Near Misses Volume 2 (So close you can feel it)

What Username Guidelines

Close one this morning here

Driver at top of queue stops at green light so as to not enter the yellow box. I'm just about to pass on the inside of the car when the van behind overtakes the stopped car, pulls hard left maybe trying to make a point (what point?) into the yellow box and straight across my path - pretty much into the position of the land rover you see in the streetview image.

I roared at him and when I say to him "you nearly hit me" he just replies "So?"

CramCycle

You need to have work insurance here, I have it on my car, costs about €100 extra year. A co worker was rear ended while carrying back work items as it was handier than going in, getting a fleet vehicle and coming back. Garda done them for no insurance. He explained what he was doing and why he had what he had in his boot, Garda asked about his insurance, he had never heard of it or like me, never thought about it.

blackwhite

Kaisr Sose wrote: »

Would I be correct thinking they are driving uninsured if they don't have class 2 or 3 insurance? I know this is the case in the UK and cars have been seized for no insurance (even though there was social, domestic and pleasure cover in place)

RGS wrote: »

I know one or two of the bigger take away companies cover the claims caused by their drivers whilst on deliveries.

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

I understand Dominos pay for insurance for their drivers. I suspect that a lot of the other operators have a gap here.

Legally speaking, it doesn't matter if the company is willing to cover the cost of claims or not - the vehicle and driver must have an insurance policy in place that covers use of the vehicle for delivery services.

Dominos state that they provide Occasional Business Use insurance for their drivers. There's an argument that someone employed/contracted to act as a delivery driver is using the vehicle above and beyond what's intended by Occasional Business Use policies, so they still need to be very careful that they've disclosed all properly to their insurers when taking out the policy.

McGrath5

Yesterday morning, a minibus goes to pull in here on top of me, I smacked the side window but he ploughed on through. I asked the driver wtf he was at, but he just muttered something about f'ing cyclists. Told him I'm going to report him and he said he couldn't give flying fcuk.

AndrewJRenko

McGrath5 wrote: »

Yesterday morning, a minibus goes to pull in here on top of me, I smacked the side window but he ploughed on through. I asked the driver wtf he was at, but he just muttered something about f'ing cyclists. Told him I'm going to report him and he said he couldn't give flying fcuk.

You might get somewhere reporting him to the employer, or even (if it is a shuttle bus funded by a local business, who's name is displayed prominently) to the company involved.

blackwhite wrote: »

Dominos state that they provide Occasional Business Use insurance for their drivers. There's an argument that someone employed/contracted to act as a delivery driver is using the vehicle above and beyond what's intended by Occasional Business Use policies, so they still need to be very careful that they've disclosed all properly to their insurers when taking out the policy.

I've no idea how they do this. If I want cover for business travel on my car, I have to get this from my current insurer as an upgrade to my policy, and then claim the cost back from my employer.

It seems strange that Dominos are able to provide this as an add-on to an existing policy, but as a seperate insurer.

In the UK, they are providing 3rd party cover only.

https://corporate.dominos.co.uk/Are-you-Driven-to-Deliver

So if you normally have fully comp cover, and you crash while you're doing a delivery, will your own fully comp cover still apply?

Some interesting discussions here;
https://forums.digitalspy.com/discussion/2034485/advice-needed-on-dominos-delivery-car-insurance

aloooof

This may of be interest to some: "Temporary cycle route proposed for Dublin quays costing €800,000"

https://www.rte.ie/news/dublin/2020/0227/1118008-dublin-cycle/

Hurrache

McGrath5 wrote: »

Yesterday morning, a minibus goes to pull in here on top of me, I smacked the side window but he ploughed on through. I asked the driver wtf he was at, but he just muttered something about f'ing cyclists. Told him I'm going to report him and he said he couldn't give flying fcuk.

Did you get the name of the company? Had one pull the same on me.

micar

Seth Brundle wrote: »

Decided to look at the article on the cesspit we know as Facebook and sure enough out of two comments there currently...

I replied to her.....couldn't help it

Pinch Flat

Elizabeth probably spends hours stuck in a traffic jam she's helped create in her motorised three piece suite every morning

stryker mcqueen

Not a near miss but the disbelief has prompted me to post, heading downhill on the Finglas Road out of town tonight opposite glasnevin cemetery , anyone who knows it knows you can get a fair bit of speed up, anyway as I'm going towards the ballyboggan road junction I notice a garda car hidden away with a speed camera and 3 cars pulled, blocking the cycle lane and a garda talking to the drivers, thank god it was dry and my bike was serviced yesterday because I had to jam on, the lack of consideration for cyclists taken by the Gardaí was astonishing, I get they are catching people speeding but a bit of common sense surely with the location of the speed trap ??? When I voiced my concerns the female garda told me to to shush which did make me giggle in fairness!

CramCycle

coward wrote: »

The driver beeps again. I've had enough. I stop and park the bike and dismount with a view to politely asking him what exactly would he like me to do? He reverses a little, mounts and drives along the footpath.

I know I should have ignored the beeping etc. And not raised my voice or said a little curse.

Little toe rag is in the bus lane the whole way as well. scum bags. hope your OK, I would not have been as calm.

stryker mcqueen

coward wrote: »

It takes me too much time to stop thinking about it. Ruins an evening. Wish I could empty my head of these things quicker!

Next time - and it will be soon enough - I hope to ignore the beeping and carry on. Anything to avoid the stress along that stretch of road.

Goes to show how brave these fools are beeping from the warmth and safety of a car.... Your man absolutely shat the bed when you got off your bike!!!!

CramCycle

Cyclist is no saint in this, accidentally tailgating a bus due to the tail wind. Driver was in the bus lane and starts tailgating and beeping at the cyclist who let up coming to the junction for obvious reasons. Language is NSFW and I am sure the cyclist is not proud of the words used.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-Iold_nHG0

Same driver was seen by me watching a movie on his phone another day.

AndrewJRenko

CramCycle wrote: »

Same driver was seen by me watching a movie on his phone another day.

A Dublin Bus driver? FFS - would be well worth getting that on camera.

coward wrote: »

My least favourite stretch of road, the New Nangor Road bus lane outbound.

First driver does a close pass. It was a tuck-my-elbow-in moment to avoid wing mirror. My heart rate soars in those moments. Followed by just anger for putting my safety at risk.

I pull out even more to ensure the driver following him doesn't try the same stupid manoeuvre. I get beeped at and I'm given hand signals to tell me to get out of his way. I do shout a bit here. I'm still angry at the first driver. The passenger has also joined in with hand signals to tell me to get out of the way.

The driver beeps again. I've had enough. I stop and park the bike and dismount with a view to politely asking him what exactly would he like me to do? He reverses a little, mounts and drives along the footpath.

I know I should have ignored the beeping etc. And not raised my voice or said a little curse.

I was having a lovely cycle home right up to this point. Nice clear dry evening. It's long gone past the point where I've had enough. I don't know what there is to be done anymore. I've seen the inside of Clondalkin garda station more times than I would like by reporting incidents. Last one was a driver who pulled out into my path and took me out of it just before Christmas. A driver who is currently nowhere to be found. Guards can do no more and I'm currently dealing with the insurance company to recover costs.

Here's a video of it. Yes, I probably shouldn't post it when I'm going to report both drivers to traffic watch tomorrow. It's just nothing ever happens. I lose time and memory sticks.

If there is even the slightest reluctance to progress your complaints, you should bring a copy of this with you;

https://www.garda.ie/en/about-us/our-departments/office-of-corporate-communications/news-media/road-safety-month-of-action-february-2020.html

Garda Members are aware of the new offence of ‘Dangerous overtaking of a Pedal Cycle’ and where such incidents are reported they will be fully investigated.

CramCycle

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

A Dublin Bus driver? FFS - would be well worth getting that on camera.

No the driver of the car. I remember the reg from another incident.

Kaisr Sose

Definately report both.

dubbrin

Seth Brundle wrote: »

The second driver could easily have driven straight through your parked bike and claimed that they felt you were going to attack them (or whatever bull they think they can get away with) and they panicked.
Be careful out there!

A Guard made a very similar point to me recently (I was in the car and it was another driver though). He said that people could do something mad like above and stick with some mad ficticious version of what happened trying to lay blame on you. Without video evidence/a witness, nobody can prove anything and it's seen as my word against yours. Go to court and it's thrown out. Confrontations are rarely going to work out in your favour unfortunately...



Unless you come across the car parked up some evening with nobody around :cool:

WOW the almost extinct lesser spotted Irish person who does wrong and doesn't deny, lie, or go on the offensive !!!!!

No excusing the pass but I know maybe 1 or 2 people max who would have done that in her situation. My Aunt and my Dad. I honestly can't say if I'd have done the same there.

sy_flembeck

Not a near miss for me but this morning I was driving inbound on Killarney Road in Bray. As I approached the junction at Boghall Road I noticed a guy out for a run crossing the road towardss the traffic lights from the church side - local running club jacket on. Nothing dangerous in that but next thing he proceeds to run on the cycle path, which is a lane painted on the road. With upcoming traffic behind him. TBH I couldn't believe his stupidity. This is a stretch of road I have had many incidents on the bike and have even had one person prosecuted for their behaviour towards me.

What really got me was the reaction of the other road users towards him. Traffic was heavy enough but to a car they gave him acres of room, nobody blew a horn and nobody acted the goat. And this guy was in the wrong all day long!

Yet, if you're on a bike....

I have dashcam footage but I don't think it would serve any purpose to put it up here. also, you'd all know I was listening to Joe Dolan

CramCycle

Presuming he is moving towards Bray, does that path not go up to be separated from the road? Either way, I'd prefer him to the d1cks who run towards you on narrow paths. At least you can slow behind him and overtake when safe, d1ck in Clonskeagh who runs contraflow. You have to stop and he still comes at you and almost tuts at you for stopping even though he never breaks his line.

As for why the cars do that, it is simple association, they can see themselves in a runner. A cyclist, for many, I can never understand why, they just think as sub human, it is very weird.

sy_flembeck

CramCycle wrote: »

Presuming he is moving towards Bray, does that path not go up to be separated from the road?

It does, but it was after that and before the lights. Where it has come back onto the road after the cottages

Steoller

My incident from last year has finally wound its way through the courts system, so I feel I should share the conclusion.

Convicted of careless driving and €200 fine.

Incident video below - Strong language warning.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYyhQSaBUQM

CramCycle

There is a level of stupidity there I cannot comprehend. Fair play to you for being so reasonable. I would have called him unpleasant things using unparliamentary language. He just couldn't get it. It was actually frightening to think he is allowed drive.

micar

Steoller wrote: »

My incident from last year has finally wound its way through the courts system, so I feel I should share the conclusion.

Convicted of careless driving and €200 fine.

Incident video below - Strong language warning.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYyhQSaBUQM

Can you explain the court process?

How did he plead?

Why did it take 12 months to get the conviction,?

Did he show any remorse?

Was he apologetic?

What was his reaction to seeing the footage of the pass?

Did he only realise after seeing the footage how little space he gave?

tnegun

Get up on the footpath, the width of the two bags, you were miles out, common sense says get out of my way. This guy has never been wrong in his life what an a$$hat. I'd be interested to hear details on how it was handled by the Gardai and got to court too.

ofthelord

Steoller wrote: »

My incident from last year has finally wound its way through the courts system, so I feel I should share the conclusion.

Convicted of careless driving and €200 fine.

Incident video below - Strong language warning.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYyhQSaBUQM

Fair play to you for being so calm when talking with him.
It's kind of worrying how people with his attitude are out there driving.

Given his attitude in the video I bet the driver see's this as a massive miscarriage of justice and will have his piss boiling over it for some time

Kaisr Sose

MojoMaker wrote: »

Interesting, I reckon it was the post-incident dialogue that secured the conviction, not necessarily the pass itself (we have seen much worse go unpunished).

I would second that. I would like to know how this went when you first reported it and then in the run up to court. Worse passes have not got to court. Prosecution of these seems very subjective, and how they are dealt with in court even more so.

AndrewJRenko

CramCycle wrote: »

Presuming he is moving towards Bray, does that path not go up to be separated from the road? Either way, I'd prefer him to the d1cks who run towards you on narrow paths. At least you can slow behind him and overtake when safe, d1ck in Clonskeagh who runs contraflow. You have to stop and he still comes at you and almost tuts at you for stopping even though he never breaks his line.

I'd bet a fiver he'd break his line if I came up against him.

Steoller wrote: »

My incident from last year has finally wound its way through the courts system, so I feel I should share the conclusion.

Convicted of careless driving and €200 fine.

Incident video below - Strong language warning.

CramCycle wrote: »

There is a level of stupidity there I cannot comprehend. Fair play to you for being so reasonable. I would have called him unpleasant things using unparliamentary language. He just couldn't get it. It was actually frightening to think he is allowed drive.

Fair play for taking it all the way through to conviction. On the question of 'unparliamentary language', did your own language come up for discussion at all?


Not criticising you in any way, but I'd have formal cautions from the Gardai about possible public order offences in similar cases when giving witness statements. Did this happen with you?

CramCycle

I said it to the Garda at the time, they just said it's not great but is irrelevant to the issue. I have had that warning, very much a PFO rather than something that would follow through to court IMO.

Pinch Flat

Steoller wrote: »

My incident from last year has finally wound its way through the courts system, so I feel I should share the conclusion.

Convicted of careless driving and €200 fine.

Incident video below - Strong language warning.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYyhQSaBUQM

jaysus the sense of entitlement from that motorist and putting it back on the cyclist. Serves him right. Some utter dopes on the road.

Does his conviction have any impact on his insurance premium? Be nice to see a hike when he renews to remind him

Kaisr Sose

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Not criticising you in any way, but I'd have formal cautions from the Gardai about possible public order offences in similar cases when giving witness statements. Did this happen with you?

Good point. The drivers language is not great either. I think this is used by the Garda when they are looking for a reason not to take it further. It someone nearly takes you out and adrenaline is pulsing through veins, its very hard to engage Kings English.

Hurrache

Steoller, did you have to go to court or could the Garda follow through on the basis of your statement and footage?

RobbieMD

Hurrache wrote: »

Steoller, did you have to go to court or could the Garda follow through on the basis of your statement and footage?

I can’t speak for Steoller but can shed some light on how it works.

If the driver entered a not guilty plea, then Steoller would’ve been required to give evidence.

If he pleaded guilty, the Garda can give the facts of the case and no witnesses are examined. In that instance, 99 times out of a 100, video footage isn’t played for the court.

For the offences of Section 51a driving without reasonable consideration, 52 careless driving and 53 dangerous driving, the judge can vary the conviction up or down depending on the facts and circumstances. A garda could charge you with dangerous driving but the judge could convict you of careless driving. For Sec 51a these are FCPNs. If the notice isn’t paid, a summons is generated. In court the judge could convict of Sec 52 if he thought it was merited.

Summons applications take roughly 4-6 months before the court service allocate a date. Not every summons is served on the first application, and if the driver had a solicitor then I’m sure there would’ve been an adjournment(s) to allow the solicitor examine the states case.

Section 52 careless driving does not give a Garda a power of arrest and as such must proceed by way of summons.

RobbieMD

magicbastarder wrote: »

in what circumstances (other than the judge actually watching the video evidence) might lead a judge to levy a punishment different to what the DPP is applying for?

In my experience, judges will generally agree with the charge levied by the state. If it’s reduced then generally it’s from dangerous driving down to careless driving. Dangerous driving is supposed to carry a disqualification. If the accused has a solicitor make a case that he/she requires the licence to work for example, then judges generally will reduce it down.

Sometimes the prosecution might be weak and the judge may not feel the charge is substantiated enough and reduce it. Some judges will ask about the volume of other road users present during an allegation of dangerous driving, and if it’s late at night on a motorway, they may reduce it down.

It’s not a common thing in my experience to see a judge increase the charge up in severity though. There are some common practices the Gardai use that have no basis in law, a common one being a person driving twice the speed limit is generally arrested for dangerous driving, but you could be doing 100 in a 60 and it would only lead to a speeding fine.

Generally the DPP won’t be directing for careless driving or dangerous driving type offences. There are instances, dangerous driving causing serious bodily harm or death that require a DPP direction, but most are directed by the Superintendent of the district.

Steoller

micar wrote: »

Can you explain the court process?

How did he plead?

Why did it take 12 months to get the conviction,?

Did he show any remorse?

Was he apologetic?

What was his reaction to seeing the footage of the pass?

Did he only realise after seeing the footage how little space he gave?

Dr_Colossus wrote: »

+1, also interested as you've never know when one of us would have to go through similar proceedings.
<snip>
Does the prosecution make much if any difference to insurance renewal quotes or was their points charged to his license also.

Kaisr Sose wrote: »

I would second that. I would like to know how this went when you first reported it and then in the run up to court.

Hurrache wrote: »

Steoller, did you have to go to court or could the Garda follow through on the basis of your statement and footage?

I'm sorry to say that my presence was not required at court, so I do not know how they pleaded, or whether my footage was used. RobbieMD seems well versed in the procedure, so I would suspect he pleaded guilty and I wasn't required.

As for why it took 12 months, it took six months of showing up at the Garda station once a month, (and a direct appeal to the Superintendent at a public meeting), to get the Garda working the issue to take my statement. That was the end of September. Then the initial hearing was early January, and the final hearing was end of February.

If he had not come back to have a go at me after the pass, I probably would have let it go earlier.
But because he did that, I would have happily gone to court if needed.

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Fair play for taking it all the way through to conviction. On the question of 'unparliamentary language', did your own language come up for discussion at all?

They made no mention of it. Maybe because he was the one who came after me, and started the argument, I could be forgiven for being a bit impolite?

Kaisr Sose

Steoller wrote: »

As for why it took 12 months, it took six months of showing up at the Garda station once a month, (and a direct appeal to the Superintendent at a public meeting), to get the Garda working the issue to take my statement. That was the end of September. Then the initial hearing was early January, and the final hearing was end of February.

Yes, fair play.
I am the process of appealing a decision not to prosecute. They (AGS) don't give much in terms of detail in the decision.

Dr_Colossus

Dr_Colossus wrote: »

Jees, what a system, in order to get any sort of justice you have to hound others for months on end to do their job and take a reportable instance seriously. Fair play for sticking with it as most wouldn't given those obstacles.

Goes to show if you want to kill anyone in this country do it in a car and most likely you will be spared jail as in this case from last year where an uninsured driver fatally hit a pedestrian, leaving him at the side of the road while he went home and buried the car in a field using a digger. That case took nearly 2 1/2 years to get a verdict in court:
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/circuit-court/man-21-who-buried-car-on-family-farm-after-fatal-hit-and-run-avoids-jail-1.3968778

Christ, I'd not read about that one. Even the custodial sentence had been suspended it would have been shockingly short. Real slap in the face to the victims family.

Steoller

Dr_Colossus wrote: »

Jees, what a system, in order to get any sort of justice you have to hound others for months on end to do their job and take a reportable instance seriously. Fair play for sticking with it as most wouldn't given those obstacles.

I should mention for fairness that the second incident I reported was dealt with within the week. The consistency isn't great, but it shows it can be a priority when it needs to be, and in small under-resourced stations like our local one we don't know what other issues they have to deal with on their shift.

That said, they did lose the first copy of the videos about a month after I gave the statement, and I had to resubmit them.

tnegun

Sorry for the FB link we can only dream about such consequences https://www.facebook.com/groups/ukdashcamfootage/permalink/1072316383145750/

I get so many close passes a day at that speed I don't even notice anymore.

tnegun

Damn works for me maybe you have to be a member of the UK Dash cam FB group I've attached a screenshot will see can I do better from the laptop later

f1000

End of O'Connell St. earlier (half 4 and very bright out) about to cross South side towards D'Olier St. after the lights went green onto O'Connell bridge, an Eircoach cut me off to pull onto the bridge behind the no.4 bus.

Had to jump off onto the path while grabbing my bike to avoid being squashed.

Was going to keep going keep going but said, **** that!

Went back, waited until the driver assisted people from the bus and then told the driver to be more aware and to let the driver know that was a dangerous manoeuvre and had put me in a dangerous situation.

The driver got very defensive became a very aggro, telling me that it was illegal for me not to have high-vis and no lights in broad daylight and it was my fault to put myself in that situation.

Kaisr Sose

f1000 wrote: »

End of O'Connell St. earlier (half 4 and very bright out) about to cross South side towards D'Olier St. after the lights went green onto O'Connell bridge, an Eircoach cut me off to pull onto the bridge behind the no.4 bus.

Had to jump off onto the path while grabbing my bike to avoid being squashed.

Was going to keep going keep going but said, **** that!

Went back, waited until the driver assisted people from the bus and then told the driver to be more aware and to let the driver know that was a dangerous manoeuvre and had put me in a dangerous situation.

The driver got very defensive became a very aggro, telling me that it was illegal for me not to have high-vis and no lights in broad daylight and it was my fault to put myself in that situation.

Just report him to his employer. Its an act of kindness to do so as it will prevent him seriously injuring or killing someone.

A lot of aircoach drivers (and other private coach /shuttle drivers) need a good lesson in road safety and etiquette towards other road users.

AndrewJRenko

MojoMaker wrote: »

You are sh***ing me, illegal not to have hi-vis on? On what planet is this muppet consuming and believing this BS???

I've gotten this more than once. I think the constant hammering by the RSA, Gardai and others have created the expectation that hi-vis and helmets are a legal requirement.

Try asking the driver about the missing hi-vis stripes on their car if it comes up again.

kenmm

RobertFoster wrote: »

Nearly had a head on collision with another cyclist on the Clontarf track today. Just before the causeway heading into town, a couple of lads heading towards Howth in single file on what looked to be fat bikes. The second man decided to pull out from behind the first and into my path when we were nearly on top of each other.

I let a roar and braked and he pulled in behind his friend again. I thought no harm no foul, these things can happen, but then he irked me by shouting "wrong side!" and pointing to the pedestrian side of the white line

An understandable mistake I suppose if he was new to the path. Just goes to show how inconsistent cycling infrastructure is here. Whatever about changes from one council area to the next, you can be on the same track and the layout can change a few times in a short stretch.

I've been both in this scenario - I am not sure where exactly on the track that is, but I have came up the wrong side and also had others nearly head-on me.

Is that where the track seems to split really narrow, where two way cycle path is squeezed into one lane, right after having a proper two way track?

mr spuckler

raheny red wrote: »

Not making excuses but the sun was nasty heading out towards Howth around 9 this morning.

The main issue seems to be that he shouted "wrong side" and pointed at the ped area, can't blame the sun for that! Dude was clearly either clueless or an arsehole who just had to shout something in response.

tnegun

More fun with Intel shuttles the guy was on my back wheel the a stupid pointless pass https://streamable.com/5lmni

Punishment pass this am for daring to come out of a dangerous cycle lane
https://streamable.com/ppnuv oddly almost the same location as the above just one the way in this am!

Think I shared these last year but uploaded again for the another thread here
https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=112725454&postcount=22

What Username Guidelines

Anyone know what’s happening in Baldoyle?

https://twitter.com/ni_allo/status/1235322004552773632?s=21

sy_flembeck

Not one wide load, not two but three....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWBHIqQvrFs

sy_flembeck

sy_flembeck wrote: »

Not one wide load, not two but three....

I don't know that stretch myself by it looks like there is some attempt at a segregated path/bike lane left of the barrier that is in rough shape and just ends and you'd have to shoulder the bike over it to continue in the hard shoulder