Special Forces ultimate hell week

bono_v

Kian Powerful Velcro wrote: »

I suppose it makes good TV, but in the DF they like you to have your sh*t squared away so you're 100% in the game and you're not receiving calls to sort out affairs at home.

I'm not sure how much discipline a week running around Kilbride will instill him, but like you I wish him the best of luck and hey if he's young enough he might just be mad enough to consider a career in the DF after the show, he'll find the real thing a hell of a lot tougher than the show, tougher and longer but at least there's a career at the end.

The show gets a very brief mention here.

Also anyone interested in a career in the DF can start at military.ie

Kian Powerful Velcro,
General recruit course couldn’t be as hard as hell week is it?
I know it’s a lot longer and over a sustained period.
What Is the drop out rate for general recruit course with DF?

Signore Fancy Pants

bono_v wrote: »

Makikomi,
General recruit course couldn’t be as hard as hell week is it?
I know it’s a lot longer and over a sustained period.
What Is the drop out rate for general recruit course with DF?

Think of Hell Week as just part of a normal day in Recruit Training. You wont always be up the side of a mountain but you will always be under mental and physical pressure.

Drop out rates vary for loads of reasons including the time of year. I heard numbers from a recent Platoon in the south of the country, 6 completed training, no idea how many started but it would be 30+.

TBH, a common theme for the last 8 or so years is that it's just a little bit too hard for the majority (not all) of young folk nowadays. They just dont seem to want (or be able to handle) to be cold, wet, sore, tired or hungry. Plus, after going through tough times, its another slap when you see how much you were paid to go through it. Its not worth it for some.

Im not sure what went wrong.

Mak might have a different POV but thats mine FWIW.

Signore Fancy Pants

Signore Fancy Pants wrote: »

Think of Hell Week as just part of a normal day in Recruit Training. You wont always be up the side of a mountain but you will always be under mental and physical pressure.

Drop out rates vary for loads of reasons including the time of year. I heard numbers from a recent Platoon in the south of the country, 6 completed training, no idea how many started but it would be 30+.

TBH, a common theme for the last 8 or so years is that it's just a little bit too hard for the majority (not all) of young folk nowadays. They just dont seem to want (or be able to handle) to be cold, wet, sore, tired or hungry. Plus, after going through tough times, its another slap when you see how much you were paid to go through it. Its not worth it for some.

Im not sure what went wrong.

Mak might have a different POV but thats mine FWIW.

I had a look at the pay rates in the link Mak posted above. I make more money packing shelves in dunnes! No wonder lads drop out of it.

Signore Fancy Pants

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I had a look at the pay rates in the link Mak posted above. I make more money packing shelves in dunnes! No wonder lads drop out of it.

Yeah I agree, it's shocking alright.

It's not financially worth it.

bono_v

Signore Fancy Pants wrote: »

Think of Hell Week as just part of a normal day in Recruit Training. You wont always be up the side of a mountain but you will always be under mental and physical pressure.

Drop out rates vary for loads of reasons including the time of year. I heard numbers from a recent Platoon in the south of the country, 6 completed training, no idea how many started but it would be 30+.

TBH, a common theme for the last 8 or so years is that it's just a little bit too hard for the majority (not all) of young folk nowadays. They just dont seem to want (or be able to handle) to be cold, wet, sore, tired or hungry. Plus, after going through tough times, its another slap when you see how much you were paid to go through it. Its not worth it for some.

Im not sure what went wrong.

Mak might have a different POV but thats mine FWIW.

Thanks for the reply. I know a few DF lads and there is no way they would get through that special forces week and they’d tell you that themselves. The calibre of individual to get through that week has to be off the charts. Anyone who gets through that week is proper elite!!!! I’ve the height of respect for all DF but I find it hard to believe what I’m seeing is general recruit training standard!
ARW fair enough but not general DF recruit training.

Signore Fancy Pants

bono_v wrote: »

Thanks for the reply. I know a few DF lads and there is no way they would get through that special forces week and they’d tell you that themselves. The calibre of individual to get through that week has to be off the charts. Anyone who gets through that week is proper elite!!!! I’ve the height of respect for all DF but I find it hard to believe what I’m seeing is general recruit training standard!
ARW fair enough but not general DF recruit training.

Not sure what to tell ya, what you have seen on tv is mostly basic. I find it very hard to believe that none of those lads you know can get through that or have been through it.

I will caveat that by saying the quality of training is not as hard as it once was but to not get through what has been on tv is unacceptable.

Me and Mak have been through it, what you saw on tv in my personal and professional experience (not opinion) is run of the mill stuff.

Also, what you see is NOT comparable to ARW Selection, there are some minor elements to it but it is so so far from reality.

Maybe the lads you know had a handy one.

Man Vs ManUre

I could complete this tv course easy. Especially the uppy downy hill walk this week. I’ve been to Glendalough and I completed the Spinc walk in about 4hrs, and I did it up the steps and down the stones. Could have easily gone round again same day if I wanted.

Muahahaha

Signore Fancy Pants wrote: »

Yeah I agree, it's shocking alright.

It's not financially worth it.

Id say the money is the long and short of it, they are just not attracting good candidates with the money so low.

Id also have thought there are far more young folk these days who are into fitness and training that there was 10 or 15 years back. Pubs these days arent attracting the 20s crowds like they used to as many are more interested in keeping in shape that going out and getting bladdered every weekend. So if anything I would have said there are more people out there who do have the fitness and stamina to complete recruit training but the money (or lack of it) puts them off.

Its pretty easy these days for a graduate to get a salary of 25k straight out of college and rise it up to 35-40k with three or four years of hard work. All sitting behind a desk in a warm office with their weekends off. Its very hard for the Defence Forces to compete with that.

Then you've got the stories of how our government treats the Defence Forces with disdain. Stuff like soldiers getting 22 euro extra for working a 24 hour shift during the Popes visit while the Gardai got 370 euro a head Or the navy lads sleeping on boats during their weeks off because they cant even afford the rents locally. Young folk see things like that and decide to give it a wide berth.

bono_v

Signore Fancy Pants wrote: »

Not sure what to tell ya, what you have seen on tv is mostly basic. I find it very hard to believe that none of those lads you know can get through that or have been through it.

I will caveat that by saying the quality of training is not as hard as it once was but to not get through what has been on tv is unacceptable.

Me and Mak have been through it, what you saw on tv in my personal and professional experience (not opinion) is run of the mill stuff.

Also, what you see is NOT comparable to ARW Selection, there are some minor elements to it but it is so so far from reality.

Maybe the lads you know had a handy one.

Thanks for the reply again! Maybe I should give my DF mates more credit!!! I know two lads that were on the last series. They are both elite ex athletes themselves in their own right. I’d say in the top % of fittest people in Ireland. They just missed out on the final last year. If the DF lads I know passed a recruit course these 2 lads would have to be able to pass the recruit course is all I’m saying!

Wailin

Man Vs ManUre wrote: »

I could complete this tv course easy. Especially the uppy downy hill walk this week. I’ve been to Glendalough and I completed the Spinc walk in about 4hrs, and I did it up the steps and down the stones. Could have easily gone round again same day if I wanted.

4hrs? That's a pretty pathetic timeframe for that route.

Signore Fancy Pants

bono_v wrote: »

Thanks for the reply again! Maybe I should give my DF mates more credit!!! I know two lads that were on the last series. They are both elite ex athletes themselves in their own right. I’d say in the top % of fittest people in Ireland. They just missed out on the final last year. If the DF lads I know passed a recruit course these 2 lads would have to be able to pass the recruit course is all I’m saying!

It's quite typical for athletes to suffer to an extent in the DF. It's just a different type of fitness. I dont even know how to describe it.

Maybe ya just have to be dumb enough to keep going or something :pac:

I trained with a guy that was a competitive open water swimmer. Once the backpack went on his back he was equal to the rest of us.

Same with guys that were proper runners...again...add a bit of weight onto them and they are back to square one.

We have plenty of athletes, triathletes, Ironmen/women, strongmen/women, combat sports people and long distance runners etc in the DF.

Im sure your athlete friends are very fit but theres more to it than being fit. Im certainly nowhere being any type of athlete...so its not really a barometer of whether they could handle it.

Muahahaha

Man Vs ManUre wrote: »

I could complete this tv course easy. Especially the uppy downy hill walk this week. I’ve been to Glendalough and I completed the Spinc walk in about 4hrs, and I did it up the steps and down the stones. Could have easily gone round again same day if I wanted.

Spinc walk via the Miners village is 2 hours at best, even then it can be done in less if you go on a proper march and dont take any breaks. Ive done 2 loops of it in just under 3hr 50m when training to go trekking in Nepal and I wouldnt say Im the fastest walker either.

Watched episode two again and I think I recognised the car park where they were based for doing the treks up the two mountains. If Im not mistaken it is the car park for Sorrell Hill marked as Ballymultagh Gap on this map. Theres another hill on the far side that they were also using though not sure of its name, might be Black Hill?
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Sorrel+Hill/@53.1451336,-6.4474803,1541m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x48679ea74c81a11b:0x7492c3a11b1d7059!8m2!3d53.1461111!4d-6.4452778!5m1!1e4

Makes sense as it is not that far from the army base in Kilbride. Ive walked up Sorrell Hill a couple of times in the summer, its easy enough going to get to the top but I wouldnt fancy going up and down it and the other hill five or six times in the fog of winter. Parts of it are very boggy, it very easy to end up knee deep in water if you dont watch your step. Great views of Blessington lake from the top though.

Man Vs ManUre

I have been to EBC and it was so cold in the evenings after I reached Kala Pataar I ran back down the route to Lukla in about 2 days even tho I had already paid for about 4, I needed a hot shower in Kathmandu to wash all the dirt away, and needed beer, fags and dhal bhat
I went to mount Huashan in China and walked up the mountain, no cable car, and I did the famous plank walk, then walked back down. The hardest part of that day was trying to suss out how to get to the train stations and back.
I could do this tv show in my sleep dressed in only a nappy for the entire week.

Princess Calla

Man Vs ManUre wrote: »

I could do this tv show in my sleep dressed in only a nappy for the entire week.

We'll know which one is you next year so

Wailin

Muahahaha wrote: »

Spinc walk via the Miners village is 2 hours at best, even then it can be done in less if you go on a proper march and dont take any breaks. Ive done 2 loops of it in just under 3hr 50m when training to go trekking in Nepal and I wouldnt say Im the fastest walker either.

Watched episode two again and I think I recognised the car park where they were based for doing the treks up the two mountains. If Im not mistaken it is the car park for Sorrell Hill marked as Ballymultagh Gap on this map. Theres another hill on the far side that they were also using though not sure of its name, might be Blackhill

Spot on, it's sorrell hill and black hill. Both easy enough, but up and down a few times with 70lbs on your back would be very tough.

boccy23

Wailin wrote: »

Spot on, it's sorrell hill and black hill. Both easy enough, but up and down a few times with 70lbs on your back would be very tough.

Are ye not forgetting also what has gone on before it. It's like they had 8 hours peaceful rest in their own beds, a good breakie and total preparation. Or even knew where they were going, what to do, when the end was.

If you know that something is x long, then you adapt. If it is open ended, then mentally, you have to prepare to reserve energy for how long you "think" it might be. At the end of day, it's a mental challenge more so than a physical one. They are all fit and to do just this in a one off event would not be an issue for any of them. But rolled in with the rest of the week is a totally different examination.

arybvtcw0eolkf

bono_v wrote: »

Makikomi,
General recruit course couldn’t be as hard as hell week is it?
I know it’s a lot longer and over a sustained period.
What Is the drop out rate for general recruit course with DF?

General recruitment is a lot tougher than these lads are getting it.

The beasting is about on par but the candidates in the show don't have room inspections, weapons inspections, running around in body armor and all the other kit a soldier would carry on the groound.

And sure the candidates are all exceptionally fit but there's also the mental toughness in accepting that every minute of the day you're under the eye and control of your training NCO's.. You've every little control over anything, and this goes on for months, and often without a weekend break or if you get off for the weekend that's brilliant until a recruit fvcks up and you're all on a punishment detail for the weekend.

Then when eventually you're off you're spending the weekend preparation your uniform and mind for returning to barracks on Sunday night knowing you're going to do this again, and again, week in week out.

Its draining, then as has been mentioned, although you've the promise of a career at the end of it many find that dream shattered by the realization that your pay packet isn't going to get you through the week or you're caught for another weekend duty which will pay around €2 (yes TWO EUR) an hour.. But that's another rant.

All credit to the candidates, they're really getting it in the neck but honestly if I was just coming out of recruit training, an NCO's course etc etc I'd be looking at that show for a laugh.

Over all, its a brilliant show. The DS's are really turning up the heat on the guys but honestly in a military context they're not doing anything remarkable.

Damo 2k9

The name of the show is for marketing purposes to catch peoples eye, and for sure its working, but its not a representation of what ARW training is (or even close).

As I said, I respect every civvie who has attempted this, but people saying its harder then ARW selection is out right insulting to the men who have went through this training and serve/served this country.

I know people who have went through Recruit training and have seen them of a Friday/Saturday after getting out for the weekend, theyve looked more defeated than the men/women on this show. Its great to watch, but not comparable in any way to the 'real thing'.

The trailer for next week mentions that the fighting is lose and your out, but I cant see them going through with it due to how many episodes is left, id say its to get the lads putting everything on the line to stay in.

Man Vs ManUre

I would excel at the fighting challenge next week. I am one hard baxtard. I would certainly be able to whoop all these divvies ass’s, and more than likely also the DS guys.

Purple Mountain

Kian Powerful Velcro wrote: »

General recruitment is a lot tougher than these lads are getting it.

The beasting is about on par but the candidates in the show don't have room inspections, weapons inspections, running around in body armor and all the other kit a soldier would carry on the groound.

And sure the candidates are all exceptionally fit but there's also the mental toughness in accepting that every minute of the day you're under the eye and control of your training NCO's.. You've every little control over anything, and this goes on for months, and often without a weekend break or if you get off for the weekend that's brilliant until a recruit fvcks up and you're all on a punishment detail for the weekend.

Then when eventually you're off you're spending the weekend preparation your uniform and mind for returning to barracks on Sunday night knowing you're going to do this again, and again, week in week out.

Its draining, then as has been mentioned, although you've the promise of a career at the end of it many find that dream shattered by the realization that your pay packet isn't going to get you through the week or you're caught for another weekend duty which will pay around €2 (yes TWO EUR) an hour.. But that's another rant.

All credit to the candidates, they're really getting it in the neck but honestly if I was just coming out of recruit training, an NCO's course etc etc I'd be looking at that show for a laugh.

Over all, its a brilliant show. The DS's are really turning up the heat on the guys but honestly in a military context they're not doing anything remarkable.

One simple question so, why pick it as a career?!

bono_v

Kian Powerful Velcro wrote: »

General recruitment is a lot tougher than these lads are getting it.

The beasting is about on par but the candidates in the show don't have room inspections, weapons inspections, running around in body armor and all the other kit a soldier would carry on the groound.

And sure the candidates are all exceptionally fit but there's also the mental toughness in accepting that every minute of the day you're under the eye and control of your training NCO's.. You've every little control over anything, and this goes on for months, and often without a weekend break or if you get off for the weekend that's brilliant until a recruit fvcks up and you're all on a punishment detail for the weekend.

Then when eventually you're off you're spending the weekend preparation your uniform and mind for returning to barracks on Sunday night knowing you're going to do this again, and again, week in week out.

Its draining, then as has been mentioned, although you've the promise of a career at the end of it many find that dream shattered by the realization that your pay packet isn't going to get you through the week or you're caught for another weekend duty which will pay around €2 (yes TWO EUR) an hour.. But that's another rant.

All credit to the candidates, they're really getting it in the neck but honestly if I was just coming out of recruit training, an NCO's course etc etc I'd be looking at that show for a laugh.

Over all, its a brilliant show. The DS's are really turning up the heat on the guys but honestly in a military context they're not doing anything remarkable.

The beasting is relentless in recruit training from what I’ve heard from DF lads. No let up- 24 hours!!!!
Where’s the enjoyment for young fellas???!!!!! JAYSIS!!!!

arybvtcw0eolkf

Purple Mountain wrote: »

One simple question so, why pick it as a career?!

Me personally, well my grandfather served with the Royal Dublin Fusiliers in WWI and during The Emergency he was an air raid warden in Dublin.

My father served.

I was always going to serve.

I joined in 1985, thought I might put in a few years. Felt like 21 years was a lifetime away, but here I am 35 years later and as corny as it sounds I love being a soldier. You won't hear too many say that in work, but that's why we're all here.

And we're pretty proud of the service we give the country and our various UN roles across the globe.

You'd never stay for the money that's for sure, and many are leaving because of it.. Its shameful that people who are prepared to give everything for their country are treated in such a way.

I can only imagine others serve for the same reason, most of the lads I speak to have a history of service in their families.

On a positive note, the DF has been very good to me personally. I've bought and sold a number of houses to finally settled in my forever home, its helped me pay off a mortage and put my children through college (with the help of nixxering as a bouncer & barman for 25 yrs!).

I think Fancy Pants was order to join by a criminal court judge who found him guilty of sniffing the seats in the ladies toilet in Bus Aras, but that may only be a ball hop (rumor) around the barracks

arybvtcw0eolkf

bono_v wrote: »

The beasting is relentless in recruit training from what I’ve heard from DF lads. No let up- 24 hours!!!!
Where’s the enjoyment for young fellas???!!!!! JAYSIS!!!!

Some of the best friends you'll ever make will be made during the toughest times in the DF. We might argue, fall out and be moany f*ckers about each other in work (sometimes) but when the chips are down I know each and every one of them will have my back.

Two years ago my 22 yr old daughter took seriously ill, very serious. I found a support network from the lads and the organisation that I know I'd have never found anywhere else and that continues today.

And I get to call myself a soldier.

jimbobaloobob

Kian Powerful Velcro wrote: »

Some of the best friends you'll ever make will be made during the toughest times in the DF. We might argue, fall out and be moany f*ckers about each other in work (sometimes) but when the chips are down I know each and every one of them will have my back.

Two years ago my 22 yr old daughter took seriously ill, very serious. I found a support network from the lads and the organisation that I know I'd have never found anywhere else and that continues today.

And I get to call myself a soldier.

Agree with you there. Hope she's doing well now.

arybvtcw0eolkf

jimbobaloobob wrote: »

Agree with you there. Hope she's doing well now.

Cheers, she's doing much better now but its going to be an ongoing issue for awhile yet.

Thanks

Signore Fancy Pants

Purple Mountain wrote: »

One simple question so, why pick it as a career?!

It's not an easy one to answer TBH.

I don't have the privilige of military ancestry like Mak does, a great and proud tradition to have, good man Mak.

However, I always had an interest in the military. As a small kid I always "played with guns" etc etc. When I was 16 I joined the FCA (now RDF), loved every second of it and it reinforced my interest.

Yes I could have travelled to another State and joined their military but I live in Ireland, Im Irish, this is where my service should be. Ultimately, I wanted to serve Ireland and I thought that being a soldier would be the best way for me to do that.

Yes I also know that it is highly unlikely that I will ever need to put my training to use here but I see that as a good thing, as do most people. I was actually called a "coward" before for not joining "the Brits" and going to "war" like a "real soldier".

A point I could understand but refuted, hard to do especially when "sure what do you actually do for us anyway" and "waste of taxpayers money" Brigade have a go at you .

Despite not being an "invading State" or a "war going Nation", as a standing military we still must be able to train and perform like one, despite the very slim chances of being needed as one. We were needed during the IRA days, Mak would be more familiar than me on that aspect.

Recruit training and Cadetships are physically and mentally hard but it doesnt end there. So too is daily military life. I have seen and experienced things I never would have in civilian life but it is also very tough on your personal life.

While you will never be rich in the DF, it has allowed me to get a mortgage....just about. I have 20+ years done, no kids, but I plan to leave in my mid-40's while im still employable.

Its not a job for everyone but its one I can do.

arybvtcw0eolkf

Signore Fancy Pants wrote: »

I have 20+ years done, no kids, but I plan to leave in my mid-40's while im still employable.

Its not a job for everyone but its one I can do.

Jaysus you'll have to work for a living then :P

I'm planning on staying 'till I'm pushed out the gate kicking and screaming :pac:

I'm 54 in two weeks, and apart from having a stress fracture to my 5th metatarsal on my left foot I'm fit as a fiddle (its killing me that I can't run for another few weeks) but I'm still putting in a lot of swimming (12,575m last week) although I've more or less retired from competitive Judo (admitting it to myself is the hard part), that sounds like I'm bragging but the point of all that is the job has allowed me, and encouraged me to stay fit and healthy, and if memory serves me you were quite the athlete too at one time?.

As far as a comparison with other warmongering nations and their forces, I was chatting with some US marines I was working with a few years ago and they were bragging about the M109 155mm SP and how powerful it was and mocking us because we don't have any.

My response was 'well if you have them its easy enough to fire them at someone, but have you ever not had them to fire back while you sheltered under fire from the same guns you supplied to the Israeli Defence Forces with terrified civilians?.

My point this time is that we can hold our own when we have to. We never backed down to the Israeli Defence Forces, one of the worlds most aggressive and ruthless forces. When it would have been easier to pack our sh*t and haul ass we never let ourselves or those under our protection down, and that goes for anywhere we've served across the globe.

We really are the mouse that roared, and we're respected for it (its a shame that respect falls short at home).

Anyway back to the show.. Looks like they're being gassed on Monday 'GAS, GAS, GAS' That'll be the craic

AndrewJRenko

Muahahaha wrote: »

Watched episode two again and I think I recognised the car park where they were based for doing the treks up the two mountains. If Im not mistaken it is the car park for Sorrell Hill marked as Ballymultagh Gap on this map. Theres another hill on the far side that they were also using though not sure of its name, might be Black Hill?
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Sorrel+Hill/@53.1451336,-6.4474803,1541m/data=!3m1!1e3!4m5!3m4!1s0x48679ea74c81a11b:0x7492c3a11b1d7059!8m2!3d53.1461111!4d-6.4452778!5m1!1e4

Makes sense as it is not that far from the army base in Kilbride. Ive walked up Sorrell Hill a couple of times in the summer, its easy enough going to get to the top but I wouldnt fancy going up and down it and the other hill five or six times in the fog of winter. Parts of it are very boggy, it very easy to end up knee deep in water if you dont watch your step. Great views of Blessington lake from the top though.

Thanks, great to know the actual locations. Is Kilbride still a real army base that they have been given access to?

Man Vs ManUre wrote: »

I could complete this tv course easy. Especially the uppy downy hill walk this week. I’ve been to Glendalough and I completed the Spinc walk in about 4hrs, and I did it up the steps and down the stones. Could have easily gone round again same day if I wanted.

Now who does that remind me of?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wUDhuxyu3ao

Did anything ever come of last year's winners? Did they manage to use their achievement to build their careers or anything?

Signore Fancy Pants

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

Is Kilbride still a real army base that they have been given access to?

Yeah, still a military camp.

PTH2009

Anyway of watching season 1 without the sign language guy on the screen