Electric scooters on the Dart

JaimeB

High everyone.

Is it possible to get in the dart at peak hours with an electric scooter? I have read that foldable bikes are allowed, but no info about scooters which fold too, but are a bit more long than foldable bikes.

Thanks!

Victor

I would exercise discretion. Will your scooter prevent other people getting on or otherwise inconvenience people? Note that the rear of a scooter won't be visible in a crowded carriage and poses a trip hazard.

Are there folding scooters?

Birneybau

High,

Please don't

arybvtcw0eolkf

If its the scooters which can be folded and stored/held vertically I wouldn't think twice about it.

JaimeB

Yes, one of those folding scooters.

arybvtcw0eolkf

JaimeB wrote: »

Yes, one of those folding scooters.

Sure they take up no more floor space than a shopping bag, I'd take it onboard and not think twice about it.

Del2005

Laylah Repulsive Fencer wrote: »

Sure they take up no more floor space than a shopping bag, I'd take it onboard and not think twice about it.

A shopping trolley isn't a vehicle which requires tax, insurance, licence and a helmet to use in a public place.

strandroad

Mind the wheels though, I saw a person get quite a bit of muck on their light coat from a fellow commuter's folded scooter, they didn't ask them for dry cleaning costs but they could have as it was quite bad. You could ruin someone's day or appointment.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Del2005 wrote: »

A shopping trolley isn't a vehicle which requires tax, insurance, licence and a helmet to use in a public place.

Neither is an electric scooter which the OP is asking about.

Victor

Laylah Repulsive Fencer wrote: »

Neither is an electric scooter which the OP is asking about.

They are mechanically-propelled vehicles and do need those things.

wonski

Victor wrote: »

They are mechanically-propelled vehicles and do need those things.

How do you tax electric scooter?

Do you get the registration plates etc?

mikeecho

wonski wrote: »

How do you tax electric scooter?

The same way you tax an electric car or bike

wonski wrote: »

Do you get the registration plates etc?

Yes


You'll also need insurance... And a drivers licence.

wonski

mikeecho wrote: »

The same way you tax an electric car or bike



Yes


And ShOcK hORrOR... You'll also need insurance

All good, but I cant see it any different from any other bicycle with similar weight etc.

Risk would be similar, too.

That is if we are talking about the same thing.

I think that scooter is not 50cc equivalent, more like a toy with battery. Stand to be corrected.

Nice ninja edit there Mike

I didn't even ask about insurance

Victor

wonski wrote: »

I think that scooter is not 50cc equivalent, more like a toy with battery. Stand to be corrected.

OP is talking about an electric scooter that you stand on, not sit on (an electric motorbike), although legally, there is little difference.

wonski

Victor wrote: »

OP is talking about an electric scooter that you stand on, not sit on (an electric motorbike), although legally, there is little difference.

Can't see this thing having number plates front and back and any space for tax disc tbh.

Not to mention trying to insure it

Victor

wonski wrote: »

Can't see this thing having number plates front and back and any space for tax disc tbh.

Not to mention trying to insure it

Fair enough, but that doesn't remove the requirement to have them. If I'm correct, motorbikes aren't required to display disks, just that they need to comply with the principal requirements.

If motor insurance is difficult to come by, then there is a procedure for nominating a motor insurer to give a quote. That the quote might be very large doesn't change the obligation to have motor insurance.

Manic Moran

Victor wrote: »

Fair enough, but that doesn't remove the requirement to have them. If I'm correct, motorbikes aren't required to display disks, just that they need to comply with the principal requirements.

If motor insurance is difficult to come by, then there is a procedure for nominating a motor insurer to give a quote. That the quote might be very large doesn't change the obligation to have motor insurance.

I think your question is really more to the matter of "Is it a motor vehicle?"

I see where you're coming from, but if all you need is a motor and wheels to fall under the purview of requirements, then the Gardai would have a field day nabbing these for no tax, registration, underage, unlicensed driver, etc...



Doing a quick search for Segway tour operators in Dublin, they don't have license plates displayed either.

Victor

Dude, what time is it there?

Manic Moran wrote: »

I think your question is really more to the matter of "Is it a motor vehicle?"

Yes. http://www.rsa.ie/Documents/VS_Information_Notes/Two_Three_Wheeled_Vehicles/FAQs%20on%20Segways%20or%20Powered%20Transporters.pdf

I see where you're coming from, but if all you need is a motor and wheels to fall under the purview of requirements, then the Gardai would have a field day nabbing these for no tax, registration, underage, unlicensed driver, etc...

If only the Garda would pay attention to them. Segway provided the Garda with some free vehicles.

Doing a quick search for Segway tour operators in Dublin, they don't have license plates displayed either.

Only tours I could find (several dud links) are in the Phoenix Park (private property run by OPW, not council), Waterford Greenway (Waterford council) and Lough Key Forest & Activity Park (Coillte and Roscommon County Council).

https://www.google.com/search?q=Segway+tour+operators+in+Dublin&rlz=1C1CHBF_enIE704IE704&oq=Segway+tour+operators+in+Dublin&aqs=chrome..69i57.607j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8

corcaigh07

Victor, I find these annoying as well but you know fully well that nobody is taxing or insuring their electric scooters (yet) so stop playing dumb for an argument.

BeerNut

Manic Moran wrote: »

I see where you're coming from, but if all you need is a motor and wheels to fall under the purview of requirements, then the Gardai would have a field day nabbing these for no tax, registration, underage, unlicensed driver, etc...

You can legally use an unregistered vehicle as much as you like when you're on the lawn next to your swimming pool. It's when that lad goes on a public road he quite rightly becomes a concern of the Gardaí.

caviardreams

I have noticed this creeping in - people storing folder scooters horizontally on the floor in the standing areas whilst their owners are sitting elsewhere down the carriage. A few days ago I was standing beside one in the carriage and when I had to move aside to let other people by I tripped over it, and the scooter itself moved a bit across the carriage. They can be quite hazardous so personally if I was bringing one on myself, I think the owner should stay beside it to keep watch for any H&S issues/hazards.

Personally, I think it is a bit much to take up a seat *and* significant standing room (two people could easily fit standing in the space they take up when horizontal) on a peak-time busy DART service but that's just my approach to etiquette and is subjective I guess.

loyatemu

whether they need tax insurance etc. has no bearing on whether the OP can carry one onto the Dart.

I'd just fold it up and bring it on, it's just luggage. I see people with them on the train, they're less bulky than a folding bike.

arybvtcw0eolkf

These scooters use a battery powered motor, just the same as hybrid bicycles.

They don't require tax, guess why?.. Because motor tax is based on the emissions of your vehicles engine (except in the case of motorbikes, which all pay the same tax of €88 per year).

The battery powered motor on these scooters emit no emissions.

Stop making things up. They don't require a helmet, licence etc etc either

L1011

There has been a motor tax rate for electric vehicles since the early 90s if not much earlier (milk floats etc were electric from the 50s)

bullpost

caviardreams wrote: »

I have noticed this creeping in - people storing folder scooters horizontally on the floor in the standing areas whilst their owners are sitting elsewhere down the carriage. A few days ago I was standing beside one in the carriage and when I had to move aside to let other people by I tripped over it, and the scooter itself moved a bit across the carriage. They can be quite hazardous so personally if I was bringing one on myself, I think the owner should stay beside it to keep watch for any H&S issues/hazards.

Personally, I think it is a bit much to take up a seat *and* significant standing room (two people could easily fit standing in the space they take up when horizontal) on a peak-time busy DART service but that's just my approach to etiquette and is subjective I guess.

Its for this reason bikes are banned during peak periods, so I think the same should apply here.

TheChizler

Laylah Repulsive Fencer wrote: »

These scooters use a battery powered motor, just the same as hybrid bicycles.

They don't require tax, guess why?.. Because motor tax is based on the emissions of your vehicles engine (except in the case of motorbikes, which all pay the same tax of €88 per year).

The battery powered motor on these scooters emit no emissions.

Stop making things up. They don't require a helmet, licence etc etc either

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/consumer/electric-scooters-could-save-time-and-money-but-they-remain-illegal-1.3832654

Markcheese

Laylah Repulsive Fencer wrote: »

These scooters use a battery powered motor, just the same as hybrid bicycles.

They don't require tax, guess why?.. Because motor tax is based on the emissions of your vehicles engine (except in the case of motorbikes, which all pay the same tax of €88 per year).

The battery powered motor on these scooters emit no emissions.

Stop making things up. They don't require a helmet, licence etc etc either

Electric cars pay road tax,
Some e scooters require you to scoot get going, could be classed as electrically assisted.. Maybe
Helmets would be smart.. But if its the same as a bike not compulsory...

I don't think é scooters are causing huge traffic disruption, or social chaos, they're more public transport friendly and portable than bikes, If they help keep traffic off the streets, more power to their users..
Yeah if guys use them poorly, they deserve a bollixing, but there are always some jerks..

d15ude

Laylah Repulsive Fencer wrote: »

Stop making things up. They don't require a helmet, licence etc etc either

They are unregulated in Ireland atm:

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/rsa-to-examine-regulation-of-electric-scooters-1.3804729

Thor

Most Electric Scooters require you to kick off to start going. This classifies them as assisted and not propelled.

Also just to note. Tax office, insurance companies and license department all state that without a reg plate nothing requires tax or can be insured from a motor insurance company.

Three ireland Sell the Mii Scooter and do require proof that you have a license, but they have stated directly that is just to cover themselves and not because the law requires it.

Like a lot of things in Ireland, the law is very behind and doesn't directly take not of these types of devices, but currently under law as it stands. They do NOT require tax, insurance or a license, and thank god they don't. Let's hope this thread can get back on track.

Take it on the dart. It won't be a problem if it folds up.

Dial Hard

Thor wrote: »

Like a lot of things in Ireland, the law is very behind and doesn't directly take not of these types of devices, but currently under law as it stands. They do NOT require tax, insurance or a license, and thank god they don't.

According to the Irish Times article that was linked a few posts up, under Irish law they are considered "mechanically propelled vehicles" and as such require a licence, tax and insurance. But, this being Ireland, it's not actually possible to tax or insure them.

Shane Ross has asked the RSA to research how they're regulated in other countries but I wouldn't be holding my breath waiting for any change to their legal status.

But, as you say, none of this discussion has any bearing on whether or not they're allowed on the DART.

Victor

Thor wrote: »

Most Electric Scooters require you to kick off to start going. This classifies them as assisted and not propelled.

That's a very nuanced view.