Random Fitness Questions

Brian?

SuprSi wrote: »

Yes, similar programme for all major muscle groups, to failure, once a week. And yes, I do those 3 big lifts in one session.

So the general consensus seems to be that I should do a smaller group of exercises per muscle group, but more than once a week, with different combinations of set/reps on each day? I very much appreciate the advice

As a matter of interest, where did you get your workout from?

There was some study out about ho the same vol over more days was better than 1 day. Uh iirc. Anyway yes do more days

Mr. CooL ICE

bluewolf wrote: »

There was some study out about ho the same vol over more days was better than 1 day. Uh iirc. Anyway yes do more days

Norwegian Frequency Project

SuprSi

Brian? wrote: »

As a matter of interest, where did you get your workout from?

I workout with a Polish guy who's quite a bit bigger (and stronger) than me, and this is what he's always done. I'll have a chat with him on Monday though, see if we can ring the changes

Brian?

Mark Rippetoe wrote: »

Norwegian Frequency Project

Their 2nd album was a real let down.

D'Agger

So I did a good deadlift set yesterday (for my standards), I did plenty warm up but the set was essentially:

1x8 60KG
1x8 80KG
2x5 120kg
1x8 80KG
1x8 60kg

That's a new best for myself weight wise doing 120KG, previously had only hit 110kg but wondering if people think I should perhaps be doing more reps before going to that max weight I can hit, or add one set of 5 at 100kg maybe? My upper back is pretty sore today, from googling this is apparently normal when lifting heavier weights and I'd imagine my problem may be that I wasn't engaging my lats enough, though I do but would be interested to hear what folks here recommend, perhaps I should be sticking do doing 4x8 80KG to get form better before looking to push past the 100KG mark again to get form down, I haven't had this type of upper back pain previously so perhaps my form just let me down on this occasion?

Finally, if I run through the movement, my back is actually sore putting the imaginary weight down, perhaps this may have caused it

I go 60x3 80x2 100x1 110x1 120x whatever
So yes i think do a couple reps at 100

No idea about the back

Alf Veedersane

D'Agger wrote: »

So I did a good deadlift set yesterday (for my standards), I did plenty warm up but the set was essentially:

1x8 60KG
1x8 80KG
2x5 120kg
1x8 80KG
1x8 60kg

That's a new best for myself weight wise doing 120KG, previously had only hit 110kg but wondering if people think I should perhaps be doing more reps before going to that max weight I can hit, or add one set of 5 at 100kg maybe? My upper back is pretty sore today, from googling this is apparently normal when lifting heavier weights and I'd imagine my problem may be that I wasn't engaging my lats enough, though I do but would be interested to hear what folks here recommend, perhaps I should be sticking do doing 4x8 80KG to get form better before looking to push past the 100KG mark again to get form down, I haven't had this type of upper back pain previously so perhaps my form just let me down on this occasion?

Finally, if I run through the movement, my back is actually sore putting the imaginary weight down, perhaps this may have caused it

Whatever works but my own experience is that the top sets don't move as well if there hasn't been enough warm-up volume. There's a balance because you don't want to use up too much energy warming up but you don't want to be going at your top sets relatively cold. There's room for a set with 100kg there.

Without seeing what you're doing its hard to say what the upper back pain is from.

shutup

During my last few work outs I have had to stop half way through because I’m getting very heavy, dull head aches centred around forehead and front of head.
I’m doing body weight circuits and feeling great other wise and had being improving reps etc until the headache kicks in. It feels like I’ve bust a blood vessel and my head is filling up!
Is this common enough or a sign for anything?
Thanks

Dtp1979

shutup wrote: »

During my last few work outs I have had to stop half way through because I’m getting very heavy, dull head aches centred around forehead and front of head.
I’m doing body weight circuits and feeling great other wise and had being improving reps etc until the headache kicks in. It feels like I’ve bust a blood vessel and my head is filling up!
Is this common enough or a sign for anything?
Thanks

It’s a sign you should go to the doctor,
Seriously

Mr. CooL ICE

D'Agger wrote: »

So I did a good deadlift set yesterday (for my standards), I did plenty warm up but the set was essentially:

1x8 60KG
1x8 80KG
2x5 120kg
1x8 80KG
1x8 60kg

That's a new best for myself weight wise doing 120KG, previously had only hit 110kg but wondering if people think I should perhaps be doing more reps before going to that max weight I can hit, or add one set of 5 at 100kg maybe? My upper back is pretty sore today, from googling this is apparently normal when lifting heavier weights and I'd imagine my problem may be that I wasn't engaging my lats enough, though I do but would be interested to hear what folks here recommend, perhaps I should be sticking do doing 4x8 80KG to get form better before looking to push past the 100KG mark again to get form down, I haven't had this type of upper back pain previously so perhaps my form just let me down on this occasion?

Finally, if I run through the movement, my back is actually sore putting the imaginary weight down, perhaps this may have caused it

When you say upper back, you mean the upper end of your lats? Or your traps? If it's your traps, then you are probably shrugging your shoulders, which you shouldn't do.

D'Agger

Mark Rippetoe wrote: »

When you say upper back, you mean the upper end of your lats? Or your traps? If it's your traps, then you are probably shrugging your shoulders, which you shouldn't do.

Thoracic area of my back, fairly central as though its my spine, though my traps are a bit sore, I reckon that's from different exercises from a different session.

I read that with heavier weights you can tend to over extend your thoracic spine when straightening up due to load which may explain it. I'm not in mad pain, just a bit of an ache that I'm aware of all day. I do reckon my form wasn't great for a few of the heavier lifts, hamstrings are a bit sore today but my glutes seem fine which shouldn't really be the case I think

Alf Veedersane

One possibility is that you're not externally rotating your shoulders to 'pack' your lats. Which then pulls your shoulders forward and your upper back will round during the lift.

But it could be several things based on what you said.

Brian?

shutup wrote: »

During my last few work outs I have had to stop half way through because I’m getting very heavy, dull head aches centred around forehead and front of head.
I’m doing body weight circuits and feeling great other wise and had being improving reps etc until the headache kicks in. It feels like I’ve bust a blood vessel and my head is filling up!
Is this common enough or a sign for anything?
Thanks

Mod note: this sounds like a medical issue. Please see a doctor.

Can I ask that no one gives advise beyond that please

.......

I am a woman and my shoulder flexibility is very poor. I am working on it with stretches and mobility exercises.

My overhead press was always very weak. In fact, the first time I overhead pressed I ran out of steam after about 3 reps with 2kg dumbells.

I have improved since then but, Ive been stuck at 17kg for the LONGEST time now (12kg bar with 2.5kg on either side).

Its like my muscles just go weak super quick doing it. The first set (10 reps) is fine, the second is more of a challenge and often in the 3rd set I stop at 7 reps (knackered from it), rest a bit, and then squeeze out 3 more.

I only overhead press once a week. Im not too worried about being able to press loads of weight, but I am curious as to how/why I go to failure so quickly with it compared to other exercises.

Alf Veedersane

....... wrote: »

I am a woman and my shoulder flexibility is very poor. I am working on it with stretches and mobility exercises.

My overhead press was always very weak. In fact, the first time I overhead pressed I ran out of steam after about 3 reps with 2kg dumbells.

I have improved since then but, Ive been stuck at 17kg for the LONGEST time now (12kg bar with 2.5kg on either side).

Its like my muscles just go weak super quick doing it. The first set (10 reps) is fine, the second is more of a challenge and often in the 3rd set I stop at 7 reps (knackered from it), rest a bit, and then squeeze out 3 more.

I only overhead press once a week. Im not too worried about being able to press loads of weight, but I am curious as to how/why I go to failure so quickly with it compared to other exercises.

They're small muscles so they will fatigue quicker.

Progress will likely be slow but stick with it.

caviardreams

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

They're small muscles so they will fatigue quicker.

+1
I am a female too and can empathise completely - I have done so much work on my OHP and progress is still tiny.

I just looked back on an old thread from 2 years and 8 months ago
https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?p=100538307

In August 2016 I just hit 10kg DBs for 4 sets of 6

Last week I just about managed 5 sets of 6 with 15kg DBs (some grinders in there for sure)
In the intervening period I have been OHP with either DBs or a bar twice most weeks along with a good bit of shoulder accessory work.
I also find my capacity/performance varies a lot more than other lifts e.g. when I am more tired the reps I can hit suffer a lot so it can be a bit up and down more than other lifts.

Feels like very slow progress but it is still progress! Stick with it

beertons

Can I just say since I've seen this thread, I've reduced my reps to 8 and I'm lifting more. Thank you.

Alf Veedersane

Reps4jesus wrote: »

getting shoulder pain on one side when doing chin ups, any thoughts on whats most likely causing it and how to clear it up?

Definitely palms facing you?

It'd be more common on pull ups with palms out and it'd likely be rotator cuff aggravation.

Reps4jesus

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

Definitely palms facing you?

It'd be more common on pull ups with palms out and it'd likely be rotator cuff aggravation.

Its actually with a neutral grip. Heavy pull downs or any other pulling movement doesnt cause this, its just something on this movement that my shoulder doesnt like.

.......

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

They're small muscles so they will fatigue quicker.

caviardreams wrote: »

+1
I am a female too and can empathise completely - I have done so much work on my OHP and progress is still tiny.

Cheers guys.

I might switch to dumbbells for a change. I forgot that I stopped doing OHP for ages last year due to a shoulder injury.

Alf Veedersane

Reps4jesus wrote: »

Its actually with a neutral grip. Heavy pull downs or any other pulling movement doesnt cause this, its just something on this movement that my shoulder doesnt like.

I had the same with dips. A long time shoulder problem and assumed it was down to benching. Eventually worked out it was dips, for whatever reason, and dropped them.

No more pain.

Reps4jesus

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

I had the same with dips. A long time shoulder problem and assumed it was down to benching. Eventually worked out it was dips, for whatever reason, and dropped them.

No more pain.

Yeah think i will take the same route on these

Blacktie.

Anyone have some upper body only recommendations? No back loading and overhead press is off the table right now.

Alf Veedersane

Blacktie. wrote: »

Anyone have some upper body only recommendations? No back loading and overhead press is off the table right now.

If OHP is an issue, what exactly are the limitations for upper body work?

You seem to have been through the injury wringer...

Blacktie.

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

If OHP is an issue, what exactly are the limitations for upper body work?

You seem to have been through the injury wringer...

Ugh ye tell me about it. And I was just starting to feel back to normal from the initial injury.ah well got my mri now and microsurgery is possibly on the table. Think my powerlifiting days are over .

Anyway. Limitations as far as I know is no compression of the spine. I know that's vague and open but I was too busy processing to ask enough questions at the time. Hopefully I'll know more next week.

I guess I'm looking for a good bench routine that might involve some arm and row work. Since that sounds like the only thing I can do right now. With no arch...

silverharp

Blacktie. wrote: »

Ugh ye tell me about it. And I was just starting to feel back to normal from the initial injury.ah well got my mri now and microsurgery is possibly on the table. Think my powerlifiting days are over .

Anyway. Limitations as far as I know is no compression of the spine. I know that's vague and open but I was too busy processing to ask enough questions at the time. Hopefully I'll know more next week.

I guess I'm looking for a good bench routine that might involve some arm and row work. Since that sounds like the only thing I can do right now. With no arch...

what caused the injury?

.......

Blacktie. wrote: »

Ugh ye tell me about it. And I was just starting to feel back to normal from the initial injury.ah well got my mri now and microsurgery is possibly on the table. Think my powerlifiting days are over .

Anyway. Limitations as far as I know is no compression of the spine. I know that's vague and open but I was too busy processing to ask enough questions at the time. Hopefully I'll know more next week.

I guess I'm looking for a good bench routine that might involve some arm and row work. Since that sounds like the only thing I can do right now. With no arch...

So if no spinal compression then look at things where you are lying with your back supported, such as *light* bench pressing, forward facing inclined rows, horizontal shrugs, reverse chest fly and horizontal chest fly, forward facing inclined frontal raises., triceps and biceps while supported too.....

Blacktie.

silverharp wrote: »

what caused the injury?

Deadlifting with a number I shouldn't have been basing my max off. That was the first trigger. Then it's just re-injuring the same spot while slowly trying to work around it. Very frustrating.

Mr. CooL ICE

Do you have access to a belt squat machine?

.......

Blacktie. wrote: »

Deadlifting with a number I shouldn't have been basing my max off. That was the first trigger. Then it's just re-injuring the same spot while slowly trying to work around it. Very frustrating.

Whereabouts is the injury, lower back or higher up - might help people to advise.

Also lots of cable exercises that you could do.

It would probably be a good idea for you to do a session with a good physical therapist who is familiar with gym injuries who can outline whats safe for you in your current state. I appreciate such a person can be difficult to find - I know one if you are in south dublin.

silverharp

Role of cable upper body v dumbbell ? I understand cables are good in that they are better at the ends of range of motion than in this case dumbbells but in very broad terms are cables best seen as a support to dumbbells 1/3 or 1/4 time? Or does alternate workout work?

Alf Veedersane

silverharp wrote: »

Role of cable upper body v dumbbell ? I understand cables are good in that they are better at the ends of range of motion than in this case dumbbells but in very broad terms are cables best seen as a support to dumbbells 1/3 or 1/4 time? Or does alternate workout work?

The level of intensities and the types of exercises you can do with both DBs cable are in the realm of isolation type exercises. Much bigger range of exercises you can do with DBs hence they're used a lot more.

Brian?

silverharp wrote: »

Role of cable upper body v dumbbell ? I understand cables are good in that they are better at the ends of range of motion than in this case dumbbells but in very broad terms are cables best seen as a support to dumbbells 1/3 or 1/4 time? Or does alternate workout work?

It doesn't matter which you use. You're loading a movement, don't over think it.

.......

Ive a question.

There are 3 types of grips for pulls ups in my gym.

The outer grips which are the standard horizontal palms facing away type. Then the next ones in are poking towards you, neutral grip palms facing each other.

Then there is a narrow set, these are shaped more like horns, the grip is narrow, with palm facing and they are higher than the other grips (the horns point up).

I can pull up unassisted on the last type. Mostly because the grip is most comfortable, but also because presumably this recruits the biceps more?

Im not too fond of the neutral grip ones - just feel awkward.

I use the wide grip ones but cannot pull up unassisted on them.

So my question is this - should I bother with the narrow grip ones I can pull up unassisted on - will they help me get unassisted on the wide grip ones or is it a completely different movement?

Im female and have never tried pull ups before now. Mid 40s.

paw patrol

current program has renegade rows in it.
Never tried them before.
I just don't see the point after 2 weeks.

Thinking of sub'ing them out.
Anybody find them of benefit?

program is fun though only this bit.

Alf Veedersane

I did find them good for core stability (anti rotation) and keeping everything aligned while rowing

Brian?

....... wrote: »

Ive a question.

There are 3 types of grips for pulls ups in my gym.

The outer grips which are the standard horizontal palms facing away type. Then the next ones in are poking towards you, neutral grip palms facing each other.

Then there is a narrow set, these are shaped more like horns, the grip is narrow, with palm facing and they are higher than the other grips (the horns point up).

I can pull up unassisted on the last type. Mostly because the grip is most comfortable, but also because presumably this recruits the biceps more?

Im not too fond of the neutral grip ones - just feel awkward.

I use the wide grip ones but cannot pull up unassisted on them.

So my question is this - should I bother with the narrow grip ones I can pull up unassisted on - will they help me get unassisted on the wide grip ones or is it a completely different movement?

Im female and have never tried pull ups before now. Mid 40s.

How many pull ups can you do unassisted now?

If you're doing proper full range pull ups, you can slowly work your grip wider moving it out a few inches once you can do 12-15.

shutup

Brian? wrote: »

once you can do 12-15.

Come on Brian. Think about it.
Female mid 40s, just started pull ups.
12 to 15!
Best of luck doing 15 stick pull ups

Brian?

shutup wrote: »

Come on Brian. Think about it.
Female mid 40s, just started pull ups.
12 to 15!
Best of luck doing 15 stick pull ups

Is this a joke?

IvoryTower

I doubt there are too many people who can do 3 x 12 full range pull ups tbh, nevermind someone who's just starting them

.......

Brian? wrote: »

How many pull ups can you do unassisted now?

If you're doing proper full range pull ups, you can slowly work your grip wider moving it out a few inches once you can do 12-15.

Unassisted, 1 or 2 but only on the narrow grip and Im wobbling all over the place and I "think" Im making a bit of a jump at the beginning so the strictest part of it is probably the negative. I doubt Im full range tbh - the first time I managed 1 was just 2 weeks ago.

Unassisted I do 5 sets of 5 using different grips but I rapidly lose strength and have to assist myself more and more (ie, add counterweight) to each set. Although I have been beginning with less counterweight over time.

circadian

On the topic of pull-ups has anyone got advice in getting started? I mean the most basic exercises to build strength to a proper pull-up.

I also struggle progressing with the overhead press and I'm sure my form is good. Maybe I've just got weak shoulders! I'm not too worried about it though, slow progress is still progress.

However, pull-ups. Any advice on practice exercises would be much welcome.

.......

circadian wrote: »

On the topic of pull-ups has anyone got advice in getting started? I mean the most basic exercises to build strength to a proper pull-up.

I also struggle progressing with the overhead press and I'm sure my form is good. Maybe I've just got weak shoulders! I'm not too worried about it though, slow progress is still progress.

However, pull-ups. Any advice on practice exercises would be much welcome.

I started by doing static hangs, then using something to climb up to the bars and doing negatives. This was the bit I found most difficult, the bars were too high and I didnt have the strength to jump up and grab them. Eventually I just started bringing a bench over and climbing up on it. Also barbell rows.

I couldnt even hang for 5 seconds for weeks. I didnt have either the grip strength or shoulder strength, I felt like I was just pulling my arms out lol.

Reps4jesus

circadian wrote: »

On the topic of pull-ups has anyone got advice in getting started? I mean the most basic exercises to build strength to a proper pull-up.

I also struggle progressing with the overhead press and I'm sure my form is good. Maybe I've just got weak shoulders! I'm not too worried about it though, slow progress is still progress.

However, pull-ups. Any advice on practice exercises would be much welcome.

To get started with pull ups - you can do band assisted pull ups (which i personally dont like as they tend to help in the easier part of the movement rather than where people get stuck but they seem to work for a lot of people.) Do inverted rows too and lat pull downs just to generally strengthen the muscles needed. gradually reduce the tension on the band until you can do unassisted pull ups.

For overhead pressing, it seems like just more volume and prioritizing the movement is the key to progressing. Also brace your abs and squeeze your ass as hard as you can when pressing helps too

shutup

Brian? wrote: »

Is this a joke?

No its not.
Unless Ive picked you up wrong and you are talking about assisted pull ups.
I think its mental to throw those numbers at a mid 40s female starting off.
What percent of gym goers can do 15 pulls ups? Now think about what percent of those are female. Now think about what percent of those are mid 40s.
I would say Ive never been in a gym where any female could do 15 pull ups.

It would be like me starting running and someone in the running forum saying when you get a sub 3 hour marathon, you could start to aim for a sub 2.5

.......

shutup wrote: »

No its not.
I think its mental to throw those numbers at a mid 40s female starting off.
What percent of gym goers can do 15 pulls ups? Now think about what percent of those are female. Now think about what percent of those are mid 40s.
I would say Ive never been in a gym where any female could do 15 pull ups.

It would be like me starting running and someone in the running forum saying when you get a sub 3 hour marathon, you could start to aim for a sub 2.5

I have to admit, I only see about 3 people doing unassisted pull ups in either gym I go to and all 3 of them are young men.

There is a woman (younger than me) who I have seen doing it, but she only does 2 or 3 and they are not very strict.

I wondered about it for ages, until trying it for myself - now I understand why hardly anyone does it!!

But I do know a woman about the same age as me who started doing pull ups a year ago and she can do 15 now - but she is a personal trainer/fitness machine who was coming from a very athletic background.

circadian

....... wrote: »

I started by doing static hangs, then using something to climb up to the bars and doing negatives. This was the bit I found most difficult, the bars were too high and I didnt have the strength to jump up and grab them. Eventually I just started bringing a bench over and climbing up on it. Also barbell rows.

I couldnt even hang for 5 seconds for weeks. I didnt have either the grip strength or shoulder strength, I felt like I was just pulling my arms out lol.

I'll give it a try, I'm making some headway on the negatives. The previous few weeks I was holding myself chin above the bar for about 20-30 seconds at a time. It's good to hear it's just as tough for others and clearly progression is slow.

Barbell rows I have no problem with, I'm regularly rowing 65+kg.

Reps4jesus wrote: »

To get started with pull ups - you can do band assisted pull ups (which i personally dont like as they tend to help in the easier part of the movement rather than where people get stuck but they seem to work for a lot of people.) Do inverted rows too and lat pull downs just to generally strengthen the muscles needed. gradually reduce the tension on the band until you can do unassisted pull ups.

For overhead pressing, it seems like just more volume and prioritizing the movement is the key to progressing. Also brace your abs and squeeze your ass as hard as you can when pressing helps too

I'll give the inverted rows a shot, that seems to make sense for this type of exercise. I'm not sure if I'd like the band assisted pull-ups, but I'll give them a try,

As for ass squeezing, that's the one thing I'm not doing, will give it a shot that's a handy little pointer.

I'm often seeing people in my gym doing unassisted pullups with weights on a belt. It's an impressive sight!

shutup

....... wrote: »

I have to admit, I only see about 3 people doing unassisted pull ups in either gym I go to and all 3 of them are young men.

There is a woman (younger than me) who I have seen doing it, but she only does 2 or 3 and they are not very strict.

I wondered about it for ages, until trying it for myself - now I understand why hardly anyone does it!!

But I do know a woman about the same age as me who started doing pull ups a year ago and she can do 15 now - but she is a personal trainer/fitness machine who was coming from a very athletic background.

Just in case anyone is misunderstanding me. Im not having a go at you. I think its great you are trying bodyweight stuff as its my favourite type of training. Just pull ups are so hard for women that 15 is not realistic. My (female) friend is in great shape, good runner and experienced with kettlebells. She cant do one.
The only women who can are very experienced and full time at the gym/lifestlye.

Brian?

IvoryTower wrote: »

I doubt there are too many people who can do 3 x 12 full range pull ups tbh, nevermind someone who's just starting them

Of course someone starting can't. The question was when to progress beyond narrow grip pull ups. The answer I gave was once you can do 12-15. It's a goal that will take time and effort.

What should I have said? What would your advice be?