Random Wrestling Thoughts (Part 2)

beakerjoe

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Just watched something on WrestleTalk YouTube about Shane McMahon and it's true.
Like there he is a 51 year old man trying to be cool (dancing, wearing sneakers etc) but more so mental is that he is being booked as a legitimate threat to Braun Strowman.

He's not being booked as an old man going up against this monster. He's being presented that Braun better watch out.

'Hes no ordinary man.... he is a McMahon dammit'

Loughc

beakerjoe wrote: »

'Hes no ordinary man.... he is a McMahon dammit'

The best in the world.....

B.A._Baracus

The Nal wrote: »

Been all downhill from there.

I would actually agree to that
WCW and ECW closing hurt wrestling. But everyone (myself included) thought that when WWE bought WCW it should have been the greatest wrestling angle of all time. Talk about a damp squib.

The proverbial rocket was in the stratosphere as wrestling was white hot and the purchase of WCW was unreal. Then it was just a slow decent. No more fuel.
I remember I had to watch Raw every week but by mid-2002 it felt a chore. By 2005 I would miss various episodes. That's not to say there wasnt any good moments but WWE was no way near the same.

ECW revival ppvs werent too bad (by wwe's standards) but then the ecw brand was a let down on sci-fi.
2009 wasnt a bad year if I remember correctly but it was plagued by triple h vs orton so much.

I could probably go on but none the less here we are with todays WWE product and it's boring. I struggle to watch it.

gerrybbadd

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

I would actually agree to that
WCW and ECW closing hurt wrestling. But everyone (myself included) thought that when WWE bought WCW it should have been the greatest wrestling angle of all time. Talk about a damp squib.

The proverbial rocket was in the stratosphere as wrestling was white hot and the purchase of WCW was unreal. Then it was just a slow decent. No more fuel.
I remember I had to watch Raw every week but by mid-2002 it felt a chore. By 2005 I would miss various episodes. That's not to say there wasnt any good moments but WWE was no way near the same.

ECW revival ppvs werent too bad (by wwe's standards) but then the ecw brand was a let down on sci-fi.
2009 wasnt a bad year if I remember correctly but it was plagued by triple h vs orton so much.

I could probably go on but none the less here we are with todays WWE product and it's boring. I struggle to watch it.

I've stopped watching entirely the past 12 months. Finally unsubbed to the Network during the week as well.

I watched WWE on and off from the early 90s up to 92, then pretty much full time from 95 up to last year. I don't miss it either. Far too much of an Entertainment company these days for my liking.

Just more on the invasion.

They should have waited until 2002 to do it (they did a brand split then anyway) when they had the likes of Bischoff, Flair, Hogan, Nash etc signed (Steiner and Goldberg would follow as well). Somehow in storyline Bischoff gets control of WCW again and turns Smackdown into Nitro or something. Would have felt more like a proper WCW Vs WWF feud.

Necro

Deleted User wrote: »

Just more on the invasion.

They should have waited until 2002 to do it (they did a brand split then anyway) when they had the likes of Bischoff, Flair, Hogan, Nash etc signed (Steiner and Goldberg would follow as well). Somehow in storyline Bischoff gets control of WCW again and turns Smackdown into Nitro or something. Would have felt more like a proper WCW Vs WWF feud.

Yeah I've recently been watching that whole timeframe and their impatience to rush things without the bigger names (Ironically, Hogan Nash and Hall signed in January after the Invasion was over, Flair was literally a couple of weeks afterwards).

Even with those 4 guys headlining the WCW side it would have been so much better.


Kurt Angle as an eg. Got over MASSIVE with the fans going up against Austin then they suddenly... turn him to join the Alliance out of nowhere because they had no stars on that side.


Benoit and Triple H being injured hurt them too, and they were pushing Rhyno massively before he also went down to a neck injury.


It should have been so much better.

The White Wolf

Seeing both Edge and Christian back on active rosters is so strange to me as only a couple of years ago these guys were doing their podcast analysing the business and they seemed happy to do it.

It just goes to show the effect WWE being the only game in town had on so many people. If they told you that you were done, all you could do is agree and take the paycheck as a legend and be thankful.

Such an awesome thing AEW have been for the business for this alone.

TheLocalMan

The White Wolf wrote: »

Seeing both Edge and Christian back on active rosters is so strange to me as only a couple of years ago these guys were doing their podcast analysing the business and they seemed happy to do it.

It just goes to show the effect WWE being the only game in town had on so many people. If they told you that you were done, all you could do is agree and take the paycheck as a legend and be thankful.

Such an awesome thing AEW have been for the business for this alone.

They were done though. Both were retired. Its not like AEW came out of nowhere and Edge's neck suddenly healed or Christian's brain suddenly repaired itself.

B.A._Baracus

Necro wrote: »

.... It should have been so much better.

Absolutely.
I have never heard anyone praise the invasion angle. In fact, quite the opposite as i know a few people who have said they stopped watching WWE / wrestling shortly after the angle. Mental.

Itssoeasy

The March 21st, 2014 episode of smackdown is currently playing on the network live channel and there was a four team no1 contenders match to face the usos at a later date. Anyway that’s not important. I was looking at the guys in the ring and other and doing a count to see where they all where since the nearly seven years since.

The teams are the shield, 3MB(mahal,McIntyre, and slater), the real Americans(swagger and Cesaro), and Ryback and Curtis axel for the record.

So the shield all become worlds champ and two of the three are still with wwe. Shockingly two of the three members of 3MB became world champion and bar slater who held on for years in gone. The real Americans, Cesaro is still there but not being used how he should and swagger is in AEW. And then we have Ryback who as far as I know isn’t in wrestling and is ranting to anyone who will listen about anything, and Curtis axel had a nice run but is no longer with the company.

It’s interesting to see what’s happened and who got a push and who didn’t work out.

Edit: the match on now was del Rio vs big E. you Have a genuinely nice guy who you never hear a bad word against and then you’ve del Rio.

Itssoeasy

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Absolutely.
I have never heard anyone praise the invasion angle. In fact, quite the opposite as i know a few people who have said they stopped watching WWE / wrestling shortly after the angle. Mental.

Well given how it was something that had been dreamed about for years about wcw and wwe being against each other, it was never really going to live up to the hype people had built up in their heads, which didn’t/and doesn’t help people’s opinions of how it was booked.

B.A._Baracus

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Well given how it was something that had been dreamed about for years about wcw and wwe being against each other, it was never really going to live up to the hype people had built up in their heads, which didn’t/and doesn’t help people’s opinions of how it was booked.

I get what you mean. Fans of what ever it may be, will end up building something up in their mind just to get disappointed.
But with the invasion angle it was just horrible. WWE just mishandled it in every way.

What doesn't seem to get brought up is that ratings for Raw actually peaked a year or 2 before WCW closed for good. They'd been fairly gradually sliding for about a year. X7 was more a swansong than the peak IMO. It broke the PPV record (I believe) as wrestling was hot but whether or not the weekly regular fans had already started slipping away is the question.

Itssoeasy

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

I get what you mean. Fans of what ever it may be, will end up building something up in their mind just to get disappointed.
But with the invasion angle it was just horrible. WWE just mishandled it in every way.

It was how rushed it was. I mean WCW and ECW(or sorry the alliance) were out of business, so they weren’t going anywhere so they had time to build up the anticipation of this amazing thing. And this isn’t meant as a disrespect to Booker T, because even though he was the WCW champion, in non WCW fans eyes there were bigger eye catching names who they’d know and would be drawn in who weren’t there.

It had huge potential but they struck out. I can’t believe it’s just shy of twenty years ago though. Where has the time gone ?

Just watching some NXT highlights on BT (I don't watch much NXT)

I always just find NXT... boring. It's not terrible and it's not brilliant. Only way I can describe it.

Also promos sound as scripted as they are on the main roster. Was always led to believe they had more freedom. And a camera cut on every move like the main roster

J. Marston

Whenever I think of the Invasion, all that comes to mind is RVD vs Jeff Hardy for the Hardcore title at Invasion. I think there was some spot where RVD knocked Jeff into the pit at the entrance stage. That's all I think about when I think of the Invasion, for some reason.

Itssoeasy

J. Marston wrote: »

Whenever I think of the Invasion, all that comes to mind is RVD vs Jeff Hardy for the Hardcore title at Invasion. I think there was some spot where RVD knocked Jeff into the pit at the entrance stage. That's all I think about when I think of the Invasion, for some reason.

Yeah it was a spot on the ramp and the ramp split in two so there was a gap and RVD did a spin kick to a chair(I think) that Jeff was holding and Jeff dropped out of sight. That’s off the top of my head from memory so it might not have been a chair.

I remember someone nearly falling into the gap on their entrance as well. Think it was Lita or Trish

Itssoeasy

Deleted User wrote: »

I remember someone nearly falling into the gap on their entrance as well. Think it was Lita or Trish

Now that you mention it I do recall someone getting too close to the gap. But the Jeff hardy spot was planned.

Itssoeasy

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Now that you mention it I do recall someone getting too close to the gap. But the Jeff hardy spot was planned.

Oh yeah the RVD Jeff bit was intentional. I just remember one of the girls walking out on their entrance, not noticing it and nearly falling in. Could have been Torrie or Stacy as well.

https://www.reddit.com/r/SquaredCircle/comments/8rdz5b/lita_saves_trish_with_some_quick_reflexes/

It was Lita and Trish after the match. I was close :pac:

Itssoeasy

Deleted User wrote: »

https://www.reddit.com/r/SquaredCircle/comments/8rdz5b/lita_saves_trish_with_some_quick_reflexes/

It was Lita and Trish after the match. I was close :pac:

Oh well done to lita for thinking on her feet because Trish was gone over the edge .

Itssoeasy

Deleted User wrote: »

Just watching some NXT highlights on BT (I don't watch much NXT)

I always just find NXT... boring. It's not terrible and it's not brilliant. Only way I can describe it.

Also promos sound as scripted as they are on the main roster. Was always led to believe they had more freedom. And a camera cut on every move like the main roster

It’s become more and more...I wouldn’t say boring but it’s very safe as a TV show which is fine to a point but we’ve seen it be exciting.

RocketRaccoon

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Absolutely.
I have never heard anyone praise the invasion angle. In fact, quite the opposite as i know a few people who have said they stopped watching WWE / wrestling shortly after the angle. Mental.

I was so excited to see how it would go, but when you had guys like Buff Bagwell as one of the main WCW stars you knew it wasn't going to go well. The night ECW seperated gave me genuine goosebumps but they managed to mess that up too.

PTH2009

Which was worse

HBKs farce of a return in Saudi or Ric Flairs ring return in TNA ?

Both of these returns in there entirety should be sent back to there home planet

J. Marston

Flair's return led to one of the best segments in wrestling history...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SobD560-9ZQ

HBK's return was just pathetic. Bald Shawn and 3 other auld fellas stumbling around the place, it was like a backyard wrestling show.

CastorTroy

Can't remember Flair's return but if going by some of the worst moments on mainstream Pro wrestling (so not counting some of the stuff that happened on the indies) Jeff vs Sting in TNA is in there

Omackeral

J. Marston wrote: »

Flair's return led to one of the best segments in wrestling history...

In fairness that was great but he pretty much had the best send off ever in the business and reneged on it.

Itssoeasy

PTH2009 wrote: »

Which was worse

HBKs farce of a return in Saudi or Ric Flairs ring return in TNA ?

Both of these returns in there entirety should be sent back to there home planet

Second one. Ric flair got the most gold plated send off ever and he turned around and took a dump on it all. I’ve only watched the first Saudi show and I watched the Lacy and natalya match after the fact because it was a big moment so thankfully I didn’t see it live.

Itssoeasy

Why isn’t the full nelson used as a finisher more in wrestling these days ? It’s a simple move to do and its easy for an opponent to sell for.

Itssoeasy

27 years ago tonight wrestle mania X took place in New York City and had two five star matches and a few that were good and at least one that probably looked good in theory but in practice didn’t work(savage vs crush match). This is the first WWE PPV I ever recorded myself and I got the tape myself so this is a special event for me in my wrestling fandom.

The Owen vs Bret match is IMO the best opening match of a wrestle mania ever and is up there with some of the best ever at a mania. It’s a wrestling clinic.

We had the yoko vs Luger title match which was okay I guess but I’m not a fan of nerve holds of doom for minutes on end. It was very 1970s WWWF MSG house show with the rest holds.

The ladder match of course is the template of which every other ladder match in wwe is based on. It still holds up today although I think the rematch at summer slam was better because they could refine the match. And we had perfect as ref which was nice.

The Quebecers vs men on a mission was fine but mostly because of the French Canadian team who were good.

We had a women’s title match which was what it was but it was madusa(aka Alundra Blaze) vs Leilani Kai so the match was good because there was two good workers in the ring but it was 1994 WWF women's division.

There was a cancelled ten man tag match because I think the ladder match went long.

We had the bam bam bigelow vs doink with Luna and dink involved to make it a tag match.

And we had the main event with a few drinks deep Burt reynolds as ring announcer and it Bret won the belt which was the plan and that’s about it.

Loughc

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Why isn’t the full nelson used as a finisher more in wrestling these days ? It’s a simple move to do and its easy for an opponent to sell for.

Well it’s Bobby lashley’s finisher so I imagine that’s why WWE don’t feature it other than him really.

TimesArrow

Any mild interest I had in edges comeback is all but dead bow. The feud with Roman is a total dud and there’s nothing interesting about this version of the character

Necro

TimesArrow wrote:

Any mild interest I had in edges comeback is all but dead bow. The feud with Roman is a total dud and there’s nothing interesting about this version of the character

That's cos Edge is a bang average face and always was, he was always better as the manipulative heel. We've also had the "return" angle last year, in the feud with Orton.

There's no pop to this feud, no spark. Why would there be, neither guy has any history of animosity beyond Roman being the champ, nor have they tried to create any since the Rumble.

Here's what they should do, but won't.

Have Bryan BEAT Roman tomorrow night. It can be with Edge's assistance, doesn't have to be clean if they're obsessed with protecting the big dog (mind you, he's a heel and should be losing sometimes).

Bryan goes into Mania as Champ up against the Rumble winner Edge, with Reigns seemingly out of the picture.

Reigns demands his rematch and Bryan being a fighting champion gives it to him at Mania, we now have a triple threat match with Reigns super focused and determined to reclaim the gold along with the wildcard of Edge.

Already annoyed with Bryan trying (and succeeding) to jump the queue and getting to the main event of Mania, Edge snaps after Bryan gives Reigns what he wants as it decreases his chances. He beats the sh1t out of Bryan, possibly gives him a con-chair-to (but maybe not, might be too close to Mania for Bryan to sell that impact).

Boom you have deranged and obsessed Edge back as a heel alongside Reigns with both chasing a face champ in Bryan.

There's your Mania main event. And they can still do it.

But they won't, and we will get Edge VS Reigns and it will likely be grand, but sort of pointless and with no real pop or meaning to the feud.

B.A._Baracus

Just heard that it only took Val Venis four years from his wrestling debut to getting signed to WWF. That's impressive.

What's also impressive is it appears he even didn't go to developmental. Also it appears that both him and Edge were originally meant to be the new Midnight Express tag team.

Seriously tho... 4 years? Fair play.

Agent Coulson

He’s also a QAnon believer so a bit nuts.

Itssoeasy

Agent Coulson wrote: »

He’s also a QAnon believer so a bit nuts.

Oh saying he’s nuts is harsh on people who are nuts. If he genuinely believed the tweets he was sending out before has was banned then he needs professional help.

Agent Coulson

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Oh saying he’s nuts is harsh on people who are nuts. If he genuinely believed the tweets he was sending out before has was banned then he needs professional help.

Tweeting and sharing sexual exploitation of children claiming he was exposing paedophilia he should have been locked up not got a small twitter ban.

TheLocalMan

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/596294.stm That time a Granny in Ediburgh called the police on Triple H, because she thought the match she was watching on PPV was real.

The best quote of this whole article was: "It just wasn't fair, Triple H never plays a fair game and he was hitting poor Mr Austin with a hammer.

"People say it is not real and it is all staged, but I knew it was real and he was hurt and I wasn't going to stand by and watch it happen."

Agent Coulson

I’d known about the Macho Man, Steph rumours for as long as I can remember however I’m only just reading that Bruce Prichard might have slept with a young Steph as well.

Itssoeasy

Agent Coulson wrote: »

I’d known about the Macho Man, Steph rumours for as long as I can remember however I’m only just reading that Bruce Prichard might have slept with a young Steph as well.

Say what now ? Where is this coming from because that’s something I’ve never heard of ever.

Agent Coulson

Jerry Lawlor said in a shoot back 20 years ago I just stumbled across it this evening.

Itssoeasy

Agent Coulson wrote: »

Jerry Lawlor said in a shoot back 20 years ago I just stumbled across it this evening.

Okay. Well I assume it was denied.

Agent Coulson

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Okay. Well I assume it was denied.

Prichard denied it last year when asked.

LineOfBeauty

Throwing this out there.

WWE are playing with fire with the Alexa stuff. As it is, WWE's female roster inherits basically the worst type of fan (stan) you can possibly imagine basically the moment they hit main roster screens. The portrayal of Bliss as a child has been dodge enough, the sexualised nature of it even more dodge and then they did thar pin last night. You just need to go look in Alexa's Twitter replies to see what we're dealing with here. In recent times the stuff that the female roster have had to deal with from that section of the audience could've been even worse than it worse (which was bad) but with the current Bliss stuff I honestly think they're walking on real dangerous ground.

J. Marston

LineOfBeauty wrote: »

Throwing this out there.

WWE are playing with fire with the Alexa stuff. As it is, WWE's female roster inherits basically the worst type of fan (stan) you can possibly imagine basically the moment they hit main roster screens. The portrayal of Bliss as a child has been dodge enough, the sexualised nature of it even more dodge and then they did thar pin last night. You just need to go look in Alexa's Twitter replies to see what we're dealing with here. In recent times the stuff that the female roster have had to deal with from that section of the audience could've been even worse than it worse (which was bad) but with the current Bliss stuff I honestly think they're walking on real dangerous ground.

The angle is shìte but what a load of reaching twaddle. She could be dressed as a binman and her replies would be still be filled with thirsty weirdos. WWE is the land where the corporate sponsor reigns and that type of stuff would make them run for the hills. She's a 30 year old woman.

Do you think AEW are walking on dangerous ground by parading an actual child, topless, every week?

LineOfBeauty

J. Marston wrote: »

The angle is shìte but what a load of reaching twaddle. She could be dressed as a binman and her replies would be still be filled with thirsty weirdos. WWE is the land where the corporate sponsor reigns and that type of stuff would make them run for the hills. She's a 30 year old woman.

Do you think AEW are walking on dangerous ground by parading an actual child, topless, every week?

Unless you've some hidden stories that you're gonna reveal here about actual attempted attacks on AEW kids by paedophiles could you you please not quote me with "whatabboutery"

And again, it's nothing but a thought that popped into my head off the back of seeing some reaction to the pin last night. And likely nothing will happen and hopefully nothing does happen. But if you think WWE haven't been presenting Bliss in a certain way to appeal to a certain kind of "fan" then your head is in the sand or you aren't watching. And personally my thoughts would be, coming so soon after the Deville stuff, I'd do everything I could to not appeal to that kind of fanbase because those people are scary as hell and instead WWE lean into it. It's not something I'd do.

CastorTroy

LineOfBeauty wrote: »

Throwing this out there.

WWE are playing with fire with the Alexa stuff. As it is, WWE's female roster inherits basically the worst type of fan (stan) you can possibly imagine basically the moment they hit main roster screens. The portrayal of Bliss as a child has been dodge enough, the sexualised nature of it even more dodge and then they did thar pin last night. You just need to go look in Alexa's Twitter replies to see what we're dealing with here. In recent times the stuff that the female roster have had to deal with from that section of the audience could've been even worse than it worse (which was bad) but with the current Bliss stuff I honestly think they're walking on real dangerous ground.

Pun intended?

Hasn't she pinned like that before? Maybe not a guy. I'm trying to think which woman pins her opponents suggestively. Can't even remember the promotion I saw it in

LineOfBeauty

CastorTroy wrote: »

Pun intended?

Hasn't she pinned like that before? Maybe not a guy. I'm trying to think which woman pins her opponents suggestively. Can't even remember the promotion I saw it in

Personally can't think of any off the top of my head. But the pin with the story and portrayal of the character is supposed to have sexual overtones. My only point here is, for any company and particularly those that book female talent, is that Stan culture is a dangerous thing at that extreme level particularly, and, much like Speaking Out and merch table culture, it's an obvious area where you know in the future there's going to be trouble.

riffmongous

What's merch table culture?