The Disappearance of Madeleine McCann (Netflix)

ifElseThen

@SusieBlue, yes that's a very good point.

Am hoping that in the next 5 - 10 years a girl in her late teens-early 20s will submit DNA to ancestry.com and this will all be resolved.

howamidifferent

Alien abduction?

Plumbthedepths

howamidifferent wrote:

Alien abduction?

Well I have seen it suggested that a large hungry fox took M so why not, equally plausible.

IAMAMORON

SusieBlue wrote: »

I think releasing the uniqueness of the iris of her eye was a huge mistake, made in good faith.
It made her instantly identifiable and a risk to keep, if she was taken.

My own feeling is that regardless of the purpose she was taken, she was probably killed not long after, due to a mixture of the media attention and her eye making her impossible to hide.
That's why no trace of her has been found on any website or no ransom attempts have been made.
That's just my own theory on it.

Sadly you could be very right. Her eye was such a giveaway. The kidnappers would not be in the business of getting caught. Also the fact that her disapearance went global so quickly, they may have decided to do so. I shudder to think, its disgusting.

The Portugese police won't have got everything wrong either. The problem appears to be that they took the wrong direction with their assumptions.

yourdeadwright

SusieBlue wrote: »

So where is she? Where did they hide her body?
They had no car, no smartphones or google maps, and approx. 1.5hrs from the time she would have "died" to when they sat down in the Tapas bar.
So where did they hide her, and if its right under our noses, why haven't her remains been discovered?

No idea ,

She was last seen at 6:30 alarm raised at 10 in between that we have no idea what happened .
You can not rule out anything that seems improbably as long as it is possible,

You can understand why McCann at one stage where suspects if they where not then the police would not be doing there job ,

There is zero evidence she was taken even zero circumstancel evidence ,

Personally I think the McCanns have always been hiding something god knows what but they have told lie's about there time line, I always find it crazy there friend never done an interview to clear things up ,

We shall never know what happened but personally I think it was the parents ,

homosapien91

Finished watching this series last night.

I don't believe the parents had anything to do with her disappearance however I also don't believe for a second that they were checking on the children every 20/30 mins, they were having a few drinks with friends and you don't feel the time slipping by when drinking, when they eventually checked Madeleine was gone and this is something they will have to live with for the rest of their lives. They shouldn't have left the children alone to go out for dinner and drinks and I'm sure they know this themselves.

iamwhoiam

homosapien91 wrote: »

Finished watching this series last night.

I don't believe the parents had anything to do with her disappearance however I also don't believe for a second that they were checking on the children every 20/30 mins, they were having a few drinks with friends and you don't feel the time slipping by when drinking, when they eventually checked Madeleine was gone and this is something they will have to live with for the rest of their lives. They shouldn't have left the children alone to go out for dinner and drinks and I'm sure they know this themselves.

I just watched it and feel the same . The checking was dodgy as was the furtive nature of the group . I think they were covering their backs as they knew they hadn't checked the kids
I think it opened a door for an opportunist to go in an unlocked door and snatch a child
Into a car and long gone before they even missed her
Poor little Madeleine .

gozunda

SusieBlue wrote: »

I don't disagree, but once again, you are pulling up my post when PP just said:

You seem to take issue with my replies but not the posts I'm replying to? I think its fair to ask what PP thinks happened when making such bold, certain statements as the above, no?

No not 'your' posts. As detailed previously what the OP states in a post is clearly speculation. It does not negate any other speculation or scenario. That is the point.

This is what I said previously on this

yes there are all kind of possibilities as to what could have happened.

Both are theories which investigators have looked at as possible. Unfortunately the evidence of one or other scenarios is lacking. Hence we are still discussing this case.

https://touch.boards.ie/thread/2057964455/5/#post109735297

yourdeadwright

As some have said, the fact since they have found millions of disgusting images from these disgusting groups and had there ears on traffickers and all sorts of horrible people and Maddy was never ever mentioned is very odd,

Not a peep about her , would lead me to believe see was never taken to be trafficked

Either a lone wolf or the parents,

I feel a lone wolf would have a harder job pulling it off than the parents would have,

,

SusieBlue

gozunda wrote: »

No not 'your' posts. As detailed previously what the OP states in a post is clearly speculation. It does not negate any other speculation or scenario. That is the point.

This is what I said previously on this



https://touch.boards.ie/thread/2057964455/5/#post109735297

So why don't you point the same out to those who categorically state she wasn't abducted and that her parents were definitively involved?

Its a bit rich that when I post about the abduction theory I'm constantly reminded that there's no proof of one, but when other people definitively state that the evidence of the McCann's guilt and involvement is right under our noses, they're merely "speculating"

IAMAMORON

yourdeadwright wrote: »

As some have said, the fact since they have found millions of disgusting images from these disgusting groups and had there ears on traffickers and all sorts of horrible people and Maddy was never ever mentioned is very odd,

Not a peep about her , would lead me to believe see was never taken to be trafficked

Either a lone wolf or the parents,

I feel a lone wolf would have a harder job pulling it off than the parents would have,

,

Even if there are images which exist of the poor girl, how easy would it be to identify her? If there are a million images available, I wouldn't fancy sifting through them looking for one person. It seems like an impossible task.

chicorytip

yourdeadwright wrote:

I feel a lone wolf would have a harder job pulling it off than the parents would have,

Not if it was a local culprit who had detailed knowledge of the geography of the entire region and could have hidden a body somewhere that would be difficult to discover. This individual would also have been very familiar with the habits and comings and goings of guests at the complex. We know of cases of many missing people here in Ireland, presumed murdered, whose remains will never be discovered unless a perpetrator is arrested and confesses.

Plumbthedepths

IAMAMORON wrote:

Even if there are images which exist of the poor girl, how easy would it be to identify her? If there are a million images available, I wouldn't fancy sifting through them looking for one person. It seems like an impossible task.

Quite easy considering how rare her eye condition is.

ifElseThen

IAMAMORON wrote: »

Even if there are images which exist of the poor girl, how easy would it be to identify her? If there are a million images available, I wouldn't fancy sifting through them looking for one person. It seems like an impossible task.

The police forces would have special tools & programs for this I'd guess, especially with the advent of AI, pattern recognition etc. Her distinct eye especially would help in this.

Still, only 16 of the 1200+ victims of the Wonderland ring were identified.

yourdeadwright

chicorytip wrote: »

Not if it was a local culprit who had detailed knowledge of the geography of the entire region and could have hidden a body somewhere that would be difficult to discover. This individual would also have been very familiar with the habits and comings and goings of guests at the complex. We know of cases of many missing people here in Ireland, presumed murdered, whose remains will never be discovered unless a perpetrator is arrested and confesses.

Staking out the apartment , getting the time correct not to be seen, The child not crying , the twins not crying , not been seen leaving , leaving a car out side or carrying a child that mite cry through town ,
That would not have been easy for one person ,

personally I think it would be easier for the parents, I don't buy they didn't have time, She was last seen at 1830hrs,

And the next morning they went out again on there own before anyone else arrived ,

It was never really mentioned but was there bin collection's In the area?
Didn't the English freelance journo say the road was being dug up outside aswell ?

Not saying this is where she is just asking the question ,

IAMAMORON

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Quite easy considering how rare her eye condition is.

I also thought about the eye, for sure. But can you imagine looking through files and files of jpegs, jpegs of old photo copies etc, looking for a 3 year old girl with a funny looking eye, seriously it would be impossible, where do you start?

iamwhoiam

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Staking out the apartment , getting the time correct not to be seen, The child not crying , the twins not crying , not been seen leaving , leaving a car out side or carrying a child that mite cry through town ,
That would not have been easy for one person ,

personally I think it would be easier for the parents, I don't buy they didn't have time, She was last seen at 1830hrs,

And the next morning they went out again on there own before anyone else arrived ,

It was never really mentioned but was there bin collection's In the area?
Didn't the English freelance journo say the road was being dug up outside aswell ?

Not saying this is where she is just asking the question ,

The big green bins from the Ocean Club and area were emptied at 4 am

Plumbthedepths

IAMAMORON wrote:

I also thought about the eye, for sure. But can you imagine looking through files and files of jpegs, jpegs of old photo copies etc, looking for a 3 year old girl with a funny looking eye, seriously it would be impossible, where do you start?

Not impossible at all, there are software tools available to the authorities to do just that and they have existed for several years.
However I don't believe an image ever will show up as I don't believe she was abducted and even if she were that uniqueness would make her too dangerous to whomever had her.

gozunda

SusieBlue wrote: »

So why don't you point the same out to those who categorically state she wasn't abducted and that her parents were definitively involved?

Those other posts were clearly speculation and have no proof either. They only difference is that those posters didn't post any interrogatories about other scenarios by way of negating them.

Its a bit rich that when I post about the abduction theory I'm constantly reminded that there's no proof of one, but when other people definitively state that the evidence of the McCann's guilt and involvement is right under our noses, they're merely "speculating"

If you read my linked post * - you will see that I categorically state there is no proof of any of these scenarios imo. It's all speculation - yours included. That's the point.

*https://touch.boards.ie/thread/2057964455/5/#post109735297

SusieBlue

gozunda wrote: »

Those posts were clearly speculation and have no proof either. They only difference is that those posters didn't post any interrogatories about other scenarios by way of negating them.



If you read my linked post * - you will see that I categorically state there is no proof of any of these scenarios imo. It's all speculation - yours included. That's the point.

*https://touch.boards.ie/thread/2057964455/5/#post109735297

There’s no point to take because I have already said several times, including in response to yourself, that I accept either scenario is possible.
You don’t need to keep reminding me of the fact.

gozunda

chicorytip wrote: »

Not if it was a local culprit who had detailed knowledge of the geography of the entire region and could have hidden a body somewhere that would be difficult to discover. This individual would also have been very familiar with the habits and comings and goings of guests at the complex. We know of cases of many missing people here in Ireland, presumed murdered, whose remains will never be discovered unless a perpetrator is arrested and confesses.

Presuming murder - Interestingly worldwide the majority of female murder-victims are killed by their family members and not strangers.

py2006

I'm at episode 4 with the sniffer dogs finding her blood in the car and apartment...

It's interesting that the Irish guy (can't remember his name) but is head of the missing children thingy in UK with a high profile background said he "didn't like Gerry".

iamwhoiam

py2006 wrote: »

I'm at episode 4 with the sniffer dogs finding her blood in the car and apartment...

It's interesting that the Irish guy (can't remember his name) but is head of the missing children thingy in UK with a high profile background said he "didn't like Gerry".

I think a lot of people involved in this case might say the same . Gerry comes across as arrogant and superior . My guess is its his personality and he is an unlikable kind of a man

py2006

I always thought that if she was taken by a paedo, he was prob part of (or paid by) a huge international ring. The coverage was so huge that handing her back ran the risk of exposing them. As a result I'd say she was killed off and remains disposed of so could not be found.

If you switch the point of interest to her parents or indeed the fellow doctor friends that night, do we have any evidence she was in the apartment sleeping that night. Could she have disappeared before that??

The White Wolf

On episode 4 and the documentary is very tabloid trash in it's presentation. It's hard for me to look past that and judge objectively.

py2006

iamwhoiam wrote: »

I think a lot of people involved in this case might say the same . Gerry comes across as arrogant and superior . My guess is its his personality and he is an unlikable kind of a man

True but still an odd thing for him in his position to say.

Plumbthedepths

py2006 wrote:

If you switch the point of interest to her parents or indeed the fellow doctor friends that night, do we have any evidence she was in the apartment sleeping that night. Could she have disappeared before that??

No one saw Madeline again after 6.00/6.30 on the 3rd other than Gerry and Kate.

py2006

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

No one saw Madeline again after 6.00/6.30 on the 3rd other than Gerry and Kate.

I wonder when the last sighting of her by others was.

gozunda

SusieBlue wrote: »

There’s no point to take because I have already said several times, including in response to yourself, that I accept either scenario is possible. You don’t need to keep reminding me of the fact.

Well good. And because everyones scenarios are speculation and don't have proof - they dont lead to or answer for questions such as:

So where is she?
Where did they hide her
why haven't her remains been discovered?

Etc etc

Plumbthedepths

py2006 wrote:

I wonder when the last sighting of her by others was.

None that I'm aware of.

SusieBlue

gozunda wrote: »

Well good. And because those scenarios are speculation and don't have proof - they dont lead to or answer for questions such as:

So where is she?
Where did they hide her
why haven't her remains been discovered?

Etc etc

I look forward to seeing similar posts from you towards those who are still definitively stating that her parents are responsible for killing her

py2006

With regards checking the kids, people check in on them to make sure they are still asleep and not up to mischief. They don't check to see if they are still there. I don't find it odd that one of the party didn't enter apartment but merely stood and listened outside.

iamwhoiam

py2006 wrote: »

With regards checking the kids, people check in on them to make sure they are still asleep and not up to mischief. They don't check to see if they are still there. I don't find it odd that one of the party didn't enter apartment but merely stood and listened outside.

I do . Anyone I know checking kids look in and make sure they are comfy and not fallen or vomited or wet etc .

py2006

iamwhoiam wrote: »

I do . Anyone I know checking kids look in and make sure they are comfy and not fallen or vomited or wet etc .

OK, I don't have kids so maybe that's the case.

gozunda

SusieBlue wrote: »

I look forward to seeing similar posts from you towards those who are still definitively stating that her parents are responsible for killing her

I see what you are saying alright, however I thought it was understood that holding an alternative opinion (about what 'might' have happened) doesn't amount "definitively stating" anything about the case though? Even the last posters discussing a specific scenario clarified that and had no idea as to the questions.

Anyway haven't came across any other such interrogatories in other posts yet tbh. Yeah anyone can present their pet theory abour what happened to Madeleine but hitting with a load of whataboutery doesn't really make sense tbh as
there is no proof of any of these scenarios - It's all speculation

So anyway back to the discussion of the documentary proper.

Plumbthedepths

Maybe I missed it but did the programme cover the refusal by Collin Sutton to lead the Mets investigation of the alleged abduction back in 2010. He was informed by telephone by a senior officer and friend his job would be to prove the McCanns innocent and only investigate an abduction. This he claimed on the Martin Brunt programme on Sky is the reasons he refused the job.

Picky owner

Plumbthedepths wrote:

Maybe I missed it but did the programme cover the refusal by Collin Sutton to lead the Mets investigation of the alleged abduction back in 2010. He was informed by telephone by a senior officer and friend his job would be to prove the McCanns innocent and only investigate an abduction. This he claimed on the Martin Brunt programme on Sky is the reasons he refused the job.

Yes, because how could they start afresh with a new investigation with one hand tied behind their back,if any clues or information points towards the McCann's they have to discard it.I am not one for conspiracy theories,but the whole thing stinks,one of the tapas 7 was friends with Gordon Brown who got personally involved,an ex spin doctor employed by them to deal with the media,BBC leaving various items out of news reports,a leading criminal profilers book on the case which pointed to the McCann's banned from Amazon.There is so much out there if you research it that is missing on mainstream media,it is like they dare not suggest they had anything to do with it in fear of libel action.I firmly believe that she died in that apartment that night just do not think their behavior is normal in the aftermath of what happened.

tibruit

iamwhoiam wrote: »

The big green bins from the Ocean Club and area were emptied at 4 am

As far as I can see, if the parents are responsible, this is how the body was disposed of. There was one of these bins close to the apartment. There were other bins that were over large underground containers so that when rubbish was placed in the bin it dropped down to the container below. Everyone was looking for a missing live child on the night and not necessarily a body and the bins weren`t searched adequately.

I don`t think there is any conspiracy here if the parents did it. The more people involved in a conspiracy, the harder it is to keep a lid on it. Technically it`s possible that only one parent knows what really happened. If Madeleine died accidentally and a parent did not want a post mortem for some reason they could have taken the body and placed it one of the bins. You`d only need a few minutes. It probably calls for the parent to be a physchopath, but there`s plenty of them out there. Once the body was hidden in a bin it would have been in landfill before morning.

yourdeadwright

tibruit wrote: »

iamwhoiam wrote: »

The big green bins from the Ocean Club and area were emptied at 4 am

As far as I can see, if the parents are responsible, this is how the body was disposed of. There was one of these bins close to the apartment. There were other bins that were over large underground containers so that when rubbish was placed in the bin it dropped down to the container below. Everyone was looking for a missing live child on the night and not necessarily a body and the bins weren`t searched adequately.

I don`t think there is any conspiracy here if the parents did it. The more people involved in a conspiracy, the harder it is to keep a lid on it. Technically it`s possible that only one parent knows what really happened. If Madeleine died accidentally and a parent did not want a post mortem for some reason they could have taken the body and placed it one of the bins. You`d only need a few minutes. It probably calls for the parent to be a physchopath, but there`s plenty of them out there. Once the body was hidden in a bin it would have been in landfill before morning.

Where is the evidence that the bims where collected at 4am that morning ?
Isnt that a huge thing to be left out of the documentry ?

Picky owner

yourdeadwright wrote:

Where is the evidence that the bims where collected at 4am that morning ? Isnt that a huge thing to be left out of the documentry ?

Watched a Dispatchs program from C4 on YouTube aired about six months after the disappearance,they sent 5 experts over to examine the evidence,the bins were all emptied during the night and the landfill was never checked,another major error by the police.Its well worth a watch.

yourdeadwright

Picky owner wrote: »

yourdeadwright wrote:

Where is the evidence that the bims where collected at 4am that morning ? Isnt that a huge thing to be left out of the documentry ?

Watched a Dispatchs program from C4 on YouTube aired about six months after the disappearance,they sent 5 experts over to examine the evidence,the bins were all emptied during the night and the landfill was never checked,another major error by the police.Its well worth a watch.

Seems like a massive thing not to mention on the documentry

gozunda

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Where is the evidence that the bims where collected at 4am that morning ?
Isnt that a huge thing to be left out of the documentry ?

Do you have a link for the underground bins please ...

fritzelly

gozunda wrote: »

Do you have a link for the underground bins please ...

Tipsy McSwagger

If anyone thinks the McCanns would simply dump their infant daughter into a bin, or throw her in the sea then they must also believe they never gave a sh#t about her in the first place. No parent who loves their child would act in such a way, panic or no panic if they accidentally killed her. Jesus Christ you wouldn’t even do that to your pet dog.

Plumbthedepths

Wasn't the body of a baby found at a recycling centre last year or the year before? Also Quebec City Canada 19 April 2018, Audrey Gagon arrested after the body of her 2 year old daughter Rosalie Gagon found in a bin outside her home. It happens.

chicorytip

tibruit wrote:

I don`t think there is any conspiracy here if the parents did it. The more people involved in a conspiracy, the harder it is to keep a lid on it. Technically it`s possible that only one parent knows what really happened. If Madeleine died accidentally and a parent did not want a post mortem for some reason they could have taken the body and placed it one of the bins. You`d only need a few minutes. It probably calls for the parent to be a physchopath, but there`s plenty of them out there. Once the body was hidden in a bin it would have been in landfill before morning.

A human body, even that of a small child, would be easily detected when emptying a bin and, I assume, the collected waste would first have been brought to a depot to be segregated rather than the entire lot driven directly to a landfill site.
Your theory is highly dubious, to say the least of it.

tibruit

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Where is the evidence that the bims where collected at 4am that morning ?
Isnt that a huge thing to be left out of the documentry ?

Bins were collected every night and there was a large bin just a 90 second walk from the apartment.

tibruit

yourdeadwright wrote: »

Seems like a massive thing not to mention on the documentry

I don`t have Netflix. Did they deal with the Gaspar testimony?

Plumbthedepths

chicorytip wrote:

A human body, even that of a small child, would be easily detected when emptying a bin and, I assume, the collected waste would first have been brought to a depot to be segregated rather than the entire lot driven directly to a landfill site. Your theory is highly dubious, to say the least of it.

Algarvedailynews.com 25th March 2014 gave a figure of 54 per cent of waste going directly to landfill, the figure in 2007 would have been higher.

gozunda

fritzelly wrote: »

'Underground bins'? Where in that video does it mention those?