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neutral?

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2

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    #32
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    wotzgoingon wrote: »

    What the hell would you be joining a live there for anyway the live feed is already there connected to the dimmer switch.
    The answer to that is in the first post.
    Now two earths in the same wire, come on lads leave it to those who know.
    Well I think it was being jokingly pointed out that 230v between phase and another 2 wires, is not absolute proof that one is a neutral.


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    #33
    wotzgoingon
    Registered Users Posts: 14,309 ✭✭✭✭wotzgoingon


    Bruthal wrote: »
    The answer to that is in the first post.

    I wasn't referring to the first post. I was answer comments in the thread where people were claiming the two "neutral" wires in the connector were a live feed.

    Also if the OP has to come on a public forum to ask if they were a neutral I don't think he/she should be wiring up the smart switches tbh.


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    #34
    gctest50
    Registered Users Posts: 9,605 ✭✭✭gctest50


    wotzgoingon wrote: »

    I wasn't referring to the first post. I was answer comments in the thread where people were claiming the two "neutral" wires in the connector were a live feed.

    wotzgoingon wrote: »

    were a live feed.

    No, anyone with any sense ( me included) were claiming it could be a live feed

    Just test it


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    #35
    wotzgoingon
    Registered Users Posts: 14,309 ✭✭✭✭wotzgoingon


    Tomorrow in day light or even now if you have a torch disconnect the two neutrals which I know they are and also the feed and switch wire. Also turn off the electricity by the main switch easier for someone who doesn't know which circuit is which. Then disconnect the two wires in the ceiling light or what ever light the switch activates and short the live and neutral. Then go back to switch and connect the DMM to the switch wire and neutral and set it to beep and it should beep or show a short if you have it set to ohms.

    Now you will know it is a neutral which I knew all along


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    #36
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    wotzgoingon wrote: »
    I wasn't referring to the first post. I was answer comments in the thread where people were claiming the two "neutral" wires in the connector were a live feed.
    Nothing would surprise me. Although as another poster said, it looked properly done, which indicated its a neutral.

    What would have happened if they connected the smart switch, and the blue was a phase I wonder.
    Nothing really
    Also if the OP has to come on a public forum to ask if they were a neutral I don't think he/she should be wiring up the smart switches tbh.

    Maybe not.


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    #37
    gctest50
    Registered Users Posts: 9,605 ✭✭✭gctest50


    wotzgoingon wrote: »
    ......

    Now you will know it is a neutral which I knew all along


    How did you know all along ?

    Were you at his house ?

    Did you test it ?


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    #38
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    wotzgoingon wrote: »

    Now you will know it is a neutral which I knew all along

    You assumed.

    If I was at the house, I would assume too, but I would be in a position to check it.

    My gas boiler packed in last week. I was sure it was the PCB after a few tests. Eventually I confirmed. Did I know it was?

    More importantly, could I be arrested,,,


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    #39
    gctest50
    Registered Users Posts: 9,605 ✭✭✭gctest50


    wotzgoingon wrote: »

    Tomorrow in day light or even now if you have a torch disconnect the two neutrals which I know they are and also the feed and switch wire. ...

    Retarded advice that leaves boards.ie wide open to legal action


    If you do that and there is a load swinging out of the other blue wire in the photo, it will "become live" ( enough to wake you up anyway) - it may not be on a RC device


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    #40
    kramer1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 305 ✭✭kramer1


    I was joking about the earth , it's clearly a neutral. Can't believe this has gone on this long , pretty entertaining .


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    #41
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    kramer1 wrote: »
    pretty entertaining .

    It used to be more often. Very serious these days.


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    #42
    wotzgoingon
    Registered Users Posts: 14,309 ✭✭✭✭wotzgoingon


    gctest50 wrote: »
    Retarded advice that leaves boards.ie wide open to legal action


    If you do that and there is a load swinging out of the other blue wire in the photo, it will "become live" ( enough to wake you up anyway) - it may not be on a RC device

    Well it's common sense to pull the main switch first I couldn't be arsed changing around the text when i wrote that post.


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    #43
    wotzgoingon
    Registered Users Posts: 14,309 ✭✭✭✭wotzgoingon


    gctest50 wrote: »
    Retarded advice that leaves boards.ie wide open to legal action


    If you do that and there is a load swinging out of the other blue wire in the photo, it will "become live" ( enough to wake you up anyway) - it may not be on a RC device

    How would there be two live feeds at the light. What your saying is there would be a live feed when you activate the switch and another feeding the neutral. look your not an electrician obviously just by reading this post I quoted leave it to the pros thank you.


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    #44
    Tuco88
    Registered Users Posts: 1,051 ✭✭✭Tuco88


    I am now confused... Do I leave the car in neutral or what?


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    #45
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    Tuco88 wrote: »
    I am now confused... Do I leave the car in neutral or what?

    Only if its blue


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    #46
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    wotzgoingon wrote: »
    How would there be two live feeds at the light. What your saying is there would be a live feed when you activate the switch and another feeding the neutral. look your not an electrician obviously just by reading this post I quoted leave it to the pros thank you.

    I guess he means if the neutral is opened, and the circuit is on.


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    #47
    gctest50
    Registered Users Posts: 9,605 ✭✭✭gctest50


    wotzgoingon wrote: »

    How would there be two live feeds at the light. What your saying is there would be a live feed when you activate the switch and another feeding the neutral. look your not an electrician obviously just by reading this post I quoted leave it to the pros thank you.

    I think you are just trolling at this stage


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    #48
    wotzgoingon
    Registered Users Posts: 14,309 ✭✭✭✭wotzgoingon


    gctest50 wrote: »
    Retarded advice that leaves boards.ie wide open to legal action


    If you do that and there is a load swinging out of the other blue wire in the photo, it will "become live" ( enough to wake you up anyway) - it may not be on a RC device

    Also you will never get a shock from a neutral on non RCD lighting circuit. So I do not know where you get this load swinging from....


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    #49
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    The lights are on, but there`s nobody home.


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    #50
    Tuco88
    Registered Users Posts: 1,051 ✭✭✭Tuco88


    wotzgoingon wrote: »
    Also you will never get a shock from a neutral on non RCD lighting circuit. So I do not know where you get this load swinging from....

    What happens when you break the neutral on a live circuit?


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    #51
    wotzgoingon
    Registered Users Posts: 14,309 ✭✭✭✭wotzgoingon


    Tuco88 wrote: »
    What happens when you break the neutral on a live circuit?

    Everything its is connected to will stop working. Also the comment you won't get a shock is true but obviously if there was a short you would for the few mili seconds until the breaker tripped.


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    #52
    listermint
    Registered Users Posts: 34,013 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    wotzgoingon wrote: »
    Tomorrow in day light or even now if you have a torch disconnect the two neutrals which I know they are and also the feed and switch wire. Also turn off the electricity by the main switch easier for someone who doesn't know which circuit is which. Then disconnect the two wires in the ceiling light or what ever light the switch activates and short the live and neutral. Then go back to switch and connect the DMM to the switch wire and neutral and set it to beep and it should beep or show a short if you have it set to ohms.

    Now you will know it is a neutral which I knew all along

    Without being funny.

    I wouldn't have you in my house if your not prepared to test things before diving in .

    Rule one


    Never assume anything. Especially with live feeds. Never

    The first man to make bravado assumptions is the first man injured..


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    #53
    wotzgoingon
    Registered Users Posts: 14,309 ✭✭✭✭wotzgoingon


    listermint wrote: »
    Without being funny.

    I wouldn't have you in my house if your not prepared to test things before diving in .

    Rule one


    Never assume anything. Especially with live feeds. Never

    The first man to make bravado assumptions is the first man injured..

    It's kind of funny that you quoted the post where I showed you how to do a basic trace.


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    #54
    gctest50
    Registered Users Posts: 9,605 ✭✭✭gctest50


    wotzgoingon wrote: »
    Also you will never get a shock from a neutral on non RCD lighting circuit. So I do not know where you get this load swinging from....

    wotzgoingon wrote: »

    Also the comment you won't get a shock is true

    You will get a shock, depends on the upstream load swinging out of the neutral



    QcI8kjq.png



    T6JLcDW.png


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    #55
    Tuco88
    Registered Users Posts: 1,051 ✭✭✭Tuco88


    wotzgoingon wrote: »
    Everything its is connected to will stop working. Also the comment you won't get a shock is true but obviously if there was a short you would for the few mili seconds until the breaker tripped.

    Well you're in for a shock when you test that theory.


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    #56
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    gctest50 wrote: »
    You will get a shock, depends on the upstream load swinging out of the neutral

    What happens if the ebay lamp was 1 megohm, what voltage then?


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    #57
    gctest50
    Registered Users Posts: 9,605 ✭✭✭gctest50


    Bruthal wrote: »
    What happens if the ebay lamp was 1 megohm, what voltage then?

    230, then drops depending on the resistance of the boards clown completing the circuit


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    #58
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    gctest50 wrote: »
    230

    How would you know?


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    #59
    gctest50
    Registered Users Posts: 9,605 ✭✭✭gctest50


    wotzgoingon wrote: »

    Also you will never get a shock from a neutral on non RCD lighting circuit.

    Livestream it so

    Connect a 500w lamp to a non RCD supply

    Cut the neutral and hold both ends, one in each hand

    Since you will get a shock or die from this, try contact boards from beyond the grave


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    #60
    Bruthal
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,422 ✭✭✭✭Bruthal


    gctest50 wrote: »
    230, then drops depending on the resistance of the boards clown completing the circuit

    Well if it was 100k ohm analogue meter and you test the open points, it will read 21 volts.

    Test with a 5 megohm digital meter, and it will read 191v.

    Which is correct?

    Both really.

    And that is related to these ghost voltages seen with digital multimeters, they are real voltages, but the capacitive coupling that causes them has so high an impedance, that it is not detectable by touch etc, only by very high impedance meters.

    A 2k ohm person in series with 50 megohm cap coupling circuit cap coupled to nearby live circuits (de-energised but near live circuits) , will have almost 0v across them. The meter though, with its multi megohm impedance, can have 20 or 30v or more show on it.


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    #61
    wotzgoingon
    Registered Users Posts: 14,309 ✭✭✭✭wotzgoingon


    gctest50 wrote: »
    Livestream it so

    Connect a 500w lamp to a non RCD supply

    Cut the neutral and hold both ends, one in each hand

    Since you will get a shock or die from this, try contact boards from beyond the grave

    Ok I will do it tomorrow, I'm a little busy now. Don't you worry i won't let you down.


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