2019 All Ireland Senior Football Championship *Mod note: Post #1*

STB.

corny wrote: »

Walsh gets a fair amount of stick but i'd be blaming the players first and foremost. They jogged around the place in the second half as if the game was already won. There has to be personal responsibility in that.

Dont know about that corny.

There seemed to be a defensive game plan. Roscommon were laterally passing the ball back and forth around the bus parked there.

The only time that changed was in the 77th minute. The second half was an absolute embarrassment for a Division 1 side in a provincial final.

grbear

PressRun wrote: »

Oh sure, I wouldn't expect them to sack him immediately. Just wondering if he'll be given further benefit of the doubt after this, even if they do still make super 8s.

AFAIK his term is up at the end of the year. Hard to see any scenario where he is still there next year.

Fann Linn

Trio123 wrote: »

Some of the posts here are comical. Roscommon obviously needed to change their game going by the the last 2 years. They've brought physicality and cuteness to their game and could be a force to be reckoned with in the super 8!

As opposed to this Galway team who have stuck rigidly to a game plan which doesn't work. Even when playing against 14 men on some occasions.

FrancieBrady

STB. wrote: »

Dont know about that corny.

There seemed to be a defensive game plan. Roscommon were laterally passing the ball back and forth around the bus parked there.

The only time that changed was in the 77th minute. The second half was an absolute embarrassment for a Division 1 side in a provincial final.

Players must have known what was happening. The blame lies with them first and foremost imo

threeball

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Players must have known what was happening. The blame lies with them first and foremost imo

If you've trained for 4yrs to play a certain way that's what you revert to when the going gets tough. Its not that easy to turn years of training on its head mid game.

Trio123

Fann Linn wrote: »

As opposed to this Galway team who have stuck rigidly to a game plan which doesn't work. Even when playing against 14 men on some occasions.

Galway went man for man against Roscommon in the second half last year which worked out a treat for them. Don't think it would have worked out today.

Sonny678

threeball wrote:

Why would you even consider 35years ago as modern. The most you could go back is to the oldest player on either of the two teams which is probably cluxton and they have beaten ye up a stick each and every time. That's even if ye got to play them and weren't knocked out by laois or carlow before you got to them.

threeball wrote:

To say it's an even modern rivalry is pure fantasy.

1983 is the pivotal year , the landmark year in the Meath v Dublin rivalry. For younger supporters they might think the rivalry begins in 2014 or in this decade. But it is a rivalry going back decades. But yes 1983 is the beginning of the modern rivalry in anyones book who understands Meath and Dublin. It begins in the 40s and 50s and early 60s . There is no game between both counties from 1964 to 1973.

1974 is the year zero for Dublin football. Before 1974 there is no hill 16 , modern Dublin gaa the boys in blue begins in 1974. Dublin play Meath in early 80s but the rivalry is dead , it is one sided. It reignites in 1983. This is the landmark year why ?

1 It is Sean Boylans first year as Meath manager.
2 It is Sean Boylans first year to manage Meath v Dublin championship match
3 It is Kevin Heffernans Dublin v Sean Boylans Meath. Meath draw in 83 v Dublin who become Leinster champions and All Ireland champions in 83 .

The rivalry goes up a level in 80s and 90s as Meaths Boylan go up a level and the rivalry captures the attention of the nation and peaks in 1991 when the fourth game is the first live televised game ever not an All Ireland final or semi final or a railway cup. It is the first ever game in the championship not played on Sunday. The 4 games Meath v Dublin in 91 kickstarts the modern gaa as we know it. The first games with sponsorship on Jerseys. People felt after Italia 1990 the GAA was in serious trouble. Attendances throughout the 80s were falling. After 91 there is an upturn in everything GAA. 1991 4 games gave the sport a massive injection of confidence and football and hurling would grow and grow as the 90s went on with Ulster teams winning Sam and Clare and Wexford winning hurling. But 4 games in 91 Meath v Dublin are the turning point. And that rivalry begins in 1983.

Anyway u look.at 1983 is the beginning of the modern Meath v Dublin rivalry. The same way 1975 is the beginning of the modern kerry v Dublin rivalry , the mid 90s was the beginning of Clare v Tippearey hurling rivalry. Yes rivalries go up and down. But before 1975, kerry and Dublin was a very different rivalry. They met in 1955 but 1975 is the real.year zero..The same with Clare and Tipp in mid 00s. Loughanes Clare is different to Clare before Loughnane . The same way Dublin is different to the Dublin before Heffernan in 1974 and Meath is different to the Meath before Boylans Meath which begins in 1983. But if u want to include the Meath v Dublin leinster finals of 70s its still a very close rivalry. Yes Dublin have gone ahead since Jim Galvin took over but the rivalry is still close.

So this Meath v Dublin since 1960 that is 59 years of championship games between Meath v Dublin .

There has been 18 Meath v Dublin leinster finals since 1960 and no draws.

Dublin have beaten Meath in 10 Meath v Dublin leinster finals
Meath have beaten Dublin in 8 Meath v Dublin leinster finals.

Since 1960 Meath v Dublin championship games
There has been 5 Meath v Dublin championship draws draws
Dublin have beaten Meath 17 times in the leinster championship
Meath have beaten Dublin 12 times in the championship.

Remeber most teams in leinster havent beaten Dublin in the championship in decades.

1 Wexford Wicklow and Carlow have beaten Dublin in the leinster championship in 70 years. Longford havent beaten Dublin in 50 years in leinster championship. Louth havent beaten Dublin in 45 years in the leinster championship. Westmeath once in 70 years , Offaly havent beaten Dublin in leinster in 35 years , laois have beaten Dublin twice in 65 years and kildare havent beaten Dublin twice in leinster championship in 45 years. Kildare would have beaten Dublin in 1 leinster final in 91 years. Meath have beaten Dublin in 7 leinster finals in last 35 years. Meath record v Dublin is outstanding in the provience.

2 And outstanding outside the provience. Meath have 35 victories over Dublin in league and championship. The only county comes close would be kerry. And who r the only county outside leinster who have double digit championship wins v Dublin The rest of the country the best of the rest would have a couple of victories over Dublin in the championship.

Championship v Dublin
1 Galway havent beaten Dublin since 1920s in championship.
2 Mayo have 2 victories and 1 draw ever over Dublin in championship eg 2005 and 2012. While the rest of Connacht have never beaten Dublin in championship.
3 In Ulster in the championship v Dublin Tyrone have 2 victories and 1 draw , Armagh have 2 victories , Donegal have 2 victories and 1 draw ( 92 and 2014) , Derry have 1 victory ( 93 ) , Down have 1 victory.
4 Down south , Cork have only beaten Dublin 3 times in the championship. kerry have 17 championship victories and 2 draws v Dublin which is extraordinary record. But Meaths 20 victories and 9 draws in the championship and then 15 victories in the league shows Meaths outstanding record v Dublin. Meath v Dublin is now one sided rivalry, but traditionally Meath is Dublins biggest rival and greatest nemesis.

elefant

threeball wrote: »

Forget about splitting Dublin and all that Craic. We'll just insist that Gavin is out and Kevin Walsh is their new manager. 20yr contract. All will be good.

Best thing for Galway football would be for him to resign this evening. An utterly unforgivable second half, including a series of baffling substitutions.

corny

STB. wrote: »

Dont know about that corny.

There seemed to be a defensive game plan. Roscommon were laterally passing the ball back and forth around the bus parked there.

The only time that changed was in the 77th minute. The second half was an absolute embarrassment for a Division 1 side in a provincial final.

Dublin will do the same thing if they get a few scores in front....AI last year they got their lead and spent the second half keeping Tyrone at arms length. They habitually do the same thing against Mayo. Its not a new or defunct tactic. Every team worth their salt make it difficult for the opposition with numbers behind the ball.

The difference between Dublin and Galway is Dublin will embrace the plan with vigour and fight for the ball. Its not beneath them. The Galway lads just capitulated when asked to do the same. There's no other word for it. Tactics are irrelevant when your man is outworking you and thats what happened. Watch the Roscommon goal. One Galway player is sprinting back and the rest are jogging. The two lads in the full back line were thinking what they'll have for dinner tonight!

I'm not an apologist. Saying Walsh isn't picking the right team or saying ultimately results are his problem might be valid. But letting the players off scot free after that just doesn't seem right to me. They have to be at least partly responsible for that performance.

PressRun

Of course players shoulder some responsibility, there seemed to be some complacency in the second half and it wouldn't be the first time. But management has married them to a system that ultimately is not going to get them anywhere.

Lucas44

OldMrBrennan83 wrote: »

They could be playing in the snow with a bag of sand and it's still going to be more entertaining than rugby.

Says the very man who’ll be Ireland’s biggest fan come World Cup! Rugby and hurling the two biggest/entertaining sports by far in Ireland at the minute

OldMrBrennan83

Lucas44 wrote: »

Says the very man who’ll be Ireland’s biggest fan come World Cup! Rugby and hurling the two biggest sports by far in Ireland at the minute

Eh what? I wouldn't turn on two seconds of the world cup. Best case is "Ireland" bomb out and end up home early.

Slattsy

Lucas44 wrote: »

Says the very man who’ll be Ireland’s biggest fan come World Cup! Rugby and hurling the two biggest/entertaining sports by far in Ireland at the minute

Nonsense of the highest order. Two of the most unskillful and boring sports at the minute.

RMAOK

elefant wrote: »

Best thing for Galway football would be for him to resign this evening. An utterly unforgivable second half, including a series of baffling substitutions.

The most difficult substitution to fathom imo was bringing on Molloy with 4 minutes gone in injury time. He should have been on long before it if he was fit to come on at all.

Sean Kelly looked like he had strapping on his leg ( was he 100% fit?) yet he was the first man on.

Strumms

Trio123 wrote: »

They've brought physicality and cuteness to their game and could be a force to be reckoned with in the super 8!

They’ve brought..poor sportsmanship, mass fouling, simulation and overall cheating and got good at it. Taking advantage of a piss weak, clueless bunch of officials. In fact they went a ways to become the most dislikable team I watched for a while in any sport.

I’d say there would be some ‘feedback’ after that to the officials in question and the next set of boys in black will be on the active lookout for their carry on and be actively seeking to put a stop to it from the throw in. Only right too.

threeball

RMAOK wrote: »

The most difficult substitution to fathom imo was bringing on Molloy with 4 minutes gone in injury time. He should have been on long before it if he was fit to come on at all.

Sean Kelly looked like he had strapping on his leg ( was he 100% fit?) yet he was the first man on.

Bringing on Molloy and farragher in garbage time was a slap in the face to them both. Farragher is a great goal poacher and should have been on at most 15 mins from the end. What were they going to do with what he gave them.

Game crying out for powerful running from deep and molloy comes on after 74mins. Should have told Walsh to stick it.

BonnieSituation

Slattsy wrote: »

Nonsense of the highest order. Two of the most unskillful and boring sports at the minute.

I'd agree with hurling. Bar an apparent cracker last night it's been a long time since I cared about the small ball.

Rugby Union on the other hand, I will take you to task on sir.

A coddle fight?

threeball

Slattsy wrote: »

Nonsense of the highest order. Two of the most unskillful and boring sports at the minute.

Now that's proper nonsense. You can accuse hurling of a lot of things but being unskillful is not one of them. Even bad games require ridiculous levels of skill.

PMU

alchemist33 wrote: »

Ref should abandon the match and have a replay

ye wouldnt win the replay either

alchemist33

PMU wrote: »

ye wouldnt win the replay either

Who is this "ye"?

Trio123

Strumms wrote: »

They’ve brought..poor sportsmanship, mass fouling, simulation and overall cheating and got good at it. Taking advantage of a piss weak, clueless bunch of officials. In fact they went a ways to become the most dislikable team I watched for a while in any sport.

I’d say there would be some ‘feedback’ after that to the officials in question and the next set of boys in black will be on the active lookout for their carry on and be actively seeking to put a stop to it from the throw in. Only right too.

The game was in salthill, in very testing conditions! The manager gave them a job at half time and the players responded. In fairness Roscommon at their best have been a very entertaining team to watch! I've seen a lot worse "cheating" and cynical play from other teams.

Slattsy

BonnieSituation wrote: »

I'd agree with hurling. Bar an apparent cracker last night it's been a long time since I cared about the small ball.

Rugby Union on the other hand, I will take you to task on sir.

A coddle fight?

More skill in darts!

It's not coddle weather though. Will have to wait until autumn.

kippy

Trio123 wrote: »

The game was in salthill, in very testing conditions! The manager gave them a job at half time and the players responded. In fairness Roscommon at their best have been a very entertaining team to watch! I've seen a lot worse "cheating" and cynical play from other teams.

Roscommon were well within their rights to engage in time wasting and cynical play. Almost every other county does it and unless the powers that be put more effort into stamping it out, its obviously a tool that any county can use, some with greater effect than others.
Galway seem to be one of the most over rated counties in the country. They should do better with the players available to them. Walsh has to be under serious pressure.

STB.

corny wrote: »

Dublin will do the same thing if they get a few scores in front....AI last year they got their lead and spent the second half keeping Tyrone at arms length. They habitually do the same thing against Mayo. Its not a new or defunct tactic. Every team worth their salt make it difficult for the opposition with numbers behind the ball.

The difference between Dublin and Galway is Dublin will embrace the plan with vigour and fight for the ball. Its not beneath them. The Galway lads just capitulated when asked to do the same. There's no other word for it. Tactics are irrelevant when your man is outworking you and thats what happened. Watch the Roscommon goal. One Galway player is sprinting back and the rest are jogging. The two lads in the full back line were thinking what they'll have for dinner tonight!

I'm not an apologist. Saying Walsh isn't picking the right team or saying ultimately results are his problem might be valid. But letting the players off scot free after that just doesn't seem right to me. They have to be at least partly responsible for that performance.

What I am saying is that Plan A in employing what was largely a defensive strategy didn't work. The Galway team looked like could they up it at any stage in the first half. I actually thought it was an endurance test whereby they were just sitting back waiting for Roscommon to knacker themselves, before flicking the switch. Of coure that didnt happen and Galway found themselves hemmed in with Roscommon playing a game of keep ball, and the clock ticking.

It was only in the 75th min that the penny seemed to drop that they were actually in a game. At no stage did I see any changes or urgency from management to change things. It took 20 minutes to score a point in the second half. And another 15 to score a second. Yes players have a responsibility, but what where the management doing ?

Galway in my mind have been a top 4 team, but that performance today was Division 4 stuff.

Connacht is always unpredictable though and anything can happen and invariably does. Perhaps it is just a glitch.

rossie1977

Cosmo Kramer wrote: »

Disgraceful stuff from the fans. And the TV commentators condoning it are even worse. Like watching something from 30 or 40 years ago.

Next time abandon the game, will put a fairly quick stop to that shyte.

Well we have had enough 'provincials don't matter anymore' posts on here, tell that to the thousands of rossie fans who invaded the pitch today.

Of course provincials matter, if cork, meath or Cavan win next week you have similar scenes

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I can never get my head around how Corofin can be so good at club level, arguably one of the top club teams in history.
But Galway can never seem to harness that at intercounty level since the late 90's.

Club football is horrendous standard. The league is really poor itself that it counts for little in the championship. Watch mayo micks youtube highlights of league final and recent Mayo Roscommon game. The difference in intensity and tackling between two games is like night and day.

Fan of Netflix

Galway should be doing much better considering the quality of the players they have. The Corofin lads and another dozen other great players there. They play dire stuff to watch.

It's much worse than Fermanagh, Fermanagh are a tiny county with barely any players to pick from. Galway should be doing much better, was happy to see the Rossies get the win. I doubt Dublin will concerned though, looking very good for them to get another All Ireland.

Strumms

Trio123 wrote: »

The game was in salthill, in very testing conditions! The manager gave them a job at half time and the players responded. In fairness Roscommon at their best have been a very entertaining team to watch! I've seen a lot worse "cheating" and cynical play from other teams.

The game was in Salthill and in testing conditions... ok so by this the next game which is staged in inclement or ‘testing’ conditions we can give a hall pass to any team who conducts themselves in a similar display of thuggish disruption and anti football ? not for me I was sick enough watching it, if I had to support a team resorting to a similar ‘tactics’ I’d take up dominos.

corny

Slattsy wrote: »

Nonsense of the highest order. Two of the most unskillful and boring sports at the minute.

Love in with the stick fighting didn't last long Slattsy.

rossie1977

Fan of Netflix wrote: »

Galway should be doing much better considering the quality of the players they have. The Corofin lads and another dozen other great players there. They play dire stuff to watch.

It's much worse than Fermanagh, Fermanagh are a tiny county with barely any players to pick from. Galway should be doing much better, was happy to see the Rossies get the win. I doubt Dublin will concerned though, looking very good for them to get another All Ireland.

Galway have good players sure but between 2007-2016 Roscommon reached 9 Connacht under 21 finals winning 4..galway won 2 during same period. They lost in extra time to Galway in 13 (a match Roscommon dominated) and Galway won all Ireland, lost in 16 last kick of game to Mayo which again Roscommon dominated and Mayo win all Ireland.

Anyway my point is these Roscommon lads have beaten the current Mayo and Galway county players numerous times at minor and under 21 between 2010-16.

Many of the players playing today played in this game https://www.the42.ie/roscommon-connacht-u21-champions-thrilling-final-galway-2031025-Apr2015/

Trio123

Strumms wrote: »

The game was in Salthill and in testing conditions... ok so by this the next game which is staged in inclement or ‘testing’ conditions we can give a hall pass to any team who conducts themselves in a similar display of thuggish disruption and anti football ? not for me I was sick enough watching it, if I had to support a team resorting to a similar ‘tactics’ I’d take up dominos.

Dominos would probably suit you better!