Why is Waterford left out on a lot of tourist Itinaries

azimuth17

This is getting a bit ridiculous. Waterford and Kilkenny are two different things and always were. We could give a list of things in Waterford, pharma investment, medical devices, medical provision, PhD education and even retail floor space (read relevant development plans) that Kilkenny cannot match. Even Glanbia is spending €300 million on a new plant in Ferrybank. I can see it from my house in Waterford. Waterford city is the biggest urban area in the south east and always has been. Industry ,.trade and commerce has always been our forte. During the hegemony of Waterford Crystal everyone here (retailers and publicans especially) abandoned everything in pursuit of that cash. Everything was geared to it and we simply did not have a tourism product. Kilkenny is a lovely town and played to its strengths in the past generation and has and done well out of it. The closure of Waterford Glass and other business in 2008/2010 hurt Waterford city badly and so we turned to tourism. We did not have a tourism offer before that on any scale other than buses in and out of an evening. Nothing here was geared to it. Almost every thing touristy in Waterford is less than 10 years old, museums etc and Greenway and is getting attention. This all increases south east tourism product. The M9 is direct from Dublin to Waterford too. I did tours for cruise ships a few years ago, and when they leave they mention things (for satisfaction ratings and marketing) they did all across the south east and the company rolls them all up under the heading Waterford! I congratulate the people in Kilkenny on what they have done, but even they will admit that their tourist offering is a relatively recent phenomenon. So why does anyone think that Waterford cannot also do the same? Because all other things being equal, Waterford has the sea and a fine historic offering as well! And if anyone can mention Mount Juliet in the same breath as KIlkenny (the town I mean) then Waterford can mention Dunmore East. I have no problem with people listing things that are bad or sub standard or could be better in Waterford, we are like Cromwell, warts and all, but the trolling and bitter mischief that has passed for comment in parts of this thread helps none of us.

Deiseen

azimuth17 wrote: »

This is getting a bit ridiculous. Waterford and Kilkenny are two different things and always were. We could give a list of things in Waterford, pharma investment, medical devices, medical provision, PhD education and even retail floor space (read relevant development plans) that Kilkenny cannot match. Even Glanbia is spending €300 million on a new plant in Ferrybank. I can see it from my house in Waterford. Waterford city is the biggest urban area in the south east and always has been. Industry ,.trade and commerce has always been our forte. During the hegemony of Waterford Crystal everyone here (retailers and publicans especially) abandoned everything in pursuit of that cash. Everything was geared to it and we simply did not have a tourism product. Kilkenny is a lovely town and played to its strengths in the past generation and has and done well out of it. The closure of Waterford Glass and other business in 2008/2010 hurt Waterford city badly and so we turned to tourism. We did not have a tourism offer before that on any scale other than buses in and out of an evening. Nothing here was geared to it. Almost every thing touristy in Waterford is less than 10 years old, museums etc and Greenway and is getting attention. This all increases south east tourism product. The M9 is direct from Dublin to Waterford too. I did tours for cruise ships a few years ago, and when they leave they mention things (for satisfaction ratings and marketing) they did all across the south east and the company rolls them all up under the heading Waterford! I congratulate the people in Kilkenny on what they have done, but even they will admit that their tourist offering is a relatively recent phenomenon. So why does anyone think that Waterford cannot also do the same? Because all other things being equal, Waterford has the sea and a fine historic offering as well! And if anyone can mention Mount Juliet in the same breath as KIlkenny (the town I mean) then Waterford can mention Dunmore East. I have no problem with people listing things that are bad or sub standard or could be better in Waterford, we are like Cromwell, warts and all, but the trolling and bitter mischief that has passed for comment in parts of this thread helps none of us.

Spot on. I'm currently trying to explain to someone who says that Waterford doesn't have quirky shops or any non-corporate cafes.

Lets talk about where Waterford is lacking (and there are many places where it can improve) but don't make an un-factual statement based on your lack of knowledge.

I'm also struggling to explain to people that Waterford and Kilkenny need each other, Wexford too as it is often forgotten. The three together can off a strong region which will only bring in more tourists. The prominent attitude in Kilkenny is that they are doing well enough without us and that is that. The reality is they don't get as many tourists as they think they do and the tourists that do come, don't actually spend that much money there. That can be improved with a strong regional offering.

Wanderer2010

Deiseen wrote: »

Spot on. I'm currently trying to explain to someone who says that Waterford doesn't have quirky shops or any non-corporate cafes.

Lets talk about where Waterford is lacking (and there are many places where it can improve) but don't make an un-factual statement based on your lack of knowledge.

I'm also struggling to explain to people that Waterford and Kilkenny need each other, Wexford too as it is often forgotten. The three together can off a strong region which will only bring in more tourists. The prominent attitude in Kilkenny is that they are doing well enough without us and that is that. The reality is they don't get as many tourists as they think they do and the tourists that do come, don't actually spend that much money there. That can be improved with a strong regional offering.

Are you throwing that un-factual line at me? By the way, since you are so fond of picking up other people on comments, un-factual isn't actually a word. But well done, slap on the back for you, you corrected someone on the internet, id say your day is complete now.

As for Kilkenny, how on earth do you know how much people spend there? I would love to hear your source on that. They don't need Waterford at all, they have much more tourists coming to visit because the fact is, its a prettier city with less scummy beggars in your face every 2 yards, they have a rake of festivals all year round, its a fantastic place for a stag or hen night and the town doesn't fall asleep after 5pm, unlike Waterford. That's something that Waterford has always struggled with, actually admitting that Kilkenny has a lot more going for it, tourism wise.

Christy Browne

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

Are you throwing that un-factual line at me? By the way, since you are so fond of picking up other people on comments, un-factual isn't actually a word. But well done, slap on the back for you, you corrected someone on the internet, id say your day is complete now.

As for Kilkenny, how on earth do you know how much people spend there? I would love to hear your source on that. They don't need Waterford at all, they have much more tourists coming to visit because the fact is, its a prettier city with less scummy beggars in your face every 2 yards, they have a rake of festivals all year round, its a fantastic place for a stag or hen night and the town doesn't fall asleep after 5pm, unlike Waterford. That's something that Waterford has always struggled with, actually admitting that Kilkenny has a lot more going for it, tourism wise.

There’s literally Fáilte Ireland stats that tell you how many tourists visit a place and how much they spend. Someone will link them here.

Wrong again....

Deiseen

Christy Browne wrote: »

There’s literally Fáilte Ireland stats that tell you how many tourists visit a place and how much they spend. Someone will link them here.

Wrong again....

It's funny how quickly the claws come out isn't. This is just exactly what we are dealing with and it's frustrating to be honest. We are trying to have a mature decent conversation on this topic but you have vested interests who think they are doing themselves (their county?) a service by knocking Waterford.

I wouldn't mind but I haven't said a single bad thing about Kilkenny, I've pointed out some facts but I have not once dissed the place, which I actually think is a really lovely place.

ImAHappyCamper

My two cents worth.My girlfriend(from Limerick) is currently spending her first weekend in Waterford and she's loving it so far. She's a chef and she's from a family of chefs so she's used to good food and she was blown away by the lunch we had in grow hq. We went out to passage east, Loftus hall, Hook head,back to Dunmore East and Tramore. We still haven't been near the copper coast, the greenway, Mahon falls, Coumshingaun, Dungarvan,Ardmore and Lismore. The city isn't perfect and no city is but we have lots of outstanding restaurants, lots of great independent cafes and truly beautiful beaches and scenery around the county. Waterford is alive and well and f*ck the begrudgers.

Deiseen

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

Are you throwing that un-factual line at me? By the way, since you are so fond of picking up other people on comments, un-factual isn't actually a word. But well done, slap on the back for you, you corrected someone on the internet, id say your day is complete now.

As for Kilkenny, how on earth do you know how much people spend there? I would love to hear your source on that. They don't need Waterford at all, they have much more tourists coming to visit because the fact is, its a prettier city with less scummy beggars in your face every 2 yards, they have a rake of festivals all year round, its a fantastic place for a stag or hen night and the town doesn't fall asleep after 5pm, unlike Waterford. That's something that Waterford has always struggled with, actually admitting that Kilkenny has a lot more going for it, tourism wise.

What you said was incorrect. Rather than insult me you should either listen to the facts or stop talking. Most recent tourism stats I can find are 2017:

8. Kilkenny: 315,000 (€55m)
11. Waterford: 255,000 (€69m)

Kilkenny did pull ahead numbers wise in 2017 (was only 10% ahead in 2016 for instance) but the spend in Waterford is still 25% greater, which was roughly the difference for 2016.

Additionally when you look at domestic tourists the trend is reversed where Waterford got more domestic tourists but they spent slightly less.

11. Waterford: 327,000 (€58m)
12. Kilkenny: 298,000 (€69m)

When you combine the two the figures add up to:

553,000 Waterford (€127m)
613,000 Kilkenny (€124m)

So Kilkenny slightly ahead on numbers and Waterford slightly ahead on spend.

So the question you have to ask yourself now is: do you think Kikenny (as such a lovely spot) is doing as well as it could be, considering it gets roughly the same spend and visitors each year as an extremely ugly place with scummy beggars every two yards?

Deiseen

ImAHappyCamper wrote: »

My two cents worth.My girlfriend(from Limerick) is currently spending her first weekend in Waterford and she's loving it so far. She's a chef and she's from a family of chefs so she's used to good food and she was blown away by the lunch we had in grow hq. We went out to passage east, Loftus hall, Hook head,back to Dunmore East and Tramore. We still haven't been near the copper coast, the greenway, Mahon falls, Coumshingaun, Dungarvan,Ardmore and Lismore. The city isn't perfect and no city is but we have lots of outstanding restaurants, lots of great independent cafes and truly beautiful beaches and scenery around the county. Waterford is alive and well and f*ck the begrudgers.

Not everyone who visits a place is going to love it and I do not expect everyone to love Waterford. I have visited plenty of world renowned cities that just haven't done it for me for whatever reason. But I find that a lot of the bad press towards Waterford is either from people who have never been here or have reasons to not like it, such as the thinking that knocking Waterford will benefit their own county somehow when it's actually counter-productive.

Retail in Waterford is extremely poor and for it's size, it is definitely the worst in Ireland. But I will challenge any person who comes on here and says that the Restaurants and Cafes are poor because that is absolute bull crap.

Wanderer2010

Deiseen wrote: »

What you said was incorrect. Rather than insult me you should either listen to the facts or stop talking. Most recent tourism stats I can find are 2017:

8. Kilkenny: 315,000 (€55m)
11. Waterford: 255,000 (€69m)

Kilkenny did pull ahead numbers wise in 2017 (was only 10% ahead in 2016 for instance) but the spend in Waterford is still 25% greater, which was roughly the difference for 2016.

Additionally when you look at domestic tourists the trend is reversed where Waterford got more domestic tourists but they spent slightly less.

11. Waterford: 327,000 (€58m)
12. Kilkenny: 298,000 (€69m)

When you combine the two the figures add up to:

553,000 Waterford (€127m)
613,000 Kilkenny (€124m)

So Kilkenny slightly ahead on numbers and Waterford slightly ahead on spend.

So the question you have to ask yourself now is: do you think Kikenny (as such a lovely spot) is doing as well as it could be, considering it gets roughly the same spend and visitors each year as an extremely ugly place with scummy beggars every two yards?

You do realise that Waterford has a bigger population than Kilkenny right? So your comparison is nonsense. Its the equivalent of me saying Dublin makes more money off tourism so therefore the Greenway is a failure...
Oh and yes Waterford has a very big beggar problem in the middle of the city every day people are getting hassled for money and having lunatics shout at them from megaphones. And not a single Guard to be found.

Christy Browne

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

You do realise that Waterford has a bigger population than Kilkenny right? So your comparison is nonsense. Its the equivalent of me saying Dublin makes more money off tourism so therefore the Greenway is a failure...
Oh and yes Waterford has a very big beggar problem in the middle of the city every day people are getting hassled for money and having lunatics shout at them from megaphones. And not a single Guard to be found.

What does an area’s population have to do with how many tourists it brings in? A minute ago you were saying Kilkenny brings in much more tourists now it’s Waterford’s population that means they’re similar. Nice moving of the goalposts there.

How many live down around the Cliffs of Moher or the Ring of Kerry again?

Deiseen

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

You do realise that Waterford has a bigger population than Kilkenny right? So your comparison is nonsense. Its the equivalent of me saying Dublin makes more money off tourism so therefore the Greenway is a failure...
Oh and yes Waterford has a very big beggar problem in the middle of the city every day people are getting hassled for money and having lunatics shout at them from megaphones. And not a single Guard to be found.

I don't think population has much to do with it. Galway City has the 4th highest population of an urban centre in Ireland but has the 2nd highest number of tourists. Kerry likewise has the 4th highest number of visitors but is the 15th largest county in Ireland so there inst much correlation between population and tourist numbers.

As Christy said below, you are moving the goal posts here.You are not facing up to the fact that the South East as a whole is way behind on tourism, and that includes Kilkenny. I can provide you the stats for the region too if you want, and they are bad, but I have a feeling you won't even bother to try and absorb the facts.

Wanderer2010

Deiseen wrote: »

I don't think population has much to do with it. Galway City has the 4th highest population of an urban centre in Ireland but has the 2nd highest number of tourists. Kerry likewise has the 4th highest number of visitors but is the 15th largest county in Ireland so there inst much correlation between population and tourist numbers.

As Christy said below, you are moving the goal posts here.You are not facing up to the fact that the South East as a whole is way behind on tourism, and that includes Kilkenny. I can provide you the stats for the region too if you want, and they are bad, but I have a feeling you won't even bother to try and absorb the facts.

I noticed you never mentioned any comment on my fact that people are constantly hassled and annoyed by the beggars and preachers in Waterford city, something I very rarely experienced in Kilkenny .Plus there is an abysmal Garda presence in Waterford city when you need them, cant you see that or is that too uncomfortable a fact for you?

Deiseen

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

I noticed you never mentioned any comment on my fact that people are constantly hassled and annoyed by the beggars and preachers in Waterford city, something I very rarely experienced in Kilkenny .Plus there is an abysmal Garda presence in Waterford city when you need them, cant you see that or is that too uncomfortable a fact for you?

It's not as bad as you are making out but yes there is definitely a problem. I've also experienced this problem in Cork, Dublin, Limerick and Galway. Also true in most/all other urban centres of a certain size. The bigger the population then the more likely it is that you get unsavoury characters, such is life. Kilkenny is lucky in this regard as it's low population means it doesn't suffer from any of the major consequences of a larger urban centre.

The Garda issue you will have to take up with An Garda Síochána or the Government, don't see how you can use that as a stick to beat Waterford with seeing as it's a fairly national issue.

Also, you haven't addressed a single point I have raised, just tried to insult me/get one up on me. For the record I have not insulted you or Kilkenny once, if you feel like I am insulting you, then I am sorry but I think that's on you.

Wanderer2010

Deiseen wrote: »

It's not as bad as you are making out but yes there is definitely a problem. I've also experienced this problem in Cork, Dublin, Limerick and Galway. Also true in most/all other urban centres of a certain size. The bigger the population then the more likely it is that you get unsavoury characters, such is life. Kilkenny is lucky in this regard as it's low population means it doesn't suffer from any of the major consequences of a larger urban centre.

The Garda issue you will have to take up with An Garda Síochána or the Government, don't see how you can use that as a stick to beat Waterford with seeing as it's a fairly national issue.

Also, you haven't addressed a single point I have raised, just tried to insult me/get one up on me. For the record I have not insulted you or Kilkenny once, if you feel like I am insulting you, then I am sorry but I think that's on you.

Ah here I give up. Read back what I bolded will you and try and have a word with yourself. I never said Waterford was awful, I merely pointed out that Kilkenny currently has much more going for it for tourists. Out.

MoashoaM

Aggressive beggars should be detained, but I don't see the rest as much of a problem. Perhaps give preachers a designated soapbox corner? I recommend chapel lane.

Deiseen

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

Ah here I give up. Read back what I bolded will you and try and have a word with yourself. I never said Waterford was awful, I merely pointed out that Kilkenny currently has much more going for it for tourists. Out.

Oh is that all you meant?!?!

Jesus, I think you had us all going there!

Are you from Waterford btw?

Deiseen

MoashoaM wrote: »

Aggressive beggars should be detained, but I don't see the rest as much of a problem. Perhaps give preachers a designated soapbox corner? I recommend chapel lane.

I don't think you've come across this preacher then... they are trying to create by-laws to deal with him

Harry Palmr

Happily the retial shortfall is being addressed big time.

alta stare

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

Ah here I give up. Read back what I bolded will you and try and have a word with yourself. I never said Waterford was awful, I merely pointed out that Kilkenny currently has much more going for it for tourists. Out.

But it doesnt. People go to see the castle and that is pretty much it. Some go visit St Canices. After that there isnt much left to visit. I know this as i lived there. Kilkenny is centred around 1 long stretch of road which goes from St Canices to the castle. There isnt much else going on anywhere else.

If you go further afield you have Kells Priory, Jerpoint Abbey, Mout Juilet, ........thats it really.

Kilkenny is small and well marketed at the tourist industry. Without that castle kilkenny would not be what it is.

If it was as popular and as busy as some people think it is then why in gods name have they only a handful of hotels there just as Waterford has.

Both places have things to do both are nice to visit and fortunately for Kilkenny they have got the tourist thing correct but to suggest it has more to offer than Waterford is nonsense.

Wanderer2010

alta stare wrote: »

But it doesnt. People go to see the castle and that is pretty much it. Some go visit St Canices. After that there isnt much left to visit. I know this as i lived there. Kilkenny is centred around 1 long stretch of road which goes from St Canices to the castle. There isnt much else going on anywhere else.

If you go further afield you have Kells Priory, Jerpoint Abbey, Mout Juilet, ........thats it really.

Kilkenny is small and well marketed at the tourist industry. Without that castle kilkenny would not be what it is.

If it was as popular and as busy as some people think it is then why in gods name have they only a handful of hotels there just as Waterford has.

Both places have things to do both are nice to visit and fortunately for Kilkenny they have got the tourist thing correct but to suggest it has more to offer than Waterford is nonsense.

To be fair that's still a lot of things you mentioned though and it depends on what is most popular for tourists here in Waterford. Yes the Viking Triangle of Crystal and Bishops Palace and Museum is very good but it can be quite spread out, so you have to head into town for more or out to Tramore and Dunmore East if you want more.

Some people may love shops or interesting cafes and I much prefer the cafes in Kilkenny, they have a lot of character and in the summer, you cant beat people watching in the middle of the street! Yes the castle is a big thing but theres also that craft store across from the castle which draws in a lot as well. I think Kilkenny have a few very decent hotels to be fair for the size. Lyrath, Hotel Kilkenny, Springhill, Aspect.

Deiseen

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Happily the retial shortfall is being addressed big time.

Biiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiig Time!

Joking aside, and I'm not being spiteful or resentful here but if it does happen then I really worry about retail in Kilkenny. It will suck the life out from it.

yuridwyer

alta stare wrote: »

But it doesnt. People go to see the castle and that is pretty much it. Some go visit St Canices. After that there isnt much left to visit. I know this as i lived there. Kilkenny is centred around 1 long stretch of road which goes from St Canices to the castle. There isnt much else going on anywhere else.

If you go further afield you have Kells Priory, Jerpoint Abbey, Mout Juilet, ........thats it really.

Kilkenny is small and well marketed at the tourist industry. Without that castle kilkenny would not be what it is.

If it was as popular and as busy as some people think it is then why in gods name have they only a handful of hotels there just as Waterford has.

Both places have things to do both are nice to visit and fortunately for Kilkenny they have got the tourist thing correct but to suggest it has more to offer than Waterford is nonsense.

Without Messi Barcelona wouldn't be half as good either...

Lads, I don't think people dispute that Waterford has a lot of stuff that has the potential to bring in tourists in bigger numbers, but the fact is Waterford does not market itself like Kilkenny, Galway, Cork etc. As a city, it's just not that appealling to tourists, and you're right, it doesn't have an anchor like Kilkenny has with the castle, so Kilkenny has an obvious advantage there. But, Kilkenny works hard at promoting itself (practically a festival every week), and maybe with time (and a bit of much needed vision) Waterford can translate itself into a city which matches the appeal of the attractions of Waterford County

Deiseen

yuridwyer wrote: »

Without Messi Barcelona wouldn't be half as good either...

Lads, I don't think people dispute that Waterford has a lot of stuff that has the potential to bring in tourists in bigger numbers, but the fact is Waterford does not market itself like Kilkenny, Galway, Cork etc. As a city, it's just not that appealling to tourists, and you're right, it doesn't have an anchor like Kilkenny has with the castle, so Kilkenny has an obvious advantage there. But, Kilkenny works hard at promoting itself (practically a festival every week), and maybe with time (and a bit of much needed vision) Waterford can translate itself into a city which matches the appeal of the attractions of Waterford County

Could someone actually list out the festivals cause in KK as Waterford actually has lots now, it's something the council have worked very hard on and fair play to them.

Off the top of my head it's:

1. Winterval
2. Spraoi + ATN
3. Daytripper
4. Harvest Festival
5. 1848 Tricolour Fest
6. Retro Fest
7. Japanese Film Festival
8. Imagine
9. John Dwyer Trad Fest

alta stare

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

To be fair that's still a lot of things you mentioned though and it depends on what is most popular for tourists here in Waterford. Yes the Viking Triangle of Crystal and Bishops Palace and Museum is very good but it can be quite spread out, so you have to head into town for more or out to Tramore and Dunmore East if you want more.

Some people may love shops or interesting cafes and I much prefer the cafes in Kilkenny, they have a lot of character and in the summer, you cant beat people watching in the middle of the street! Yes the castle is a big thing but theres also that craft store across from the castle which draws in a lot as well. I think Kilkenny have a few very decent hotels to be fair for the size. Lyrath, Hotel Kilkenny, Springhill, Aspect.

Yes and i did not mention what Waterford has to offer as there is too much to be honest. All swings and roundabouts really. If Waterford got marketed the way it should be then it would be pulling in many more visitors.

Of course they have nice hotels sure so does Waterford so does most places in Ireland. You and others are giving off an impression that Kilkenny is really busy and full of tourists and my point is that if it was then why isnt there a load of hotels? There isnt as there isnt a need for them. Same with Waterford.

alta stare

yuridwyer wrote: »

Without Messi Barcelona wouldn't be half as good either...

Lads, I don't think people dispute that Waterford has a lot of stuff that has the potential to bring in tourists in bigger numbers, but the fact is Waterford does not market itself like Kilkenny, Galway, Cork etc. As a city, it's just not that appealling to tourists, and you're right, it doesn't have an anchor like Kilkenny has with the castle, so Kilkenny has an obvious advantage there. But, Kilkenny works hard at promoting itself (practically a festival every week), and maybe with time (and a bit of much needed vision) Waterford can translate itself into a city which matches the appeal of the attractions of Waterford County

Kilkenny would be not much bigger than Thomastown if they did not have that Castle.

Wanderer2010

alta stare wrote: »

Yes and i did not mention what Waterford has to offer as there is too much to be honest. All swings and roundabouts really. If Waterford got marketed the way it should be then it would be pulling in many more visitors.

Of course they have nice hotels sure so does Waterford so does most places in Ireland. You and others are giving off an impression that Kilkenny is really busy and full of tourists and my point is that if it was then why isnt there a load of hotels? There isnt as there isnt a need for them. Same with Waterford.

I don't know. You could argue Waterford have too many hotels. You have the Bridge and Dooleys and Granville and the Tower all within a mile. Oh, the Fitzwilton as well so that's 5 very close to each other. Then you have the Marina, TravelLodge, the Viking as well, so a huge amount of hotels for our needs. You could probably argue that the Tower is required because of the Viking but a few of them could be done without and nobody would notice.

Deiseen

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

I don't know. You could argue Waterford have too many hotels. You have the Bridge and Dooleys and Granville and the Tower all within a mile. Oh, the Fitzwilton as well so that's 5 very close to each other. Then you have the Marina, TravelLodge, the Viking as well, so a huge amount of hotels for our needs. You could probably argue that the Tower is required because of the Viking but a few of them could be done without and nobody would notice.

The Tower are currently undergoing a big redevelopment and there are plans for two more hotels in the city due to the shortage.

Sorry to say it now but what do you actually base your opinions on? Do you just dream them up while people watching in Kilkenny?

alta stare

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

I don't know. You could argue Waterford have too many hotels. You have the Bridge and Dooleys and Granville and the Tower all within a mile. Oh, the Fitzwilton as well so that's 5 very close to each other. Then you have the Marina, TravelLodge, the Viking as well, so a huge amount of hotels for our needs. You could probably argue that the Tower is required because of the Viking but a few of them could be done without and nobody would notice.

Really?? You think that some of them could be done away with?? They are all tipping away nicely so i dont know how you think no one notice.

Wanderer2010

alta stare wrote: »

Really?? You think that some of them could be done away with?? They are all tipping away nicely so i dont know how you think no one notice.

But for the amount of hotels in a short space, you could argue you don't really need all of them. And its the same in Kilkenny, I never saw the need for the Aspect when its so close to other hotels. Im sure they all do well but the point about the population and number hotels means it is a bit over filled when it comes to hotels.

alta stare

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

But for the amount of hotels in a short space, you could argue you don't really need all of them. And its the same in Kilkenny, I never saw the need for the Aspect when its so close to other hotels. Im sure they all do well but the point about the population and number hotels means it is a bit over filled when it comes to hotels.

If they do well then why would they close? If you had a shop which was doing well would you close just because another similiar shop opened near by??? No you wouldnt. Im sorry but you are being silly on this.

There are hotels there because they are needed. Simple really. Plenty of cities across the world with alot more hotels in close proximity to one another.