Is anyone else starting to become a bit excited?

makeorbrake

Blueshoe wrote: »

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/d/dutch_tulip_bulb_market_bubble.asp

Fair play - the old tulip bulb theory hasn't gotten a run out for quite some time. :-)

Blueshoe

makeorbrake wrote: »

Fair play - the old tulip bulb theory hasn't gotten a run out for quite some time. :-)

Not since the 1600s but sure we know better now don't we

Grumpypants

Blueshoe wrote: »

Not since the 1600s but sure we know better now don't we

Still waiting for the bitcoin bubble to burst. What a terrible bubble that just keeps going in a very predictable cycle.

Blueshoe

Grumpypants wrote: »

Still waiting for the bitcoin bubble to burst. What a terrible bubble that just keeps going in a very predictable cycle.

You will be waiting. Bitcoin is the future. The dollar killer. Decentralised man. Think about it.

The new world currency.

Who owns all of the bitcoin?
Who controls the price more importantly?

The future is now man. Your salary will be paid in satoshis. Pints and taytos will cost X amount of satoshis. Power to the common people. Let's close the banks man

makeorbrake

Blueshoe wrote: »

Not since the 1600s but sure we know better now don't we

Maybe you do. In which case, if you truly believe that - then you should make fat money by shorting the market. Now, are you going to do what so many naysayers have failed to do in the past and short the market?

stockshares

makeorbrake wrote: »

Maybe you do. In which case, if you truly believe that - then you should make fat money by shorting the market. Now, are you going to do what so many naysayers have failed to do in the past and short the market?

Can someone explain Shorting to me. I've googled it but can't get my head around it.

makeorbrake

Blueshoe wrote: »

Who owns all of the bitcoin?

Do enlighten us? Evidently now you. I had a few satoshis and sold them. Then I bought a few satoshis 6 months ago. I guess I have a few :-)

Blueshoe wrote:

Who controls the price more importantly?

I dunno. Who controls the price then?

Blueshoe

makeorbrake wrote: »

Maybe you do. In which case, if you truly believe that - then you should make fat money by shorting the market. Now, are you going to do what so many naysayers have failed to do in the past and short the market?

No I will not short the market. Mainly because the entire market is a manipulated and unregulated lie.
Artificiality pumped and then dumped. The exchanges and the holders of the huge amounts of BTC have the control. Greed is part of human nature especially when huge sums of money are involved. The whole thing is a sham.

I have a few euro in for the past 3 years and will just leave it there. Maybe they will pump it up and when I reach a figure I have in mind I will cash out or maybe it will fall apart like a pyramid scheme and I will lose the few euro instead.

Blockchain as a technology has some potential but the crypto currency market is a bag of sh1te.

Some folk don't see the difference between them

makeorbrake

stockshares wrote: »

Can someone explain Shorting to me. I've googled it but can't get my head around it.

In a bear market, there's just as much money to be made as in a bull market. i.e. if you believe that as of tomorrow morning, the price of Bitcoin is going to drop, you can take out a position to reflect that and make a bag full of $

That's if you have conviction in your claim.

makeorbrake

Blueshoe wrote: »

No I will not short the market. Mainly because the entire market is a manipulated and unregulated lie.

We've heard that excuse here a few times. If you believe that its a tulip bulb, then short it - simple as that. Manipulation doesn't matter - either you have conviction in your belief or you dont.

Blueshoe wrote: »

The exchanges and the holders of the huge amounts of BTC have the control.

This is nothing new. Ask George Soros (who manipulated GBP back in the day). It's a nascent market and its market cap is not even a drop in the ocean. As that market cap grows, the ability to manipulate it will become more difficult.

Blueshoe wrote: »

Greed is part of human nature especially when huge sums of money are involved.

I agree - albeit that I'd wager it doesn't matter the sums involved - its a part of human nature at all levels.

Blueshoe wrote: »

The whole thing is a sham.

So you reckon that BTC and decentralised crypto has no redeeming qualities? Can't possibly agree with you on that one dude - you're on your own.

Blueshoe wrote: »

I have a few euro in for the past 3 years and will just leave it there.

And why prey tell did you buy any if you think its a bag of ****e? You bought 3 years ago you say and not at the top of the market? Why don't you sell today if you think the market is manipulated and you don't believe cryptocurrency has any value?

Blueshoe wrote: »

Maybe they will pump it up and when I reach a figure I have in mind I will cash out or maybe it will fall apart like a pyramid scheme and I will lose the few euro instead.

What figure do you have in mind that will motivate you to sell?

Blueshoe wrote: »

Blockchain as a technology has some potential but the crypto currency market is a bag of sh1te.
Some folk don't see the difference between them

This old toss that the banks came out with a few years ago i.e. Blockchain not Bitcoin. Hard to figure what was going on with you the day you bought btc if you think its rubbish.

Blueshoe

makeorbrake wrote: »

Do enlighten us? Evidently now you. I had a few satoshis and sold them. Then I bought a few satoshis 6 months ago. I guess I have a few :-)




I dunno. Who controls the price then?

Wash trading, fake volume, artificial buy and sell walls etc
These are only the things we can see on the exchanges.
Remember when bch was released and coinbase employees were accused of insider trading.
The whole market is a manipulated mess.
Even the biggest bitcoin believers know this.

Do you believe the crypto currency market is an honest and transparent place?

Arrival

Blueshoe wrote: »

makeorbrake wrote: »

Maybe you do. In which case, if you truly believe that - then you should make fat money by shorting the market. Now, are you going to do what so many naysayers have failed to do in the past and short the market?

No I will not short the market. Mainly because the entire market is a manipulated and unregulated lie.
Artificiality pumped and then dumped. The exchanges and the holders of the huge amounts of BTC have the control. Greed is part of human nature especially when huge sums of money are involved. The whole thing is a sham.

I have a few euro in for the past 3 years and will just leave it there. Maybe they will pump it up and when I reach a figure I have in mind I will cash out or maybe it will fall apart like a pyramid scheme and I will lose the few euro instead.

Blockchain as a technology has some potential but the crypto currency market is a bag of sh1te.

Some folk don't see the difference between them

Ok.

Grumpypants

stockshares wrote: »

Can someone explain Shorting to me. I've googled it but can't get my head around it.

The very simplest explanation would be if i thought Bitcoin would be 8k now but drop to 2k in July. I'd say to you, give me a loan of 10 bitcoin now and ill give them back in August.

You give them to me, i sell them all for 80k. Then buy them back for 20k in July. I give you back 10 bitcoin in August and pocket 60k profit.

The risk is of course that bitcoin goes to 10k and i've to spend 100k to get your coins back.

makeorbrake

Blueshoe wrote: »

Do you believe the crypto currency market is an honest and transparent place?

I believe that the market implicates bad practices - for sure. However, it's completely logical to me that we would have such activity given that it is a completely nascent market at this point in time. These tricks are nothing new - they come from wall street. As the market matures and as the market cap grows, these bad practices will be flushed out.

Now all of that doesn't mean that there isn't something tangible behind decentralised crypto.

Grumpypants

Blueshoe wrote: »

Wash trading, fake volume, artificial buy and sell walls etc
These are only the things we can see on the exchanges.
Remember when bch was released and coinbase employees were accused of insider trading.
The whole market is a manipulated mess.
Even the biggest bitcoin believers know this.

Do you believe the crypto currency market is an honest and transparent place?

Manipulate it up and we don't care.

Blueshoe

makeorbrake wrote: »

We've heard that excuse here a few times. If you believe that its a tulip bulb, then short it - simple as that. Manipulation doesn't matter - either you have conviction in your belief or you dont.


This is nothing new. Ask George Soros (who manipulated GBP back in the day). It's a nascent market and its market cap is not even a drop in the ocean. As that market cap grows, the ability to manipulate it will become more difficult.


I agree - albeit that I'd wager it doesn't matter the sums involved - its a part of human nature at all levels.


So you reckon that BTC and decentralised crypto has no redeeming qualities? Can't possibly agree with you on that one dude - you're on your own.


And why prey tell did you buy any if you think its a bag of ****e? You bought 3 years ago you say and not at the top of the market? Why don't you sell today if you think the market is manipulated and you don't believe cryptocurrency has any value?


What figure do you have in mind that will motivate you to sell?


This old toss that the banks came out with a few years ago i.e. Blockchain not Bitcoin. Hard to figure what was going on with you the day you bought btc if you think its rubbish.

Blockchain = potential
Crypto currency market= unregulated, manipulated wild west where the little guy will lose

I do think BTC will come close to 20k again though. Lots of people were burnt before so it may take time to gather up so many guilible folk again. I'm holding tight and waiting to see the effect that bakkt and Facebook coin among other things have on the market as a whole.

I don't have life changing money in either way so il hold fire.
I still think the market is junk though. You don't and that's ok too

makeorbrake

Blueshoe wrote: »

Blockchain = potential
Crypto currency market= unregulated, manipulated wild west where the little guy will lose

Ok, in this you're considering the technology with the former and the market with the latter.

On crypto, is there any technological substance to it or none?

Blueshoe

makeorbrake wrote: »

Ok, in this you're considering the technology with the former and the market with the latter.

On crypto, is there any technological substance to it or none?

I think Blockchain technology has the potential to streamline business practice. Ie cheaper , faster and more secure.
But it's a niche market. It's still only a possibility. That's the technology.

The crypto market is a mess. Like I said an unregulated, manipulated wild West full of insider trading, fake volume, pump and dump tactics etc.

But people are greedy and many are also stupid so there is no reason that BTC can't be pumped up again to ath making those in control a fortune only to free fall again for no apparent reason.

Do you remember when the "owner/inventor " of ripple was for a short period one of the wealthiest men in the world!
Pumped up on hype and speculation and nothing else
It's laughable.

Look how many tokens these teams have for themselves. They are pulling wealth out of thin air. I can see many will take the money and run if there is another crypto market price explosion

makeorbrake

Blueshoe wrote: »

I think Blockchain technology has the potential to streamline business practice. Ie cheaper , faster and more secure.
But it's a niche market. It's still only a possibility. That's the technology.

The crypto market is a mess. Like I said an unregulated, manipulated wild West full of insider trading, fake volume, pump and dump tactics etc.

But people are greedy and many are also stupid so there is no reason that BTC can't be pumped up again to ath making those in control a fortune only to free fall again for no apparent reason.

Do you remember when the "owner " of ripple was for a short period one of the wealthiest men in the world!
Laughable

Eh, no - yer doing the same thing again. You are looking at blockchain from a tech point of view then considering crypto purely from a market perspective.

Is there any technological value in cryptocurrency? Does it have anything tangible to offer?

Blueshoe

makeorbrake wrote: »

Eh, no - yer doing the same thing again. You are looking at blockchain from a tech point of view then considering crypto purely from a market perspective.

Is there any technological value in cryptocurrency? Does it have anything tangible to offer?

As a currency? Ie an alternative to dollars and euro?

makeorbrake

Blueshoe wrote: »

As a currency? Ie an alternative to dollars and euro?

Cryptocurrency as a means of either store of value or digital money.

Arrival

Blueshoe, ignore the $10m price prediction on the title and thumbnail, even the biggest Bitcoin Maximalists amongst us would be very sceptical of that, of this but when you have some time watch this video and give us your opinion afterwards, and watch it in full too because everything in it is in it for a reason including segments with some household names you'd be surprised to hear being very optimistic about Bitcoin. But of course maybe Bill Gates and Steve Wozniak aren't seeing something you've spotted. But we'll wait and see your feedback to find out what that may be. I know it's 40mins but trust me it flies by

And if you could also give us an idea of how you think humans will pay for things in 10, 20, 30+ years time that'd be interesting too, especially with some insight into where we'll be with regards to the inflation of all FIAT currencies.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V3VgbQ23E8k

Blueshoe

makeorbrake wrote: »

Cryptocurrency as a means of either store of value or digital money.

No I don't think so. Not while there is no regulation

Blueshoe

Arrival wrote: »

Blueshoe, ignore the $10m price prediction on the title and thumbnail, even the biggest Bitcoin Maximalists amongst us would be very sceptical of that, of this but when you have some time watch this video and give us your opinion afterwards, and watch it in full too because everything in it is in it for a reason including segments with some household names you'd be surprised to hear being very optimistic about Bitcoin. But of course maybe Bill Gates and Steve Wozniak aren't seeing something you've spotted. But we'll wait and see your feedback to find out what that may be. I know it's 40mins but trust me it flies by

And if you could also give us an idea of how you think humans will pay for things in 10, 20, 30+ years time that'd be interesting too, especially with some insight into where we'll be with regards to the inflation of all FIAT currencies.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V3VgbQ23E8k

I will be driving for a few hours tomorrow. I will have a listen through the Bluetooth.

How will people pay for things in 10, 20 ,30 years later?
What!?

Arrival

Blueshoe wrote: »

Arrival wrote: »

Blueshoe, ignore the $10m price prediction on the title and thumbnail, even the biggest Bitcoin Maximalists amongst us would be very sceptical of that, of this but when you have some time watch this video and give us your opinion afterwards, and watch it in full too because everything in it is in it for a reason including segments with some household names you'd be surprised to hear being very optimistic about Bitcoin. But of course maybe Bill Gates and Steve Wozniak aren't seeing something you've spotted. But we'll wait and see your feedback to find out what that may be. I know it's 40mins but trust me it flies by

And if you could also give us an idea of how you think humans will pay for things in 10, 20, 30+ years time that'd be interesting too, especially with some insight into where we'll be with regards to the inflation of all FIAT currencies.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V3VgbQ23E8k

I will be driving for a few hours tomorrow. I will have a listen through the Bluetooth.

How will people pay for things in 10, 20 ,30 years later?
What!?

It's better to watch it to actually see the video as well but I guess that's better than nothing.

Yeah, what's wrong with that question? I'm asking how you think we will all pay for things in a few decades time, like will we still be using paper money. Everything is quickly evolving due to technology so all of us in this thread believe Bitcoin and certain other Cryptocurrencies are the evolution of money/payment, but you don't. So do you think we'll still actually be using FIAT in a few decades time? If you do, how do you think we'll cope with the inflation which FIAT currencies rely on?

Blueshoe

Arrival wrote: »

It's better to watch it to actually see the video as well but I guess that's better than nothing.

Yeah, what's wrong with that question? I'm asking how you think we will all pay for things in a few decades time, like will we still be using paper money. Everything is quickly evolving due to technology so all of us in this thread believe Bitcoin and certain other Cryptocurrencies are the evolution of money/payment, but you don't. So do you think we'll still actually be using FIAT in a few decades time? If you do, how do you think we'll cope with the inflation which FIAT currencies rely on?

The same way we have been using fiat in the last 50 years of inflation
Example. If a bag of chips cost you 10p in the 70s but it costs 3 euro now.
In the 70s you were getting 50 pounds a week wages are you getting 50 euro a week pay now?

Inflation and deflation are the cornerstone of fractional reserve banking and must be constantly fiddled with depending on how an economy is performing. You need to look into this a bit more.
If you don't understand it you can't have an accurate opinion on it

makeorbrake

Blueshoe wrote: »

No I don't think so. Not while there is no regulation

So why buy into something that you had no belief in?

Whilst centralised aspects of the crypto industry need regulation (as in the markets/speculative angle), decentralised crypto is all about no regulation.

Anyway, it seems you see no redeeming facets of crypto. Interesting. :-)

Arrival

Blueshoe wrote: »

Arrival wrote: »

It's better to watch it to actually see the video as well but I guess that's better than nothing.

Yeah, what's wrong with that question? I'm asking how you think we will all pay for things in a few decades time, like will we still be using paper money. Everything is quickly evolving due to technology so all of us in this thread believe Bitcoin and certain other Cryptocurrencies are the evolution of money/payment, but you don't. So do you think we'll still actually be using FIAT in a few decades time? If you do, how do you think we'll cope with the inflation which FIAT currencies rely on?

The same way we have been using fiat in the last 50 years of inflation
Example. If a bag of chips cost you 10p in the 70s but it costs 3 euro now.
In the 70s you were getting 50 pounds a week wages are you getting 50 euro a week pay now?

Inflation and deflation are the cornerstone of fractional reserve banking and must be constantly fiddled with depending on how an economy is performing. You need to look into this a bit more.
If you don't understand it you can't have an accurate opinion on it

Yes, this is the point. Looking forward to paying €30 for a bag of chips in the future

grindle

Arrival wrote: »

Yes, this is the point. Looking forward to paying €30 for a bag of chips in the future

I think he thinks it "has to be this way" due to "reasons".

Amazing how people fall for the most obvious bullshít and claim manipulation in crypto as a curse whilst ignoring the far greater manipulation of the world's money supply. Prices should decrease over time given a static currency and a rising population, but we equate bigger numbers with success so prices rise. Money has been inflating rapidly and as time goes on it gets divided more unfairly over time.
Has to be that way of course. Reasons.

To the naysayers who love to post the parabolic bubble charts whilst calling crypto a scam - anything look familiar here:

But y'know, keep wasting your time crapping on a sub-trillion dollar asset class whilst the world's whole money supply has magically multiplied and coincidentally managed to fill the coffers of the world's wealthiest faster than ever before. :pac:

Blueshoe

grindle wrote: »

I think he thinks it "has to be this way" due to "reasons".

Amazing how people fall for the most obvious bullshít and claim manipulation in crypto as a curse whilst ignoring the far greater manipulation of the world's money supply. Prices should decrease over time given a static currency and a rising population, but we equate bigger numbers with success so prices rise. Money has been inflating rapidly and as time goes on it gets divided more unfairly over time.
Has to be that way of course. Reasons.

To the naysayers who love to post the parabolic bubble charts whilst calling crypto a scam - anything look familiar here:

But y'know, keep wasting your time crapping on a sub-trillion dollar asset class whilst the world's whole money supply has magically multiplied and coincidentally managed to fill the coffers of the world's wealthiest faster than ever before. :pac:

Prices should decrease because there are more people.

Explain that one please

grindle

Blueshoe wrote: »

Prices should decrease because there are more people.

Explain that one please

With a static currency wages and prices would experience the effects of deflation instead of us having to invent QE and abusing inflation to make things seem "fair" to people who've gotten used to benchmarked ever-increasing wages and property prices booming for fúck all reason.

I presume you imagine the 2008 bail-outs (bail-ins) weren't a manipulation of the markets?
Notions. Reminds me of the property forum here before the crash, everybody thought the constant upwards movement was natural - it was an illness and it was much more damaging than anything the crypto market has pulled off.

q85dw7osi4lebg

Blueshoe wrote: »

The crypto market is a mess. Like I said an unregulated, manipulated wild West full of insider trading, fake volume, pump and dump tactics etc.

But it's not supposed to be regulated

Blueshoe

Addison Fancy Macrame wrote: »

But it's not supposed to be regulated

The market should be. Especially when there is USD and Euro involved . If people want to trade worthless buttons with each other that's fine but when real money is involved it needs regulation of it is ever to become mainstream.

Blueshoe

grindle wrote: »

With a static currency wages and prices would experience the effects of deflation instead of us having to invent QE and abusing inflation to make things seem "fair" to people who've gotten used to benchmarked ever-increasing wages and property prices booming for fúck all reason.

I presume you imagine the 2008 bail-outs (bail-ins) weren't a manipulation of the markets?
Notions. Reminds me of the property forum here before the crash, everybody thought the constant upwards movement was natural - it was an illness and it was much more damaging than anything the crypto market has pulled off.

Do you think the bail outs shouldn't have happened? Where would the world economy be now.

Speculation on other assets has nothing to do with the crypto market.
Saying that the current monetary system or stock market is bad does not give any legitimacy to the crypto markets.
It's just another means of a cash grab. It's still valued in fiat currency .
Unlike the stock market though it is not regulated. An absolute mess

q85dw7osi4lebg

Blueshoe wrote: »

The market should be. Especially when there is USD and Euro involved . If people want to trade worthless buttons with each other that's fine but when real money is involved it needs regulation of it is ever to become mainstream.

Real money? No such thing.

Blueshoe

Addison Fancy Macrame wrote: »

Real money? No such thing.

Lol.

Go pay for your shopping or kids clothes with your tokens. See how that goes

And what do you intend to use to buy those tokens?

q85dw7osi4lebg

Blueshoe wrote: »

Lol.

Go pay for your shopping or kids clothes with your tokens. See how that goes

And what do you intend to use to buy those tokens?

You genuinely have nothing better to do with your life do you haha.

q85dw7osi4lebg

What happens if you use your Coinbase visa card to purchase crypto on Coinbase? Does a black hole open ?

Blueshoe

Addison Fancy Macrame wrote: »

You genuinely have nothing better to do with your life do you haha.

You have drawn a blank.
Respond with an insult instead.

No such thing as real money. Lol.

q85dw7osi4lebg

Blueshoe wrote: »

You have drawn a blank.
Respond with an insult instead.

No such thing as real money. Lol.

No, I'm just not arsed talking to a non believer, it's a battle that cant be won. This is the excited thread. Go over to the worried one and bash away.

I honestly don't know why someone would spend their weekends sealioning strangers on the web.

Blueshoe

Addison Fancy Macrame wrote: »

No, I'm just not arsed talking to a non believer, it's a battle that cant be won. This is the excited thread. Go over to the worried one and bash away.

I honestly don't know why someone would spend their weekends sealioning strangers on the web.

It's pissing rain all day. Iv little to do.
I'm off to Tesco now to buy food with fiat before it becomes useless and is replaced by tokens.

stockshares

makeorbrake wrote: »

In a bear market, there's just as much money to be made as in a bull market. i.e. if you believe that as of tomorrow morning, the price of Bitcoin is going to drop, you can take out a position to reflect that and make a bag full of $

That's if you have conviction in your claim.

Grumpypants wrote: »

The very simplest explanation would be if i thought Bitcoin would be 8k now but drop to 2k in July. I'd say to you, give me a loan of 10 bitcoin now and ill give them back in August.

You give them to me, i sell them all for 80k. Then buy them back for 20k in July. I give you back 10 bitcoin in August and pocket 60k profit.

The risk is of course that bitcoin goes to 10k and i've to spend 100k to get your coins back.

Thanks Lads.

So does it mean that two people bet on a different outcome for a coins price on a certain date and whoever loses pays the other

grindle

Blueshoe wrote: »

Do you think the bail outs shouldn't have happened? Where would the world economy be now.

Speculation on other assets has nothing to do with the crypto market.
Saying that the current monetary system or stock market is bad does not give any legitimacy to the crypto markets.
It's just another means of a cash grab. It's still valued in fiat currency .
Unlike the stock market though it is not regulated. An absolute mess

AIB should have been nationalised and phased out through buy-outs of their assets by competing banks over a set period, house prices should have had another 25-50% drop from what we consider the bottomed-out prices (seriously, at the bottom of the dip they were still massive overvalued - don't worry though, print more money, be graaaannnnnd... sometime.), the German bondholders should never have been paid back and if the EU refused to stump up money as an insurance against our failure they should have been taken to court.
They were literally blackmailing us. There isn't any other way to view it unless you lie.

Dohnjoe

stockshares wrote: »

Can someone explain Shorting to me. I've googled it but can't get my head around it.

Borrow the stock now, sell it now. Buy the stock later (when you believe it will be a lower price) and give the stock back to the lender

Blueshoe

grindle wrote: »

AIB should have been nationalised and phased out through buy-outs of their assets by competing banks over a set period, house prices should have had another 25-50% drop from what we consider the bottomed-out prices (seriously, at the bottom of the dip they were still massive overvalued - don't worry though, print more money, be graaaannnnnd... sometime.), the German bondholders should never have been paid back and if the EU refused to stump up money as an insurance against our failure they should have been taken to court.
They were literally blackmailing us. There isn't any other way to view it unless you lie.

What does that specifically have to do with crypto currency markets though?

What does it have to do with Eos or Vet or iota?

stockshares

Dohnjoe wrote: »

Borrow the stock now, sell it now. Buy the stock later (when you believe it will be a lower price) and give the stock back to the lender

Who do you borrow it from. Who ensures that it's paid back

Dohnjoe

grindle wrote: »

I presume you imagine the 2008 bail-outs (bail-ins) weren't a manipulation of the markets?

It wasn't a manipulation. It was a full-on rescue of the financial system, aka ourselves. If the system went into full meltdown (it came close enough), it was curtains, 1929 all over again, there were projections of 25%+ unemployment in the US, a catastrophic recession, "soup lines and shanty towns".. real disaster movie stuff. The only thing it would have achieved would have given the fickle public some old testament justice against the perceived arsonists

Actually the politicians in the US, on both sides of the divide, rejected the first TARP, it's only when it became clear that the fin. crisis was affecting their constituents, that ATMs would literally stop working, that there would be runs on banks (like Northern Rock in the UK) that they realised they had no choice

It was a no-brainer. Was it "fair"? not really. But banks, insurers, credit rating agencies, etc are institutions of people, there wasn't some evil bond villain behind it all. There wasn't much moral hazard behind it (except in Iceland). Many, if not most, got caught up in "bubble thinking", the notion that house prices wouldn't significantly drop, and even if they did, there'd be a brief "correction", the whole market became leveraged on that, took great risks, relaxed credit controls, relied on assets that didn't immediately belay growing numbers of underlying defaults (a bit like the mood in December 2017 for crypto)

Also regarding QE, yeah it was controversial, has benefits/drawbacks (it's not black and white), but in retrospect most economists seem to agree that it was beneficial considering the circumstances

stockshares

Apparently there is an Analyst who correctly predicted Bitcoins low point and the current high. The analyst made further predictions.
https://cryptopotato.com/the-analyst-who-predicted-bitcoins-bottom-current-price-says-16k-in-october/

I didn't think much of the article until Traders that I follow on Twitter started tweeting on it.

The future predictions are in the screenshot.

JJJJNR

Dohnjoe wrote: »

It wasn't a manipulation. It was a full-on rescue of the financial system, aka ourselves. If the system went into full meltdown (it came close enough), it was curtains, 1929 all over again, there were projections of 25%+ unemployment in the US, a catastrophic recession, "soup lines and shanty towns".. real disaster movie stuff. The only thing it would have achieved would have given the fickle public some old testament justice against the perceived arsonists

Actually the politicians in the US, on both sides of the divide, rejected the first TARP, it's only when it became clear that the fin. crisis was affecting their constituents, that ATMs would literally stop working, that there would be runs on banks (like Northern Rock in the UK) that they realised they had no choice

It was a no-brainer. Was it "fair"? not really. But banks, insurers, credit rating agencies, etc are institutions of people, there wasn't some evil bond villain behind it all. There wasn't much moral hazard behind it (except in Iceland). Many, if not most, got caught up in "bubble thinking", the notion that house prices wouldn't significantly drop, and even if they did, there'd be a brief "correction", the whole market became leveraged on that, took great risks, relaxed credit controls, relied on assets that didn't immediately belay growing numbers of underlying defaults (a bit like the mood in December 2017 for crypto)

Also regarding QE, yeah it was controversial, has benefits/drawbacks (it's not black and white), but in retrospect most economists seem to agree that it was beneficial considering the circumstances

Ahem. Does the Rothschilds being a partner in Anglo telling the bank to pump irish developers with cheap credit to build houses and then sit back and watch the house of cards fall not constitute....manipulation.

Dohnjoe

JJJJNR wrote: »

Ahem. Does the Rothschilds being a partner in Anglo telling the bank to pump irish developers with cheap credit to build houses and then sit back and watch the house of cards fall not constitute....manipulation.

"Can you provide an overview of the key factors involved in the housing crisis"

"The Jews.."