Saracens vs Munster, Sat 20th April, 3pm

Buer

irishbucsfan wrote: »

Hmm...

It's ok to agree with me.

Try it. Go on.

Jump_In_Jack

Just talking about Scannell, we had Arnold and Goggin available to play 12, both are strong physical carriers.
I would have selected Goggin over Scannell against Saracens for the game-plan that was used.

If we used Scannell to throw skip passes then he would be worth keeping ahead of the others though.
Scannell has a deceptive burst of speed, but the problem is it's wasted when he is only carrying a few steps into contact.
I wonder would he be better playing in the wider channels?

For the future I would go with 12. Goggin, 13. Farrell,
and backup would be 12. Arnold, 13. Scannell/Shane Daly

Burkie1203

RoG on OTB with Ger Gilroy discussing Zebo as one of the answers to Munsters problems because he brings xfactor

troyzer

Burkie1203 wrote: »

RoG on OTB with Ger Gilroy discussing Zebo as one of the answers to Munsters problems because he brings xfactor

I'd have to say bollocks to that. Zebo has turned to a blubbering mush this season.

AbusesToilets

troyzer wrote: »

I'd have to say bollocks to that. Zebo has turned to a blubbering mush this season.

Seems to playing pretty well in fairness, scoring plenty of tries.

troyzer

AbusesToilets wrote: »

Seems to playing pretty well in fairness, scoring plenty of tries.

Have you actually watched him play? He's great at getting at the end of a try. But he's seriously overweight and really struggles defensively. He's also quite standoffish, even for a winger.

Erik Shun

Zebo is a player who can create something from almost nothing... unfortunately, he's not going anywhere for another 2 + years...so it's not really worth discussing.... Munster probably need a big signing in the backs this summer.. just to elevate us a level above what we are right now

AbusesToilets

troyzer wrote: »

Have you actually watched him play? He's great at getting at the end of a try. But he's seriously overweight and really struggles defensively. He's also quite standoffish, even for a winger.

I've only seen clips of him, so I'll defer to you. Is he actually overweight, or just bigger?

Quin_Dub

AbusesToilets wrote: »

I've only seen clips of him, so I'll defer to you. Is he actually overweight, or just bigger?

From the games I've seen he has the look of a guy trying to emulate Rupeni Caucaunibuca in terms of his "look" whilst in France...

He's not there yet of course , but I don't think he's putting in many extra cardio sessions

sydthebeat

Quin_Dub wrote: »

From the games I've seen he has the look of a guy trying to emulate Rupeni Caucaunibuca in terms of his "look" whilst in France...

He's not there yet of course , but I don't think he's putting in many extra cardio sessions

Caucau was a god!!!

Quin_Dub

sydthebeat wrote: »

Caucau was a god!!!

He was indeed , but when he was in France he definitely looked more like Buddha..:-)

sydthebeat

Quin_Dub wrote: »

He was indeed , but when he was in France he definitely looked more like Buddha..:-)

touche

:D:D:D

yerrahbah

Disappointing result but not unexpected
Going into the match three things needed to happen for Munster to have any chance
1. Munster give their best performance in years
2. Ref decisions go their way
3. Saracens have an off day

Unfortunately none of the above happened

I don’t think Munster were particularly poor or Saracens particularly great, but Saracens didn’t need to be and largely looked comfortable

Thought Saracens kicked really well and Haley had a tough time under the high ball

The Munster kick –chase was a bit off and gifted possession back too easily
We didn’t really disrupt their lineout which is unusual for Munster

We missed the breaking ability of Carbery to keep the Saracens defense on their toes

I think if Cloete had been in better form he would have played at 7, JOD is not a natural 7 but Cloete has just been out of sorts for the most of this season.

Munster are easily in the top 6 in Europe but are still a good bit off competing with the likes of Saracens, Racing and Leinster

Munster just don’t have the $$$ that Saracens and Racing have nor do we have the conveyor belt of talent coming through that Leinster have.
It will not be easy to bridge that gap.

I think Munster have a team of “good” Heineken cup standard players and not enough “fantastic” Heineken cup standard players.

Think EPCR will need to rethink the choosing of venues for Semi finals, maybe have a look at the attendance of the home team throughout the campaign and pick a suitable ground based on that.

Having a half full stadium doesn’t do anyone any favours.

The spectator who entered the field needs a ban from Munster games.

Between the Zebo incident in Belfast, the Sectarianism incident in the Aviva and now this, It’s not a good look for Irish rugby supporters in the last few months.

Anyway
Come on Leinster in the final

Sabre0001

Detailed look at how Saracens dealt with the threat of Beirne at the weekend: https://www.the42.ie/tadhg-beirne-munster-saracens-analysis-4602847-Apr2019/

Former Former

Sabre0001 wrote: »

Detailed look at how Saracens dealt with the threat of Beirne at the weekend: https://www.the42.ie/tadhg-beirne-munster-saracens-analysis-4602847-Apr2019/

Every time Munster lose a big game this gets wheeled out.

Sorry but if the guy is that easily neutralised then is he really that good?

troyzer

Former Former wrote: »

Every time Munster lose a big game this gets wheeled out.

Sorry but if the guy is that easily neutralised then is he really that good?

His technique and timing are excellent, he's just blown off the ball too easily sometimes by guys who are way bigger.

The way Garces reffed the breakdown did him no favours mind.

aloooof

Former Former wrote: »

Every time Munster lose a big game this gets wheeled out.

Sorry but if the guy is that easily neutralised then is he really that good?

What other games, just out of interest?

Paul Smeenus

aloooof wrote: »

What other games, just out of interest?

Both Castres games.

And for my money, that's quite correct.

aloooof

Paul Smeenus wrote: »

Both Castres games.

And for my money, that's quite correct.

Fair enough. The flip side is he's gotten man of the match in other big games. e.g. both Exeter and the Leinster games so he's obviously doing something right.

Former Former

aloooof wrote: »

What other games, just out of interest?

I must admit I was also thinking about his time at Scarlets.

I just don't think he's able to really compete at the top level against a strong pack.

partyguinness

yerrahbah wrote: »

Disappointing result but not unexpected
Going into the match three things needed to happen for Munster to have any chance
1. Munster give their best performance in years
2. Ref decisions go their way
3. Saracens have an off day

Unfortunately none of the above happened

I don’t think Munster were particularly poor or Saracens particularly great, but Saracens didn’t need to be and largely looked comfortable

Thought Saracens kicked really well and Haley had a tough time under the high ball

The Munster kick –chase was a bit off and gifted possession back too easily
We didn’t really disrupt their lineout which is unusual for Munster

We missed the breaking ability of Carbery to keep the Saracens defense on their toes

I think if Cloete had been in better form he would have played at 7, JOD is not a natural 7 but Cloete has just been out of sorts for the most of this season.

Munster are easily in the top 6 in Europe but are still a good bit off competing with the likes of Saracens, Racing and Leinster

Munster just don’t have the $$$ that Saracens and Racing have nor do we have the conveyor belt of talent coming through that Leinster have.
It will not be easy to bridge that gap.

I think Munster have a team of “good” Heineken cup standard players and not enough “fantastic” Heineken cup standard players.

Think EPCR will need to rethink the choosing of venues for Semi finals, maybe have a look at the attendance of the home team throughout the campaign and pick a suitable ground based on that.

Having a half full stadium doesn’t do anyone any favours.

The spectator who entered the field needs a ban from Munster games.

Between the Zebo incident in Belfast, the Sectarianism incident in the Aviva and now this, It’s not a good look for Irish rugby supporters in the last few months.

Anyway
Come on Leinster in the final

Yeah can't disagree with any of that. I was at it and the half empty stadium was very disappointing. Felt more like a pre-season friendly with the sunshine.

Saracens were just the better side, too slick, little mistakes and Munster just never got up a head of steam- done to their own mistakes and Saracens not letting them. That 5-6 minute period after half time was a killer but that was all credit to Saracens.

aloooof

Former Former wrote: »

I must admit I was also thinking about his time at Scarlets.

I just don't think he's able to really compete at the top level against a strong pack.

I agree to an extent but pedantic-me would say he's proven he can do it against a strong pack (e.g. Exeter) but hasn't against the absolute top tier (Saracens).

It was always gonna be a tough ask; 4 of their front 5 were Lions test starters. From the pack, Billy V might have been too if he didn't get injured.

I just think it's overly harsh saying he was "easily neutralised" given the calibre of opposition he was up against. I don't think too many beforehand would've claimed he was better than his opposite numbers.

Paul Smeenus

aloooof wrote: »

I agree to an extent but pedantic-me would say he's proven he can do it against a strong pack (e.g. Exeter) but hasn't against the absolute top tier (Saracens).

It was always gonna be a tough ask; 4 of their front 5 were Lions test starters. From the pack, Billy V might have been too if he didn't get injured.

I just think it's overly harsh saying he was "easily neutralised" given the calibre of opposition he was up against. I don't think too many beforehand would've claimed he was better than his opposite numbers.

I think "easily neutralised" is unfair myself, but I do think he goes missing.

shootermacg

He also scored a very legit turnover. But Garces made a terrible call.

Richie_Rich89

Fardy is the player Beirne is sometimes compared with. The thing is that Fardy has played most of his European knock-out rugby at blindside, and has two phenomenal locks in Ryan and Toner to carry him. How would Beirne look if he played 6 with the Leinster second rows playing with him at lock?

Also, against a team as physical and technically-sound at the clearout as Saracens I think Munster needed to be getting another player into the ruck to anchor Beirne and make him more difficult to shift off the ball. Looking at that 42.ie analysis article there were a few times when a quick-thinking teammate could have jumped in to support Beirne.

troyzer

Richie_Rich89 wrote: »

Fardy is the player Beirne is sometimes compared with. The thing is that Fardy has played most of his European knock-out rugby at blindside, and has two phenomenal locks in Ryan and Toner to carry him. How would Beirne look if he played 6 with the Leinster second rows playing with him at lock?

Also, against a team as physical and technically-sound at the clearout as Saracens I think Munster needed to be getting another player into the ruck to anchor Beirne and make him more difficult to shift off the ball. Looking at that 42.ie analysis article there were a few times when a quick-thinking teammate could have jumped in to support Beirne.

I've never seen anyone compare Beirne to Fardy. They're completely different players.

Shefwedfan

Richie_Rich89 wrote: »

Fardy is the player Beirne is sometimes compared with. The thing is that Fardy has played most of his European knock-out rugby at blindside, and has two phenomenal locks in Ryan and Toner to carry him. How would Beirne look if he played 6 with the Leinster second rows playing with him at lock?

Also, against a team as physical and technically-sound at the clearout as Saracens I think Munster needed to be getting another player into the ruck to anchor Beirne and make him more difficult to shift off the ball. Looking at that 42.ie analysis article there were a few times when a quick-thinking teammate could have jumped in to support Beirne.

First time I heard anyone compare Beirne and Fardy. Not a comparison that would have popped into my mind,.......

Richie_Rich89

Similar height, weight, and both play blindside and second row and are good on the deck.

stephen_n

Shefwedfan wrote: »

First time I heard anyone compare Beirne and Fardy. Not a comparison that would have popped into my mind,.......

I wasn't aware that Fardy needed carrying, then again as a non Irish player it stands to reason I suppose.


p.s. I'm quoting you cause you quoted him

razorblunt

aloooof wrote: »

Fair enough. The flip side is he's gotten man of the match in other big games. e.g. both Exeter and the Leinster games so he's obviously doing something right.

Case in point of the saying "you're never as good as they say you are nor are as bad".

IanOBo

Any links to watch the game back?

LuckyGent88

IanOBo wrote: »

Any links to watch the game back?

I echo this post. Just back in civilisation after a 7 day trek to Machu Picchu. Never expected us to win but I’d like to watch the game back.

PS: Machu Picchu is incredible

Shefwedfan

LuckyGent88 wrote: »

PS: Machu Picchu is incredible

The match isn’t

stephen_n

LuckyGent88 wrote: »

.

PS: Machu Picchu is incredible

Defo on my bucket list.

partyguinness

stephen_n wrote: »

Defo on my bucket list.

I would recommend it.I have done:-

1. Egypt with all the bells and whistles
2. Ankor Wat
3. Machu Picchu
4. Even Chichen Itza

Machu Picchu was defo the most satisfying.

aloooof

stephen_n wrote: »

Defo on my bucket list.

partyguinness wrote: »

I would recommend it.I have done:-

1. Egypt with all the bells and whistles
2. Ankor Wat
3. Machu Picchu
4. Even Chichen Itza

Machu Picchu was defo the most satisfying.

One for another thread perhaps, but a rugby bucket list??

I'd like to go see a game in the Rec at some stage.
Munster v Clermont in the Marcel Michelin would be up there for me as well.
And a Lions test in Wellington (sentimental reasons for that one).

Kinda different, but I'd also absolutely love to see Ireland hosting a RWC some day (still bitter).

thomond2006

Munster Rugby Statement re Champions Cup semi-final spectator incident
Following further investigation into the incident involving a spectator entering the field of play at the Ricoh Arena the province can confirm that a decision has been made to prohibit the supporter from attending matches at Irish Independent Park and Thomond Park, in addition to the ban from the Ricoh Arena.

The province wishes to reiterate it does not condone the entry of any spectator to the field of play.

While it was hugely disappointing to see a supporter breach the stadium regulations, the behaviour of this one individual is not reflective of our supporters.

https://munsterrugby.ie/2019/05/03/munster-rugby-statement/?_ga=2.198516264.641920175.1556531788-1841986196.1522064652

Erik Shun

Kind of hard to enforce that ban if he's not a season ticket holder, or an mrsc member

Quin_Dub

Erik Shun wrote: »

Kind of hard to enforce that ban if he's not a season ticket holder, or an mrsc member

I've always wondered about these kind of bans and how on earth you actually enforce them.

Agree completely with him being banned , but beyond stopping a person from buying a ticket in their own name via official sources , how do you actually stop them getting a ticket elsewhere and walking in??

sydthebeat

you mean it wasn't actually a Saracens supporter in a Munster jersey ?????

whoood 'ave thunk.....

Henry Ford III

Quin_Dub wrote:

I've always wondered about these kind of bans and how on earth you actually enforce them.

ANPR?

Erik Shun

Henry Ford III wrote: »

ANPR?

It's independant park in cork....not the MI6 counter intelligence division

Tomtom364

Can't really stop them from doing that. But you can make your stewards aware of banned individuals who they may then recognise.

It's more of a procedural thing that you've informed them they are banned. If they then sneak in via unnamed ticket and you catch them you can eject them. If they refuse you can have the guards eject them for trespass.
Then if they do it repeatedly you can have a court order to bar them.
Then if that's broken they can be arrested.

It's a long old process that requires the person to be repeatedly entering without permission.

Sabre0001

Most will only recognise this lad by his footwear Did he even have a face?!

razorblunt

Yeah, I always presumed these bans were token efforts. Mary at the Gate on the Ballyphehane Road side of Musgrave Park won't recognise this guy.

As long as he doesn't use his own cards to buy tickets and he's not wearing the shorts and shoes combo.

Shefwedfan

thomond2006 wrote: »

Munster Rugby Statement re Champions Cup semi-final spectator incident
Following further investigation into the incident involving a spectator entering the field of play at the Ricoh Arena the province can confirm that a decision has been made to prohibit the supporter from attending matches at Irish Independent Park and Thomond Park, in addition to the ban from the Ricoh Arena.

The province wishes to reiterate it does not condone the entry of any spectator to the field of play.

While it was hugely disappointing to see a supporter breach the stadium regulations, the behaviour of this one individual is not reflective of our supporters.

https://munsterrugby.ie/2019/05/03/munster-rugby-statement/?_ga=2.198516264.641920175.1556531788-1841986196.1522064652

All too late now....they just look like idiots now