it a terrible call? Kimpembe had time to turn away but not to move his arms? It was a cowardly play and he's been punished for it.

I doubt you'll be so sanguine the next time a call like that goes against your team.

Wheeliebin30

Liam O wrote: »

The defender sees the ball coming towards them, turns away from it while 'unaware' that the ball is heading for their arms, both of which happen to be spread wide of their bodies on the same side. The ball then hits one of said arms that the player has made no effort to move and instead has moved it slightly wider to make him even bigger while again NOT LOOKING AT THE BALL.

How is that not a deliberate attempt to use your arm to affect the play?

He moved his hand back towards his body.

alchemist33

NIMAN wrote: »

Funnily, the Utd man that took the shot appealed for a corner and was happy that it was awarded.

Funny old game, eh.

He was tapping his arm to appeal for a penalty. Hilarious

jacool

Liam O wrote: »

The referee, the VAR technician and whoever the ex ref was on BT all agreed it was a penalty. So the people interpreting the laws all being aligned on something and agreeing on a decision makes it a terrible call? Kimpembe had time to turn away but not to move his arms? It was a cowardly play and he's been punished for it.

Clearly you watched BT Sport last night, but failed to mention that 4 ex-players, 3 of whom played with Manchester United said it was not a penalty.
Peter Walton always says that the referess call was right.
The only player I've ever seen jump without his arms coming up was another Manchester United player, Kevin Moran (pronounce that correctly now, everyone).