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Chimney crack

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  • 15-04-2019 1:45pm
    #1
    marykitty47
    Registered Users Posts: 115 ✭✭


    Hi all

    Bought a house and had a building inspection report carried out that stated there was no cracks in the chimnchimney breast. Upon painting we can see a crack and had it checked and there are quite a few issues that need to br fixed including flue and relining etc eye and quite a significant cost to us. I have co tested the engineer who carried out the inspection and discussed the matter with him and he viewed the crack himself and had his own survey carried out on it. I spoke to the honey specialist when he was there and he listed all the issues including not installed correctly relining etc and said he would discuss with the engineer. The engineer then proceeded to tell me there is no issues?!! And he can recommend someone to hide the crack for cosmetic reasons. I told him exactly what his chimney specialist advised and that I also had a full survey carried out and I'm still waiting a response. What can I do here?


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    #2
    ted1
    Registered Users Posts: 23,523 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    Is the chimney specialists an engineer? Just because some one specialises in an area makes them an expert.

    How old is the house ? Do you intend to fit a stove ? Or use the chimney ?


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    #3
    marykitty47
    Registered Users Posts: 115 ✭✭marykitty47


    No he is not an engineer. The house is 20 years old. There is a stove there that doesn't meet fire regulations that needs to be re-done. My issue is that the engineer stated there was no crack when there was. I'd we were aware of the crack prior to purchasing we would have had it checked to realise it is costing us €5k to fix.


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    #4
    ted1
    Registered Users Posts: 23,523 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    marykitty47 wrote: »
    No he is not an engineer. The house is 20 years old. There is a stove there that doesn't meet fire regulations that needs to be re-done. My issue is that the engineer stated there was no crack when there was. I'd we were aware of the crack prior to purchasing we would have had it checked to realise it is costing us €5k to fix.


    It only needs to meet fire regulations at the time of install.
    A chimney should be lined for a stove. It shouldn’t cost 5k.


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    #5
    Victor
    Registered Users Posts: 78,402 ✭✭✭✭Victor


    How big is the crack? How far through the wall does it go?

    Minor cracks in plasterwork generally aren't a problem.


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    #6
    marykitty47
    Registered Users Posts: 115 ✭✭marykitty47


    My issue is that the engineer stated there was no crack when there is. If I had known this prior to buying the house I would have the chimney itself checked. Surely the engineer is liable for this?


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    #7
    blackbox
    Registered Users Posts: 4,317 ✭✭✭blackbox


    I'll bet you will find that the engineer's contract was carefully worded to ensure that he/she will have no liability.


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    #8
    ted1
    Registered Users Posts: 23,523 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    marykitty47 wrote: »
    My issue is that the engineer stated there was no crack when there is. If I had known this prior to buying the house I would have the chimney itself checked. Surely the engineer is liable for this?

    Is it a cosmetic crack? Was the report based on visual inspection ? What made you a (non ?) qualified specialist ?


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    #9
    bri007
    Registered Users Posts: 1,375 ✭✭✭bri007


    From experience the surveys are all visual and on the terms and conditions at the bottom of it exempt the engineer from anything that turns up later on.

    Your basically paying someone that if it isn’t obvious defect within the house from walking around, examining cracks he can see, damp etc but even so he won’t say for certain it’s down to x y or z.


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    #10
    antiskeptic
    Registered Users Posts: 9,555 ✭✭✭antiskeptic


    marykitty47 wrote: »
    Hi all

    Bought a house and had a building inspection report carried out that stated there was no cracks in the chimnchimney breast. Upon painting we can see a crack and had it checked and there are quite a few issues that need to br fixed including flue and relining etc eye and quite a significant cost to us. I have co tested the engineer who carried out the inspection and discussed the matter with him and he viewed the crack himself and had his own survey carried out on it. I spoke to the honey specialist when he was there and he listed all the issues including not installed correctly relining etc and said he would discuss with the engineer. The engineer then proceeded to tell me there is no issues?!! And he can recommend someone to hide the crack for cosmetic reasons. I told him exactly what his chimney specialist advised and that I also had a full survey carried out and I'm still waiting a response. What can I do here?

    Who told you it needs relining? The norm is for:

    a) chimney co. carries out cctv inspection

    b) they spot a hairline crack(s) in the flue liner and say 'relining required'.

    Its a scam. I asked such a company why , given a designed-in brick sized ope (from room into flue above fireplace) they had an issue with a hairline crack in the liner. Shrug of shoulders, repeat to fade.

    A flue sucks air in from the exterior (fireplace/ cracks in flue, it doesn't blow fumes out.

    The question is: is it wholesale flue damage ( chunks missing from previous chimney fires) or some hairline cracks.

    I'm a mechanical engineer, understand how things work/fail, know what questions to ask, know when I'm being fed bull$h**it. Even if the bull$h**it id is inadvertently spread by folk who don't actually understand why its bull$hu**t


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    #11
    marykitty47
    Registered Users Posts: 115 ✭✭marykitty47


    ted1 wrote: »
    Is it a cosmetic crack? Was the report based on visual inspection ? What made you a (non ?) qualified specialist ?

    Yes visual inspection with a visual crack and he stated there wasn't.


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    #12
    marykitty47
    Registered Users Posts: 115 ✭✭marykitty47


    bri007 wrote: »
    From experience the surveys are all visual and on the terms and conditions at the bottom of it exempt the engineer from anything that turns up later on.

    Your basically paying someone that if it isn’t obvious defect within the house from walking around, examining cracks he can see, damp etc but even so he won’t say for certain it’s down to x y or z.

    It is obvious from walking around.


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    #13
    Metric Tensor
    Registered Users Posts: 3,724 ✭✭✭Metric Tensor


    Does the "chimney expert" provide (i.e. sell) the repair service or have links with the company that do? If so their advice is not independent.

    I have seen quite a few surveys in my time. I have never seen one to explicitly state "the chimney has no cracks". Do you mean that the survey did not specifically identify a crack in the chimney rather than categorically stating there are none.

    Finally. You need a totally independent review of the chimney from someone who does not sell any products or repair services. You will have to pay for this. If you are not paying for it the advice will not be independent.


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    #14
    my3cents
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,764 ✭✭✭my3cents


    OP how can you see this crack are you sticking your head up the chimney?

    A crack in the plaster work on the chimney breast will show up with tar stains dripping from it if it is a crack that goes through to the chimney itself.

    If its that obvious why didn't you spot it yourself before the purchase?


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    #15
    marykitty47
    Registered Users Posts: 115 ✭✭marykitty47


    Metric Tensor wrote: »
    Does the "chimney expert" provide (i.e. sell) the repair service or have links with the company that do? If so their advice is not independent.

    I have seen quite a few surveys in my time. I have never seen one to explicitly state "the chimney has no cracks". Do you mean that the survey did not specifically identify a crack in the chimney rather than categorically stating there are none.

    Finally. You need a totally independent review of the chimney from someone who does not sell any products or repair services. You will have to pay for this. If you are not paying for it the advice will not be independent.

    The survey explicitly stated that the chimney breast has no cracks. I had an independent review carried out that was chargeable and a free review - both advised the same thing.

    The engineer had a survey carried out also and i was at the property at the time and the chimney expert states there was a range of issues yet the next day the engineer told me very differently.


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    #16
    Metric Tensor
    Registered Users Posts: 3,724 ✭✭✭Metric Tensor


    marykitty47 wrote: »
    The survey explicitly stated that the chimney breast has no cracks. I had an independent review carried out that was chargeable and a free review - both advised the same thing.

    The engineer had a survey carried out also and i was at the property at the time and the chimney expert states there was a range of issues yet the next day the engineer told me very differently.

    Fair play. You've done your homework.

    All I can recommend is continued engagement with the surveyor. If you go a legal route it may end up costing you more than the cost of repairs
    (although you may win your fees) and it will take about three years.


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    #17
    ted1
    Registered Users Posts: 23,523 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    marykitty47 wrote: »
    The survey explicitly stated that the chimney breast has no cracks. I had an independent review carried out that was chargeable and a free review - both advised the same thing.

    The engineer had a survey carried out also and i was at the property at the time and the chimney expert states there was a range of issues yet the next day the engineer told me very differently.
    Why did you feel the need to have two additional ones ?


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