General Premier League Thread 2018-19 Part 2

windy shepard henderson

Deleted User wrote: »

If Liverpool fail to win the league, it is perfectly legitimate for fans of other clubs to use phrases like "blown it" and "bottled it".

Because they are simply other ways of saying "fail".

Liverpool fans don't get to prescribe changes to the English language and how it is used just because it bothers them.

yep .... a failure to finish behind a team that picked up 198 points in 2 seasons :rolleyes:

i think city deserve a little more respect then that , as much as i don't like them

sabat

[Deleted User] wrote: »

If Liverpool fail to win the league, it is perfectly legitimate for fans of other clubs to use phrases like "blown it" and "bottled it"...

...Because they are simply other ways of saying "fail".

But those aren't direct synonyms of "fail" - they also imply an element of psychological collapse, which wasn't the case. If anything Liverpool became mentally stronger as the season went on. As I said in a post here back around Christmas, this is a "title winning team" who are just extremely unlucky to have run into a sport-changing outfit- Liverpool's points total is enough to have won this league 25 times. For an example of an actual bottle job, I'd suggest Leeds in the championship this year.

windy shepard henderson

windy shepard henderson wrote: »

yep .... a failure to finish behind a team that picked up 198 points in 2 seasons :rolleyes:

Are Liverpool fans arguing that arguing that the phrase "Liverpool failed to win the league" is inappropriate if Liverpool fail to win the league?

sabat wrote: »

But those aren't direct synonyms of "fail" - they also imply an element of psychological collapse, which wasn't the case.

https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/blow-it

Collapse is not implied every time someone uses the word "blow" in the context of "fail", and suspect "bottle" is even more informal and imprecise.

dmigsy

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Are Liverpool fans arguing that arguing that the phrase "Liverpool failed to win the league" is inappropriate if Liverpool fail to win the league?



https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/blow-it

Collapse is not implied every time someone uses the word "blow" in the context of "fail", and suspect "bottle" is even more informal and imprecise.

Jesus Christ. What the fcuk are you hoping to achieve with this shíte?

The White Wolf

dmigsy wrote: »

Jesus Christ. What the fcuk are you hoping to achieve with this shíte?

Probably exactly that.

dmigsy

The White Wolf wrote: »

Probably exactly that.

Ha. You may be right. Mad stuff.

blueser

shamrock55 wrote: »

Tbf what city have done since losing 2 games in December is quite staggering, we shouldn't even have had a title race the way they've been picking up points

3. Chelsea (8th), Palace (22nd) and Leicester (26th).

dmigsy

dmigsy wrote: »

Jesus Christ. What the fcuk are you hoping to achieve with this shíte?

The "****e" as you call it is Liverpool fans overreacting to words like "blow" and "bottle".

They are absolutely legitimate.

Liverpool fans like you wading in and getting more irate does not change that.

dmigsy

[Deleted User] wrote: »

The "****e" as you call it is Liverpool fans overreacting to words like "blow" and "bottle".

They are absolutely legitimate.

Liverpool fans like you wading in and getting more irate does not change that.

When you find yourself digging in the dictionary you've lost whatever petty battle you're fighting. Get over it.

The White Wolf

blueser wrote: »

3. Chelsea (8th), Palace (22nd) and Leicester (26th).

Still Blueser the point stands. You've been in peak domestic form for more or less half a season to the point where I didn't fancy Spurs or United to get anything off you, the gulf in class and form being that apparent to me.

All credit to what your team has done, I'm just happy that we've forced it to the last day regardless of the supposed futility many people are seeing - not me though.

blueser

The White Wolf wrote: »

Still Blueser the point stands. You've been in peak domestic form for more or less half a season to the point where I didn't fancy Spurs or United to get anything off you, the gulf in class and form being that apparent to me.

All credit to what your team has done, I'm just happy that we've forced it to the last day regardless of the supposed futility many people are seeing - not me though.

You've pushed us bloody hard this season, which is all credit to your manager. Making up 20 odd points is a huge achievement. As you implied, the run we've gone on since the defeat at St James' Park is remarkable.

noodler

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Are Liverpool fans arguing that arguing that the phrase "Liverpool failed to win the league" is inappropriate if Liverpool fail to win the league?



https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dictionary/english/blow-it

Collapse is not implied every time someone uses the word "blow" in the context of "fail", and suspect "bottle" is even more informal and imprecise.

Well, that's probably the stupidest one so far.

Iused2likebusts

[Deleted User] wrote: »

They were around 86% likely to win the league at one stage, so you can't discount peoples views on that as worthless.

Also I heard/read somewhere there ppg are higher when they have not been in 1st compared to when in 1st.

So its hardly surprising the narrative has taken hold

At that stage I wonder what % City were to get 54 pts from their next 57. Less than 5% id imagine. Thats the real story here a remarkable run of wins by a quality team.

ArielAtom

Just to add, UTD, Chelsea, Spurs, Arsenal and the rest of the Premier League can be added to the fail to win it. It think the point scoring of some posters says more about them than the posters their fishing for. City ya e been sublime and deservedly are going to be crowned champions. Congrats to all City fans on a truly remarkable season and also Liverpool for making it the best in run ever. Those two sit so far above the chasing pack this season.

niallo27

Could you imagine if city did **** up again Brighton, this place would self implode.

Shanotheslayer

If City do bottle it, and it would be a bottle job. I would be extremely surprised.

Grinding out a result each week and making it to a crunch week against a team with literally nothing to play for. There would be no excuse.

RollieFingers

If Liverpool bottled the league, what did the eighteen teams below them do? Sh*t the bed in October?

GavRedKing

RollieFingers wrote: »

If Liverpool bottled the league, what did the eighteen teams below them do? Sh*t the bed in October?

Pretty much, only Spurs up until about February put it up to either side and they've fallen off a cliff in terms of results and consistency the last dozen games.

IncognitoMan

RollieFingers wrote: »

If Liverpool bottled the league, what did the eighteen teams below them do? Sh*t the bed in October?

As far as I can see most posters never said they "bottled" the league.

Jesus you can't say anything without it turning into "oh you think they bottled it on 97 points".

It's weird.

ThunbergsAreGo

blueser wrote: »

The White Wolf wrote: »

Still Blueser the point stands. You've been in peak domestic form for more or less half a season to the point where I didn't fancy Spurs or United to get anything off you, the gulf in class and form being that apparent to me.

All credit to what your team has done, I'm just happy that we've forced it to the last day regardless of the supposed futility many people are seeing - not me though.

You've pushed us bloody hard this season, which is all credit to your manager. Making up 20 odd points is a huge achievement. As you implied, the run we've gone on since the defeat at St James' Park is remarkable.

To be fair the run both teams have been on since the season started is remarkable.

Crazy consistency. City team must go down as the best based on the points total over two years

Some folks forgetting the league isn't over yet. Anything can happen on the last day. And it would be a massive failure if City don't win it now.

However when the dust settles and folks reflect on the season one team will have been better than the other and one team was 2nd best. Yea, stating the obvious but that's the reality. One team failed in the attempt to win and one was successful.

As it currently stands dropping a 7 point lead mid season is where it has fallen down for Liverpool. That's what will be dissected if City do manage to win it.

GLaDOS

198 points over 2 seasons (Assuming City win next week) is insane levels of good. Literally the 1st and 2nd best Premier League seasons ever.

I do genuinely feel sorry for Liverpool. They may never produce a season this good (pointswise) again, and it's still not good enough to get that elusive title.

5starpool

Deleted User wrote: »

If Liverpool fail to win the league, it is perfectly legitimate for fans of other clubs to use phrases like "blown it" and "bottled it".

Because they are simply other ways of saying "fail".

Liverpool fans don't get to prescribe changes to the English language and how it is used just because it bothers them.

People can state and believe whatever they want. It's still my opinion that anyone who expresses that belief in this case (where city won 19/20 or whatever) is a moron whose opinion is ridiculous.

Doesn't stop anyone expressing that opinion though. My belief and opinion isn't fact, it isn't a group LFC fan opinion, it is just mine.

Quazzie

Shanotheslayer wrote: »

If City do bottle it, and it would be a bottle job. I would be extremely surprised.

Grinding out a result each week and making it to a crunch week against a team with literally nothing to play for. There would be no excuse.

So if City come from behind and just fail to stay ahead of Liverpool they are bottlers, but Liverpool lose a 8 point lead and they aren't?

Seems a bit harsh

Gavlor

The only people bringing up liverpool bottling the league are liverpool fans. Get over the paranoia lads.

ERG89

Liverpool had dips in form like every other team in football this season.
Losing 1 game and amassing (maybe) 97 points to me says they did all they can. Dug deep in some games to get late wins.
Juve, PSG or Barca have absolutely walked their leagues this season and only Juve might eclipse that points total.
Whoever is going to beat City to a league needs them to drop back to 91-92 points to have a hope of staying with them for 38 matches.
Not sure if Liverpool can get that points total next year but other than City none of the rest have a notion of getting 95+ points so next years title race might not be much beyond February.

jpboard1

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

I've seen the United team I support fail to get the necessary points to win the title on numerous occasions. Upton Park '95 springs to mind. Doesn't mean they were bottlers. It happens in sport sometimes. Wish my team had the character of those sides now.

Can understand some fans being emotional tonight but I think if they reflect on what's been said coldly and without emotion they'll realise it really was in their team's hands.

Not over yet of course. Maybe City will have their Upton Park moment at the weekend.

So by the same logic, was the league in liverpool’s Hands after the first round of games in August?

Harry Palmr

ERG89 wrote: »

Whoever is going to beat City to a league needs them to drop back to 91-92 points to have a hope of staying with them for 38 matches.

Not sure if Liverpool can get that points total next year but other than City none of the rest have a notion of getting 95+ points so next years title race might not be much beyond February.

Beating City next season might rely as much on the other bigger teams being better rather than Liverpool being able to up their game a notch.

Top Six Mini League

Man City 25 points
Liverpool 19 points
Chelsea 12 points
Arsenal 12 points
Spurs 07 points
Man Utd 07 points

Arsenal did rather better than I thought, Spurs worse.

The Talking Bread

jpboard1 wrote: »

Is it over?

Yeah. It's definitely over.

GavRedKing

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Beating City next season might rely as much on the other bigger teams being better rather than Liverpool being able to up their game a notch.

Top Six Mini League

Man City 25 points
Liverpool 19 points
Chelsea 12 points
Arsenal 12 points
Spurs 07 points
Man Utd 07 points

Arsenal did rather better than I thought, Spurs worse.

Chelsea havent beaten any of the top 6 away in about 2 years so picking up 12 points from 30 available isnt bad all things considered.

Citys record is amazing.

Shanotheslayer

Quazzie wrote: »

So if City come from behind and just fail to stay ahead of Liverpool they are bottlers, but Liverpool lose a 8 point lead and they aren't?

Seems a bit harsh

I mean in terms of bottling the last game. It's crunch time, they've done all the hard work getting to this part and they've done everything possible.

You can lose a cup final and not bottle the occasion you just lose. In this case, as it's league I would consider it bottling the final hurdle.

I don't consider Liverpool bottling the league because it was back in January and nobody expected City to win all their remaining games.

rob316

Shanotheslayer wrote: »

I don't consider Liverpool bottling the league because it was back in January and nobody expected City to win all their remaining games.

A sensible opinion

Shanotheslayer

Shanotheslayer wrote: »

I mean in terms of bottling the last game. It's crunch time, they've done all the hard work getting to this part and they've done everything possible.

You can lose a cup final and not bottle the occasion you just lose. In this case, as it's league I would consider it bottling the final hurdle.

I don't consider Liverpool bottling the league because it was back in January and nobody expected City to win all their remaining games.

Just to note; It was a Liverpool fan who brought bottled it to this discussion.

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=110116580&postcount=1497

I agree with the sentiment but as I mentioned in a previous post if City do win the league the most notable area where Liverpool failed to win it was the 7 point lead at once stage being pulled back due to dropped points.

This is allowed to be discussed and it's all valid.

Crash Bang Wall

As a LFC fan, I was angry with Klopp over the Everton game.......not going all out to win it.......but I never thought both teams would be pretty much perfect for the last 9 or 10 games......i would have expected 7 wins in 10 for both.

Its been insane......even if Liverpool lose next weekend (I expect City to beat Brighton comfortably), it will be more down to fatigue and key injuries, than a bottle job

Fitz*

Where does it stop? If a team has a 6 point lead in August and fails to win the league, does that count as bottling it too? :rolleyes:

I mean, Liverpool have literally won every one of their last 8, possibly 9, games in the crunch part of the season. In all types of ways, the drubbings, the hard-fought victory, late winners that is usually being talked about as the signs of being champions, tough away wins after being demoralized through other results and injuries, come from behind twice in that run also. They have shown excellent mental strength in the last run of months of games.

yourdeadwright

If Liverpool lose the league it'll be down to the head to head games , City picked up 4 Liverpool 1,

Neither team in any way shape or form have throw away anything but teams are so far ahead of the rest its fitting the results against each other will decide it,

Liverpool and City could have lost 9 more games and still be ahead of United ,That is mental,

Shanotheslayer

Harry Palmr wrote: »

Beating City next season might rely as much on the other bigger teams being better rather than Liverpool being able to up their game a notch.

Top Six Mini League

Man City 25 points
Liverpool 19 points
Chelsea 12 points
Arsenal 12 points
Spurs 07 points
Man Utd 07 points

Arsenal did rather better than I thought, Spurs worse.

Wow. Everton are matching Chelsea/Arsenal I think in terms of points taken off the big 6. Altho we would need to be added to the table for the points to be more accurate.

Fred The Red wrote: »

Just to note; It was a Liverpool fan who brought bottled it to this discussion.

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=110116580&postcount=1497

I agree with the sentiment but as I mentioned in a previous post if City do win the league the most notable area where Liverpool failed to win it was the 7 point lead at once stage being pulled back due to dropped points.

This is allowed to be discussed and it's all valid.

Absolutely it's a fair topic, at the end of the day that's were the points dropped may cost them the league. That minor dip in form and I mean minor has essentially cost them the league and it's crazy to think that something so minimal over the course of the season had such a huge impact.

pjohnson

yourdeadwright wrote: »

If Liverpool lose the league it'll be down to the head to head games , City picked up 4 Liverpool 1,

Neither team in any way shape or form have throw away anything but teams are so far ahead of the rest its fitting the results against each other will decide it,

Liverpool and City could have lost 9 more games and still be ahead of United ,That is mental,

United arent in 3rd so odd position to pick.

The White Wolf

Fred The Red wrote: »

Just to note; It was a Liverpool fan who brought bottled it to this discussion.

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=110116580&postcount=1497

I agree with the sentiment but as I mentioned in a previous post if City do win the league the most notable area where Liverpool failed to win it was the 7 point lead at once stage being pulled back due to dropped points.

This is allowed to be discussed and it's all valid.

I think those games (United, Leicester, West Ham, Everton) unfortunately fell together at a time where the squad was stretched to the limit. The likes of TAA, Gomez and Keita were out through injury while the front 3 went though a momentary lapse of form.

The simple reality is that City had the better squad where they could call on the likes of Sane and Mahrez from the bench while we were looking at Origi and Sturridge. That's where it begins and ends for me if you're trying to look beyond the absolutely incredible form both teams produced throughout the season; one team just had that bit more in reserve.

GavRedKing

If City win it, and theres still another 90mins left in the season so i wouldnt write Pool off just yet, I wouldn't say Pool have bottle it but they've certainly left the title behind with their draws in the last few months.

Both sides have put immense pressure on the other and both have gained form dodgy offsides, penalties, dives and what not but Citys squad is what will get them over the line. De Bruyne has been injured nearly all season and City look like they can carry that through. No other side in the PL could do it.

noodler

If city were to draw one game in 14, I'd hardly call that bottling either tbh.

Shanotheslayer

noodler wrote: »

If city were to draw one game in 14, I'd hardly call that bottling either tbh.

If that 1 draw was 13 games ago absolute not. Hell, even it was 4-5 games ago I wouldn't consider it bottling.

The fact it's the last game I personally would consider it bottling it. The crunch game, everything they've worked for all season now wrapped up for them against Brighton.

As a side note. Rodgers has improved as a manager since he's left Liverpool.

Leicester for me next season (and if they sign a couple of players) are in with a good shout to challenge for top 6 again IMO

sky88

i really dont think you could say teams with over 90 points have bottled it at all

GavRedKing

Shanotheslayer wrote: »

If that 1 draw was 13 games ago absolute not. Hell, even it was 4-5 games ago I wouldn't consider it bottling.

The fact it's the last game I personally would consider it bottling it. The crunch game, everything they've worked for all season now wrapped up for them against Brighton.

Its the fact its against an already safe and terrible Brighton side.

If City lose it from here, again, its not a bottle job because of the wins they've reeled off but it would be a serious blot on Pep's copy book if they dont see it out.

shamrock55

I think the whole thing of bottling it comes from being on top at Xmas when sky keep telling us no team except Liverpool when on top at Xmas has failed to win the league, its happened us twice now

Shanotheslayer

Fred The Red wrote: »

As a side note. Rodgers has improved as a manager since he's left Liverpool.

Leicester for me next season (and if they sign a couple of players) are in with a good shout to challenge for top 6 again IMO

Top 6 is definitely there for the taking for a few teams next season.

Wolves may struggle assuming they get Europa.

Leicester and Everton will have no excuses not to fighting for top 6. Fully expect Everton to be battling for it with no Europa a settled manager. A striker is definitely needed for us though

TitianGerm

Fred The Red wrote: »

As a side note. Rodgers has improved as a manager since he's left Liverpool.

Leicester for me next season (and if they sign a couple of players) are in with a good shout to challenge for top 6 again IMO

What I want to know is how they find such good DM's. Kante and now Ndidi

Hoddle and Waddle, have they got the bottle.

Shanotheslayer

Shanotheslayer wrote: »

Top 6 is definitely there for the taking for a few teams next season.

Wolves may struggle assuming they get Europa.

Leicester and Everton will have no excuses not to fighting for top 6. Fully expect Everton to be battling for it with no Europa a settled manager. A striker is definitely needed for us though

You could probably add Utd and Arsenal to that list. That's our standard at the moment.

TitianGerm wrote: »

What I want to know is how they find such good DM's. Kante and now Ndidi

He was great last night. He will be snapped up possibly in the summer (Not by us because we are a laughing stock).
Same with Rice
Same with Neves (Not exclusively DM but still)
Same with Jota (Same)