Extinction Rebellion Ireland

lleti

If the government care about cutting our emissions why don't they try and fight against their own projections of a population growth of 20% in 20 years?

A carbon tax increase while ignoring the population problem is like a fat person going for a run in the gym while they're stuffing their face when they go home when they're trying to lose weight. When all the fat person needed to do to lose weight was reduce their calories and no need to go to the gym.

Enough is Enough!

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

Why is there such a strong link between climate changer deniers and being into conspiracy theories, bitcoin, Donald Trump, and their paper thin arguments about ‘freedom of speech’?

Think a lot of these sorts of lads spent too much time watching conspiracy theory and right wing videos on YouTube and their minds have turned to mush.

Then walk the walk. Never fly again, don't buy a new phone. Make the changes that are needed.

But you won't.

lola85

The crowd have dispersed because of the rain!!

Real hardcore and desperate alright:)

Beechwoodspark

Calhoun wrote: »

This post highlights the contradiction, its super important but i cant be arsed getting the day off to attend.

Not trying to have a go but genuinely if folk cannot attend for something so important how can we expect the decisions to be made on the ground. How much of an inconvenience to your current life are you prepared to take for your principles?

There is a solar farm near me that potentially should be going in place but its already got objections because people are stupid. We cannot throw our arms in the air and say something should be done without being prepared to make changes.

Plenty ppl support the activities and the focus on climate change. Life gets in the way for me personally to attend the march. But I support their aims. I might visit on sat with my kids. These protestors will be seen as legends in 100 years time. History in the making

castletownman

I believe with tomorrow being Budget day, they are marching on the Dail in case there is any social welfare cuts. Damn hippies.

And a concert on tonight till 10.30? Sounds like an excuse to essentially scive off for the week to me.

weldoninhio

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Let me be clearer.

To whom are you referring when you mention 'doomsday apocalyptic types'? Are you talking about the World Meteorological Organisation who are predicting global temperature rises of considerably higher than 5 degrees in our lifetimes, if we continue to exhaust fossil fuels?

Are you talking about the UN who have said that reversing the trend requires a level of mobilisation akin to WW1 and WW2, combined?

Personally I think this is all true, but it's not going to happen, so yeah, let's just let ourselves disappear.

An entertaining diversion, however, is the mindset of people who claim to believe in science, but think that the protestors are exaggerating things. Do you think scientists are involved in a conspiracy theory with the UN and the WMO and Extinction Rebllion?

Seriously what are you on about?

Had a look at the WMO website. Can’t see anything about warming predictions for the future at all, never mind 5 degrees in our lifetime.

_Brian

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Let me be clearer.

To whom are you referring when you mention 'doomsday apocalyptic types'? Are you talking about the World Meteorological Organisation who are predicting global temperature rises of considerably higher than 5 degrees in our lifetimes, if we continue to exhaust fossil fuels?

Are you talking about the UN who have said that reversing the trend requires a level of mobilisation akin to WW1 and WW2, combined?

Personally I think this is all true, but it's not going to happen, so yeah, let's just let ourselves disappear.

An entertaining diversion, however, is the mindset of people who claim to believe in science, but think that the protestors are exaggerating things. Do you think scientists are involved in a conspiracy theory with the UN and the WMO and Extinction Rebllion?

Seriously what are you on about?

I've heard Er protestors interviewed saying we need to give up the lives we live now, countries need to abandon industrial civilisation, people need to lower the expectations for their standard of living... youtube is full of such nonsence too.. this is whackjob talk and will get things consigned to the bin rather than discussed in any serious way.



I've nowhere denied that climate change is happening, and that human behaviour is having an impact on the same..


We need to make make changes to limit OUR impact on climate change but its stupid to think at this stage that we can control the natural climate of the planet. We're passengers on this ride, its a joke to think we're in control or can take control....


Countries arent going to give up industrial civilisation, really, thats just not happening, no matter what they have to face down the line...



ER need to get a grip on how humans work and what motivates them, their current "give up your lifestyle" rant is turning people away in droves and has them labeled nutjobs..


The best can be done is incrimental change, start now and build going forward, its something you can get large numbers of people involved in and comitted to. Better everyone doing something than most people tuned out doing nothing because the goal is unatainable and the message is so bad it probably wouldnt make a difference anyway..

JohnnyFlash

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

Why is there such a strong link between climate changer deniers and being into conspiracy theories, bitcoin, Donald Trump, and their paper thin arguments about ‘freedom of speech’?

Think a lot of these sorts of lads spent too much time watching conspiracy theory and right wing videos on YouTube and their minds have turned to mush.

Maybe they are the smart ones and the activists are the eejits. After all, the Carbon ticker-tape doesn't pause when we reduce our emissions to 1980s levels. All things being equal, that just gives us an extra few decades we have to make even more drastic cuts before we return to the same catastrophic end. Global warming doesn't have an end-date.

While we are busy avoiding emitting carbon, the existing Carbon in our atmosphere will be doing push-ups, waiting for us to slip up. This isn't something that climate activists like to admit, but it's junior cert science. Somewhere along the timeline, there must logically be a tipping point where even benign (natural) emissions start to accumulate to ensure our demise.

I'm not trying to sound fatalist, this man said it better.

https://www.newyorker.com/culture/cultural-comment/what-if-we-stopped-pretending

Finally, overwhelming numbers of human beings, including millions of government-hating Americans, need to accept high taxes and severe curtailment of their familiar life styles without revolting. They must accept the reality of climate change and have faith in the extreme measures taken to combat it. They can’t dismiss news they dislike as fake. They have to set aside nationalism and class and racial resentments. They have to make sacrifices for distant threatened nations and distant future generations. They have to be permanently terrified by hotter summers and more frequent natural disasters, rather than just getting used to them. Every day, instead of thinking about breakfast, they have to think about death.

Call me a pessimist or call me a humanist, but I don’t see human nature fundamentally changing anytime soon.

weldoninhio

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Plenty ppl support the activities and the focus on climate change. Life gets in the way for me personally to attend the march. But I support their aims. I might visit on sat with my kids. These protestors will be seen as legends in 100 years time. History in the making

But this is an emergency apparently, and ‘life gets in the way’?? If that’s a viable excuse, then there is no emergency.

Beechwoodspark

weldoninhio wrote: »

But this is an emergency apparently, and ‘life gets in the way’?? If that’s a viable excuse, then there is no emergency.

It’s a climate emergency yes. I will be supporting the parties that prioritise that in the next election. I’ll do my bit. Don’t worry!

_Brian

_Brian wrote: »

I've heard Er protestors interviewed saying we need to give up the lives we live now, countries need to abandon industrial civilisation, people need to lower the expectations for their standard of living... youtube is full of such nonsence too.. this is whackjob talk and will get things consigned to the bin rather than discussed in any serious way.

Brian what are you on about?

Look at what you've just written.

You're disagreeing with a scientific consensus because it undermines your (or a popular) way of life.

That is about as fundamentally illogical and as fallacious as it gets. Whether or not the known scientific models are unrealistic, or unpalatable, this is completely irrelevant.

It doesn't matter if it is radical, or highly demanding. Organisations like the WMO or the UN are not conspiring against you, even if their proposals mean radical action.

lleti

castletownman wrote: »

I believe with tomorrow being Budget day, they are marching on the Dail in case there is any social welfare cuts. Damn hippies.

And a concert on tonight till 10.30? Sounds like an excuse to essentially scive off for the week to me.

There'll be plenty of shagging done I bet. Great way to network with fellow crusties.

Jimmy Garlic

Zorya wrote: »

From what pictures I have seen (even globally) looks like very few people are drawn to this cult. The media must have nothing better to be doing than giving them air time - or maybe there is an agenda that is being pushed. You would get more people out at a rural 5k charity run. Looks like the Law of Diminishing Returns is hitting the boys and girls who constantly scream wolf.

That's why they need to pressgang schoolchildren into protesting, to create the illusion of mass popular support. It is clear that the establishment both here and in The UK etc have absolutely no problem with these wallys going around demanding that governments "do something" (raise taxes). The EU has a honeypot slushfund for 'climate change' that it plans to dish out to Saudi Princes, the Carlyle group (umbrella group that has a lot of arms manufacturers under its wing), France's Total oil company, banks and vulture funds etc. The whole thing is the biggest scam of all time.

_Brian

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Brian what are you on about?

Look at what you've just written.

You're disagreeing with a scientific consensus because it undermines your (or a popular) way of life.

That is about as fundamentally illogical and as fallacious as it gets. Whether or not the known scientific models are unrealistic, or unpalatable, this is completely irrelevant.

It doesn't matter if it is radical, or highly demanding. Organisations like the WMO or the UN are not conspiring against you, even if their proposals mean radical action.

Can you point me to one article on the UN website that says we must abandon industrial civilisation.

Plumbthedepths

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

I’ll do my bit. Don’t worry!

...but only on the weekend, ;-)

_Brian

_Brian wrote: »

Can you point me to one article on the UN website that says we must abandon industrial civilisation.

No, but then you were the one who introduced that claim?

You're talking shïte man. You're introducing straw men and asking others to refute, whilst perpetuating vague insults about others being apocalyptic, when we're quoting actual scientific reports by respected organisations.

Give it a rest.

Enough is Enough!

Do people actually think the world is ending in 10 years or is that a meme?

weldoninhio

weldoninhio wrote: »

Had a look at the WMO website. Can’t see anything about warming predictions for the future at all, never mind 5 degrees in our lifetime.

To spare you further exertion, this is the most conservative version of WMO data I have bookmarked.

https://public.wmo.int/en/media/press-release/wmo-climate-statement-past-4-years-warmest-record

A five degree rise in global temperatures (it will be higher if we continue to exhaust fossil fuels) will either mean enormous global shortage of food resources for a growing population, or it means mass migration, or both.

By the end of the century, ie within the lifetime of our kids, if we have them.

People are free to dismiss this. Just please tell us why you're dismissing this version of science, but if there was a BBC bulletin where scientists told you your hoover was giving you cancer, poor old Henry would already be in the bin.

You can't just pick and choose what science you believe in, just because it doesn't suit you.

Panch18

Enough is Enough! wrote: »

Do people actually think the world is ending in 10 years or is that a meme?

No if you read through this thread there are actually people who believe it

Pure mad Ted

NIMAN

Enough is Enough! wrote: »

Do people actually think the world is ending in 10 years or is that a meme?

No, I genuinely think some people are so stupid they accept this as fact.

I have heard it a few times.

Their leader on BBC HardTalk programme said that in the next few years there will be billions of deaths. Billions!!

The man is deluded.

Enough is Enough!

Enough is Enough! wrote: »

Do people actually think the world is ending in 10 years or is that a meme?

Literally nobody beleievs that. Except maybe a few evangelists who think the coming of the Lord is imminent, and who reject climate science.

_Brian

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

No, but then you were the one who introduced that claim?

You're talking shïte man. You're introducing straw men and asking others to refute, whilst perpetuating vague insults about others being apocalyptic, when we're quoting actual scientific reports by respected organisations.

Give it a rest.

the leader if IR ireland was on Matt Cooper and said we need to move away from iondustrial civilisation, that countries need to intentionally implement plans to move to negative gdp growth



This is the talk that turns people off..

Calhoun

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

Plenty ppl support the activities and the focus on climate change. Life gets in the way for me personally to attend the march. But I support their aims. I might visit on sat with my kids. These protestors will be seen as legends in 100 years time. History in the making

Maybe if we haven't all killed each other by then. The real heroes are the astronauts in space growing meat in a lab or the individuals coming up with realistic/alternative methods of doing things.

What are you going to do with your kids other than a trip out to meet them?

Beechwoodspark

Calhoun wrote: »

Maybe if we haven't all killed each other by then. The real heroes are the astronauts in space growing meat in a lab or the individuals coming up with realistic/alternative methods of doing things.

What are you going to do with your kids other than a trip out to meet them?

I am fully behind realistic innovations. 100 percent. But protest is required as well.

NIMAN

_Brian wrote: »

the leader if IR ireland was on Matt Cooper and said we need to move away from iondustrial civilisation, that countries need to intentionally implement plans to move to negative gdp growth



This is the talk that turns people off..

I suggest you listen to the HardTalk episode.

Their co-founder wants the entire UK to be carbon neutral by 2025. In 6 yrs time! The presenter asked him that would mean no cars, no lorries, no planes, no home heating oil or gas etc, and he said it could be done if the political will was there.

I'm telling you, delusional.

These folk want us back in caves.

weldoninhio

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

To spare you further exertion, this is the most conservative version of WMO data I have bookmarked.

https://public.wmo.int/en/media/press-release/wmo-climate-statement-past-4-years-warmest-record

A five degree rise in global temperatures (it will be higher if we continue to exhaust fossil fuels) will either mean enormous global shortage of food resources for a growing population, or it means mass migration, or both.

By the end of the century, ie within the lifetime of our kids, if we have them.

People are free to dismiss this. Just please tell us why you're dismissing this version of science, but if there was a BBC bulletin where scientists told you your hoover was giving you cancer, poor old Henry would already be in the bin.

You can't just pick and choose what science you believe in, just because it doesn't suit you.

“we may see temperature increases 3-5°C by the end of the century.“ - so they are guessing.

_Brian

_Brian wrote: »

the leader if IR ireland was on Matt Cooper and said we need to move away from iondustrial civilisation, that countries need to intentionally implement plans to move to negative gdp growth



This is the talk that turns people off..

We do need to "move away" from industrialised models of economic development. The head of the UN has referenced things like the prohibition on the private use of petrol in WW1/ WW2 to describe the scale of the emergency. We obviously can't just cease it immediately, that's daft.

In fact, the thought of altering our modes of industrialisation under any circumstances, however slowly, is probably daft. That's why I think, although this is an interesting discussion, it's futile. Half the climate science research seems to be suggesting we've already passed the point of no return, the other half thinks it's imminent in the next generation.

There is just no way that the world is going to go carbon neutral in the next 25 years. We might as well just enjoy ourselves and stop breeding*


*might be mutually incompatible

Calhoun

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

I am fully behind realistic innovations. 100 percent. But protest is required as well.

Would you be in favor of some of their more extreme ends? What are you planning to do in your life with your family to change how you live and consume things?

Don't get me wrong, we need to change something but those who are pushing for it at all cost need to realize what it is they are wishing for.

I don't know where you live but would you be willing to give up your car and only use public transport? Look at the whole debacle over the bus connect for example of how we are in Ireland. Finally think how much of a pain in the arse its going to be as we change the current fleet of cars in Ireland from fossil fuel to electric.

We need to seriously start preparing ourselves for the changing dynamics of how we live as we move away from the status quo. I personally don't think people are ready for it and are just looking for a feel good bandwagon to jump on. I hope i am wrong and they appreciate what its going to take.

weldoninhio

NIMAN wrote: »

I suggest you listen to the HardTalk episode.

Their co-founder wants the entire UK to be carbon neutral by 2025. In 6 yrs time! The presenter asked him that would mean no cars, no lorries, no planes, no home heating oil or gas etc, and he said it could be done if the political will was there.

I'm telling you, delusional.

These folk want us back in caves.

https://mobile.twitter.com/PoliticsJOE_UK/status/1181184150549737472

That is the type of absolute wingnut you are dealing with.

weldoninhio

weldoninhio wrote: »

https://mobile.twitter.com/PoliticsJOE_UK/status/1181184150549737472

That is the type of absolute wingnut you are dealing with.

Do you have any reason, based on scientific evidence, to call him a wingnut?

Huge if true.